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Barca4Life
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+x+x+xThere is so many factors here In my opinion: The competition globally has changed dramatically since the late 90s/early 2000s I recall we had around a dozen playing in the EPL alone now we will get lucky to get some via promoted teams! These days there is competition for places all over the world vying to get into the top level of Euro football whilst Australia had the advantage of sending over players due to their euro connections now that advantage has completely diminished as the rules are alot more relaxed for working visas. I also agree our geo distance is a big disadvantage for us, alot easier living in Europe where you can drive down or go via a train into any euro country and play against best v best especially at younger age groups and get that exposure and overall get noticed, whilst Australia has to spend a-lot more money and time to get that exposure unless the players live over there. Even in Asia they getting that exposure but they have a tone of resources and cash to compete, but onto Asia qualifying into youth world cups was a pathway of getting the exposure and getting noticed by top leagues and clubs but qualifying via Asia has gotten alot harder than it ever has been since we joined in 2006 and therefore qualifying has dried up completely. U17 level we haven't qualified since 2019 U20 level we haven't qualified since 2013 And recently the olyroos have only qualified for the Olympics twice since we joined Asia. This was a catalyst for the GG which was the international exposure they had from world cups and Olympic games which has been missing in the current era since we joined Asia, Oceania we struggled to qualifying for senior world cups but it helped the players get that international exposure and overall recognition when they qualified for under age tournaments. Im sure we could improve more in our own backyard but without the international exposure and competing with some of the best countries in the world it be hard to get players on that level and why I don't see it change that much unless something changes. It will be interesting to see how FA tackle this challenge, apparently Ernie Merrick is going to soon release a technical report in a plan to get Australia to develop top class players and aim to be a top 10 in the next 10 years but overall the landscape has changed since the golden generation days and therefore if Australia wants to change it then it needs a rethink in how it does things. Its amazing to see how much the competition has grown. Souttar would walk into any socceroos team historically yet has struggled for a year with game time. He has had bad luck mind you. At least u17s we should improve our qualification record with the expanded format. To improve u20 and u23 is crucial. Some of it will take care of itself if the a league expands and the nst goes ahead we will have a larger pool. It is crucial though to get a full time coach with club experience and youth football experience. Here is the biggest difference. As you say Souttar, he has it all, height, speed, great tackles, great in the air, great on the ball, the perfect defender, but just not good enough to please some coaches who needs his ball playing ability to bet better. This was not a prerequisite in 2006, Souttar would walk into most PL sides in the early 2000s. LFC, my mate's son was told by a rep coach to forget about making it, 'while you train for 2 hours a day & go to school & go home to play your FIFA, most Africian kids are training 8-10 hours a day'. I’m not sure I would use Souttar as a reference given he didn’t developed through the system here, he’s a foreigner playing for the Roos but i get your point. The landscape has changed no doubt, the type of player to make it at the top level now is certainly a lot different to one that was playing 20 odd years ago.
Just seeing a player in a national team that plays in league 1 shows how much has changed, we are long way off developing players ready for top level leagues compared to our peers especially in Asia who are level above at this.
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LFC.
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+x+xI had 2 sons go through from YL to U18's, opted out making it to Snrs - youngest now 23. Oh nice! Was there entitlement from other rep kids? I agree what we do in training is a small part of development compared to how many hours a player trains at home or with other kids other rep kids ? yep in spades. Certain Clubs and management/TD's ? yep. Parents ? yep and many who have NO FN idea of the game. Its like a look at me for some and some/many are not worthy but selected for many years. Its all about the $$$'s/status and agendas. Its a wanky status scenario that is pretty pathetic to watch - if only I knew what I know nowadays.
Love Football
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LFC.
