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sydneyfc1987
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]Where's all the blokes saying we'd never get to 80% fully vaxxed let alone 90%. Game over! yeah its amazing what threatening people with their and their families livelihoods will achieve. Awww diddums the selfish tradies with jet skis as their facebook profile pics cant continue to be selfish. The greatest imposition on civil rights since the holocaust (except the similar things happened with smallpox injections which were mandated as well). Using facebook evidence to argue for mandatory medical procedures and human rights abuses. Strong case there. Any side effects yet besides the ability to dodge a potentially lethal illness? /quote] Biggest Side effect now is the Government being able to come back as many times as they feel like during your lifetime and use you as a medical instrument. You will be used for viruses less deadly than this, and for drugs that are less effective. You don't get to decide where the line is. As has been previously mentioned, government mandated vaccination is nothing new and dates all the way back to the 19th Century. It only appears to be something new to you living in your privileged little first-world, 21st century existence. Well that makes it OK then Edit Sorry. Cant find past mandatory mentioned in thread or with Google. Can someone link This is a nice little history compilation. https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20211029-why-mandatory-vaccination-is-nothing-new
(VAR) IS NAVY BLUE
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sydneyfc1987
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]Where's all the blokes saying we'd never get to 80% fully vaxxed let alone 90%. Game over! yeah its amazing what threatening people with their and their families livelihoods will achieve. Awww diddums the selfish tradies with jet skis as their facebook profile pics cant continue to be selfish. The greatest imposition on civil rights since the holocaust (except the similar things happened with smallpox injections which were mandated as well). Using facebook evidence to argue for mandatory medical procedures and human rights abuses. Strong case there. Any side effects yet besides the ability to dodge a potentially lethal illness? /quote] Biggest Side effect now is the Government being able to come back as many times as they feel like during your lifetime and use you as a medical instrument. You will be used for viruses less deadly than this, and for drugs that are less effective. You don't get to decide where the line is. As has been previously mentioned, government mandated vaccination is nothing new and dates all the way back to the 19th Century. It only appears to be something new to you living in your privileged little first-world, 21st century existence. Sorry when did government mandated population-level vaccination take place using vaccines that were until a few weeks ago listed for emergency use only? Jesus. Even for you that is some truly incredible goalpost shifting.
(VAR) IS NAVY BLUE
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tsf
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Industry mandates bringing is literally only just happening. We haven’t even rounded the first corner.
So basically in the end you chose to get vaccinated and nothing has happened so the hoo haa was for nothing, you’re free to get on with life and work because the community as a whole has come together to tackle a once in 100 year pandemic.
You can now not worry….unless you got the vaccine which makes you impotent in a year, then you’re screwed.
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Enzo Bearzot
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]Where's all the blokes saying we'd never get to 80% fully vaxxed let alone 90%. Game over! yeah its amazing what threatening people with their and their families livelihoods will achieve. Awww diddums the selfish tradies with jet skis as their facebook profile pics cant continue to be selfish. The greatest imposition on civil rights since the holocaust (except the similar things happened with smallpox injections which were mandated as well). Using facebook evidence to argue for mandatory medical procedures and human rights abuses. Strong case there. Any side effects yet besides the ability to dodge a potentially lethal illness? /quote] Biggest Side effect now is the Government being able to come back as many times as they feel like during your lifetime and use you as a medical instrument. You will be used for viruses less deadly than this, and for drugs that are less effective. You don't get to decide where the line is. As has been previously mentioned, government mandated vaccination is nothing new and dates all the way back to the 19th Century. It only appears to be something new to you living in your privileged little first-world, 21st century existence. Sorry when did government mandated population-level vaccination take place using vaccines that were until a few weeks ago listed for emergency use only? Jesus. Even for you that is some truly incredible goalpost shifting. You don't think its significant your government and the media did not openly tell the people beyond putting it being hidden away on the TGA website that very few people would read -I'm willing to bet no-one this site know either- the vaccines were approved for emergency use at a time when there were government funded saturation campaigns urging people to get injected with them? You think that's ok?
