Australian Football TV Ratings Season 2017/18


Australian Football TV Ratings Season 2017/18

Author
Message
Waz
Waz
Legend
Legend (19K reputation)Legend (19K reputation)Legend (19K reputation)Legend (19K reputation)Legend (19K reputation)Legend (19K reputation)Legend (19K reputation)Legend (19K reputation)Legend (19K reputation)Legend (19K reputation)Legend (19K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 19K, Visits: 0
So a netball international gets 170k in the week the soccer gets 1,000,000. Right oh ..
Midfielder
Midfielder
World Class
World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.7K, Visits: 0
Fri TV 89k
aufc_ole
aufc_ole
World Class
World Class (7K reputation)World Class (7K reputation)World Class (7K reputation)World Class (7K reputation)World Class (7K reputation)World Class (7K reputation)World Class (7K reputation)World Class (7K reputation)World Class (7K reputation)World Class (7K reputation)World Class (7K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 7K, Visits: 0
Eldar - 15 Oct 2017 4:49 PM
crimsoncrusoe - 15 Oct 2017 3:22 PM

Of what you list, only big names would have an immediate affect on ratings, you could bring in expansion, relegation tomorrow and it would have zero affect on the ratings, possibly make them slightly worse with a drop in quality and smaller teams. That's not to say it isn't worth while or even necessary but these ratings here, now are just the reality of the Australian publics interest in an Australian soccer league. You can point out SBS figures from the first year but the fact is they got worse because the FTA public lost interest.

For me, I see the rise in ratings as encouraging because no matter what you do you need to grow the ratings from here, something SBS and the FFA failed to do. The positive is we have had two pretty good games so far.

Yeah who would be interested in games with more meaning/consequences? Sounds boring to me
Eldar
Eldar
Pro
Pro (4.4K reputation)Pro (4.4K reputation)Pro (4.4K reputation)Pro (4.4K reputation)Pro (4.4K reputation)Pro (4.4K reputation)Pro (4.4K reputation)Pro (4.4K reputation)Pro (4.4K reputation)Pro (4.4K reputation)Pro (4.4K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.2K, Visits: 0
bluebird - 15 Oct 2017 5:53 PM
Eldar - 15 Oct 2017 4:49 PM

I'm at a loss
1/ A 20k drop is not a rise
2/ Last year's ratings were shithouse which 10 has not matched let alone exceeded
3/ 10 have shown 2 of the 3 biggest games of the A League (1 more to come next week) and still haven't matched what SBS did last year for Friday content
4/ We left SBS for 10 because ratings of 150k-175k were not good enough

Its clear you have an agenda. Either an anti SBS agenda, a pro FFA agenda, a pro commercial TV agenda, or all 3

If you can defend an 84k big blue opener followed by a 90k derby, both lower than the payTV audience, and 44% of what SBS managed with Friday games - then I cant take your posts serious


Are you trying to tell me that 90k isn't more than 84k? In the past two years, no games have surpassed the opening games ratings, yet this year the second game already has, its called rising.

You seriously think SBS was going to pay us another $5mil? You are dreaming.

The first season of SBS was the general publics introduction to the a-league, more people tuned in but they didn't come back because the product wasn't good enough. Banging on about how SBS once got 150k proves nothing, have a look at where the ratings ended up

I don't have an agenda, I have said all along that the move to Saturday was more significant than the move to One, I would have been happy for SBS to keep it and move it to Saturday. My point is that you wont see the result of the move to Saturday straight away, it takes time. I realise you are desperate to prove a point because someone once said it would rate 300k on 10 but did anyone besides Midfielder honestly think it would happen straight away? What we need is for the ratings to grow to that, for the product to bring people back and to spread by word of mouth, it was never going to happen straight away, trying to prove your point after one game is useless.

What do you mean " 44% of what SBS managed with Friday games ", both games are well above the SBS Friday average. Do you mean the opening games? How do you know that people with only a passing interest in the a-league know that the a-league has started, that it is now on Saturdays, that it is now on One and that it is now better quality games than when they last watched it 3 years ago on SBS?

All I'm saying is give it time before making a judgement, if the ratings continue to rise then that is positive.




Beaten by Eldar

Enzo Bearzot
Enzo Bearzot
Pro
Pro (4.8K reputation)Pro (4.8K reputation)Pro (4.8K reputation)Pro (4.8K reputation)Pro (4.8K reputation)Pro (4.8K reputation)Pro (4.8K reputation)Pro (4.8K reputation)Pro (4.8K reputation)Pro (4.8K reputation)Pro (4.8K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K, Visits: 0
azzaMVFC - 15 Oct 2017 7:38 PM
More teams and a higher quality of football required, plain and simple.

