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Also, if you want to play for a big club, it seems a huge advantage to be born in europe somewhere. Some 2nd tier euro nations are packed with players who play in the big 5 yet would struggle to get through asia judging by the wc performances (looking at you poland). And denmark looked only slightly better than us (if that) last world cup. So looking at how teams are on paper needs to take that into context
Playing to their potential and having acclimatised, Poland would canter through Asian qualification, if it had the luxury. Any Asian would dearly love to have Robert Lewandowski or Matty Cash. I think you seriously underestimate UEFA. The Swedes beat Spain and still didn’t qualify, FFS! Imagine the reaction on this forum if Australia beat Spain in a WCQ. The repêchage for UEFA featured Italy, Portugal and Sweden. I would say Sweden is about Japan’s level. In Asia, Japan has qualified with relative ease. In UEFA, (depending on the difficulty of the various group) a team of that quality is likely going to the repêchage play-offs Fancy going to the play-offs just to qualify for the WC and you’re up against the European champions. Or Cristiano Ronaldo + Bernardo Silva + João Felíx All that is true on paper but I would love to see a mid tier Euro team have to travel 24 hours on a plane, land 3 days before, train, play a match in completely opposite conditions than what they're used to, (jetlagged mind you), then head back across multiple time zones to the other side of the world and play again 3 days later. That would sort the wheat from the chaff pretty quickly. I agree to a point. But don't forget it's a double-edged sword. For any given European nation, they'd still have half their games at home (unless, God forbid, there were a pandemic and their government barred its own citizens from returning home). And that would mean that ME+A countries travelling a considerable way to play in unfamiliar conditions. So, for example, Saudi Arabia could find themselves playing in sleet on a night in Glasgow. How much fun would that that be for them? Meanwhile, the European nations would initially struggle. But after a couple of WC qualification campaigns, they'd become better at handling the conditions. So, roughly, I think they'd fare about as well as Japan do.
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+x+x+x+xWe played against Honduras last WC playoff and because we had some questionable results against asian teams, many people said that Honduras was going to win as they are from a 'better confederation'. The same thing happened this WC cycle. By now, can we at least give Asia some respect? I was going to start a thread on something like this topic. Thanks for doing it instead, Pasquali. I'm out of the coaching loop now. I think when I was still doing coaching courses in 2013 or 2014, often our coach educators from FFA/Football Australia, were constantly saying that our Asian opposition were often far better technicians than us in Australia, but naive tactically. The race was on for us to improve technically, because as our Asian opposition improved tactically, it would not be long before they would be too good for us they said. Of course it takes a lot longer to build technique than tactical nous. Even though we didn't score today, I thought we had more scoring chances than Peru. I thought their ability defending set pieces and crosses was inferior to most of our recent Asian opposition. Today's victory was not only fantastic for the Socceroos, but it demonstrated by the 5th ranked Asian team defeating the 5th ranked South American powerhouse Football Federation, generally recognised as second ranked in the world after Europe, the Asian Confederation has improved relative to the rest of the world. Many Eurosnobs in Australia perceive only Europe and South America as having any semblance of football quality. They also think we only won against Uruguay in 2005, because we had lots of players playing in big European leagues. Apart from Hrustic playing for Eintracht Frankfurt, mainly as a sub, and Ryan as a reserve La Liga keeper, none of our other Socceroos play in the European big five leagues ( England, France, Germany, Italy, Spain) do they? If that is the case, it also demonstrates how much a better the Socceroo team unit is than the individuals who comprise that team. Today's Socceroo victory refutes that notion Asa is a football backwater. I think every 5th ranked South American country has won every other intercontinental play off apart from us in 2005 and 2022? Im as happy as anyone but lets not get too carried away with one off games (decided on penalties no less) bearing any credence on Asia being a better confederation than Sth America..... No one is saying that the Asian Confederation is 'better' than the South American. Its just that outside of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay the others arent that strong infact i'd put them on par with our best 5 asian teams (Iran, S Korea, Japan, Australia, Saudi). Of course Columbia , chile and paraguay have a golden gen every now and then (Colombia mid nineties and 2014, Chile 10-16, Paraguay around 2000) but we place too much value on these teams generally its been shown. This game, the last time socceroos played chile and Columbia we've been as good if not better than them all of them. Granted some fair points and lets not forget about any game, who's going to put it on today those 90mins. Another point is those Sth American Clubs/players have a number more X players performing in big leagues compared to us recent and past thats why we have always never felt confident playing them barring as mentioned above one of those days luck and all goes your way as has occurred. Colombia, a recent Diaz would smoke us, Falco up front in his days, Cuadrabo/Juve, Hammers Rodriguez. Chile, Vidal, A Sanchez, Maripan, Bravo and their recent past gen as you mentioned. Paraguay, Sante Cruz, Almiron and most stay local or in the Americas league. Sure we've looked ok against them but its all biting finger nail viewing be it Arnie as coach Ange at the helm or whoever. Lets get it into persepctive, this game we were lucky and thats the beauty of football or any ball game as said "on the day". Those first 20 odd mins their footwork/movement on off the ball showed they had far better skill but their tactics we're all wrong and we could gain composure and importantly defensively we hung in and they couldn't make that final pass work. That post saved our bacon wasn't to be their day.
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quickflick
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+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp I think like many Aussie football fans, you are far too dismissive about the improving qualities of Asian football. They've improved technically but not result-wise. How many Asian teams made it out of the groups stage last WC? Or 2014? Or 2010? How many Asian teams have ever made it to the semi-finals of a WC? Sorry Decentric, but that's the best measure. And Asia does crap, in that respect.