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Enzo Bearzot
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+xIndustry mandates bringing is literally only just happening. We haven’t even rounded the first corner.
So basically in the end you chose to get vaccinated and nothing has happened so the hoo haa was for nothing, you’re free to get on with life and work because the community as a whole has come together to tackle a once in 100 year pandemic.
You can now not worry….unless you got the vaccine which makes you impotent in a year, then you’re screwed. The directives for mandatory vaccination came from the government first and industry followed because they had to. Up until then I was not vaccinated. They are the facts.
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Davide82
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]Where's all the blokes saying we'd never get to 80% fully vaxxed let alone 90%. Game over! yeah its amazing what threatening people with their and their families livelihoods will achieve. Awww diddums the selfish tradies with jet skis as their facebook profile pics cant continue to be selfish. The greatest imposition on civil rights since the holocaust (except the similar things happened with smallpox injections which were mandated as well). Using facebook evidence to argue for mandatory medical procedures and human rights abuses. Strong case there. Any side effects yet besides the ability to dodge a potentially lethal illness? /quote] Biggest Side effect now is the Government being able to come back as many times as they feel like during your lifetime and use you as a medical instrument. You will be used for viruses less deadly than this, and for drugs that are less effective. You don't get to decide where the line is. As has been previously mentioned, government mandated vaccination is nothing new and dates all the way back to the 19th Century. It only appears to be something new to you living in your privileged little first-world, 21st century existence. Well that makes it OK then Edit Sorry. Cant find past mandatory mentioned in thread or with Google. Can someone link Seriously? Regardless of the merits of this or that, if you couldn't find any info on that topic online you have SERIOUS issues. It's not even a question of "trusting the source" if you can't even find ONE.... Holy Jesus that's scary that this is the sort of person who is debating online with such self assurance. I think Enzo is the only person on the other "side" of these topics that I can actually listen to (when he is not playing games)
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numklpkgulftumch
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 1.9K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]Where's all the blokes saying we'd never get to 80% fully vaxxed let alone 90%. Game over! yeah its amazing what threatening people with their and their families livelihoods will achieve. Awww diddums the selfish tradies with jet skis as their facebook profile pics cant continue to be selfish. The greatest imposition on civil rights since the holocaust (except the similar things happened with smallpox injections which were mandated as well). Using facebook evidence to argue for mandatory medical procedures and human rights abuses. Strong case there. Any side effects yet besides the ability to dodge a potentially lethal illness? /quote] Biggest Side effect now is the Government being able to come back as many times as they feel like during your lifetime and use you as a medical instrument. You will be used for viruses less deadly than this, and for drugs that are less effective. You don't get to decide where the line is. As has been previously mentioned, government mandated vaccination is nothing new and dates all the way back to the 19th Century. It only appears to be something new to you living in your privileged little first-world, 21st century existence. Well that makes it OK then Edit Sorry. Cant find past mandatory mentioned in thread or with Google. Can someone link This is a nice little history compilation. https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20211029-why-mandatory-vaccination-is-nothing-new Ok, ta, sorry, I was looking at Australia. Still, conscientious objection seems to have been a consistent feature of democratic societies. This Public Health Act seems to have allowed many to get in touch with their Dictator side.