Star names will do more than 2 teams of  locals and the odd Eastern Europem no-ones heard of.
aussie scott21
aussie scott21
Legend
Legend (20K reputation)Legend (20K reputation)Legend (20K reputation)Legend (20K reputation)Legend (20K reputation)Legend (20K reputation)Legend (20K reputation)Legend (20K reputation)Legend (20K reputation)Legend (20K reputation)Legend (20K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 19K, Visits: 0
Sirocco - 15 Oct 2017 6:31 PM
Just to put the Channel 10 ratings in perspective. 

Sat TV Netball NINE AUS v NZL 117 K metro 53k regional 170k total

Even the netball is more popular that then A-league........

Les Murray, Bluebird et al were right. Its not the channel making the difference, its the product.

It might be early doors in this season, but the ratings on Commercial TV so far, are a disaster. 
 

Cant wait for that womens footy to start eh oliveballs?
asanchez
asanchez
Semi-Pro
Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.2K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 1.2K, Visits: 0
After 2 weeks of the new season, not sure what all the doom and gloom is about...
Reading certain people's comments on here, you'd think that the A-League was gonna shut up shop, that the Pope was gay, and that the world was gonna end tomorrow... either some posters on here are absolute trolls or AFL employees or a combination of both, but they sure don't sound like football fans to me!

Yes agreed, the TV viewing numbers on One aren't where we want them to be. But unfortunately this is our reality at the moment, for a variety of reasons (way too many to mention right now, and not just that it's the same 10 teams, or that the standard isn't up there) the numbers are where they are. But we also need to realise a couple of other points;

- SBS paid too much for the A-league a few years back ($5m-$6m a season), and I'm not even talking about ROI or viewers vs $$$ here, but that was too much of their budget, and they then started to cut down spending on their other programming, so really, regardless how well or not the A-league rated on SBS, the public broadcaster was never gonna pay that sort of $$$ again, so really any of that talk is irrelevant and a waste of time. So if you were the FFA would you give the rights back to SBS for next to nothing, or to a commercial station?

- if our game ever wants to grow, and yes the current FTA ratings show that's it's coming off a low base, but we always need to be on a commercial FTA channel, so it has to be on 7,9 or 10 or any of their secondary channels. The base has to be built first, then hopefully it starts growing. And for that to happen, a bunch of factors have to be sorted out for it to grow.

- I'm not a big fan of the FFA, particularly these days, but they did say that they were expecting to reach an average of 120k viewers on One, and a 4% increase in attendances, they were the metrics they were trying to reach for this season. So far that's pretty much where the viewing numbers are at, so not too sure of what critics/experts on this forum are expecting.

- channel 10/One hasn't paid a cent for these A-League rights, and are averaging 3-4 times the viewers they used to get last year, showing the NBL (pretty much what the NBL is still getting now on SBS2), so I wouldn't think they'd be complaining too much.

We all want the numbers to be better, but at the moment it is what it is, we have a 2 year contract on One (I think), and hopefully we can start growing from here, the numbers can't really get much worse, and for me the only way we can go is up. Apologies for being so positive...


TheSelectFew
TheSelectFew
Legend
Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 30K, Visits: 0
asanchez - 15 Oct 2017 11:04 PM
After 2 weeks of the new season, not sure what all the doom and gloom is about... Reading certain people's comments on here, you'd think that the A-League was gonna shut up shop, that the Pope was gay, and that the world was gonna end tomorrow... either some posters on here are absolute trolls or AFL employees or a combination of both, but they sure don't sound like football fans to me! Yes agreed, the TV viewing numbers on One aren't where we want them to be. But unfortunately this is our reality at the moment, for a variety of reasons (way too many to mention right now, and not just that it's the same 10 teams, or that the standard isn't up there) the numbers are where they are. But we also need to realise a couple of other points; - SBS paid too much for the A-league a few years back ($5m-$6m a season), and I'm not even talking about ROI or viewers vs $$$ here, but that was too much of their budget, and they then started to cut down spending on their other programming, so really, regardless how well or not the A-league rated on SBS, the public broadcaster was never gonna pay that sort of $$$ again, so really any of that talk is irrelevant and a waste of time. So if you were the FFA would you give the rights back to SBS for next to nothing, or to a commercial station? - if our game ever wants to grow, and yes the current FTA ratings show that's it's coming off a low base, but we always need to be on a commercial FTA channel, so it has to be on 7,9 or 10 or any of their secondary channels. The base has to be built first, then hopefully it starts growing. And for that to happen, a bunch of factors have to be sorted out for it to grow. - I'm not a big fan of the FFA, particularly these days, but they did say that they were expecting to reach an average of 120k viewers on One, and a 4% increase in attendances, they were the metrics they were trying to reach for this season. So far that's pretty much where the viewing numbers are at, so not too sure of what critics/experts on this forum are expecting. - channel 10/One hasn't paid a cent for these A-League rights, and are averaging 3-4 times the viewers they used to get last year, showing the NBL (pretty much what the NBL is still getting now on SBS2), so I wouldn't think they'd be complaining too much. We all want the numbers to be better, but at the moment it is what it is, we have a 2 year contract on One (I think), and hopefully we can start growing from here, the numbers can't really get much worse, and for me the only way we can go is up. Apologies for being so positive...

