*Fixed

Yes the far right is getting some traction - Golden Dawn.

That's because the people are in pain and there is no way out. Just austerity and taxes, which shrinks the economy.

It is unsustainable and one day the Greeks will go absolutely crazy.

To explain to those who don't understand.

Australia has a deficit and is increasing its debts. The Federal Reserve can lower interest rates to stimulate growth. It can also print money.

Greece is not financially independent anymore as it is an EU country. It can't do what Australia can do. They are trapped.

Add to this the fact that Greeks are only having 1.1 kids per family and an aging population - 2 tax payers per pensioner.

Plus free health and education as a birthright which the EU is forcing Greece to abolish. If Greece does that, Greeks will burn the house down.

I believe Greece will be next to exit EU with France and Austria.

Edited by Aikhme: 26/6/2016 01:37:31 PM

Greece will end up worse that that as part of the EU.

I was there only 6 months ago, and things are constantly deteriorating.

There is absolutely no chance for Greece in the EU without its own Central Bank.

Outside the EU, there will be hyperinflation in the short term and even a Banking Collapse but with the Drachma, things will dramatically improve very quickly and even create another boom and bubble. The recovery would be quick but it involves default.

Greece will lose its credit rating but will get back to AAA within 5 years.

Yes it is true. Greece has no future as part of the EU.

With GREXIT, its own currency and Central Bank it could devalue it by printing money.

However, the EU is holding Greece to ransom. The debt is in Euros. They have Greece in shackles so it can't leave.

But that won't stop the Greeks. When people are unable to feed themselves, they will revolt and good luck to the EU in recovering the debt as Greece will default causing a major international financial collapse.

That is true too.

So many countries have stolen from us.

Then there's the influx of refugees in Greece from the Middle East

Yes that too.

One of the most amazing things on show in Greece is a marvelous humanity. Pensioners are going down to the camps and sharing groceries with Syrian mothers.

But there are too many to contend with.

So the far right will create a lot of hysteria and scare mongering about Greece regaining control of its borders.

Much like Farage and UKIP.

what a wonderful history moment for britan and for democracy.
the good folk of england have done the right thing.
i have enjoyed watching the globalist liberal left suffering epic butthurt over this:d

I dont think it's a left or right thing

It's becoming one.

Extremely far right political movements are sweeping across the continent as they will in Aistralia as well.

Nationalism is at an all time high and increasing because of the EU.

I find it funny that this happens during the two day euros break, no matches on the tele = exit

It saddens me that the whole Brexit thing has been cheapened by the dishonest who seem to look for validation in bringing up racism. No shock there, but still, a shame.

I don't like the freedom of movement in the EU. I think if you are born somewhere you should have to have a job in the next country to live there (our your partner/parents) or show you can support yourself (pension etc).

This isn't over by any stretch.
I believe that the EU will try and hatch something to get the UK back down the track...and the elites will keep trying and trying until they do.

I think it goes beyond racism.

There is a very clear euro-scepticism spreading across Europe, from Greece to Prance and onwards to Scandinavia and UK.

People vote for different reasons. Some might be motivated by racism, but you can't say that 16 million leave voters were motivated by racism. The EU system is broken, very corrupt and designed to line the pockets of the political elites in Brussels. Anyone who has been to Greece and followed the Financial Crisis there, knows first hand the lunacy which is destroying a country.

At the minute, their rhetoric suggests otherwise. But you might have a point. In the event (unlikely right now) that the UK gets cut a deal like Switzerland, then it would be basically that.

Quite but those two countries have a very different relationship with the EU, compared to the UK. They were never part of the EU at the outset. It was just wisest to get them as part of the EEC (probably especially because of Norwegian oil and Swiss financial service, I'm guessing). But they kept it on their terms by never joining the EU in the first place. Very bright.

It's possible that the UK will, eventually, get a relationship with the EU similar to that of those countries. But at the minute, it's unlikely.

Firstly, it's all about perception. The EU has grave fears for its own stability. It is fearful of other nations breaking off. So it wants to send out a message and take punitive measures against the UK. It doesn't want to send out the message that you can just quit the EU and get a better deal. That is a reason why the EU would not, at least immediately, give the UK that kind of a deal.

Secondly, the Norwegians and Swiss permit freedom of movement and labour as members of the Schengen Zone. One of the major platforms of the Brexit campaign was regaining "border control" and controlling immigration and employment of non-Brits. It's doubtful that the EU would allow Britain privileged trade deals, etc., if they weren't prepared to allow freedom of movement and labour, etc.