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numklpkgulftumch
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 1.9K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]Where's all the blokes saying we'd never get to 80% fully vaxxed let alone 90%. Game over! yeah its amazing what threatening people with their and their families livelihoods will achieve. Awww diddums the selfish tradies with jet skis as their facebook profile pics cant continue to be selfish. The greatest imposition on civil rights since the holocaust (except the similar things happened with smallpox injections which were mandated as well). Using facebook evidence to argue for mandatory medical procedures and human rights abuses. Strong case there. Any side effects yet besides the ability to dodge a potentially lethal illness? /quote] Biggest Side effect now is the Government being able to come back as many times as they feel like during your lifetime and use you as a medical instrument. You will be used for viruses less deadly than this, and for drugs that are less effective. You don't get to decide where the line is. As has been previously mentioned, government mandated vaccination is nothing new and dates all the way back to the 19th Century. It only appears to be something new to you living in your privileged little first-world, 21st century existence. Well that makes it OK then Edit Sorry. Cant find past mandatory mentioned in thread or with Google. Can someone link Seriously? Regardless of the merits of this or that, if you couldn't find any info on that topic online you have SERIOUS issues. It's not even a question of "trusting the source" if you can't even find ONE.... Holy Jesus that's scary that this is the sort of person who is debating online with such self assurance. I think Enzo is the only person on the other "side" of these topics that I can actually listen to (when he is not playing games) Thanks for that. I've had enough of the abuse in here Good day to you sir
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Enzo Bearzot
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Mandatory vaccination in the current circumstance is a very complex topic. Its actually balance between health and safety, human rights and privacy. None of those rights are absolute and anyone of those rights can be violated by the others, in the right circumstances.
Mandatory vaccination and whether it can be justified depends on contextual factors like the absolute risk of morbidity and mortality to an individual, the risk to the community an unvaccinated individual presents to others, the safety and efficacy- both short and long term of the vaccines-, the justifications to have previously-infected people vaccinate, whether there are other reasonable and effective measures to mitigate against spread and severe illness.
Saying that its OK to have mandatory vaccination now because its happened in the past in different contexts is too simplistic as the above considerations are specific to the diseases and vaccines against them.
I think it says a lot that the Victorian health department openly states that no vaccines in Victoria are mandatory. This really is an admission that the government does not actually have a sound case for mandatory vaccines.
Instead they rely on a what is essentially a legal loophole to ban people from working in their usual occupation for not vaccinating, and then frame it as a "choice".
Right now they can get away with it because there is still a climate of fear and the exact facts about this disease and its management by those in charge are somewhat opaque. However its only matter of time before this is seen for what it is: a violation of Article 23 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and the balance will shift against this policy.
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Muz
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Enzo Bearzot
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Interesting recent shift on vaccine policy: https://www.health.gov.au/initiatives-and-programs/covid-19-vaccines/advice-for-providers/clinical-considerationsVaccination can be deferred for up to 6 months as past infection reduces the chance of reinfection for at least this amount of time.
But of course, the government retains the same rhetoric that you still have the "choice" to be vaccinated when [you] have a job that requires [you] to be vaccinated. Contradictory juxtaposition of words: It is a choice, but at the same time legislates certain jobs require vaccination. They know they are walking a thin legal line. We'll see how the class action in Victoria will go. The NSW one was lost on the argument that its a choice to get vaccinated and taking away the right to work freely doesn't change that, but I suspect that lessons would have been learned from that case.
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patjennings
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+xI think it says a lot that the Victorian health department openly states that no vaccines in Victoria are mandatory. This really is an admission that the government does not actually have a sound case for mandatory vaccines. I think it says that traditionally Australians take up vaccines at a rate that does not require making vaccines mandatory. There has never been a need to.
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tsf
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for all the 'my immune system is strong' brigade...
someone I know, in 30s, fit as hell (boxer), didnt get the jab....in icu and it's looking very bad. He was trying to get a vaccine just before going to ICU - but too late. I am really hoping he is ok but it's very worrying. Someone else close to him is also in ICU and they look like they will not make it. Tragic. The family are besides themselves. He's terrified.
Just not worth rolling that dice.