Can't wait for the cricket to roll round and that fresh of breath air becomes a chocking toxic gas.




99 Problems
99 Problems
Pro
Pro (2.6K reputation)Pro (2.6K reputation)Pro (2.6K reputation)Pro (2.6K reputation)Pro (2.6K reputation)Pro (2.6K reputation)Pro (2.6K reputation)Pro (2.6K reputation)Pro (2.6K reputation)Pro (2.6K reputation)Pro (2.6K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 2.6K, Visits: 0
Eldar - 15 Oct 2017 9:54 PM
bluebird - 15 Oct 2017 5:53 PM

Are you trying to tell me that 90k isn't more than 84k? In the past two years, no games have surpassed the opening games ratings, yet this year the second game already has, its called rising.

You seriously think SBS was going to pay us another $5mil? You are dreaming.

The first season of SBS was the general publics introduction to the a-league, more people tuned in but they didn't come back because the product wasn't good enough. Banging on about how SBS once got 150k proves nothing, have a look at where the ratings ended up

I don't have an agenda, I have said all along that the move to Saturday was more significant than the move to One, I would have been happy for SBS to keep it and move it to Saturday. My point is that you wont see the result of the move to Saturday straight away, it takes time. I realise you are desperate to prove a point because someone once said it would rate 300k on 10 but did anyone besides Midfielder honestly think it would happen straight away? What we need is for the ratings to grow to that, for the product to bring people back and to spread by word of mouth, it was never going to happen straight away, trying to prove your point after one game is useless.

What do you mean " 44% of what SBS managed with Friday games ", both games are well above the SBS Friday average. Do you mean the opening games? How do you know that people with only a passing interest in the a-league know that the a-league has started, that it is now on Saturdays, that it is now on One and that it is now better quality games than when they last watched it 3 years ago on SBS?

All I'm saying is give it time before making a judgement, if the ratings continue to rise then that is positive.



You did fail to mention that last night was a Melbourne derby, so it's expected to rate higher.

On the Socceroos game, the home fixture will almost certainly be on the main channel, unless their are any contractual restraints that prevent them. I'm not sure on the timing of the away leg, but if its after 9am it's likely it will go to the main channel as well. If these games fail to rate, then we do have a very big issue. 
bluebird
bluebird
Legend
Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 10K, Visits: 0
Eldar - 15 Oct 2017 9:54 PM
bluebird - 15 Oct 2017 5:53 PM

Are you trying to tell me that 90k isn't more than 84k? In the past two years, no games have surpassed the opening games ratings, yet this year the second game already has, its called rising.

You seriously think SBS was going to pay us another $5mil? You are dreaming.

The first season of SBS was the general publics introduction to the a-league, more people tuned in but they didn't come back because the product wasn't good enough. Banging on about how SBS once got 150k proves nothing, have a look at where the ratings ended up

1/ There was also an increase on Fox's ratings from the Saturday opener to Saturday nights game. Its called a derby. Not every game has equal weight

2/ We'll never know as the FFA publicly slammed them with 2 years to go. All we know is that the tail was improving. The overlap games went from an 88k average to a 114k average. This could have continued to improve meaning more investment from SBS when the rights came up for renegotiation or more of an interest from commercial networks

3/ Fans did come back in the same numbers. There were 2 years of consistent figures for SBS. In the same way we see consistent membership numbers and consistent attendances. Things only changed after the FFA spat the dummy


My posts arent about personal pride. This is about accountability. Something people here piss and moan about the lack of, yet vigorously defend every action done

If channel 10 could bring us to a larger audience through cross promotion and reputation then there would have been an immediate impact. Much like SBS gave us an immediate impact. But this proved to be false

Progress means understanding where and why things went wrong so we don't make the same mistakes. Not rationalising how the first 2 years of a broadcast didn't exist and that the pathetic ratings we see now are a reasonable baseline

I cant take your opinion seriously. Its seems very much like you are trying to win an argument instead of make a point




Edited
8 Years Ago by bluebird
Midfielder
Midfielder
World Class
World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.7K, Visits: 0
Sat TV 125k (Metro 90k Regional 35k)