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+x+x+x+xThere is so many factors here In my opinion: The competition globally has changed dramatically since the late 90s/early 2000s I recall we had around a dozen playing in the EPL alone now we will get lucky to get some via promoted teams! These days there is competition for places all over the world vying to get into the top level of Euro football whilst Australia had the advantage of sending over players due to their euro connections now that advantage has completely diminished as the rules are alot more relaxed for working visas. I also agree our geo distance is a big disadvantage for us, alot easier living in Europe where you can drive down or go via a train into any euro country and play against best v best especially at younger age groups and get that exposure and overall get noticed, whilst Australia has to spend a-lot more money and time to get that exposure unless the players live over there. Even in Asia they getting that exposure but they have a tone of resources and cash to compete, but onto Asia qualifying into youth world cups was a pathway of getting the exposure and getting noticed by top leagues and clubs but qualifying via Asia has gotten alot harder than it ever has been since we joined in 2006 and therefore qualifying has dried up completely. U17 level we haven't qualified since 2019 U20 level we haven't qualified since 2013 And recently the olyroos have only qualified for the Olympics twice since we joined Asia. This was a catalyst for the GG which was the international exposure they had from world cups and Olympic games which has been missing in the current era since we joined Asia, Oceania we struggled to qualifying for senior world cups but it helped the players get that international exposure and overall recognition when they qualified for under age tournaments. Im sure we could improve more in our own backyard but without the international exposure and competing with some of the best countries in the world it be hard to get players on that level and why I don't see it change that much unless something changes. It will be interesting to see how FA tackle this challenge, apparently Ernie Merrick is going to soon release a technical report in a plan to get Australia to develop top class players and aim to be a top 10 in the next 10 years but overall the landscape has changed since the golden generation days and therefore if Australia wants to change it then it needs a rethink in how it does things. Its amazing to see how much the competition has grown. Souttar would walk into any socceroos team historically yet has struggled for a year with game time. He has had bad luck mind you. At least u17s we should improve our qualification record with the expanded format. To improve u20 and u23 is crucial. Some of it will take care of itself if the a league expands and the nst goes ahead we will have a larger pool. It is crucial though to get a full time coach with club experience and youth football experience. Here is the biggest difference. As you say Souttar, he has it all, height, speed, great tackles, great in the air, great on the ball, the perfect defender, but just not good enough to please some coaches who needs his ball playing ability to bet better. This was not a prerequisite in 2006, Souttar would walk into most PL sides in the early 2000s. LFC, my mate's son was told by a rep coach to forget about making it, 'while you train for 2 hours a day & go to school & go home to play your FIFA, most Africian kids are training 8-10 hours a day'. I’m not sure I would use Souttar as a reference given he didn’t developed through the system here, he’s a foreigner playing for the Roos but i get your point. The landscape has changed no doubt, the type of player to make it at the top level now is certainly a lot different to one that was playing 20 odd years ago.
Just seeing a player in a national team that plays in league 1 shows how much has changed, we are long way off developing players ready for top level leagues compared to our peers especially in Asia who are level above at this.
correct re Souttar, hence my mention of Burgess I think left at 16. We now have quite a mix of how many EU NT's have pulled players over their years, same applies with Boyle another eg. We can't count any of those who developed abroad important point to gauge regards to us. We don't have countires with half hour flights or overnight coach rides. Hence the importance of getting our act together once and for all one day. NST is a beginning as grazor mentions but were miles behind. That for a start NST HAS to succeed as a comp next few seasons to establish itself, it needs even you AL guys to turn up and support a game as much as you can, we can't survive on the AL alone not a chance !!!!
Love Football
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grazorblade
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+xI had 2 sons go through from YL to U18's, opted out making it to Snrs - youngest now 23. Oh nice! Was there entitlement from other rep kids? I agree what we do in training is a small part of development compared to how many hours a player trains at home or with other kids other rep kids ? yep in spades. Certain Clubs and management/TD's ? yep. Parents ? yep and many who have NO FN idea of the game. Its like a look at me for some and some/many are not worthy but selected for many years. Its all about the $$$'s/status and agendas. Its a wanky status scenario that is pretty pathetic to watch - if only I knew what I know nowadays. So when you say entitlement can u go into more details? Do u mean lack of work ethic? Hostility and cattiness to other kids and parents? Know it all attitude while being wrong? (If so on what issues?) Something else?
