Front and back post marking at corners.


Front and back post marking at corners.

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Muz
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What's the go with the players leaving, usually, the back post but sometimes the front post unmanned as well from corners?

So many goals have been scored from headers and tap-ins from corners at the back post that I find it bizarre that the coach doesn't stick a player on both posts.

Argentina's 3rd goal this morning was a perfect example of this.

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Munrubenmuz wrote:
What's the go with the players leaving, usually, the back post but sometimes the front post unmanned as well from corners?

So many goals have been scored from headers and tap-ins from corners at the back post that I find it bizarre that the coach doesn't stick a player on both posts.

Argentina's 3rd goal this morning was a perfect example of this.


Some pundits were saying its a new strategy employed by some coaches, dunno to what end though.

-PB

http://i.imgur.com/6NzMzeY.png

Muz
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paulbagzFC wrote:
Munrubenmuz wrote:
What's the go with the players leaving, usually, the back post but sometimes the front post unmanned as well from corners?

So many goals have been scored from headers and tap-ins from corners at the back post that I find it bizarre that the coach doesn't stick a player on both posts.

Argentina's 3rd goal this morning was a perfect example of this.


Some pundits were saying its a new strategy employed by some coaches, dunno to what end though.

-PB


I don't get it.

I think I read somewhere that one third of all goals are scored from set pieces.


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I think UEFA , or FIFA, research has shown that having a player on both posts, doesn't equate to conceding less goals.

Having said that, anecdotally, many goals seem to be conceded from not having a player on each post. I always coach teams to have one player at each post.
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Decentric wrote:
I think UEFA , or FIFA, research has shown that having a player on both posts, doesn't equate to conceding less goals.

Having said that, anecdotally, many goals seem to be conceded from not having a player on each post. I always coach teams to have one player at each post.


I think UEFA and FiFA research needs checking on this one.
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But whenever there is a flick on inside the area and the players on the post keep the goal scorer onside then sloppy marking gets the blame, which is why the disadvantage of it is overlooked.

FWIW, I always take the back post so i can lean on it it catch my breath and not have to mark anyone. I've only really saved probably one goal over the past 6-7 years.
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torcida90 wrote:
But whenever there is a flick on inside the area and the players on the post keep the goal scorer onside then sloppy marking gets the blame, which is why the disadvantage of it is overlooked.

FWIW, I always take the back post so i can lean on it it catch my breath and not have to mark anyone. I've only really saved probably one goal over the past 6-7 years.


I'd agree with the first part of your post except that often the front post is marked and they're riveted to it after the ball comes in so they're keeping them onside anyway.

I'm going to look at a goal compilation when I can find one and just see how many were scored because of a missing player at the back post.

Sticking me neck out here but I'm thinking at least 6.

I also like taking a post as you don't have to go up for a header which I am shit at. Unfortunately I am tall so whenever I try and take a post I get told to get off and mark their massive striker.


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Munrubenmuz wrote:
torcida90 wrote:
But whenever there is a flick on inside the area and the players on the post keep the goal scorer onside then sloppy marking gets the blame, which is why the disadvantage of it is overlooked.

FWIW, I always take the back post so i can lean on it it catch my breath and not have to mark anyone. I've only really saved probably one goal over the past 6-7 years.


I'd agree with the first part of your post except that often the front post is marked and they're riveted to it after the ball comes in so they're keeping them onside anyway.

I'm going to look at a goal compilation when I can find one and just see how many were scored because of a missing player at the back post.

Sticking me neck out here but I'm thinking at least 6.

I also like taking a post as you don't have to go up for a header which I am shit at. Unfortunately I am tall so whenever I try and take a post I get told to get off and mark their massive striker.


Does your team do zonal marking or man to man marking?
Muz
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It's over 35's. (With 90% of us 45 and over.)

"Tactics" consist of trying not to have a heart attack or get injured so you don't miss out on a post-match schooner.