Coverdale
Coverdale
Pro
Pro (2.4K reputation)Pro (2.4K reputation)Pro (2.4K reputation)Pro (2.4K reputation)Pro (2.4K reputation)Pro (2.4K reputation)Pro (2.4K reputation)Pro (2.4K reputation)Pro (2.4K reputation)Pro (2.4K reputation)Pro (2.4K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 2.2K, Visits: 0
BB and I have history of disagreeing but in this instance he is correct that the ratings are balls. Who would want to tune in to sd for a football match in 2017? I have no idea what the cross promotion has been like between one and 10. What bb should stop banging on about is the loss of $5m. SBS were never going to pay that again. Remember they've sold their World Cup soul to Optus. Things are what they are. We need better leadership, Cart horse etc
Footballer
Footballer
Semi-Pro
Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)Semi-Pro (1.3K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 1.2K, Visits: 0
Coverdale - 16 Oct 2017 7:56 AM
BB and I have history of disagreeing but in this instance he is correct that the ratings are balls. Who would want to tune in to sd for a football match in 2017? I have no idea what the cross promotion has been like between one and 10. What bb should stop banging on about is the loss of $5m. SBS were never going to pay that again. Remember they've sold their World Cup soul to Optus. Things are what they are. We need better leadership, Cart horse etc

we all like HD, but I dont buy the argument that SD affects ratings.

Do we really think that people are at home, gather their snacks, get all set in front of the telly, switch on, and then say "oh sod this I'm not watching SD, put Masterchef back on".
bluebird
bluebird
Legend
Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 10K, Visits: 0
Coverdale - 16 Oct 2017 7:56 AM
BB and I have history of disagreeing but in this instance he is correct that the ratings are balls. Who would want to tune in to sd for a football match in 2017? I have no idea what the cross promotion has been like between one and 10. What bb should stop banging on about is the loss of $5m. SBS were never going to pay that again. Remember they've sold their World Cup soul to Optus. Things are what they are. We need better leadership, Cart horse etc

In season 5 the TV rights were tipped to be worth $60m a year. When they were renegotiated the FFA managed to get $40m a year

This is the cost of inaction. The value of something changes over time

Before the SBS / FFA spat there was a heavy amount of interest in the A League by commercial FTA networks. 7 even paid $2m just for 2 games. After 2 years of shit ratings and no movement the value of the ratings was nothing

If it wasn't for the FFA spitting the dummy without a plan B, it is very reasonable to assume that we would have gotten $7m or more. Particularly from a commercial network. Instead we walked away with $2m for Foxtel to onsell an SD stream

Also SBS selling their soul happened after the FFA stormed away

Its all hypothetical. But its fair to argue if the dummy spit didnt happen, and the ratings were consistent, that there would have been a bid for them




Gyfox
Gyfox
Legend
Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K, Visits: 0
bluebird - 16 Oct 2017 10:05 AM
Coverdale - 16 Oct 2017 7:56 AM

In season 5 the TV rights were tipped to be worth $60m a year. When they were renegotiated the FFA managed to get $40m a year

This is the cost of inaction. The value of something changes over time

Before the SBS / FFA spat there was a heavy amount of interest in the A League by commercial FTA networks. 7 even paid $2m just for 2 games. After 2 years of shit ratings and no movement the value of the ratings was nothing

If it wasn't for the FFA spitting the dummy without a plan B, it is very reasonable to assume that we would have gotten $7m or more. Particularly from a commercial network. Instead we walked away with $2m for Foxtel to onsell an SD stream

Also SBS selling their soul happened after the FFA stormed away

Its all hypothetical. But its fair to argue if the dummy spit didnt happen, and the ratings were consistent, that there would have been a bid for them
SBS tried to off load its A-League contract to other FTA broadcasters after its second season citing making a financial loss in its first season and a larger loss in its second season as well as losing market share in the Friday night slot as its reasons.  It got no takers.  Under pressure from the public and its senior sports department staff it decided to continue with the broadcast.  Unfortunately it got caught in the downturn at the start of its third season where crowds were down significantly and its and Fox's ratings averaged 57k and 60k respectively after 7 rounds.  I don't have SBS figures for the rest of that season but Fox recovered to average 62k for the season and crowds for the second half of the season were the best we have had in the current 10 club era.  I don't think for a second that SBS would have been interested in bidding for the A-League even after a small improvement at the start of the final year of its contract but having allocated their limited budget to other projects it was no longer an option.


Edited
8 Years Ago by Gyfox
kaufusi
kaufusi
Pro
Pro (2.7K reputation)Pro (2.7K reputation)Pro (2.7K reputation)Pro (2.7K reputation)Pro (2.7K reputation)Pro (2.7K reputation)Pro (2.7K reputation)Pro (2.7K reputation)Pro (2.7K reputation)Pro (2.7K reputation)Pro (2.7K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 2.6K, Visits: 0
You also need to consider the league as a whole has had zero marketing this season. Nothing. Nada. No 'you've got to have a team ads', no big name players, and despite watching Survivor and the Bachelor (not my choice) i think i may have seen one ad for the HAL on ch 10. So there's no buzz, excitement or anything positive about the league. 

Why aren't channel 10 advertising the league at all? The big bash used to have non stop advertising during the simpsons, project and anything and everything on channel 10. Yet they're barely doing anything at all to promote the HAL. I would hazard a guess that a majority of the general public (who aren't HAL regulars) have little idea the HAL has started and almost zero idea the league is now broadcast on One on Saturday nights. If we don't tell them, we can't just expect them to know. 