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grazorblade
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+xThere is so many factors here In my opinion: The competition globally has changed dramatically since the late 90s/early 2000s I recall we had around a dozen playing in the EPL alone now we will get lucky to get some via promoted teams! These days there is competition for places all over the world vying to get into the top level of Euro football whilst Australia had the advantage of sending over players due to their euro connections now that advantage has completely diminished as the rules are alot more relaxed for working visas. I also agree our geo distance is a big disadvantage for us, alot easier living in Europe where you can drive down or go via a train into any euro country and play against best v best especially at younger age groups and get that exposure and overall get noticed, whilst Australia has to spend a-lot more money and time to get that exposure unless the players live over there. Even in Asia they getting that exposure but they have a tone of resources and cash to compete, but onto Asia qualifying into youth world cups was a pathway of getting the exposure and getting noticed by top leagues and clubs but qualifying via Asia has gotten alot harder than it ever has been since we joined in 2006 and therefore qualifying has dried up completely. U17 level we haven't qualified since 2019 U20 level we haven't qualified since 2013 And recently the olyroos have only qualified for the Olympics twice since we joined Asia. This was a catalyst for the GG which was the international exposure they had from world cups and Olympic games which has been missing in the current era since we joined Asia, Oceania we struggled to qualifying for senior world cups but it helped the players get that international exposure and overall recognition when they qualified for under age tournaments. Im sure we could improve more in our own backyard but without the international exposure and competing with some of the best countries in the world it be hard to get players on that level and why I don't see it change that much unless something changes. It will be interesting to see how FA tackle this challenge, apparently Ernie Merrick is going to soon release a technical report in a plan to get Australia to develop top class players and aim to be a top 10 in the next 10 years but overall the landscape has changed since the golden generation days and therefore if Australia wants to change it then it needs a rethink in how it does things. Its amazing to see how much the competition has grown. Souttar would walk into any socceroos team historically yet has struggled for a year with game time. He has had bad luck mind you. At least u17s we should improve our qualification record with the expanded format. To improve u20 and u23 is crucial. Some of it will take care of itself if the a league expands and the nst goes ahead we will have a larger pool. It is crucial though to get a full time coach with club experience and youth football experience. Here is the biggest difference. As you say Souttar, he has it all, height, speed, great tackles, great in the air, great on the ball, the perfect defender, but just not good enough to please some coaches who needs his ball playing ability to bet better. This was not a prerequisite in 2006, Souttar would walk into most PL sides in the early 2000s. LFC, my mate's son was told by a rep coach to forget about making it, 'while you train for 2 hours a day & go to school & go home to play your FIFA, most Africian kids are training 8-10 hours a day'. I’m not sure I would use Souttar as a reference given he didn’t developed through the system here, he’s a foreigner playing for the Roos but i get your point. The landscape has changed no doubt, the type of player to make it at the top level now is certainly a lot different to one that was playing 20 odd years ago.
Just seeing a player in a national team that plays in league 1 shows how much has changed, we are long way off developing players ready for top level leagues compared to our peers especially in Asia who are level above at this.
Well im using souttar as a reference for just how hard it has become to make it at the top since in my view he is the cb oz has ever had yet struggling for game time at epl level
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LFC.
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K,
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+x+x+x+xThere is so many factors here In my opinion: The competition globally has changed dramatically since the late 90s/early 2000s I recall we had around a dozen playing in the EPL alone now we will get lucky to get some via promoted teams! These days there is competition for places all over the world vying to get into the top level of Euro football whilst Australia had the advantage of sending over players due to their euro connections now that advantage has completely diminished as the rules are alot more relaxed for working visas. I also agree our geo distance is a big disadvantage for us, alot easier living in Europe where you can drive down or go via a train into any euro country and play against best v best especially at younger age groups and get that exposure and overall get noticed, whilst Australia has to spend a-lot more money and time to get that exposure unless the players live over there. Even in Asia they getting that exposure but they have a tone of resources and cash to compete, but onto Asia qualifying into youth world cups was a pathway of getting the exposure and getting noticed by top leagues and clubs but qualifying via Asia has gotten alot harder than it ever has been since we joined in 2006 and therefore qualifying has dried up completely. U17 level we haven't qualified since 2019 U20 level we haven't qualified since 2013 And recently the olyroos have only qualified for the Olympics twice since we joined Asia. This was a catalyst for the GG which was the international exposure they had from world cups and Olympic games which has been missing in the current era since we joined Asia, Oceania we struggled to qualifying for senior world cups but it helped the players get that international exposure and overall recognition when they qualified for under age tournaments. Im sure we could improve more in our own backyard but without the international exposure and competing with some of the best countries in the world it be hard to get players on that level and why I don't see it change that much unless something changes. It will be interesting to see how FA tackle this challenge, apparently Ernie Merrick is going to soon release a technical report in a plan to get Australia to develop top class players and aim to be a top 10 in the next 10 years but overall the landscape has changed since the golden generation days and therefore if Australia wants to change it then it needs a rethink in how it does things. Its amazing to see how much the competition has grown. Souttar would walk into any socceroos team historically yet has struggled for a year with game time. He has had bad luck mind you. At least u17s we should improve our qualification record with the expanded format. To improve u20 and u23 is crucial. Some of it will take care of itself if the a league expands and the nst goes ahead we will have a larger pool. It is crucial though to get a full time coach with club experience and youth football experience. Here is the biggest difference. As you say Souttar, he has it all, height, speed, great tackles, great in the air, great on the ball, the perfect defender, but just not good enough to please some coaches who needs his ball playing ability to bet better. This was not a prerequisite in 2006, Souttar would walk into most PL sides in the early 2000s. LFC, my mate's son was told by a rep coach to forget about making it, 'while you train for 2 hours a day & go to school & go home to play your FIFA, most Africian kids are training 8-10 hours a day'. 