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quickflick
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Also, if you want to play for a big club, it seems a huge advantage to be born in europe somewhere. Some 2nd tier euro nations are packed with players who play in the big 5 yet would struggle to get through asia judging by the wc performances (looking at you poland). And denmark looked only slightly better than us (if that) last world cup. So looking at how teams are on paper needs to take that into context
Playing to their potential and having acclimatised, Poland would canter through Asian qualification, if it had the luxury. Any Asian would dearly love to have Robert Lewandowski or Matty Cash. I think you seriously underestimate UEFA. The Swedes beat Spain and still didn’t qualify, FFS! Imagine the reaction on this forum if Australia beat Spain in a WCQ. The repêchage for UEFA featured Italy, Portugal and Sweden. I would say Sweden is about Japan’s level. In Asia, Japan has qualified with relative ease. In UEFA, (depending on the difficulty of the various group) a team of that quality is likely going to the repêchage play-offs Fancy going to the play-offs just to qualify for the WC and you’re up against the European champions. Or Cristiano Ronaldo + Bernardo Silva + João Felíx All that is true on paper but I would love to see a mid tier Euro team have to travel 24 hours on a plane, land 3 days before, train, play a match in completely opposite conditions than what they're used to, (jetlagged mind you), then head back across multiple time zones to the other side of the world and play again 3 days later. That would sort the wheat from the chaff pretty quickly. So, for example, Saudi Arabia could find themselves playing in sleet on a night in Glasgow. How much fun would that that be for them? On this point, the ME+A teams travel really badly, with the exception of Japan and possibly Korea. They don't like coming to Australia. Although, annoyingly, the Saudis have improved this campaign. Even Japan weren't thrilled about the prospect of having to play in a place other than Melbourne or Sydney. They didn't want to play in a less international city where there are fewer Japanese fans, iirc. So while really international cities like London mightn't displease ME+A countries, I can't imagine that they'd be very happy to travel to bogan equivalent parts of Europe.
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quickflick
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+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp Did you actually watch all the Socceroo games in this WCQ campaign, particularly the last round? All of them. Did you watch any of the WCQs for any other confederation? I did. I followed Portugal (my second team) and Sweden (my friends' team). I also tried to watch extended highlights of other matches. Do you watch any professional football other than Socceroos matches and the HAL? I think you're a nice person Decentric who is well-versed in FFA coaching methodology. But with all due respect, I consider you an FFA apparatchik. I cannot recall ever reading anything where you've criticised the current administration, NT manager or the playing group, as a whole. While you may have followed international/foreign football closely at some stage, my impression is that you're completely locked into the football scene here and nowhere else. You appear to regard any coaching guidance handed down by the FFA as gospel. These kind of conversations almost have shades of a discussion about "liberal democracy" with a Chinese person inculcated in "Xi Jinping Thought". We're coming at this from such different angles.
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quickflick
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+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp Unless France has a really bad day, their quality should be far too much for us. However, Denmark and Tunisia are winnable games. I agree.
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LFC.
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+x+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp I think like many Aussie football fans, you are far too dismissive about the improving qualities of Asian football.
They've improved technically but not result-wise. How many Asian teams made it out of the groups stage last WC? Or 2014? Or 2010? How many Asian teams have ever made it to the semi-finals of a WC? Sorry Decentric, but that's the best measure. And Asia does crap, in that respect. BA BOOM spot on...... Results earn respect and until Asian teams stand up and get through to Qrtrs let alone 2nd rounds more - the Africans have been in 3 x Qrtrs starting back in 02, 2nd rounds x 5 times, thats what gets notice, above all they have had big name players in big leagues adding to their reputation and results. Of the Asian NT's Japan is in the most likely position to make some noise for our region as long as the planets align for them going deeper.
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Davide82
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+x+x+x+x+xWe played against Honduras last WC playoff and because we had some questionable results against asian teams, many people said that Honduras was going to win as they are from a 'better confederation'. The same thing happened this WC cycle. By now, can we at least give Asia some respect? I was going to start a thread on something like this topic. Thanks for doing it instead, Pasquali. I'm out of the coaching loop now. I think when I was still doing coaching courses in 2013 or 2014, often our coach educators from FFA/Football Australia, were constantly saying that our Asian opposition were often far better technicians than us in Australia, but naive tactically. The race was on for us to improve technically, because as our Asian opposition improved tactically, it would not be long before they would be too good for us they said. Of course it takes a lot longer to build technique than tactical nous. Even though we didn't score today, I thought we had more scoring chances than Peru. I thought their ability defending set pieces and crosses was inferior to most of our recent Asian opposition. Today's victory was not only fantastic for the Socceroos, but it demonstrated by the 5th ranked Asian team defeating the 5th ranked South American powerhouse Football Federation, generally recognised as second ranked in the world after Europe, the Asian Confederation has improved relative to the rest of the world. Many Eurosnobs in Australia perceive only Europe and South America as having any semblance of football quality. They also think we only won against Uruguay in 2005, because we had lots of players playing in big European leagues. Apart from Hrustic playing for Eintracht Frankfurt, mainly as a sub, and Ryan as a reserve La Liga keeper, none of our other Socceroos play in the European big five leagues ( England, France, Germany, Italy, Spain) do they? If that is the case, it also demonstrates how much a better the Socceroo team unit is than the individuals who comprise that team. Today's Socceroo victory refutes that notion Asa is a football backwater. I think every 5th ranked South American country has won every other intercontinental play off apart from us in 2005 and 2022? Im as happy as anyone but lets not get too carried away with one off games (decided on penalties no less) bearing any credence on Asia being a better confederation than Sth America..... No one is saying that the Asian Confederation is 'better' than the South American. Its just that outside of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay the others arent that strong infact i'd put them on par with our best 5 asian teams (Iran, S Korea, Japan, Australia, Saudi). Of course Columbia , chile and paraguay have a golden gen every now and then (Colombia mid nineties and 2014, Chile 10-16, Paraguay around 2000) but we place too much value on these teams generally its been shown. This game, the last time socceroos played chile and Columbia we've been as good if not better than them all of them. Lets get it into persepctive, this game we were lucky and thats the beauty of football or any ball game as said "on the day". Sorry, I like you as a poster but that is UTTER horseshit. We can debate the advantage of knowing the conditions better or that they chose arrogantly to not acclimatise etc etc all day But none of that is luck
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grazorblade
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Ah the eurosnobs are here, facing this dilemma of course
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LFC.