I don't think I've seen any billboards, bus stops ads or anything like that either. It's pathetic.

But no, let's compare stats from when ADP was playing...
TheSelectFew
TheSelectFew
Legend
Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 30K, Visits: 0
kaufusi - 16 Oct 2017 10:57 AM
You also need to consider the league as a whole has had zero marketing this season. Nothing. Nada. No 'you've got to have a team ads', no big name players, and despite watching Survivor and the Bachelor (not my choice) i think i may have seen one ad for the HAL on ch 10. So there's no buzz, excitement or anything positive about the league. 

Why aren't channel 10 advertising the league at all? The big bash used to have non stop advertising during the simpsons, project and anything and everything on channel 10. Yet they're barely doing anything at all to promote the HAL. I would hazard a guess that a majority of the general public (who aren't HAL regulars) have little idea the HAL has started and almost zero idea the league is now broadcast on One on Saturday nights. If we don't tell them, we can't just expect them to know. 

I don't think I've seen any billboards, bus stops ads or anything like that either. It's pathetic.

But no, let's compare stats from when ADP was playing...

Why not? It wasn't a different league.


Midfielder
Midfielder
World Class
World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.7K, Visits: 0
 BB & TheSelectectFew others.

Would value your input.

Lets make a bold motherhood statement, we all want a full FIFA model with two three divisions. It’s the journey there where the debate lies.

The ratings are what they are, and I think no matter who or what system is in place today they need to be build.

While I want P & R, I don’t hold the proclamations made by some, not a predictions, by some folks who see the future that it is a solve all policy turning point.

Our issues run very deep and the current stagnation by FFA caught in a power struggle is only making it worse.

Before I move to where I need your assistance BB, let me say as loud as I can, that Football since 1955 has been its own worst enemy…. Our history in a sentence is IMO the Associations built the player base, but have little idea how to run a professional league, the professional side of our league have not build the player base and in over 60 years still do not have ways and methods to connect to the player base.

BB we move to P & R, say within 5 years…. How do we solve these issues.... BTW BB these are genuine questions I am not having a go at you in any way, but very interested in your comments ... see also my question to TheSelectFew at the end therein may lie the answer.

1] Broadcast arrangement  will Fox and 10 be happy that say a WSW or MV could be out and a Blacktown City in…… my guess is not and that the media deal would be far less than what it is.

2] Stadiums, most new teams could provide a low cost stadium, and arguably existing teams could move to lower costs stadiums…… would this be a good thing.. would broadcasters be willing to broadcast…

3] Quality of our league is often seen as a don’t watch by some sections of the Football community…. IMO lower amounts than today would make selling the league all that harder… If we go to a full P & R can we maintain existing salaries and wage growth…

4] We say we are a full FIFA model… will this make the Woy Woy players all of a sudden all join hands, and sing from the same song sheet.

 
TheSelectFew ….. very very very very very very much appreciate your input into my following comment. Your knowledge in this area is equal too any.

The growth in Football, in Australia is in the under 30 year old's, those that can afford Fox are in the main older supporters, and those older supporters who can’t afford Fox watch on FTA.

What has grown the Football market and blown away the media bias is the net…..

Net streaming will grow the game much faster than FTA TV.







 

Gyfox
Gyfox
Legend
Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K, Visits: 0
Jets v Perth  59k

Sydney v Wellington  76k
Gyfox
Gyfox
Legend
Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K, Visits: 0
STV comparison after 2 rounds:-

2015-16  61k average

2016-17  92k average

2017-18  81k average.
Midfielder
Midfielder
World Class
World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.7K, Visits: 0


error in posting 
Edited
8 Years Ago by Midfielder
Midfielder
Midfielder
World Class
World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.7K, Visits: 0
Fox comparison Hal's 13, 12 & 11 on round ratings totals 


                   17/18 16/1715/16
                 384,000467,000296,000
                 453,000457,000312,000

Australian Football dude
Australian Football dude
Hardcore Fan
Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)Hardcore Fan (278 reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 274, Visits: 0
Midfielder - 16 Oct 2017 12:06 PM
Fox comparison Hal's 13, 12 & 11 on round ratings totals 


                   17/18 16/1715/16
                 384,000467,000296,000
                 453,000457,000312,000

I could swear last year that only the previous year was used in Midfielder's ratings comparisons...what were the ratings in the opening rounds of the preceding seasons?  
Gyfox
Gyfox
Legend
Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)Legend (13K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K, Visits: 0
Australian Football dude - 16 Oct 2017 12:15 PM
Midfielder - 16 Oct 2017 12:06 PM

I could swear last year that only the previous year was used in Midfielder's ratings comparisons...what were the ratings in the opening rounds of the preceding seasons?  