8-10 is a lot but viduka was told to train 8 hours a day apparently by the ais and he did. How early do u need to start putting in those hours? I imagine if you wanted to at least get ok grades 2 hours is the absolute maximum and maybe 8 hours on the weekend. So for a parent to encourage their kid to do 8 hours they have to gamble on them making the grade, since you are screwing over their academic prospectz. With only 11 pro clubs and few making it overseas that seams a heck of a risk! How do you even fit in those 8 hours? School starts at 830, so at most you can fit in 90 minutes in the morning. School then finishes at 330, so if you have no commute you can go to bed at 10 if u skimp on homework and only train grazor, I can't recall exactely what Dukes quoted but at the AIS he drove his team bunk mate mad kicking the ball against the wall for hours on end. Thats the thing where does the kid make the time..... Sure school is important but they can find the time still - depending the dedication. Many kids today think they do enough just x 3/4 trainings a week, well nope not enough espcially IF you want ball skill. Look at playwers of the past, using oranges, walls like squash - heck I was outside smacking the ball to the fence for ages, ruined Mums plants counltess times. I spent arvo's outside even after work playing chips from other side of the road teaching my boys touch/feel/distance/close range low to ground shots to avoid breaking windows lol - my boys close range foot skills are very good watching them on full pitch's. Tought them how their foot placement/stance and drive through a set piece ball. Sat watching games with them - talking how X moves, reads the play. Obviously not everyone is the same especially some parents of today BUT During those dev years I'd be at every single game of theirs, so so many times I'd wonder whereis Dad of xyz and more, I know they are not tradies or gov workers. So so many of these kids their parents would drop them off off they go elsewhere. Whats more important than supporting your kid - I get IF your job is a support service or whatever. Some if there are on their mobiles yakking away, more important I guess.
Love Football
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LFC.
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K,
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+x+x+x+xI had 2 sons go through from YL to U18's, opted out making it to Snrs - youngest now 23. Oh nice! Was there entitlement from other rep kids? I agree what we do in training is a small part of development compared to how many hours a player trains at home or with other kids other rep kids ? yep in spades. Certain Clubs and management/TD's ? yep. Parents ? yep and many who have NO FN idea of the game. Its like a look at me for some and some/many are not worthy but selected for many years. Its all about the $$$'s/status and agendas. Its a wanky status scenario that is pretty pathetic to watch - if only I knew what I know nowadays. So when you say entitlement can u go into more details? Do u mean lack of work ethic? Hostility and cattiness to other kids and parents? Know it all attitude while being wrong? (If so on what issues?) Something else? graz, said enough and my opinion means jack shit to others. Our trouble is massive all over as so so many know. We not a football country as the biggest hurdle. GTFO out here if want to make it somewhere and thats the big IF anywhere in the big picture - I would not spend the money here at all - I'd sooner take the risk abroad with my kids IF I could do it again.
Love Football
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robbos
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+xThere is so many factors here In my opinion: The competition globally has changed dramatically since the late 90s/early 2000s I recall we had around a dozen playing in the EPL alone now we will get lucky to get some via promoted teams! These days there is competition for places all over the world vying to get into the top level of Euro football whilst Australia had the advantage of sending over players due to their euro connections now that advantage has completely diminished as the rules are alot more relaxed for working visas. I also agree our geo distance is a big disadvantage for us, alot easier living in Europe where you can drive down or go via a train into any euro country and play against best v best especially at younger age groups and get that exposure and overall get noticed, whilst Australia has to spend a-lot more money and time to get that exposure unless the players live over there. Even in Asia they getting that exposure but they have a tone of resources and cash to compete, but onto Asia qualifying into youth world cups was a pathway of getting the exposure and getting noticed by top leagues and clubs but qualifying via Asia has gotten alot harder than it ever has been since we joined in 2006 and therefore qualifying has dried up completely. U17 level we haven't qualified since 2019 U20 level we haven't qualified since 2013 And recently the olyroos have only qualified for the Olympics twice since we joined Asia. This was a catalyst for the GG which was the international exposure they had from world cups and Olympic games which has been missing in the current era since we joined Asia, Oceania we struggled to qualifying for senior world cups but it helped the players get that international exposure and overall recognition when they qualified for under age tournaments. Im sure we could improve more in our own backyard but without the international exposure and competing with some of the best countries in the world it be hard to get players on that level and why I don't see it change that much unless something changes. It will be interesting to see how FA tackle this challenge, apparently Ernie Merrick is going to soon release a technical report in a plan to get Australia to develop top class players and aim to be a top 10 in the next 10 years but overall the landscape has changed since the golden generation days and therefore if Australia wants to change it then it needs a rethink in how it does things. Its amazing to see how much the competition has grown. Souttar would walk into any socceroos team historically yet has struggled for a year with game time. He has had bad luck mind you. At least u17s we should improve our qualification record with the expanded format. To improve u20 and u23 is crucial. Some of it will take care of itself if the a league expands and the nst goes ahead we will have a larger pool. It is crucial though to get a full time coach with club experience and youth football experience. Here is the biggest difference. As you say Souttar, he has it all, height, speed, great tackles, great in the air, great on the ball, the perfect defender, but just not good enough to please some coaches who needs his ball playing ability to bet better. This was not a prerequisite in 2006, Souttar would walk into most PL sides in the early 2000s. LFC, my mate's son was told by a rep coach to forget about making it, 'while you train for 2 hours a day & go to school & go home to play your FIFA, most Africian kids are training 8-10 hours a day'. I’m not sure I would use Souttar as a reference given he didn’t developed through the system here, he’s a foreigner playing for the Roos but i get your point. The landscape has changed no doubt, the type of player to make it at the top level now is certainly a lot different to one that was playing 20 odd years ago.