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+x+x+x+x+x+xWe played against Honduras last WC playoff and because we had some questionable results against asian teams, many people said that Honduras was going to win as they are from a 'better confederation'. The same thing happened this WC cycle. By now, can we at least give Asia some respect? I was going to start a thread on something like this topic. Thanks for doing it instead, Pasquali. I'm out of the coaching loop now. I think when I was still doing coaching courses in 2013 or 2014, often our coach educators from FFA/Football Australia, were constantly saying that our Asian opposition were often far better technicians than us in Australia, but naive tactically. The race was on for us to improve technically, because as our Asian opposition improved tactically, it would not be long before they would be too good for us they said. Of course it takes a lot longer to build technique than tactical nous. Even though we didn't score today, I thought we had more scoring chances than Peru. I thought their ability defending set pieces and crosses was inferior to most of our recent Asian opposition. Today's victory was not only fantastic for the Socceroos, but it demonstrated by the 5th ranked Asian team defeating the 5th ranked South American powerhouse Football Federation, generally recognised as second ranked in the world after Europe, the Asian Confederation has improved relative to the rest of the world. Many Eurosnobs in Australia perceive only Europe and South America as having any semblance of football quality. They also think we only won against Uruguay in 2005, because we had lots of players playing in big European leagues. Apart from Hrustic playing for Eintracht Frankfurt, mainly as a sub, and Ryan as a reserve La Liga keeper, none of our other Socceroos play in the European big five leagues ( England, France, Germany, Italy, Spain) do they? If that is the case, it also demonstrates how much a better the Socceroo team unit is than the individuals who comprise that team. Today's Socceroo victory refutes that notion Asa is a football backwater. I think every 5th ranked South American country has won every other intercontinental play off apart from us in 2005 and 2022? Im as happy as anyone but lets not get too carried away with one off games (decided on penalties no less) bearing any credence on Asia being a better confederation than Sth America..... No one is saying that the Asian Confederation is 'better' than the South American. Its just that outside of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay the others arent that strong infact i'd put them on par with our best 5 asian teams (Iran, S Korea, Japan, Australia, Saudi). Of course Columbia , chile and paraguay have a golden gen every now and then (Colombia mid nineties and 2014, Chile 10-16, Paraguay around 2000) but we place too much value on these teams generally its been shown. This game, the last time socceroos played chile and Columbia we've been as good if not better than them all of them. Lets get it into persepctive, this game we were lucky and thats the beauty of football or any ball game as said "on the day". Sorry, I like you as a poster but that is UTTER horseshit. We can debate the advantage of knowing the conditions better or that they chose arrogantly to not acclimatise etc etc all day But none of that is luck True re climatising and we did manage prepping for this game better than them, sure thats not luck at the same time they were unlucky/or we were lucky, the woodwork sure helped our cause wether planned or not forcing the errors. We deserved it more overall but it was one of those games x mm's that could have gone either way no ? No offense taken mate ditto.
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Booney
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+x+x+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp I think like many Aussie football fans, you are far too dismissive about the improving qualities of Asian football.
They've improved technically but not result-wise. How many Asian teams made it out of the groups stage last WC? Or 2014? Or 2010? How many Asian teams have ever made it to the semi-finals of a WC? Sorry Decentric, but that's the best measure. And Asia does crap, in that respect. BA BOOM spot on...... Results earn respect and until Asian teams stand up and get through to Qrtrs let alone 2nd rounds more - the Africans have been in 3 x Qrtrs starting back in 02, 2nd rounds x 5 times, thats what gets notice, above all they have had big name players in big leagues adding to their reputation and results. Of the Asian NT's Japan is in the most likely position to make some noise for our region as long as the planets align for them going deeper. Didn't S Korea under the guidance of one Guus Hiddink make it to the semis of the 2002 WC which was co -hosted by Japan and S Korea?Admittedly with some dodgy refereeing in the game against Italy I think
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Keeper66
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+x+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp I think like many Aussie football fans, you are far too dismissive about the improving qualities of Asian football. They've improved technically but not result-wise. How many Asian teams made it out of the groups stage last WC? Or 2014? Or 2010? How many Asian teams have ever made it to the semi-finals of a WC?Sorry Decentric, but that's the best measure. And Asia does crap, in that respect. Well, I believe it is one more than the number of African teams that have made it to the semi-finals (South Korea 2002).
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Muz
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Also, if you want to play for a big club, it seems a huge advantage to be born in europe somewhere. Some 2nd tier euro nations are packed with players who play in the big 5 yet would struggle to get through asia judging by the wc performances (looking at you poland). And denmark looked only slightly better than us (if that) last world cup. So looking at how teams are on paper needs to take that into context
Playing to their potential and having acclimatised, Poland would canter through Asian qualification, if it had the luxury. Any Asian would dearly love to have Robert Lewandowski or Matty Cash. I think you seriously underestimate UEFA. The Swedes beat Spain and still didn’t qualify, FFS! Imagine the reaction on this forum if Australia beat Spain in a WCQ. The repêchage for UEFA featured Italy, Portugal and Sweden. I would say Sweden is about Japan’s level. In Asia, Japan has qualified with relative ease. In UEFA, (depending on the difficulty of the various group) a team of that quality is likely going to the repêchage play-offs Fancy going to the play-offs just to qualify for the WC and you’re up against the European champions. Or Cristiano Ronaldo + Bernardo Silva + João Felíx All that is true on paper but I would love to see a mid tier Euro team have to travel 24 hours on a plane, land 3 days before, train, play a match in completely opposite conditions than what they're used to, (jetlagged mind you), then head back across multiple time zones to the other side of the world and play again 3 days later. That would sort the wheat from the chaff pretty quickly. I agree to a point. But don't forget it's a double-edged sword. For any given European nation, they'd still have half their games at home (unless, God forbid, there were a pandemic and their government barred its own citizens from returning home). And that would mean that ME+A countries travelling a considerable way to play in unfamiliar conditions. So, for example, Saudi Arabia could find themselves playing in sleet on a night in Glasgow. How much fun would that that be for them? Meanwhile, the European nations would initially struggle. But after a couple of WC qualification campaigns, they'd become better at handling the conditions. So, roughly, I think they'd fare about as well as Japan do. Middle Eastern teams are barely a time zone or 2 away. I'm talking a 24 hour flight with 2 transfers and a 3 hour bus trip from the airport to play Thailand in Bangkok on a 30 degree night with 95% humidity. That would fuck up more than a few teams I'm sure.
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LFC.
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp I think like many Aussie football fans, you are far too dismissive about the improving qualities of Asian football.