After 2 rounds the season before the average rating was the same as last year i.e. 92k.  It shows that the start of year 11 was horrendous and the start of this year is relatively poor.
bluebird
bluebird
Legend
Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 10K, Visits: 0
@midfielder - the success of the game in this country depends on viability, not ratings or attendances

Now I know what you are going to post as a reply to that (one drives the other) but hear me out

Football as it currently stands has a TV deal where each team receives $2.6m and they must fund a youth league team. The costs of this is $300k for east coast teams and $700k for Perth. There is no reason why tomorrow they couldn't make the youth league a second division

Problem 1: There are two Melbourne Victories

The 10 youth league teams are replaced by 10 stand alone teams. The cost of the stand alone club is about $500k which tendering clubs must cover with sponsorship dollars (not hard for a second tier club with a clear path to the top). The FFA give each youth league team $700k and each A League team $3m (which they can do due to the new TV deal)

So we have two fully viable tiers with no additional funding required

Problem 2: The owners wanted more money

The cap is scrapped and each team can manage their own affairs. They also have full club ownership (brand, merchandise) and retain all revenue their club makes including finals. I cant see owners pissing and moaning about $3m from the FFA instead of $4m under those circumstances. With $1m sponsorship likely, each club is fully viable as a minimal club and all other spending is discretionary

After 2 years, 2 div2 clubs are promoted into the A League (T1 12 teams, T2 8 teams). After 1 year (3 years in total) P/R begins

The cost of this is about $4m as 2 teams require extra assistance, but this is easily covered
Current model: 10 teams x $4m = $40m, plus marquee fund
Proposed model: 12 teams x $3m, 8 teams x $700k = $41.6m


That's it. Not 10 years from now, or 15 years from now. But something the ball could have been rolling on a long time ago

Problem 3: Will this affect the broadcast?
The FTA partner "pays" for Saturday night content. This is the big games. Whether the Sunday game is CCM vs PG or CCM vs Canberra is moot
Ditto for Fox. They will be getting 2-3 big games a week, and a scattering of derbies and rivalries. The rest is just filler content. 6 games in total, and a second division. Add the W League to that and we may even finally get our own channel like the AFL and NRL

Problem 4: Will this affect sponsorship dollars and corporate funding?
P/R is low cost team out, low cost team in. Under my example, the A League consists of 10 A League teams and 2 "youth league" teams. The relegated team is either a youth league team, or an A League team with no money and resources. I cant see how that will affect MV's or SFC's ability to grow. In fact in every single year a club has been scrapped we have seen an increase in attendances, and more revenue for the game


There seems to be a myth here that crowds pay for the league. And this figure is 10,000 because Lowy said so in 2004. There also seems to be a myth that if the Sunday 3pm game isn't a high profile encounter then our TV deal is damaged

Neither of these are true. Football like most businesses goes by the 80/20 rule (more like 70/30), where 70% of the income is generated by 30% of the product. With a balanced model it means that 70% of our revenue is going to the 70% that nobody gives a shit about

Football needs big teams and big players. That's what fans want. That's what sponsors, corporate partners and broadcasters want. Never heard anybody say "Hey, did anybody catch that CCM v PG game where either team could win on the day?"


The problem is the Australian sports market is flooded with one trick ponies fresh out of the AFL / NRL who simply on sold something that was already valuable. People who will throw concessions and balance at everything because it worked in their previous line of work. The way forward is to buy in external expertise. The people who made the FIFA model work in the J League and K League

And its not like the FIFA model cant be tailored to our individual qualities. Football here will always be a national game so there will need to be a rule the Adelaide and Perth must exist in one of the tiers with a direct pathway to the A League. We will also have finals so instead of 1 ACL spot to the cup winner, and 3 to top 3 in league - we will instead have semi finals, with grand finalists getting 2 spots, and 3rd spot going to a losing teams play off


The important thing is we have business people who can say "This is what we want, this is the money we have, this is how we get there". Not has bens who say "we must kick off October, we must be on an FTA network, we must have a salary cap and then give teams concessions. Oh and lets rig everything from the FFA cup right through to the W League"




crimsoncrusoe
crimsoncrusoe
World Class
World Class (7.1K reputation)World Class (7.1K reputation)World Class (7.1K reputation)World Class (7.1K reputation)World Class (7.1K reputation)World Class (7.1K reputation)World Class (7.1K reputation)World Class (7.1K reputation)World Class (7.1K reputation)World Class (7.1K reputation)World Class (7.1K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 6.9K, Visits: 0
The problem is FFA ,their apologists and lack of accountbility.
Soon after Gallop came in things have gone downhill .I can't say it's his fault because he follows directions.
After the initial hype of WSW and name marquees at the time ,FFA have sat on their hands with regard to advancing the game.In doing so they have picked fights with most of the football family and neglected promotion and overseen a devaluation of football from where it should have been.
The ineptitude of the self serving power hungry hierachy is tragic.
They have no plan,absolute zero idea what they are doing,other than keeping their chairs warm.
While they sit and hide behind secret metrics ,they defer making decisions to concentrate on the main agenda of keeping control.

