Wow!

Without Smith and Warner I think the Aus batting has been pretty bad too.

I would have thought Foakes should replace Bairstow as well.

The recent English  batting performances  have been appalling when I read these figures.

Yeah - but you have faith in the Australian production system still right? England has only produced one dominant batting team since the 1980's, when Cook, KP and Trott with Prior took them to number 1 with Bell and Strauss giving admirable support. But you take out KP and Trott, and that batting line up looks very very different and far less high calibre.

3 nations have the money to make the best cricketers. Australia, India and England. India is producing not only batsmen, but even fast bowlers now. Fast bowlers! To go with their spinners and fancy and vaunted batsmen. Australia continue to develop fast bowlers, and is in a bit of a pickle right now with batting depth. That said, the system put in place and produced a glut of talent since the 1980s. An absolute glut.

So what is England doing so wrong? Why is Australia and India producing batsman after batsman, regularly, and England not able to?

England has played some aboslute lemon batsmen since Boycott retired. Regularly. Team after team of them. And most of the best ones were built in SA.

See I just don't get it. How can they be failing to produce regular talent, when they have all these resources? 

Pace is very important on Australian pitches. Our pitches are more clay based and as a result offer more pace and bounce. However, they offer little swing and seam movement. Pace becomes the most important thing for bowlers. English pitches arent as bouncy or quick but offer far more seam and swing movement. England generally being better for those who bowl 130s and generate movement (see Anderson) over those who bowl express pace.

Archer is such a talent because he seems capable of bowling it at 150 and generating lots of movement despite. Generally when you hit that top pace you lose movement. Archer seems also capable of bowling a consistent line and length at that pace. He really is a huge prospect

Really not true at all for swing, Steyn could bowl outswingers at 150, Bond huge inswingers at 150, Younis ditto. Pattinson pre injury 145 and swing. Boult also (in odi). Jones, Flintoff, Akhtar all had the ball reversing well into the 140's and beyond for Akhtar. Everyone has seen Starc's inswinging yorkers at 150k. I really can just keep listing off pace men who swung the ball. 

Swing has very little to do with pitches (bar a block taking off the shine earlier which then brings reverse swing into play). The kookaburra ball is far more to blame. As the Dukes swings (and seams) nicely in your Shield games when it is used. Australia used to produce an all day swinging Kookaburra ball back in the era of McDermott, I grew up watching Hadlee swing the ball in Australia. Big Botham was swinging it in 1986 in Australia. So its not Australian clay related at all. Donald used to bowl first change in Australia during an ODI series in Australia in 1997/98 because the new ball swung too much for him to get an edge. Flemming has a fine record in Australia as a medium paced swinger.

Aus moved to roads of pitches during the 1990's and defnitely by the 2000's. You could leave grass on a pitch if you wanted to. The only pitch that was famously a road in Australia historically was Adelaide, but look what happened in the day night tests there when they left grass on it.

Drop in pitches make it hard to generate reverse swing as there is no block to scuff the ball on so rapidly.

For seam, the Kookaburra has a shorter seam than the SG or Dukes. And it has 2 fake stitches. It goes softer earlier, so nibbles less. Even then, give it to Philander or Abbot especially in Australia when new, and it will still nibble around.

If Australia left grass on the wicket, even Adelaide will hoop with swing. Like it did for Steyn last year in the late overs in that ODI there. You need a harder ball to bring the seamers into it for longer than the first 30 overs. The machine made Kookie just gets soft too early now on shaved pitches that resemble concrete. It doesn't give a lot of overs to seamers and swingers unless there is grass on the wicket.

Too much focus on short form cricket since 2015. Batters have ‘forgotten’ how to bat for long periods?
Too much snobbery/exclusiveness in the sport - state schools hardly play the game (terrestrial tv doesn’t even show live matches). When I was a kid in the 70s cricket was the national (summer) sport, now in polls you hear 2% of kids listing it in their top two favourite sports to play or watch (of course football is utterly dominant in the country).