They've improved technically but not result-wise. How many Asian teams made it out of the groups stage last WC? Or 2014? Or 2010? How many Asian teams have ever made it to the semi-finals of a WC? Sorry Decentric, but that's the best measure. And Asia does crap, in that respect. BA BOOM spot on...... Results earn respect and until Asian teams stand up and get through to Qrtrs let alone 2nd rounds more - the Africans have been in 3 x Qrtrs starting back in 02, 2nd rounds x 5 times, thats what gets notice, above all they have had big name players in big leagues adding to their reputation and results. Of the Asian NT's Japan is in the most likely position to make some noise for our region as long as the planets align for them going deeper. Didn't S Korea under the guidance of one Guus Hiddink make it to the semis of the 2002 WC which was co -hosted by Japan and S Korea?Admittedly with some dodgy refereeing in the game against Italy I think ah yes bud R16 it was with Guus/Pim actually thanks correcting me. 2010 to knockout stage as well. Seems nobody notices or cares suppose.
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Enzo Bearzot
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+x+x+x+x+x+xWe played against Honduras last WC playoff and because we had some questionable results against asian teams, many people said that Honduras was going to win as they are from a 'better confederation'. The same thing happened this WC cycle. By now, can we at least give Asia some respect? I was going to start a thread on something like this topic. Thanks for doing it instead, Pasquali. I'm out of the coaching loop now. I think when I was still doing coaching courses in 2013 or 2014, often our coach educators from FFA/Football Australia, were constantly saying that our Asian opposition were often far better technicians than us in Australia, but naive tactically. The race was on for us to improve technically, because as our Asian opposition improved tactically, it would not be long before they would be too good for us they said. Of course it takes a lot longer to build technique than tactical nous. Even though we didn't score today, I thought we had more scoring chances than Peru. I thought their ability defending set pieces and crosses was inferior to most of our recent Asian opposition. Today's victory was not only fantastic for the Socceroos, but it demonstrated by the 5th ranked Asian team defeating the 5th ranked South American powerhouse Football Federation, generally recognised as second ranked in the world after Europe, the Asian Confederation has improved relative to the rest of the world. Many Eurosnobs in Australia perceive only Europe and South America as having any semblance of football quality. They also think we only won against Uruguay in 2005, because we had lots of players playing in big European leagues. Apart from Hrustic playing for Eintracht Frankfurt, mainly as a sub, and Ryan as a reserve La Liga keeper, none of our other Socceroos play in the European big five leagues ( England, France, Germany, Italy, Spain) do they? If that is the case, it also demonstrates how much a better the Socceroo team unit is than the individuals who comprise that team. Today's Socceroo victory refutes that notion Asa is a football backwater. I think every 5th ranked South American country has won every other intercontinental play off apart from us in 2005 and 2022? Im as happy as anyone but lets not get too carried away with one off games (decided on penalties no less) bearing any credence on Asia being a better confederation than Sth America..... No one is saying that the Asian Confederation is 'better' than the South American. Its just that outside of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay the others arent that strong infact i'd put them on par with our best 5 asian teams (Iran, S Korea, Japan, Australia, Saudi). Of course Columbia , chile and paraguay have a golden gen every now and then (Colombia mid nineties and 2014, Chile 10-16, Paraguay around 2000) but we place too much value on these teams generally its been shown. This game, the last time socceroos played chile and Columbia we've been as good if not better than them all of them. Lets get it into persepctive, this game we were lucky and thats the beauty of football or any ball game as said "on the day". Sorry, I like you as a poster but that is UTTER horseshit. We can debate the advantage of knowing the conditions better or that they chose arrogantly to not acclimatise etc etc all day But none of that is luck Penalties are though.
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Keeper66
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+x+x+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp I think like many Aussie football fans, you are far too dismissive about the improving qualities of Asian football.
They've improved technically but not result-wise. How many Asian teams made it out of the groups stage last WC? Or 2014? Or 2010? How many Asian teams have ever made it to the semi-finals of a WC? Sorry Decentric, but that's the best measure. And Asia does crap, in that respect. BA BOOM spot on...... Results earn respect and until Asian teams stand up and get through to Qrtrs let alone 2nd rounds more - the Africans have been in 3 x Qrtrs starting back in 02, 2nd rounds x 5 times, thats what gets notice, above all they have had big name players in big leagues adding to their reputation and results. Of the Asian NT's Japan is in the most likely position to make some noise for our region as long as the planets align for them going deeper. Re Africans in quarter finals, I believe it is 2 not 3 since 2002 (Senegal 2002, Ghana 2010).
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Davide82
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe played against Honduras last WC playoff and because we had some questionable results against asian teams, many people said that Honduras was going to win as they are from a 'better confederation'. The same thing happened this WC cycle. By now, can we at least give Asia some respect? I was going to start a thread on something like this topic. Thanks for doing it instead, Pasquali. I'm out of the coaching loop now. I think when I was still doing coaching courses in 2013 or 2014, often our coach educators from FFA/Football Australia, were constantly saying that our Asian opposition were often far better technicians than us in Australia, but naive tactically. The race was on for us to improve technically, because as our Asian opposition improved tactically, it would not be long before they would be too good for us they said. Of course it takes a lot longer to build technique than tactical nous. Even though we didn't score today, I thought we had more scoring chances than Peru. I thought their ability defending set pieces and crosses was inferior to most of our recent Asian opposition. Today's victory was not only fantastic for the Socceroos, but it demonstrated by the 5th ranked Asian team defeating the 5th ranked South American powerhouse Football Federation, generally recognised as second ranked in the world after Europe, the Asian Confederation has improved relative to the rest of the world. Many Eurosnobs in Australia perceive only Europe and South America as having any semblance of football quality. They also think we only won against Uruguay in 2005, because we had lots of players playing in big European leagues. Apart from Hrustic playing for Eintracht Frankfurt, mainly as a sub, and Ryan as a reserve La Liga keeper, none of our other Socceroos play in the European big five leagues ( England, France, Germany, Italy, Spain) do they? If that is the case, it also demonstrates how much a better the Socceroo team unit is than the individuals who comprise that team. Today's Socceroo victory refutes that notion Asa is a football backwater. I think every 5th ranked South American country has won every other intercontinental play off apart from us in 2005 and 2022? Im as happy as anyone but lets not get too carried away with one off games (decided on penalties no less) bearing any credence on Asia being a better confederation than Sth America..... No one is saying that the Asian Confederation is 'better' than the South American. Its just that outside of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay the others arent that strong infact i'd put them on par with our best 5 asian teams (Iran, S Korea, Japan, Australia, Saudi). Of course Columbia , chile and paraguay have a golden gen every now and then (Colombia mid nineties and 2014, Chile 10-16, Paraguay around 2000) but we place too much value on these teams generally its been shown. This game, the last time socceroos played chile and Columbia we've been as good if not better than them all of them. Lets get it into persepctive, this game we were lucky and thats the beauty of football or any ball game as said "on the day". Sorry, I like you as a poster but that is UTTER horseshit. We can debate the advantage of knowing the conditions better or that they chose arrogantly to not acclimatise etc etc all day But none of that is luck We deserved it more overall but it was one of those games x mm's that could have gone either way no ? Sure, but by that standard the majority of football games in the world are decided by luck. I don't think it's lucky to win just coz your opponent had one good chance in one of their 2 or 3 10 minute good spells in 120 minutes. Anyway