To think years ago ,while Buckley was in charge football could have had a better deal than it does now.To think the value of FTA tv is zero now.Then we have all the enthusiastic people waiting in the wings to fund teams in an expanded HAL ,if only FFA released some metrics.There are clubs lining up to form a second division and their are clubs who can bring in name marquees if only FFA would let them.(Sory Frank Lampard the cap was full).

Then there is all the things FFA could be doing to promote the HAL ,support youth development ,futsul and who knows what else.
In fact I struggle to think of a scenario where a governing body can do so little for the sport (even rugby try new things even if they fail)it is responsible for and is so divorced from support of the whole football fraternity.Even the national coach is quitting because of them apparently.

HAL clubs offside...tick
Fans offside ..tick
National coach offside...tick
PFA offside...tick
Grassroots offside(high regn fees)...tick
FIFA and AFC offside...tick
Expansion clubs offside...tick
NPL div2 clubs offside ...tick
Old Soccer offside..tick
SBS offside ..tick
Futsul offside..tick
Youth players offside..tick
Driving the value of FTA tv rights to zero for HAL games...tick
Being told by Foxsports what they will get for HAL rights and making them announce a great result for Football.Awkward....

The you have
TEN paying zero dollars but cant even be bothered putting HAL games on HD from a stream from Foxsport.How hard is that?FFA can't even get FTA to present the best format for free.Eventhough it is more likely to get more viewers?

Well done FFA. Managers.....if you had any integrity you would follow Anges lead and all resign.But we know you have none.

Edited
8 Years Ago by crimsoncrusoe
Midfielder
Midfielder
World Class
World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)World Class (5K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.7K, Visits: 0
^^^^^^

BB

Enjoyed reading that post .... Nail head when you said... """ the success of the game in this country depends on viability, not ratings or attendances"""

Interesting idea if I understand you for the youth teams to go and that funding be used to fund a second division.... tis worth consideration ... no idea what it does for player development at youth level but is as I said well worth considering ... will do some think on it but a good idea I must say...

I posted some time back my preference for how P & R could work in the A-League and its currently in use in Belgium .... I think its the bottom 4 sides in div 1 play the top 4 sides in div 2 over a for and against 14 rounds with the top four going back to first division... whatever the number is 2 or 3 or 4 the concept I believe makes sense in the Australian environment. ..

Within all this there is a minimum we need to fund in player payments .... otherwise you won't get the quality we need...

Have a look at this vid .. its from the US and its a left wing online network called """The Young Turks""" the journalist argues the need for the MLS to go to P & R and its an angle I have never heard put in Australia but equally it applies in Australia ... your thoughts on the journalist P & R comments appreciated..  its brief only about 10 seconds but he argues P & R produces stronger national sides.... should listen from about 1:50 to say 2:40 or thereabouts so you have the flow...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfhGSRZUd70











Edited
8 Years Ago by Midfielder
FullBack4
FullBack4
Amateur
Amateur (723 reputation)Amateur (723 reputation)Amateur (723 reputation)Amateur (723 reputation)Amateur (723 reputation)Amateur (723 reputation)Amateur (723 reputation)Amateur (723 reputation)Amateur (723 reputation)Amateur (723 reputation)Amateur (723 reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 697, Visits: 0
Midfielder - 16 Oct 2017 2:12 PM
^^^^^^

BB

Enjoyed reading that post .... Nail head when you said... """ the success of the game in this country depends on viability, not ratings or attendances"""

Interesting idea if I understand you for the youth teams to go and that funding be used to fund a second division.... tis worth consideration ... no idea what it does for player development at youth level but is as I said well worth considering ... will do some think on it but a good idea I must say...

I posted some time back my preference for how P & R could work in the A-League and its currently in use in Belgium .... I think its the bottom 4 sides in div 1 play the top 4 sides in div 2 over a for and against 14 rounds with the top four going back to first division... whatever the number is 2 or 3 or 4 the concept I believe makes sense in the Australian environment. ..

Within all this there is a minimum we need to fund in player payments .... otherwise you won't get the quality we need...

Have a look at this vid .. its from the US and its a left wing online network called """The Young Turks""" the journalist argues the need for the MLS to go to P & R and its an angle I have never heard put in Australia but equally it applies in Australia ... your thoughts on the journalist P & R comments appreciated..  its brief only about 10 seconds but he argues P & R produces stronger national sides.... should listen from about 1:50 to say 2:40 or thereabouts so you have the flow...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfhGSRZUd70











nothing and I mean NOTHING will change until we get a change at the FFA. anything else is pure fantasy

bluebird
bluebird
Legend
Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)Legend (10K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 10K, Visits: 0
@midfielder

In my proposed model each team are responsible for their own youth teams. This will be relatively cheap because they don't need to be national. Why does Perth need to spend $700k a year on youth development just so their players can be flying to the other side of the country to play Queensland?