I dont blame short form cricket at all. I fear you're onto something with the snobbery and exclusiveness... I hope you're wrong.

with all the talk of all rounders I'm surprised Faulkner isn't mentioned. Would probably score as many as Mitch but is as good as a top line line and length bowler. Incredible first class record

He has only played 1 FC game since 2016/17. 1. And hasn't really performed well in FC or anything really since 2015.

https://www.crichq.com/players/1315363/statistics/domestic

https://www.smh.com.au/interactive/2019/rough-and-ready-the-art-and-science-of-reverse-swing/

Really good article for those interested in swing and reverse swing and why.

Lord's, where he has a career average of 17.60 having taken 5-88 from 30 overs at the venue. Talking about Josh Hazlewood.
Yesterday he finished with 3-34 off 15. I knew he had back trouble.. but did not know it was a double stress fracture. Another case of  a mature bowler going down with the rookie quicks ailment.

Faulkner has been plagued by injury for past few years. I agree with grazor.. is a better bet than Marsh or Stoinis when fit. Also being a lefie he adds balance to an attack.

Aus moved to roads of pitches during the 1990's and defnitely by the 2000's. You could leave grass on a pitch if you wanted to. The only pitch that was famously a road in Australia historically was Adelaide, but look what happened in the day night tests there when they left grass on it.
Drop in pitches make it hard to generate reverse swing as there is no block to scuff the ball on so rapidly.

Cricket keyboard warriors like me have been saying this on forums for years. Does CA listen. The only decent pitch that ensures a fair contest between bat and ball is Bellerive.. and guess what CA took away its Test status last summer. Hope that is not a permanent move. I have to say that for a drop in I was impressed with the life of the deck at the New Perth Stadium. Great looking venue too. 

Australia used to produce an all day swinging Kookaburra ball back in the era of McDermott, I grew up watching Hadlee swing the ball in Australia. Big Botham was swinging it in 1986 in Australia.

Is it any wonder that Aussies are lost when it comes to swinging the ball. They dont have the bloody ball or conditions to do so. That is up till three years ago when  CA introduced an Aussie version of the English Dukes to be used in the final 5 matches of the Shield. This may pay dividends if we at least are competitive these Ashes. CA may then not feel the need to abandon the idea.  If Kooka used to make a swinging ball.. perhaps they shud revisit it otherwise the English Dukes may just take over all red ball international cricket to make it more competitive and save Test cricket from dying.

Yeah, you can spice up a drop in and leave a ton of grass on it. That will keep the new ball in the game a lot lot longer. Just makes it more difficult to do anything with an old ball unless the fielders get creative in making a super rough side somehow.

Hobart regularly doesn't get a test at all. 

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/team/match_results.html?class=1;id=905;type=ground

It will always be the 6th ranked town for Australian cricket.

NZ is slowly going in a different direction to the big city norm, with Mount Maunganui and Hamilton already was, becoming lead venues with the Basin Reserve in Wellington. Eden Park (Auckland) is consigned only for Ind and Eng tests now.

Then copy their pitch blueprint. Or poach their curator. 

Yes that is a piddling number of test matches over 40 years.

Your curators know what they're doing. As do most in the world. They're acting on orders from CA. Channel 9 wanted 5 days of cricket to cover its costs. CA wanted the money. You got roads. Plus the only bowling attack regularly as fast if not faster than yours was South Africas, so only South Africa caused regular problems for Australia in Australia.

I

Not that simple Baggers. Your players have gotten used to and like being millionaires. And the CA is in "partnership" with the players association. Money is here to stay.

WIthout money your whole FC structure would fall over. You'd be left like the rest of the non-big 3. With even less money. 

A standardized platform for the ball is being discussed by the iCC right now. What is being tabled, is that SG, Dukes and Kooka still make the balls, but make them all the same. A problem for Kookaburra is they machine make them, SG and Dukes are hand stitched. So interesting times ahead.

SA uses a Kookaburra, and that's not a fun tour for many batsmen, so Aus really could just leave more grass on the pitches. 

That is good news Paddles. So there are basic differences between the hand stitched ball and and the machine made one? Then Kooka have to do likewise and hand stitch theirs or CA  get some other maker to do it. Who uses the SG.. is it Indian?

SG is India.

Kooka has four fake stitches cos machine made sewing. It is also not crafted by hand for the lacquer. This, and the less lacquer,  causes it to soften faster.

Yes it is unfathonable.. given their structure and rich history. Where are the Hammonds, Hobbs, Huttons, Barringtons of today?