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Davide82
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe played against Honduras last WC playoff and because we had some questionable results against asian teams, many people said that Honduras was going to win as they are from a 'better confederation'. The same thing happened this WC cycle. By now, can we at least give Asia some respect? I was going to start a thread on something like this topic. Thanks for doing it instead, Pasquali. I'm out of the coaching loop now. I think when I was still doing coaching courses in 2013 or 2014, often our coach educators from FFA/Football Australia, were constantly saying that our Asian opposition were often far better technicians than us in Australia, but naive tactically. The race was on for us to improve technically, because as our Asian opposition improved tactically, it would not be long before they would be too good for us they said. Of course it takes a lot longer to build technique than tactical nous. Even though we didn't score today, I thought we had more scoring chances than Peru. I thought their ability defending set pieces and crosses was inferior to most of our recent Asian opposition. Today's victory was not only fantastic for the Socceroos, but it demonstrated by the 5th ranked Asian team defeating the 5th ranked South American powerhouse Football Federation, generally recognised as second ranked in the world after Europe, the Asian Confederation has improved relative to the rest of the world. Many Eurosnobs in Australia perceive only Europe and South America as having any semblance of football quality. They also think we only won against Uruguay in 2005, because we had lots of players playing in big European leagues. Apart from Hrustic playing for Eintracht Frankfurt, mainly as a sub, and Ryan as a reserve La Liga keeper, none of our other Socceroos play in the European big five leagues ( England, France, Germany, Italy, Spain) do they? If that is the case, it also demonstrates how much a better the Socceroo team unit is than the individuals who comprise that team. Today's Socceroo victory refutes that notion Asa is a football backwater. I think every 5th ranked South American country has won every other intercontinental play off apart from us in 2005 and 2022? Im as happy as anyone but lets not get too carried away with one off games (decided on penalties no less) bearing any credence on Asia being a better confederation than Sth America..... No one is saying that the Asian Confederation is 'better' than the South American. Its just that outside of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay the others arent that strong infact i'd put them on par with our best 5 asian teams (Iran, S Korea, Japan, Australia, Saudi). Of course Columbia , chile and paraguay have a golden gen every now and then (Colombia mid nineties and 2014, Chile 10-16, Paraguay around 2000) but we place too much value on these teams generally its been shown. This game, the last time socceroos played chile and Columbia we've been as good if not better than them all of them. Lets get it into persepctive, this game we were lucky and thats the beauty of football or any ball game as said "on the day". Sorry, I like you as a poster but that is UTTER horseshit. We can debate the advantage of knowing the conditions better or that they chose arrogantly to not acclimatise etc etc all day But none of that is luck Penalties are though. Maybe MORE to do with luck than a 90 minute result, sure. Not sure it's 100% luck. Planning and mental strength do still come into it. It's luck on the level of a good poker hand or something but not like a dice roll
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Davide82
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp I think like many Aussie football fans, you are far too dismissive about the improving qualities of Asian football.
They've improved technically but not result-wise. How many Asian teams made it out of the groups stage last WC? Or 2014? Or 2010? How many Asian teams have ever made it to the semi-finals of a WC? Sorry Decentric, but that's the best measure. And Asia does crap, in that respect. BA BOOM spot on...... Results earn respect and until Asian teams stand up and get through to Qrtrs let alone 2nd rounds more - the Africans have been in 3 x Qrtrs starting back in 02, 2nd rounds x 5 times, thats what gets notice, above all they have had big name players in big leagues adding to their reputation and results. Of the Asian NT's Japan is in the most likely position to make some noise for our region as long as the planets align for them going deeper. Didn't S Korea under the guidance of one Guus Hiddink make it to the semis of the 2002 WC which was co -hosted by Japan and S Korea?Admittedly with some dodgy refereeing in the game against Italy I think I'll say aha I've never seen a more insanely corrupt game. Whether from literal corruption or just the ref losing his mind in the occasion I won't speculate on. Referee: Moreno was then investigated by FIFA and suspended by his own federation for 20 matches for “time keeping errors.” He then did time in jail for smuggling six kilograms of heroin in 2010 at John F. Kennedy International Airport in New York City. .
Their next win vs Spain was just as corrupt but memory is hazy and the article didn't have details aha
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grazorblade
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+x+x+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp I think like many Aussie football fans, you are far too dismissive about the improving qualities of Asian football. They've improved technically but not result-wise. How many Asian teams made it out of the groups stage last WC? Or 2014? Or 2010? How many Asian teams have ever made it to the semi-finals of a WC?Sorry Decentric, but that's the best measure. And Asia does crap, in that respect. Well, I believe it is one more than the number of African teams that have made it to the semi-finals (South Korea 2002). has a concacaf team ever made it to the semis? It's not just the quality of the top team that should determine the quality of a confederation. It's also their weaker teams Curious how many confederations have knocked out a conmenbol team in an interconfederation playoff? AFC's 5th best pulled it off. But it's the 10th best team (or even the 20th best) that makes the afc hard compared to many confederations. Our 10th best team this time round was a country of 1 billion people, second largest economy in the world, a domestic league better than the MLS and having a striker who has played 100 games in the la liga If you take our 20th best, how does that compare to caf, conmenbol or concacaf's 20th?
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grazorblade
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp I think like many Aussie football fans, you are far too dismissive about the improving qualities of Asian football.
