base on what? Spain just said they will veto it....Poland will veto it for a UK mechanized infantry battalion place in Poland or the Baltic

what the EU commission or EU MEP say, doesn't matter

If Scotland secedes, it will do it with the UK's consent. Why would UK make that a deal with Poland to keep Scotland out in that scenario?

because, the EU is still full of poor countries who are no longer growing , or full of not poor countries who are not growing and have a very Protective non free trade ideas

Australia was working on a FTA with the EU, but it's now as good as dead with the UK gone....Australia would
d have to give up to much to gain the Germany, French, Italy and Spain markets

i'm no expert on financial rules in the EU, but i think the rules are, if your financial regulator is close to be the same as the EU (UK, USA, Australia, are) then you get full access)....

it not after a vote, it before....when France and Spain say they will veto Scotland from joining a EU, it make it hard for the SNP to win a Scottish independence vote

my point on Poland is, the UK has power to get one country in the EU to say they would veto Scotland joining the EU , long before any Scottish independence vote

Yes Greece was threatened all the time.

I was in Greece at the time and Juncker and co were visiting all the time amid mass violent anti EU demonstrations. Athens was on fire and people were getting hurt, police patrols attacked even the Presidential Guard.

The EU did not want Greece to leave and the pro LEAVE Socialist Syriza won the election.

The rear was that Greece will spark the contagion much like they are accusing the UK of now.

Yes in the scheme of things, Greece's debt is a speck for the EU but not Greece. Austerity has and will obliterate the people into despair for 50 years, which is why anti EU sentiment is high in Greece. Eventually, the fascists will get stronger along with some other parties. They already get 15% of the vote. They want GREXIT. Pro GREXIT parties are getting 30% of the vote and rising.

Greeks are generally supporting of Farage and the BREXIT. This only fuels GREXIT. The time bomb is ticking.

What the EU could have done for Greece is actually given them a hair cut of the debt. That never hapenned. The debt has only increased and Austerity has reduce GDP by 20%.

Pensioners were given a 10% pension cut pushing many under the poverty line. These are EU enforced measures. More like black mail if you ask me.

Even to this day, they don't want Greece to leave and continuously threaten the Government with scare mongering. It will all end with the Fascists which btw I Would vote for under such circumstances and I never ever thought I would vote for a fascist movement. When people are pushed over the edge, this is what happens.

Now that we know BREXIT has not made the sky fall in for Britain, other countries will follow. It won't be as simple for Greece as it will involve defaults but once it's done it's done.

Edited by Aikhme: 30/6/2016 11:10:26 AM

Read what is bolded in Azza's post...

If you actually read the full quotes and article about what the Spanish guy said, his actual position was that the EU could not do any negotiations with Scotland (Nicola Sturgeon was at the EU meeting) separate to their negotiations with the UK.

However, if Scotland LEFT the UK, that would be different.

The point was that Scotland could not be part of the UK and the EU at the same time.

The only way the EU can threaten Greece is if Greece wants to stay in the EU. The conditions imposed on Greece by the EU was "take it or leave it".

But Greece did not want to leave, so they capitulated.

If Greece were willing to leave the EU, they could do so tomorrow. They could immediately default on their debts as other countries have.

But they know that their legal and political institutions are weak, they have endemic corruption, and that the investment they do have, is largely because they are in the EU. That would all disappear if they went out.

The UK has a strong tradition of reliable legal and political institutions, so they are much less prone to collapse than Greece.

But the issue with the UK is not that they would have an immediate apocalypse, but that being outside the EU will have long-term consequences on economic growth.

From a local Christadelphian church :lol:

and?

Sorry I can't help you anymore than what both I and Azza have said.