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Muz
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+xMandatory vaccination in the current circumstance is a very complex topic. Its actually balance between health and safety, human rights and privacy. None of those rights are absolute and anyone of those rights can be violated by the others, in the right circumstances. Mandatory vaccination and whether it can be justified depends on contextual factors like the absolute risk of morbidity and mortality to an individual, the risk to the community an unvaccinated individual presents to others, the safety and efficacy- both short and long term of the vaccines-, the justifications to have previously-infected people vaccinate, whether there are other reasonable and effective measures to mitigate against spread and severe illness. Saying that its OK to have mandatory vaccination now because its happened in the past in different contexts is too simplistic as the above considerations are specific to the diseases and vaccines against them. I think it says a lot that the Victorian health department openly states that no vaccines in Victoria are mandatory. This really is an admission that the government does not actually have a sound case for mandatory vaccines. Instead they rely on a what is essentially a legal loophole to ban people from working in their usual occupation for not vaccinating, and then frame it as a "choice". Right now they can get away with it because there is still a climate of fear and the exact facts about this disease and its management by those in charge are somewhat opaque. However its only matter of time before this is seen for what it is: a violation of Article 23 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and the balance will shift against this policy. It's awesome seeing you not talk in absolutes for a change and then you flush it all away with your last sentence. (We ignore the UN on multiple issues, why we would give a shit now?) Also don't all vaccines uptakes work on 'a climate of fear'? It's the only reason I got all my kids vaccinated when they little because, for want of a better word, we were 'afraid' of them catching a preventable disease.
Member since 2008.
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mcjules
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+xThe NSW one was lost on the argument that its a choice to get vaccinated and taking away the right to work freely doesn't change that, but I suspect that lessons would have been learned from that case. There are tons of jobs I can't "freely" work because I don't meet they require being registered with their industry registration board (I suspect your line of work is one of those) and to do that you need to meet a stack of criteria. It's not uncommon for those criteria to be updated as time goes on as well.
Insert Gertjan Verbeek gifs here
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Burztur
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+x+xThe NSW one was lost on the argument that its a choice to get vaccinated and taking away the right to work freely doesn't change that, but I suspect that lessons would have been learned from that case. There are tons of jobs I can't "freely" work because I don't meet they require being registered with their industry registration board (I suspect your line of work is one of those) and to do that you need to meet a stack of criteria. It's not uncommon for those criteria to be updated as time goes on as well. CPD hours is oppression. How dare an authority mandate what I need to put into my mind. /s
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tsf
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+x+x+xThe NSW one was lost on the argument that its a choice to get vaccinated and taking away the right to work freely doesn't change that, but I suspect that lessons would have been learned from that case. There are tons of jobs I can't "freely" work because I don't meet they require being registered with their industry registration board (I suspect your line of work is one of those) and to do that you need to meet a stack of criteria. It's not uncommon for those criteria to be updated as time goes on as well. CPD hours is oppression. How dare an authority mandate what I need to put into my mind. /s Or helmets, or work shoes.
Ffs I had to wear a dinger at a brothel - my body my choice. Don’t put a corset on my cock!
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sydneyfc1987
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+x+xMandatory vaccination in the current circumstance is a very complex topic. Its actually balance between health and safety, human rights and privacy. None of those rights are absolute and anyone of those rights can be violated by the others, in the right circumstances. Mandatory vaccination and whether it can be justified depends on contextual factors like the absolute risk of morbidity and mortality to an individual, the risk to the community an unvaccinated individual presents to others, the safety and efficacy- both short and long term of the vaccines-, the justifications to have previously-infected people vaccinate, whether there are other reasonable and effective measures to mitigate against spread and severe illness. Saying that its OK to have mandatory vaccination now because its happened in the past in different contexts is too simplistic as the above considerations are specific to the diseases and vaccines against them. I think it says a lot that the Victorian health department openly states that no vaccines in Victoria are mandatory. This really is an admission that the government does not actually have a sound case for mandatory vaccines. Instead they rely on a what is essentially a legal loophole to ban people from working in their usual occupation for not vaccinating, and then frame it as a "choice". Right now they can get away with it because there is still a climate of fear and the exact facts about this disease and its management by those in charge are somewhat opaque. However its only matter of time before this is seen for what it is: a violation of Article 23 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and the balance will shift against this policy. It's awesome seeing you not talk in absolutes for a change and then you flush it all away with your last sentence. (We ignore the UN on multiple issues, why we would give a shit now?)