So that is why the the Kooka seam softens quicker than the Dukes. Surely they can apply a lacquer.. they did with the pinkies? Not sure what they can do about the seam. Perhaps continue to machine stitch their white ball but hand stitch the red one. I'd have notioned is is paramount for the evolution of the game that all nations use a universal ball.

But where is the next level below these guys? Where is their depth players?

NZ right now is enjoying Henry Nicholls surge onto the world stage. But arguably - our best batsmen aren't even in the team as yet. 

Every single NZ fan knows that the next batsman will be Will Young, who has murdered runs in Australia against Starc, Cummins, Haze and co, made runs Pak A in the UAE and against Ind A in NZ. All in 1 year.

We have Devon Conway on eligibility count down from SA. Then there is the future boy wonder of Rachin Ravindra, who may or may not be a superstar. But lets just say there is expectations on him starring.

Not to mention that for most of the past 7 years, Jesse Ryder was basically sacked. 

If NZL has finally started producing quality intl batsmen, why isn't England? There is something totally wrong with the England system. It has to be wrong, cos its failing. Repeatedly. Decade after decade.

Kookaburra has money. Far more money than Dukes. They make more gear than just balls, and sell to more countries. NZ uses a Kookaburra cos it paid to do so by Kookaburra. And presumably SA, SL and the likes are also paid. Kookaburra by giving away this dosh, or balls for free, gets endless free advertising. 

 Dukes doesn't have the money to compete with this deal. They only make balls. And because their balls are entirely handmade, they cost a lot more to boot. But makes a better ball for test cricket bowling. 

Faulkner has barely played  a Shield game in the last few years. 

He is plagued by knee trouble. When a mate asked him recently how his injuries were going he said they were ‘fu...d’. 

He isn’t. 

He is quoting Root’s perceptions. 

No I'm not a massive advocate of the current Aus development system for many of the reasons Baggers has elucidated in aforementioned posts.

We have our worst generation of Test batters for some time. Cricket, like many sports, is simply orientated around money at present. 20/20 and BBL reign supreme in Australia. We now have a period in summer from early December until late February when no FC or Shield cricket is played. How can a break in nearly 3 months in the middle of the cricket season be conducive to developing quality red ball cricketers?

Moreover, our pitches are very poor in encouraging the development of spin bowlers.

The last point is that batters from overseas suggest it is too easy batting on Aussie wickets.

I've seen a fair bit of Test cricket on Kiwi pitches.

Your test wickets are easy. And right now CA has a batting depth crisis. But since the AIS and Academy in the 1980's - you went through the 90's the naughties, and most of this decade with great batsmen. 

• Michael Bevan (SA/NSW/TAS)
• Greg Blewett (SA)
• 
  
• Michael Clarke (NSW)
• 
  
• Callum Ferguson (SA)
• Adam Gilchrist (NSW/WA)
• 
  
• Brad Haddin (NSW)
• 
  
• Brad Hodge (VIC)
• David Hussey (WA)
• Michael Hussey (WA)
• 
  
• 
  
• 
  
• Simon Katich (WA/NSW)
• 
  
• Justin Langer (WA)
• 
  
• Shaun Marsh (WA)
• Damien Martyn (WA)
• 
  
• Tim Paine (TAS)
• Ricky Ponting (TAS)
• Michael Slater (NSW)
• Andrew Symonds (QLD)
• 
  
• Shane Watson (QLD/NSW)
• Cameron White (VIC)
• 
  

David Warner (expelled)

On top of this, Lejmann, Hayden and Hughes and many more were state made. There is nothing wrong with the Aus production lines for at least batting at home. England don't even have batsmen for home.\

Now in the same time frame, England has developed Cook and Root. Trott and KP were imports. Buttler and Prior is being generous to include them. But lets say we do. It doesn't compare.

There is nothing wrong with your spin bowlers. The Academy expelled Warne and graduated MacGill. But you lost years worth of options when you sought a new leg spinner where the was none. It took you years to play Lyon. And even then NSW overlooked Sommerville at a state level who can demolish Pakistan in UAE at test level.

England has one spinner in Leach who is quality. Ali is made spinner. Who has been useful at times. But he was made at intl level. Not even domestic. After Swann they had noone, before Swann, it was what? Panesar? Tuffnell? Embury?