Just seeing a player in a national team that plays in league 1 shows how much has changed, we are long way off developing players ready for top level leagues compared to our peers especially in Asia who are level above at this.
Exactly I was more discussing the type of player to make it to the top now & then.
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grazorblade
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 19K,
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+x+x+x+x+xThere is so many factors here In my opinion: The competition globally has changed dramatically since the late 90s/early 2000s I recall we had around a dozen playing in the EPL alone now we will get lucky to get some via promoted teams! These days there is competition for places all over the world vying to get into the top level of Euro football whilst Australia had the advantage of sending over players due to their euro connections now that advantage has completely diminished as the rules are alot more relaxed for working visas. I also agree our geo distance is a big disadvantage for us, alot easier living in Europe where you can drive down or go via a train into any euro country and play against best v best especially at younger age groups and get that exposure and overall get noticed, whilst Australia has to spend a-lot more money and time to get that exposure unless the players live over there. Even in Asia they getting that exposure but they have a tone of resources and cash to compete, but onto Asia qualifying into youth world cups was a pathway of getting the exposure and getting noticed by top leagues and clubs but qualifying via Asia has gotten alot harder than it ever has been since we joined in 2006 and therefore qualifying has dried up completely. U17 level we haven't qualified since 2019 U20 level we haven't qualified since 2013 And recently the olyroos have only qualified for the Olympics twice since we joined Asia. This was a catalyst for the GG which was the international exposure they had from world cups and Olympic games which has been missing in the current era since we joined Asia, Oceania we struggled to qualifying for senior world cups but it helped the players get that international exposure and overall recognition when they qualified for under age tournaments. Im sure we could improve more in our own backyard but without the international exposure and competing with some of the best countries in the world it be hard to get players on that level and why I don't see it change that much unless something changes. It will be interesting to see how FA tackle this challenge, apparently Ernie Merrick is going to soon release a technical report in a plan to get Australia to develop top class players and aim to be a top 10 in the next 10 years but overall the landscape has changed since the golden generation days and therefore if Australia wants to change it then it needs a rethink in how it does things. Its amazing to see how much the competition has grown. Souttar would walk into any socceroos team historically yet has struggled for a year with game time. He has had bad luck mind you. At least u17s we should improve our qualification record with the expanded format. To improve u20 and u23 is crucial. Some of it will take care of itself if the a league expands and the nst goes ahead we will have a larger pool. It is crucial though to get a full time coach with club experience and youth football experience. Here is the biggest difference. As you say Souttar, he has it all, height, speed, great tackles, great in the air, great on the ball, the perfect defender, but just not good enough to please some coaches who needs his ball playing ability to bet better. This was not a prerequisite in 2006, Souttar would walk into most PL sides in the early 2000s. LFC, my mate's son was told by a rep coach to forget about making it, 'while you train for 2 hours a day & go to school & go home to play your FIFA, most Africian kids are training 8-10 hours a day'. 8-10 is a lot but viduka was told to train 8 hours a day apparently by the ais and he did. How early do u need to start putting in those hours? I imagine if you wanted to at least get ok grades 2 hours is the absolute maximum and maybe 8 hours on the weekend. So for a parent to encourage their kid to do 8 hours they have to gamble on them making the grade, since you are screwing over their academic prospectz. With only 11 pro clubs and few making it overseas that seams a heck of a risk! How do you even fit in those 8 hours? School starts at 830, so at most you can fit in 90 minutes in the morning. School then finishes at 330, so if you have no commute you can go to bed at 10 if u skimp on homework and only train grazor, I can't recall exactely what Dukes quoted but at the AIS he drove his team bunk mate mad kicking the ball against the wall for hours on end. Thats the thing where does the kid make the time..... Sure school is important but they can find the time still - depending the dedication. Many kids today think they do enough just x 3/4 trainings a week, well nope not enough espcially IF you want ball skill. Look at playwers of the past, using oranges, walls like squash - heck I was outside smacking the ball to the fence for ages, ruined Mums plants counltess times. I spent arvo's outside even after work playing chips from other side of the road teaching my boys touch/feel/distance/close range low to ground shots to avoid breaking windows lol - my boys close range foot skills are very good watching them on full pitch's. Tought them how their foot placement/stance and drive through a set piece ball. Sat watching games with them - talking how X moves, reads the play. Obviously not everyone is the same especially some parents of today BUT During those dev years I'd be at every single game of theirs, so so many times I'd wonder whereis Dad of xyz and more, I know they are not tradies or gov workers. So so many of these kids their parents would drop them off off they go elsewhere. Whats more important than supporting your kid - I get IF your job is a support service or whatever. Some if there are on their mobiles yakking away, more important I guess. Thats interesting and 10 out of 10 parenting from u! Since moving to england ive realized two things are true 1) our training is better than england and probably as good as anywhere in the world 2) training is such a small part of development In england there a lot of videos you get as a parent of 1) games kids can do with parents to improve skills 2) games kids can do with each other 3) games kids can do against a wall Do parents recieve anything like that here? Or at least are they given things to do at home? I would wager most families dont realize most of your development is at home and dont realize what to do at home to improve unless they came from a football savvy family like ur kids This is really low hanging fruit for the fa in australia, provide fun videos of stuff to do at home to every club in australia to pass on to parents and send the message that most training is at home