I would have thought Enzo would have been in the "abolish the UN" camp for sure.
(VAR) IS NAVY BLUE
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mcjules
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+x+x+x+xThe NSW one was lost on the argument that its a choice to get vaccinated and taking away the right to work freely doesn't change that, but I suspect that lessons would have been learned from that case. There are tons of jobs I can't "freely" work because I don't meet they require being registered with their industry registration board (I suspect your line of work is one of those) and to do that you need to meet a stack of criteria. It's not uncommon for those criteria to be updated as time goes on as well. CPD hours is oppression. How dare an authority mandate what I need to put into my mind. /s Or helmets, or work shoes.
Ffs I had to wear a dinger at a brothel - my body my choice. Don’t put a corset on my cock! Don't you know you can still get an STI even though you used a condom? They're a waste of time!
Insert Gertjan Verbeek gifs here
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
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+x+x+xMandatory vaccination in the current circumstance is a very complex topic. Its actually balance between health and safety, human rights and privacy. None of those rights are absolute and anyone of those rights can be violated by the others, in the right circumstances. Mandatory vaccination and whether it can be justified depends on contextual factors like the absolute risk of morbidity and mortality to an individual, the risk to the community an unvaccinated individual presents to others, the safety and efficacy- both short and long term of the vaccines-, the justifications to have previously-infected people vaccinate, whether there are other reasonable and effective measures to mitigate against spread and severe illness. Saying that its OK to have mandatory vaccination now because its happened in the past in different contexts is too simplistic as the above considerations are specific to the diseases and vaccines against them. I think it says a lot that the Victorian health department openly states that no vaccines in Victoria are mandatory. This really is an admission that the government does not actually have a sound case for mandatory vaccines. Instead they rely on a what is essentially a legal loophole to ban people from working in their usual occupation for not vaccinating, and then frame it as a "choice". Right now they can get away with it because there is still a climate of fear and the exact facts about this disease and its management by those in charge are somewhat opaque. However its only matter of time before this is seen for what it is: a violation of Article 23 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and the balance will shift against this policy. It's awesome seeing you not talk in absolutes for a change and then you flush it all away with your last sentence. (We ignore the UN on multiple issues, why we would give a shit now?)
I would have thought Enzo would have been in the "abolish the UN" camp for sure. Haha yes of course. Didn't even think about that but yes he'd be all over that.
Member since 2008.
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sydneyfc1987
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+xThe NSW one was lost on the argument that its a choice to get vaccinated and taking away the right to work freely doesn't change that, but I suspect that lessons would have been learned from that case. There are tons of jobs I can't "freely" work because I don't meet they require being registered with their industry registration board (I suspect your line of work is one of those) and to do that you need to meet a stack of criteria. It's not uncommon for those criteria to be updated as time goes on as well. CPD hours is oppression. How dare an authority mandate what I need to put into my mind. /s Or helmets, or work shoes.
Ffs I had to wear a dinger at a brothel - my body my choice. Don’t put a corset on my cock! Don't you know you can still get an STI even though you used a condom? They're a waste of time! Not to mention that the government is hiding the real numbers of adverse allergic reactions to latex from the public!
(VAR) IS NAVY BLUE
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Muz
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This was on Gruen the other week. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6tt88zzqvI
Member since 2008.
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tsf
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+xThe NSW one was lost on the argument that its a choice to get vaccinated and taking away the right to work freely doesn't change that, but I suspect that lessons would have been learned from that case. There are tons of jobs I can't "freely" work because I don't meet they require being registered with their industry registration board (I suspect your line of work is one of those) and to do that you need to meet a stack of criteria. It's not uncommon for those criteria to be updated as time goes on as well. CPD hours is oppression. How dare an authority mandate what I need to put into my mind. /s Or helmets, or work shoes.