I'd argue that Britain's membership within NATO has a greater impact in preventing wars. This is because Article 5 is a clause which invokes collective security. If one NATO nation gets attacked, all other NATO members are obliged to come to that nation's defence (with military force, if necessary). Of course, the danger with this is it could lead to a Third World War between Russia, Russia's allies and all the NATO countries. But, sanity prevailing, NATO probably has a greater direct impact on the UK not being involved in wars with other EU nations, than the EU itself.

In saying that, if the whole EU breaks apart, that's another story. The EU, as a whole, is crucial in keeping all EU members from warring with each other. It is a great platform for open diplomacy and mediation. It's far more likely European nations would go to war without the EU.

Soft Greeks can't even defend their treasures.

It looms likely that the EU will dissolve in the short to medium term .
George Soros admitted this as much and has said the damage is done....
But after the EU dissolves, I believe the elites will try again and form something similar but just call it something else with the attention of achieving the same thing,
Only thing is they might try to be smarter next time by ensuring no such referendum like Brexit ever occurs and that common people will have no say in the matter .
A bit similar to Mcjules notion that only the intellectuals should matter and be the only ones placed in high positions of power, whereby the common folk should have little say in the matter of all things that affect their daily livelihoods

Edited by Socawho: 27/6/2016 01:55:07 AM

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/lost-350million-nazi-treasure-stolen-7809895

The Germans already paid to rebuild it in Russia.

Well that is fine then. London also has a new Mayor who is Muslim and therefore probably sympathetic to the Greek position of returning the Elgin Marbles to Athens. George Clooney is a huge spokesperson for this issue as well.

You know, it is not very nice to make fun over the illegal dispossession over a countries historical artifacts. That is unwarranted hate.

Edited by Aikhme: 27/6/2016 02:51:08 AM

It's harmless.

Edited by paladisious: 27/6/2016 02:57:10 AM

:lol: But pretty important to us nevertheless.

I think you need to be a little more specific than that. In fact, I don't think the existence of the EU is a direct causality for increased nationalism.

Rather, I would suggest increased nationalism in the West is an equally opposite reaction to the Arab Spring in 2011.

ENG 1 v 0 NWO

The issue, as I see it, is this:

Joining the EU has been a clear net gain for the UK. However, as with globalisation, there have been winners and losers.

Those working in financial services, university educated, London-based, middle-upper class, have gained the most.

They are also the least threatened by EU immigration to the UK which has occurred (eg influx of Polish workers etc). In fact, they probably hired a lot of them.

Those with lowest levels of education, working in blue collar, or low-skill jobs, have not gained by globalisation, or directly from the EU.

I would argue that the transition the UK economy has made away from manufacturing work, towards knowledge-work or services, is an inevitable consequence of modernisation. And not caused directly by the EU. However, membership of the EU has probably accelerated this.

These people are also the most threatened by the increase in Polish workers, whether justifiably or not.

They just see that "things are changing", and that they are not feeling that they are better off.

So I am heavily critical of the government for 2 main things:

1) Not doing far more to help people, particularly in the former industrial powerhouse cities in the north. As I said, whilst the UK is better off overall in the EU, there have been winners and losers. The govt has not done anywhere near enough to help the "losers".

2) For too many years, govts have not done enough to defend the EU, or repeatedly make the case for why free trade and globalisation, as well as immigration, has actually benefited the UK.

The EU is an easy punching bag, and for decades politicians have passed the buck to it. Instead of having the hard conversations about why the EU is important, they've been happy to blame it for the ills of the economy.

So it is no surprise that a significant number of people feel disenfranchised, and willing to voice their disapproval against a bureaucratic bogeyman like the EU.

Many people feel powerless, and that they do not have a stake in the current system.

When people feel like the current system does not work, they will be willing to make a change, even if that change is uncertain, and possibly damaging - because they are losing out at the moment anyway.

I cant make heads or tails whether ENG mad the right decision in Brexit?? So much infomation and dis-information flying around its hard to say?
I have noticed a nasty spike in hate speech across Briton if my OS pals are any indicator.
It does seem like a whole lot of people think that EU membership takes jobs away and that it will rid the streets of any immigrant even if they are 2nd gen.

the thing is, did the UK win more then if the UK had stayed trading with it Commonwealth countries (which they gave up to join the EU trading block)

the UK can now sign trade deal that suits it's people, trade deal that don't get fuck up to what the French farmers think