They've improved technically but not result-wise. How many Asian teams made it out of the groups stage last WC? Or 2014? Or 2010? How many Asian teams have ever made it to the semi-finals of a WC? Sorry Decentric, but that's the best measure. And Asia does crap, in that respect. BA BOOM spot on...... Results earn respect and until Asian teams stand up and get through to Qrtrs let alone 2nd rounds more - the Africans have been in 3 x Qrtrs starting back in 02, 2nd rounds x 5 times, thats what gets notice, above all they have had big name players in big leagues adding to their reputation and results. Of the Asian NT's Japan is in the most likely position to make some noise for our region as long as the planets align for them going deeper. Didn't S Korea under the guidance of one Guus Hiddink make it to the semis of the 2002 WC which was co -hosted by Japan and S Korea?Admittedly with some dodgy refereeing in the game against Italy I think I'll say aha I've never seen a more insanely corrupt game. Whether from literal corruption or just the ref losing his mind in the occasion I won't speculate on. Referee: Moreno was then investigated by FIFA and suspended by his own federation for 20 matches for “time keeping errors.” He then did time in jail for smuggling six kilograms of heroin in 2010 at John F. Kennedy International Airport in New York City. .
Their next win vs Spain was just as corrupt but memory is hazy and the article didn't have details aha I reckon australia has had worse refereeing at times (that game against syria). In the end SK were good enough to make the final four. AFC I think is the only confederation outside the big two to achieve that
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patjennings
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Europe and South America are rightly the highest rated federations.
I would actually rate Asia and CAF ahead of CONCACAF who apart from Mexico are extremely poor. Oceania of course brings up the rear.
AFC is too large and the travel is the killer. A grouping of the AFC plus West Asia together with a grouping of East Asia and Oceania would make much more sense.
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Barca4Life
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The World Cup will be another level from this current campaign, we will need to go to another level and from what ive seen this team needs to improve alot even that we had to go through via the penalty shootout.
But the group stages game's the opponents will be ready for us and preparation will be evened out.
The fact its played in November will be interesting considering how fatigued teams are in June, but this time it will be different.
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Bunch of Hacks
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+x+x+x+x+xWe played against Honduras last WC playoff and because we had some questionable results against asian teams, many people said that Honduras was going to win as they are from a 'better confederation'. The same thing happened this WC cycle. By now, can we at least give Asia some respect? I was going to start a thread on something like this topic. Thanks for doing it instead, Pasquali. I'm out of the coaching loop now. I think when I was still doing coaching courses in 2013 or 2014, often our coach educators from FFA/Football Australia, were constantly saying that our Asian opposition were often far better technicians than us in Australia, but naive tactically. The race was on for us to improve technically, because as our Asian opposition improved tactically, it would not be long before they would be too good for us they said. Of course it takes a lot longer to build technique than tactical nous. Even though we didn't score today, I thought we had more scoring chances than Peru. I thought their ability defending set pieces and crosses was inferior to most of our recent Asian opposition. Today's victory was not only fantastic for the Socceroos, but it demonstrated by the 5th ranked Asian team defeating the 5th ranked South American powerhouse Football Federation, generally recognised as second ranked in the world after Europe, the Asian Confederation has improved relative to the rest of the world. Many Eurosnobs in Australia perceive only Europe and South America as having any semblance of football quality. They also think we only won against Uruguay in 2005, because we had lots of players playing in big European leagues. Apart from Hrustic playing for Eintracht Frankfurt, mainly as a sub, and Ryan as a reserve La Liga keeper, none of our other Socceroos play in the European big five leagues ( England, France, Germany, Italy, Spain) do they? If that is the case, it also demonstrates how much a better the Socceroo team unit is than the individuals who comprise that team. Today's Socceroo victory refutes that notion Asa is a football backwater. I think every 5th ranked South American country has won every other intercontinental play off apart from us in 2005 and 2022? Im as happy as anyone but lets not get too carried away with one off games (decided on penalties no less) bearing any credence on Asia being a better confederation than Sth America..... No one is saying that the Asian Confederation is 'better' than the South American. Its just that outside of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay the others arent that strong infact i'd put them on par with our best 5 asian teams (Iran, S Korea, Japan, Australia, Saudi). Of course Columbia , chile and paraguay have a golden gen every now and then (Colombia mid nineties and 2014, Chile 10-16, Paraguay around 2000) but we place too much value on these teams generally its been shown. This game, the last time socceroos played chile and Columbia we've been as good if not better than them all of them. Granted some fair points and lets not forget about any game, who's going to put it on today those 90mins. Another point is those Sth American Clubs/players have a number more X players performing in big leagues compared to us recent and past thats why we have always never felt confident playing them barring as mentioned above one of those days luck and all goes your way as has occurred. Colombia, a recent Diaz would smoke us, Falco up front in his days, Cuadrabo/Juve, Hammers Rodriguez. Chile, Vidal, A Sanchez, Maripan, Bravo and their recent past gen as you mentioned. Paraguay, Sante Cruz, Almiron and most stay local or in the Americas league. Sure we've looked ok against them but its all biting finger nail viewing be it Arnie as coach Ange at the helm or whoever. Lets get it into persepctive, this game we were lucky and thats the beauty of football or any ball game as said "on the day". Those first 20 odd mins their footwork/movement on off the ball showed they had far better skill but their tactics we're all wrong and we could gain composure and importantly defensively we hung in and they couldn't make that final pass work. That post saved our bacon wasn't to be their day. I don't know who you mean specifically by 'they' but if you mean Peru then they don't have more players in europe than us infact less..... only 1 of their players is in a big 5 league club which was their DM. 4 players are at MLS clubs, 2 in sweden, 1 in columbia, 2 in saudi, a couple in the peruvian league (which is very poor) almost never qualifying for the 2nd stage in the copa liberdatores. Ecuador who finished 4th in Sth Am, have less players in europe than us too. Now let's look at Columbia whose players you mentioned in the above - you're saying they have more x factor players than us but of the ones youve mentioned Falcao is 36 yrs old and Cuadrado is 34. Hammers is 30 and playing in qatar. Their team looks similar to our dying golden gen of 2011-13 which wasnt a great side.
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Bunch of Hacks
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+xEurope and South America are rightly the highest rated federations. I would actually rate Asia and CAF ahead of CONCACAF who apart from Mexico are extremely poor. Oceania of course brings up the rear. AFC is too large and the travel is the killer. A grouping of the AFC plus West Asia together with a grouping of East Asia and Oceania would make much more sense. I actually think a Nth Africa and West Asia confed makes sense, given the political and cultural ties. And then an East Asian and Oceania Confed.