Ffs I had to wear a dinger at a brothel - my body my choice. Don’t put a corset on my cock! Don't you know you can still get an STI even though you used a condom? They're a waste of time! I’m going to the knock shop now to protest!
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ErogenousZone
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+x+xThe NSW one was lost on the argument that its a choice to get vaccinated and taking away the right to work freely doesn't change that, but I suspect that lessons would have been learned from that case. There are tons of jobs I can't "freely" work because I don't meet they require being registered with their industry registration board (I suspect your line of work is one of those) and to do that you need to meet a stack of criteria. It's not uncommon for those criteria to be updated as time goes on as well. CPD hours is oppression. How dare an authority mandate what I need to put into my mind. /s Or helmets, or work shoes.
Ffs I had to wear a dinger at a brothel - my body my choice. Don’t put a corset on my cock! Don't you know you can still get an STI even though you used a condom? They're a waste of time! Not to mention that the government is hiding the real numbers of adverse allergic reactions to latex from the public! From what younger people tell me these days Skyns are the go for that issue.
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Burztur
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+x+xThe NSW one was lost on the argument that its a choice to get vaccinated and taking away the right to work freely doesn't change that, but I suspect that lessons would have been learned from that case. There are tons of jobs I can't "freely" work because I don't meet they require being registered with their industry registration board (I suspect your line of work is one of those) and to do that you need to meet a stack of criteria. It's not uncommon for those criteria to be updated as time goes on as well. CPD hours is oppression. How dare an authority mandate what I need to put into my mind. /s Or helmets, or work shoes.
Ffs I had to wear a dinger at a brothel - my body my choice. Don’t put a corset on my cock! Don't you know you can still get an STI even though you used a condom? They're a waste of time! Not to mention that the government is hiding the real numbers of adverse allergic reactions to latex from the public! Condoms are all about government control of the population!
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tsf
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Noticed a massive shift from people i know who were a year ago that covid was fake to now about govt tyranny. Somehow just all forgot it was fake 🤷🏼♂️
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ErogenousZone
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+xNoticed a massive shift from people i know who were a year ago that covid was fake to now about govt tyranny. Somehow just all forgot it was fake 🤷🏼♂️ Someone should tell them that in a tyranny you can't complain about the government as hard as everyone does in democratic countries. I imagine people who have actually lived under those regimes would be amused at some whiny bullshit.
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ErogenousZone
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+x+xIn better-ish news for NSW besides the reopening/cases and what I have been following is the number of hospitalisation has dropped a fair bit. Today - 766 COVID-19 cases admitted to hospital, with 155 people in intensive care, 74 of whom require ventilation. 1st October - 1,055 COVID-19 cases admitted to hospital, with 210 people in intensive care, 104 of whom require ventilation 15th September - 1,241 COVID-19 cases admitted to hospital, with 234 people in intensive care, 108 of whom require ventilation Still alot of people dying - 15th Sep - 254 deaths total. Today - 500 deaths total - More than doubled in less than a month. As of yesterday-ish hospitalisations going way down in NSW 381 COVID-19 cases admitted to hospital, with 82 people in intensive care, 38 of whom require ventilation. There have been 508 COVID-19 related deaths in NSW since 16 June 2021 and 564 in total since the start of the pandemic. There are currently 264 COVID-19 cases admitted to hospital, with 48 people in intensive care, 20 of whom require ventilation. NSW has recorded 537 COVID-19 related deaths since 16 June 2021 and 593 in total since the start of the pandemic.
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Davide82
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First time in my life I can officially say "I want to move to Qld".
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Burztur
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+xFirst time in my life I can officially say "I want to move to Qld". Please explain
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