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Decentric
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Munrubenmuz wrote:
It's over 35's. (With 90% of us 45 and over.)

"Tactics" consist of trying not to have a heart attack or get injured so you don't miss out on a post-match schooner.




:lol:
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Decentric wrote:
I think UEFA , or FIFA, research has shown that having a player on both posts, doesn't equate to conceding less goals.

Having said that, anecdotally, many goals seem to be conceded from not having a player on each post. I always coach teams to have one player at each post.
Maybe not, but if you concede a header off a corner without a man on the post you look like a dk
Muz
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Back post unmarked by Chile tonight. Corner flick on by Brazil, tap in at back post.

Goal Brazil.

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Back post unmarked by Columbia this morning. Corner by Brazil, tap in at back post.

Goal Brazil.



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Germany and Bayern Munich don't have corner post markers because Neuer says they both get in his way and block his vision.

Right proudly high over Dublin town, they hung out the flag of war.

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Bringing this up again due to Australia's lack of front and back post markers which probably resulted in their first goal against last night.

It's not hard. Stick a bloke on each post FFS.

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Often wondered why one post marker isn't used in certain free kick situations. Sometimes with certain angles and distances and wall setups plus keeper position you can see that if the free kick taker can get the ball around the wall with a little bit of bend just inside the post the keeper will have no chance of getting to it but a man on the post has a chance. I saw this in the manchester derby a couple of years back I think it was van nistelrooy who scored in the dying seconds from a free the keeper predictably couldn't get near it when it was placed low just inside the post it was the clear weak point in the defensive set up and van nistelroy predictably saw it.
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Munrubenmuz wrote:
Bringing this up again due to Australia's lack of front and back post markers which probably resulted in their first goal against last night.

It's not hard. Stick a bloke on each post FFS.

There's not marking your back post, and then there's just gifting goals to the opposition.



Clearly falls in the latter.

Edited by Heineken: 19/11/2014 04:27:43 PM

WOLLONGONG WOLVES FOR A-LEAGUE EXPANSION!

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spfc wrote:
Often wondered why one post marker isn't used in certain free kick situations. Sometimes with certain angles and distances and wall setups plus keeper position you can see that if the free kick taker can get the ball around the wall with a little bit of bend just inside the post the keeper will have no chance of getting to it but a man on the post has a chance. I saw this in the manchester derby a couple of years back I think it was van nistelrooy who scored in the dying seconds from a free the keeper predictably couldn't get near it when it was placed low just inside the post it was the clear weak point in the defensive set up and van nistelroy predictably saw it.


If you put a player on the post for a free kick, you play everyone onside and let the opposition block the keeper.

Image


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biscuitman1871 wrote:
spfc wrote:
Often wondered why one post marker isn't used in certain free kick situations. Sometimes with certain angles and distances and wall setups plus keeper position you can see that if the free kick taker can get the ball around the wall with a little bit of bend just inside the post the keeper will have no chance of getting to it but a man on the post has a chance. I saw this in the manchester derby a couple of years back I think it was van nistelrooy who scored in the dying seconds from a free the keeper predictably couldn't get near it when it was placed low just inside the post it was the clear weak point in the defensive set up and van nistelroy predictably saw it.


If you put a player on the post for a free kick, you play everyone onside and let the opposition block the keeper.


That's true but irrelevant for corners.

A player on the back post last night could have seen ol' mate peel off to the back and either closed him down or tried to head the ball back out.

It did actually go in top left. A player there may have stopped that from happening.

From my point of view you lose nothing by having a man there so just have a man there.

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Munrubenmuz wrote:
biscuitman1871 wrote:
spfc wrote:
Often wondered why one post marker isn't used in certain free kick situations. Sometimes with certain angles and distances and wall setups plus keeper position you can see that if the free kick taker can get the ball around the wall with a little bit of bend just inside the post the keeper will have no chance of getting to it but a man on the post has a chance. I saw this in the manchester derby a couple of years back I think it was van nistelrooy who scored in the dying seconds from a free the keeper predictably couldn't get near it when it was placed low just inside the post it was the clear weak point in the defensive set up and van nistelroy predictably saw it.