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grazorblade
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 19K,
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+x+x+x+x+xI had 2 sons go through from YL to U18's, opted out making it to Snrs - youngest now 23. Oh nice! Was there entitlement from other rep kids? I agree what we do in training is a small part of development compared to how many hours a player trains at home or with other kids other rep kids ? yep in spades. Certain Clubs and management/TD's ? yep. Parents ? yep and many who have NO FN idea of the game. Its like a look at me for some and some/many are not worthy but selected for many years. Its all about the $$$'s/status and agendas. Its a wanky status scenario that is pretty pathetic to watch - if only I knew what I know nowadays. So when you say entitlement can u go into more details? Do u mean lack of work ethic? Hostility and cattiness to other kids and parents? Know it all attitude while being wrong? (If so on what issues?) Something else? graz, said enough and my opinion means jack shit to others. Our trouble is massive all over as so so many know. We not a football country as the biggest hurdle. GTFO out here if want to make it somewhere and thats the big IF anywhere in the big picture - I would not spend the money here at all - I'd sooner take the risk abroad with my kids IF I could do it again. Why do u think ur opinion means little?
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Barca4Life
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K,
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+x+x+x+x+xThere is so many factors here In my opinion: The competition globally has changed dramatically since the late 90s/early 2000s I recall we had around a dozen playing in the EPL alone now we will get lucky to get some via promoted teams! These days there is competition for places all over the world vying to get into the top level of Euro football whilst Australia had the advantage of sending over players due to their euro connections now that advantage has completely diminished as the rules are alot more relaxed for working visas. I also agree our geo distance is a big disadvantage for us, alot easier living in Europe where you can drive down or go via a train into any euro country and play against best v best especially at younger age groups and get that exposure and overall get noticed, whilst Australia has to spend a-lot more money and time to get that exposure unless the players live over there. Even in Asia they getting that exposure but they have a tone of resources and cash to compete, but onto Asia qualifying into youth world cups was a pathway of getting the exposure and getting noticed by top leagues and clubs but qualifying via Asia has gotten alot harder than it ever has been since we joined in 2006 and therefore qualifying has dried up completely. U17 level we haven't qualified since 2019 U20 level we haven't qualified since 2013 And recently the olyroos have only qualified for the Olympics twice since we joined Asia. This was a catalyst for the GG which was the international exposure they had from world cups and Olympic games which has been missing in the current era since we joined Asia, Oceania we struggled to qualifying for senior world cups but it helped the players get that international exposure and overall recognition when they qualified for under age tournaments. Im sure we could improve more in our own backyard but without the international exposure and competing with some of the best countries in the world it be hard to get players on that level and why I don't see it change that much unless something changes. It will be interesting to see how FA tackle this challenge, apparently Ernie Merrick is going to soon release a technical report in a plan to get Australia to develop top class players and aim to be a top 10 in the next 10 years but overall the landscape has changed since the golden generation days and therefore if Australia wants to change it then it needs a rethink in how it does things. Its amazing to see how much the competition has grown. Souttar would walk into any socceroos team historically yet has struggled for a year with game time. He has had bad luck mind you. At least u17s we should improve our qualification record with the expanded format. To improve u20 and u23 is crucial. Some of it will take care of itself if the a league expands and the nst goes ahead we will have a larger pool. It is crucial though to get a full time coach with club experience and youth football experience. Here is the biggest difference. As you say Souttar, he has it all, height, speed, great tackles, great in the air, great on the ball, the perfect defender, but just not good enough to please some coaches who needs his ball playing ability to bet better. This was not a prerequisite in 2006, Souttar would walk into most PL sides in the early 2000s. LFC, my mate's son was told by a rep coach to forget about making it, 'while you train for 2 hours a day & go to school & go home to play your FIFA, most Africian kids are training 8-10 hours a day'. I’m not sure I would use Souttar as a reference given he didn’t developed through the system here, he’s a foreigner playing for the Roos but i get your point. The landscape has changed no doubt, the type of player to make it at the top level now is certainly a lot different to one that was playing 20 odd years ago.