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Bunch of Hacks
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+xThe World Cup will be another level from this current campaign, we will need to go to another level and from what ive seen this team needs to improve alot even that we had to go through via the penalty shootout. But the group stages game's the opponents will be ready for us and preparation will be evened out. The fact its played in November will be interesting considering how fatigued teams are in June, but this time it will be different. We've got players to come back.. Rogic, Sains, Souttar and Taggart are great additions, particularly rogic. I think we'd have beaten them in 90 mins with those guys playing. And we've got mcgree on the bench whose a great player.
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LFC.
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+x+x+x+x+x+xWe played against Honduras last WC playoff and because we had some questionable results against asian teams, many people said that Honduras was going to win as they are from a 'better confederation'. The same thing happened this WC cycle. By now, can we at least give Asia some respect? I was going to start a thread on something like this topic. Thanks for doing it instead, Pasquali. I'm out of the coaching loop now. I think when I was still doing coaching courses in 2013 or 2014, often our coach educators from FFA/Football Australia, were constantly saying that our Asian opposition were often far better technicians than us in Australia, but naive tactically. The race was on for us to improve technically, because as our Asian opposition improved tactically, it would not be long before they would be too good for us they said. Of course it takes a lot longer to build technique than tactical nous. Even though we didn't score today, I thought we had more scoring chances than Peru. I thought their ability defending set pieces and crosses was inferior to most of our recent Asian opposition. Today's victory was not only fantastic for the Socceroos, but it demonstrated by the 5th ranked Asian team defeating the 5th ranked South American powerhouse Football Federation, generally recognised as second ranked in the world after Europe, the Asian Confederation has improved relative to the rest of the world. Many Eurosnobs in Australia perceive only Europe and South America as having any semblance of football quality. They also think we only won against Uruguay in 2005, because we had lots of players playing in big European leagues. Apart from Hrustic playing for Eintracht Frankfurt, mainly as a sub, and Ryan as a reserve La Liga keeper, none of our other Socceroos play in the European big five leagues ( England, France, Germany, Italy, Spain) do they? If that is the case, it also demonstrates how much a better the Socceroo team unit is than the individuals who comprise that team. Today's Socceroo victory refutes that notion Asa is a football backwater. I think every 5th ranked South American country has won every other intercontinental play off apart from us in 2005 and 2022? Im as happy as anyone but lets not get too carried away with one off games (decided on penalties no less) bearing any credence on Asia being a better confederation than Sth America..... No one is saying that the Asian Confederation is 'better' than the South American. Its just that outside of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay the others arent that strong infact i'd put them on par with our best 5 asian teams (Iran, S Korea, Japan, Australia, Saudi). Of course Columbia , chile and paraguay have a golden gen every now and then (Colombia mid nineties and 2014, Chile 10-16, Paraguay around 2000) but we place too much value on these teams generally its been shown. This game, the last time socceroos played chile and Columbia we've been as good if not better than them all of them. Granted some fair points and lets not forget about any game, who's going to put it on today those 90mins. Another point is those Sth American Clubs/players have a number more X players performing in big leagues compared to us recent and past thats why we have always never felt confident playing them barring as mentioned above one of those days luck and all goes your way as has occurred. Colombia, a recent Diaz would smoke us, Falco up front in his days, Cuadrabo/Juve, Hammers Rodriguez. Chile, Vidal, A Sanchez, Maripan, Bravo and their recent past gen as you mentioned. Paraguay, Sante Cruz, Almiron and most stay local or in the Americas league. Sure we've looked ok against them but its all biting finger nail viewing be it Arnie as coach Ange at the helm or whoever. Lets get it into persepctive, this game we were lucky and thats the beauty of football or any ball game as said "on the day". Those first 20 odd mins their footwork/movement on off the ball showed they had far better skill but their tactics we're all wrong and we could gain composure and importantly defensively we hung in and they couldn't make that final pass work. That post saved our bacon wasn't to be their day. I don't know who you mean specifically by 'they' but if you mean Peru then they don't have more players in europe than us infact less..... only 1 of their players is in a big 5 league club which was their DM. 4 players are at MLS clubs, 2 in sweden, 1 in columbia, 2 in saudi, a couple in the peruvian league (which is very poor) almost never qualifying for the 2nd stage in the copa liberdatores. Ecuador who finished 4th in Sth Am, have less players in europe than us too. Now let's look at Columbia whose players you mentioned in the above - you're saying they have more x factor players than us but of the ones youve mentioned Falcao is 36 yrs old and Cuadrado is 34. Hammers is 30 and playing in qatar. Their team looks similar to our dying golden gen of 2011-13 which wasnt a great side. To claify for you, "they" near the end of my post was about the other days game, nothing about them playing abroad just that they looked good many times but no end product. Bringing up past players from a couple of related NT's in their region was just that about the quality that has been and I said "past" to some present. Yep those other NT's are on the downhill phase but they still play well imo. Thanks for your input.