If you put a player on the post for a free kick, you play everyone onside and let the opposition block the keeper.


That's true but irrelevant for corners.

A player on the back post last night could have seen ol' mate peel off to the back and either closed him down or tried to head the ball back out.

It did actually go in top left. A player there may have stopped that from happening.

From my point of view you lose nothing by having a man there so just have a man there.


Yes, I agree with you but the comment I was responding to was about free kicks, not corners.

Image


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melbourne_terrace wrote:
Germany and Bayern Munich don't have corner post markers because Neuer says they both get in his way and block his vision.

Well there's the solution; cap Neuer.

M80.

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Excuse the MS Paint job but this is what my team does, and it works a treat:



Blue is GK, red are my team.

A man on each post. If you're left footed, you stand on the right post so your main foot is closer to the middle of the goal. And right footer on left post. Or if both one foot, whatever.

A man on the 6 yard box, just inside where the post-men are, on both sides.

A man near the edge of the 6 yard box, on the side of the field the corner is being taken from, to block a low incoming cross and also to shut down a short corner. He becomes the wide option early if we get a break.

A man at the top of the half, for breakaway.

A man at the top of the 18 yard box, waiting for clearance header/kick and prevent the Paul Scholes type volley for the oppositions attacker. If an early break is on, he helps the man at the top of the half.

The remaining 3 man-mark. If the opposition has a pretty good header of the ball (and I play in a division where most players are known pretty well, so easily identifiable) then our best header man-marks him. Otherwise, our best header is one of the two on the 6 yard box.

I am yet to see a better way of defending corners tbh, and I fail to see why all/most professional teams don't line up similarly.
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^ very good.


As an ex goalkeeper, I can't understand the trend to stop putting players on the post or why some keepers wouldn't want them to be.
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I've moved this to the Performance section from World Cup section, as I figured it isn't exactly a WC-specific topic and thought there may be some that frequent this section and would be interested in contributing that didn't do so when it was placed elsewhere.

Edited by pv4: 25/11/2014 01:53:04 PM
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pv4 wrote:
I've moved this to the Performance section from World Cup section, as I figured it isn't exactly a WC-specific topic and thought there may be some that frequent this section and would be interested in contributing that didn't do so when it was placed elsewhere.

Edited by pv4: 25/11/2014 01:53:04 PM


Good move.

Interesting to see your team model.

I incorporated a zonal model, but it was too difficult.
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Good mod work pv4!
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I only caught the highlights but noticed that in the Arsenal/Liverpool game on the weekend that Keiran Gibbs jumped off the post to pick up a man, and Liverpool scored at the empty post. Would have been a 2-1 victory to Arsenal had they had a man on the post.
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pv4.

I'll have an U12's team this year so first year for them on full field and full 11 a side.

Formation's and things like corners I am going to work on so your positioning at corners has been good info. It all makes sense and follows a similar thought process to mine.

Anything you would change for an U12's team though?

Edited by SoccerDad: 24/12/2014 12:06:19 AM
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SoccerDad wrote:
pv4.

I'll have an U12's team this year so first year for them on full field and full 11 a side.

Formation's and things like corners I am going to work on so your positioning at corners has been good info. It all makes sense and follows a similar thought process to mine.

Anything you would change for an U12's team though?

Edited by SoccerDad: 24/12/2014 12:06:19 AM


To be honest I haven't thought a great deal about applying it to younger ages.

I'd imagine under12s would be less consistent, and not get as much distance/height from corners as seniors.

I don't have a solid answer for you, sorry mate!
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I use it with U9's.
Also my team on their own started to take short corners last year. bloody fantastic. of cause the parents of the kids with the boot did not think much of it. I liked it because it came from the players also fits in with my philosophy of keeping the ball.
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