Just seeing a player in a national team that plays in league 1 shows how much has changed, we are long way off developing players ready for top level leagues compared to our peers especially in Asia who are level above at this.
Exactly I was more discussing the type of player to make it to the top now & then. Oz football will need a rethink in order to produce top level players of today’s game but I’m not sure if the ambition is around for that.
Not enough constructive discussion and too much sugar coating for my liking.
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Bunch of Hacks
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None of those .. the answer is the creation of the A league. Previously if an Australian player wanted to 'make it' as a professional footballer they pretty much had to leave and so would jump at the first opportunity which expanded our national pool. Furthermore if said player was starting to struggle in his new environment he didnt have the comfort/ safety net of the A league to return to. Still remember when the Crawford report came out they estimated that a third of exports would return home and the first thought I had was "this will greatly diminish our national pool as less players will be overseas, and they'll be less places for younger guys at the national league level".... and so it proved. Its only really now that our overseas stocks are getting back to the numbers they were.. and surprise surprise we suddenly have more top 5 players next season
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Bunch of Hacks
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+xNone of those .. the answer is the creation of the A league. Previously if an Australian player wanted to 'make it' as a professional footballer they pretty much had to leave and so would jump at the first opportunity which expanded our national pool. Furthermore if said player was starting to struggle in his new environment he didnt have the comfort/ safety net of the A league to return to. Still remember when the Crawford report came out they estimated that a third of exports would return home and the first thought I had was "this will greatly diminish our national pool as less players will be overseas, and they'll be less places for younger guys at the national league level".... and so it proved. Its only really now that our overseas stocks are getting back to the numbers they were.. and surprise surprise we suddenly have more top 5 players next season To add to my point.. a vibrant economically successful domestic league does NOT actually help our national league in fact the opposite. It's no coincidence that our most accomplished batch of players (05- 10) were blooded/developed (98-04) whilst national league was at its worst.
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Bunch of Hacks
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+x+xNone of those .. the answer is the creation of the A league. Previously if an Australian player wanted to 'make it' as a professional footballer they pretty much had to leave and so would jump at the first opportunity which expanded our national pool. Furthermore if said player was starting to struggle in his new environment he didnt have the comfort/ safety net of the A league to return to. Still remember when the Crawford report came out they estimated that a third of exports would return home and the first thought I had was "this will greatly diminish our national pool as less players will be overseas, and they'll be less places for younger guys at the national league level".... and so it proved. Its only really now that our overseas stocks are getting back to the numbers they were.. and surprise surprise we suddenly have more top 5 players next season To add to my point.. a vibrant economically successful domestic league does NOT actually help our national league in fact the opposite. It's no coincidence that our most accomplished batch of players (05- 10) were blooded/developed (98-04) whilst national league was at its worst. * does NOT help our national team
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LFC.
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hit the nail on the head on some points I agree BoH's. I didn't want to say it due to some resistance here BUT yep, AL. Killed anything we had and as messy some say what lied beneath it did produce some bloody things. AL set back the NPL's - the development of Youth, AL Clubs didn't have anything much to nuture Youth till years and years later etcetcetc.... Yes early days as I have mentioned, GTFO of here, hence why those players got somewhere in the past, they lived and breathed it abroad the hard way. Not just in living away from Mummy but getting to know what/who your really competing with - in pace/touch/movement/ and thats just at Youth levels let alone playing games amongst experienced Snrs. They got noticed cutting the mustard way back then, same applies today. You are in the real cauldrum, not this cushy far away league. All this stay here longer is dreamland sorry barring the few exceptions like Mooysi for eg. People go on how much harder it is modern times post GG, yep well that says it even more you got to work harder smarter and staying here isn't the best option at all till what mid 20's. Most people mature away from the womb, football players no different. Yep the GG's etc prospered being in the cauldrum, so do the nth africans, latinos, asians. If and when we finally gain to have more Pro players, the NST lord help us gets up and running/supported and moves ahead in years to come having more Pro players - more competition we increase our pool of more competitive players. Some will never venture away, some will never be scouted, some will be scouted, some will never be good enough but sound local players. P/R is a dream but to have comps with something to play for and avoid relo has certainly worked abroad forever and a day, are we hoping too much in this country that ranks our game 3 or 4 of the codes ? I don't know but it will help a little BoH imo. All I know is you need "competiton" "competitors" no different to any commodity, its just not going to be suffient enough as we currently are with 1 closed up league that is on the nose.