A second division replaces a youth league because it will predominately be youth. You are talking about up to 160 playing spots and since its a central scouting platform there will be heavy competition for places. Not only that but Canberra or Geelong can justify the cost because its about bringing high profile football to their region, and an A League spot on the line. Perth already have this


To your video, P/R definitely does help the national team. Currently the best 40 players are spread across 10 teams. 4 good players, the rest shit. This creates accidental heroes and skewed stats because the best strikers aren't running at the best defences. It also means 28 of our best players will not be playing in the ACL. It also means no competition for places

With P/R, and naturally an unbalanced league, it means the best 40 players are in the top 4 teams. It means winning the title depends on your ability to consistently tear down 3 quality teams. It also means the best players, who are likely to be the next Socceroos, get regular game time with one another (as we saw in the golden generation)


In the W League Sam Kerr, Lisa De Vanna and Katrina Gorry (as an example) can all play in the same side. Now that the FFA are on the verge of touching this up with their same brush, it means these players will be supported by weaker players, and it will be an easy league to win. The quality of the Matildas will go down

This is what the A League is like. Somebody kicks 20 goals a season, gets snapped up overseas because obviously anybody who can do that in the highest league in Australia has to be good, and then they sit on the bench for a season only to return as a marquee

P/R is a competitive dog eat dog league with real reward for effort. The A League is all smoke and mirrors to produce interesting headlines (like letting your nephew beat you at chess)

No surprise the Socceroos are struggling




TheSelectFew
TheSelectFew
Legend
Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)Legend (30K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 30K, Visits: 0
Midfielder - 16 Oct 2017 11:18 AM
 BB & TheSelectectFew others.

Would value your input.

Lets make a bold motherhood statement, we all want a full FIFA model with two three divisions. It’s the journey there where the debate lies.

The ratings are what they are, and I think no matter who or what system is in place today they need to be build.

While I want P & R, I don’t hold the proclamations made by some, not a predictions, by some folks who see the future that it is a solve all policy turning point.

Our issues run very deep and the current stagnation by FFA caught in a power struggle is only making it worse.

Before I move to where I need your assistance BB, let me say as loud as I can, that Football since 1955 has been its own worst enemy…. Our history in a sentence is IMO the Associations built the player base, but have little idea how to run a professional league, the professional side of our league have not build the player base and in over 60 years still do not have ways and methods to connect to the player base.

BB we move to P & R, say within 5 years…. How do we solve these issues.... BTW BB these are genuine questions I am not having a go at you in any way, but very interested in your comments ... see also my question to TheSelectFew at the end therein may lie the answer.

1] Broadcast arrangement  will Fox and 10 be happy that say a WSW or MV could be out and a Blacktown City in…… my guess is not and that the media deal would be far less than what it is.

2] Stadiums, most new teams could provide a low cost stadium, and arguably existing teams could move to lower costs stadiums…… would this be a good thing.. would broadcasters be willing to broadcast…

3] Quality of our league is often seen as a don’t watch by some sections of the Football community…. IMO lower amounts than today would make selling the league all that harder… If we go to a full P & R can we maintain existing salaries and wage growth…

4] We say we are a full FIFA model… will this make the Woy Woy players all of a sudden all join hands, and sing from the same song sheet.

 
TheSelectFew ….. very very very very very very much appreciate your input into my following comment. Your knowledge in this area is equal too any.

The growth in Football, in Australia is in the under 30 year old's, those that can afford Fox are in the main older supporters, and those older supporters who can’t afford Fox watch on FTA.

What has grown the Football market and blown away the media bias is the net…..

Net streaming will grow the game much faster than FTA TV.







 

Net streaming may grow but I feel as if our national infrastructure won't be able to keep up and our internet based plans are still not good enough. For example, I stopped watching in fear I'd run out of data. Until these roadblocks are overcome I don't see much change anytime soon. 

I identify two issues for second and third tiers in the future:

Exposure v Capital: If the second division were to get picked up you'd imagine they would be sold for next to nothing. I think they may even lose money but the exposure may be enough to cover any windfall. Unfortunately, I haven't been behind any deals but I would hope that the second division looks into this very seriously and try and make as much money from streaming as possible ie. in play ads in the corner, half time ads, billboards etc.

Selling to the right bidder: That means they may have to sell themselves to Foxtel for nothing as they hold all the cards. They need to be in the hearts and minds of football fans.A-League, Serie A, Ligue 1, EFL and A2. That would be a good line up. It needs to be kept in the one place because no one will watch it on Optus. It's a shame Optus picked up the rights but by God they are kicking goals.

In short: Short deals with the biggest football provider would be best. Foxtel Now is my preference as they are doing great things at the moment. Facebook seems too laggy for second tier and if it has any chance of success it can't be seen as patched together. Rather, the third tier and NPL should be played on FB.


GO


Select a Forum....























Inside Sport


Search