Love Football
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quickflick
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Also, if you want to play for a big club, it seems a huge advantage to be born in europe somewhere. Some 2nd tier euro nations are packed with players who play in the big 5 yet would struggle to get through asia judging by the wc performances (looking at you poland). And denmark looked only slightly better than us (if that) last world cup. So looking at how teams are on paper needs to take that into context
Playing to their potential and having acclimatised, Poland would canter through Asian qualification, if it had the luxury. Any Asian would dearly love to have Robert Lewandowski or Matty Cash. I think you seriously underestimate UEFA. The Swedes beat Spain and still didn’t qualify, FFS! Imagine the reaction on this forum if Australia beat Spain in a WCQ. The repêchage for UEFA featured Italy, Portugal and Sweden. I would say Sweden is about Japan’s level. In Asia, Japan has qualified with relative ease. In UEFA, (depending on the difficulty of the various group) a team of that quality is likely going to the repêchage play-offs Fancy going to the play-offs just to qualify for the WC and you’re up against the European champions. Or Cristiano Ronaldo + Bernardo Silva + João Felíx All that is true on paper but I would love to see a mid tier Euro team have to travel 24 hours on a plane, land 3 days before, train, play a match in completely opposite conditions than what they're used to, (jetlagged mind you), then head back across multiple time zones to the other side of the world and play again 3 days later. That would sort the wheat from the chaff pretty quickly. I agree to a point. But don't forget it's a double-edged sword. For any given European nation, they'd still have half their games at home (unless, God forbid, there were a pandemic and their government barred its own citizens from returning home). And that would mean that ME+A countries travelling a considerable way to play in unfamiliar conditions. So, for example, Saudi Arabia could find themselves playing in sleet on a night in Glasgow. How much fun would that that be for them? Meanwhile, the European nations would initially struggle. But after a couple of WC qualification campaigns, they'd become better at handling the conditions. So, roughly, I think they'd fare about as well as Japan do. Middle Eastern teams are barely a time zone or 2 away. I'm talking a 24 hour flight with 2 transfers and a 3 hour bus trip from the airport to play Thailand in Bangkok on a 30 degree night with 95% humidity. That would fuck up more than a few teams I'm sure. What 24 hour flight to Bangkok. It’s nine or ten hours from London to Bangkok. I remember a few years ago coming back to Melbourne from Heathrow on Thai Airways. The flight was late morning or lunch but I hadn’t slept at all the night before. The aircraft was an A380 and by some fluke I had an entire row in the middle to myself. On an A380, that’s four seats, I think. So I popped a sleeping tablet, removed all armrests and woke up just before the descent into Bangkok. Really pleasant sleep. That’s the flight the European players would be taking except in business class, unlike me. And if the match is in Bangkok, it’s a direct flight. At worst, in less than a handful of countries and only if the host nation chooses an obscure stadium, they might have to get a connecting flight. But even that I doubt. Singapore Airlines, Emirates and Etihad service basically all cities in Asia and Europe
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Davstar
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Also, if you want to play for a big club, it seems a huge advantage to be born in europe somewhere. Some 2nd tier euro nations are packed with players who play in the big 5 yet would struggle to get through asia judging by the wc performances (looking at you poland). And denmark looked only slightly better than us (if that) last world cup. So looking at how teams are on paper needs to take that into context
Playing to their potential and having acclimatised, Poland would canter through Asian qualification, if it had the luxury. Any Asian would dearly love to have Robert Lewandowski or Matty Cash. I think you seriously underestimate UEFA. The Swedes beat Spain and still didn’t qualify, FFS! Imagine the reaction on this forum if Australia beat Spain in a WCQ. The repêchage for UEFA featured Italy, Portugal and Sweden. I would say Sweden is about Japan’s level. In Asia, Japan has qualified with relative ease. In UEFA, (depending on the difficulty of the various group) a team of that quality is likely going to the repêchage play-offs Fancy going to the play-offs just to qualify for the WC and you’re up against the European champions. Or Cristiano Ronaldo + Bernardo Silva + João Felíx All that is true on paper but I would love to see a mid tier Euro team have to travel 24 hours on a plane, land 3 days before, train, play a match in completely opposite conditions than what they're used to, (jetlagged mind you), then head back across multiple time zones to the other side of the world and play again 3 days later. That would sort the wheat from the chaff pretty quickly. I agree to a point. But don't forget it's a double-edged sword. For any given European nation, they'd still have half their games at home (unless, God forbid, there were a pandemic and their government barred its own citizens from returning home). And that would mean that ME+A countries travelling a considerable way to play in unfamiliar conditions. So, for example, Saudi Arabia could find themselves playing in sleet on a night in Glasgow. How much fun would that that be for them? Meanwhile, the European nations would initially struggle. But after a couple of WC qualification campaigns, they'd become better at handling the conditions. So, roughly, I think they'd fare about as well as Japan do. Middle Eastern teams are barely a time zone or 2 away. I'm talking a 24 hour flight with 2 transfers and a 3 hour bus trip from the airport to play Thailand in Bangkok on a 30 degree night with 95% humidity. That would fuck up more than a few teams I'm sure. What 24 hour flight to Bangkok. It’s nine or ten hours from London to Bangkok. I remember a few years ago coming back to Melbourne from Heathrow on Thai Airways. The flight was late morning or lunch but I hadn’t slept at all the night before. The aircraft was an A380 and by some fluke I had an entire row in the middle to myself. On an A380, that’s four seats, I think. So I popped a sleeping tablet, removed all armrests and woke up just before the descent into Bangkok. Really pleasant sleep. That’s the flight the European players would be taking except in business class, unlike me. And if the match is in Bangkok, it’s a direct flight. At worst, in less than a handful of countries and only if the host nation chooses an obscure stadium, they might have to get a connecting flight. But even that I doubt. Singapore Airlines, Emirates and Etihad service basically all cities in Asia and Europe in fairness the English national team media complains when it has to fly 4 hours to the other side of Europe i think i remember reading how the players might 'deteriorate' on the flight from London to Moscow in the 2018 world cup..... i got no idea how it would impact a player flying 10-12 hours and back again to play football all over the world but i dare say it would not be 'easy'
these Kangaroos can play football -
Ange P. (Intercontinental WC Play-offs 2017)
KEEP POLITICS OUT OF FOOTBALL
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Decentric 2
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+x+x+x+x+xThe last Roos v Japan game in Sydney showed real world class quality from Japan - who would have troubled many Euro/South American sides with the skillful tactics and techniques they showed that game- so yeah not close to Europe and South American levels overall but still worthy of respect here in Asia. Roos did just defeat 5th best Sth Am side afterall 👊 We can only speculate, but where would Japan have placed in South American WCQs if they had played in them? They were much tougher opposition than 5th placed Peru. Anywhere from 3rd to 7th sounds likely to me. They were a better opposition than Peru. On the other hand, Colombia (6th place) could beat Japan. At least, the Colombians have the best individual player in their NT right now, in Luis Díaz. If we must speculate… one campaign I picture Japan finishing third in South America. Another campaign I picture them finishing sixth or seventh. Football’s a funny game. It’s not a case of x beat y and y beat z, therefore x would also beat z. One other thing to consider… the Peru you watched mightn’t have been playing in the manner of or with the skill of the Peru that won all those recent games in qualification. Maybe the play much better football in South America than in the Middle-East? Good job for us we had so many days in camp Did you actually watch all the Socceroo games in this WCQ campaign, particularly the last round? All of them. Did you watch any of the WCQs for any other confederation? No. I have watched a lot of games at a recent Euro championships. I have watched a lot of European WCQs in the not so distant past. I'm just watching quite a few excerpts of League Of Nations games.
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