Love Football
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LFC.
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+x+x+x+x+x+xI had 2 sons go through from YL to U18's, opted out making it to Snrs - youngest now 23. Oh nice! Was there entitlement from other rep kids? I agree what we do in training is a small part of development compared to how many hours a player trains at home or with other kids other rep kids ? yep in spades. Certain Clubs and management/TD's ? yep. Parents ? yep and many who have NO FN idea of the game. Its like a look at me for some and some/many are not worthy but selected for many years. Its all about the $$$'s/status and agendas. Its a wanky status scenario that is pretty pathetic to watch - if only I knew what I know nowadays. So when you say entitlement can u go into more details? Do u mean lack of work ethic? Hostility and cattiness to other kids and parents? Know it all attitude while being wrong? (If so on what issues?) Something else? graz, said enough and my opinion means jack shit to others. Our trouble is massive all over as so so many know. We not a football country as the biggest hurdle. GTFO out here if want to make it somewhere and thats the big IF anywhere in the big picture - I would not spend the money here at all - I'd sooner take the risk abroad with my kids IF I could do it again. Why do u think ur opinion means little? because we all see things differently and in the end get labelled/judged or roasted.
Love Football
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I think making a link between the desire to make it and the socio-economic situation of the Country you're from is very tenuous. I think that comes down to personality.
How and how often you train, now that's a better argument. I'd like to know a lot more to put an optimum time on it per day though. Saying 8 hours because of an anecdote from the AIS/Viduka isn't very strong. It's an interesting one to consider though.
That said I think time outside of formal training is important. The bus I used to get to school arrived before classes started. We'd all play before school, at lunch and the while we waited for the bus home. That would have been maybe 2.5-3 hours a day. If you add training, games, 5-sided stuff during the week it adds up. If you love playing you find a way to do it.
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grazorblade
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+xI think making a link between the desire to make it and the socio-economic situation of the Country you're from is very tenuous. I think that comes down to personality. How and how often you train, now that's a better argument. I'd like to know a lot more to put an optimum time on it per day though. Saying 8 hours because of an anecdote from the AIS/Viduka isn't very strong. It's an interesting one to consider though. That said I think time outside of formal training is important. The bus I used to get to school arrived before classes started. We'd all play before school, at lunch and the while we waited for the bus home. That would have been maybe 2.5-3 hours a day. If you add training, games, 5-sided stuff during the week it adds up. If you love playing you find a way to do it. 8 hours indeed sounds like an exaggeration. You would have to finish at midnight everyday to get school work done Id like to know what a realistic target is for kids in school that doesnt mean closing academic options off.
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grazorblade
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xI had 2 sons go through from YL to U18's, opted out making it to Snrs - youngest now 23. Oh nice! Was there entitlement from other rep kids? I agree what we do in training is a small part of development compared to how many hours a player trains at home or with other kids other rep kids ? yep in spades. Certain Clubs and management/TD's ? yep. Parents ? yep and many who have NO FN idea of the game. Its like a look at me for some and some/many are not worthy but selected for many years. Its all about the $$$'s/status and agendas. Its a wanky status scenario that is pretty pathetic to watch - if only I knew what I know nowadays. So when you say entitlement can u go into more details? Do u mean lack of work ethic? Hostility and cattiness to other kids and parents? Know it all attitude while being wrong? (If so on what issues?) Something else? graz, said enough and my opinion means jack shit to others. Our trouble is massive all over as so so many know. We not a football country as the biggest hurdle. GTFO out here if want to make it somewhere and thats the big IF anywhere in the big picture - I would not spend the money here at all - I'd sooner take the risk abroad with my kids IF I could do it again. Why do u think ur opinion means little? because we all see things differently and in the end get labelled/judged or roasted. Sorry to hear u have been judged before here You are right that Id disagree that the professionalization of the national league is the problem. Sure there are outliers, but the strength of a national league is very well correlated with the wages in the countries first division. It is implausible to me that if we cut the wages in the eredivisie, or even the brazilian seri a to semi pro wages they would start to produce better national teams If I were to tell a story of the a league hurting it would not be the fact that it is professional, but that it was run by the fa. This meant u have a double whammy of the fa, with their 260million in revenue, covering expenses of the a league and taking money from grass roots and the a league not having the pressure to generate money on the transfer market because they have that safety net.
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