Spain will veto Scotland, any time , day and night..Scotland, will not be joining the EU at any time, just as Ukraine or Turkey will not be joining the EU at any time

what great insight, does Azza have on the likely hood, that Scotland will join the EU

i just give you a insight, into something you never thought about,,,,that Poland, or a Baltic country , would happy veto Scotland EU bid, for a UK mechanized infantry battalion place in the East

Poland doesn't have to say such words, because everyone knows, that Spain will say it.....how many fucking times, and fucking ways does Spain have to say, before you understand the fucking message is , Scotland not getting into the EU



Edited by adrtho: 30/6/2016 02:38:22 PM

About as much as you, he did make it pretty clear that the Spanish PM was talking in the context of Scotland joining the EU while still being part of the UK.

I also made it pretty clear that if Scotland were to become independent, it would be with the UK's consent. Why would they then ask Poland, Belarus or anywhere else to veto Scotland joining them?

See above

If you don't understand that's cool but I can't do more than I've already done.

Spain sent a message, loud and clear today...France also sent a message today, when France didn't need to...


why did David Cameron, give a Scottish referendum vote, and then campaign against?.....

why did they say , Scotland would need to re-apply for EU membership, only to hear Spain say, they will block it








Belarus is run by a dictator Lukashenko , it is not in the EU















Edited by adrtho: 30/6/2016 03:22:03 PM

UK won't be part of the EU anymore so this quote (and the one proceeding) is not really irrelevant.

oh please....

it not a court of law, you you finding fault in the word., your ignoring message that Spain has said every time,

we will veto, Scotland EU hope

Edited by adrtho: 30/6/2016 04:12:47 PM

Who said anything about a court of law? Who is we? :lol:

Anyway, you have an opinion and I have another. Personally I don't think it'll even come to this scenario and the deal done will satisfy Scotland, the moderate leavers and most remainers. We'll wait and see :-"

we is Spain...

It might not be that simple, mcjules.

It appears that Spain and France, potentially among others, won't allow the EU to negotiate with Scotland while they are part of the UK. They say that Scotland hasn't the power.

Now, you're quite right that there will likely be another Scottish referendum in which case Scotland might become an independent nation.

Only then is there any chance that Scotland will be able to negotiate re-entry to the EU. But that will take a while to happen.

And, even then, there's no guarantee that they'll be allowed back. You see Spain is opposed to Scottish independence because it doesn't want to send out encouraging messages to Catalonian separatists. So Spain may well act to punish Scotland, too, even if they have already gotten their independence.

The whole thing is a mess.

I didn't say it was simple. The whole "Spain will never accept Scotland" argument is flawed. They may well veto an independent Scotland's bid but they haven't come out and said that so you can't be sure. Frankly the time frames involved in all of this to play out is years and so many things can change.

True. Lots of imponderables.

flawed., is to not listed to the message that Spain has said over many years about Scotland joining the EU

and it not only Spain, France send the same message

Edited by adrtho: 30/6/2016 09:06:53 PM

As expected Boris Johnson doesn't have the balls to go through with triggering article 50 and wants no part of it :lol:

Nah, if he thought he could win the leadership he'd definitely run.

With Gove announcing his candidacy though, it's clear Boris wouldn't even make it past the party room ballot.

Yeah - I think your comment is a reasonable position. Whereas some others are making sweeping absolutist comments.

I personally think Spain is making noises because they fear Scotland leaving the UK. But I think their rhetoric will change if and when Scotland actually leave the UK. However, obviously this is just my opinion.

The biggest issue I think that will come up with the Brexit divorce is this:

The EU has made it very clear that access to the single market ONLY comes with an agreement to free movement of people.

One of the main reasons people voted leave was over concerns related to migrants.

So I think this will be a major point of contention over the coming months.

Greece wanted to GREXIT. The Syriza Party (Socialist Party) won office on this very platform.

The flamboyant Varoufakis (Finance Minister) who was a senior lecturer in economics at Sydney University, was wanting Greece to default and exit the Eurozone single currency, claiming it to be the only method of salvation for the country.

He is right of course, only if the Debt would be converted to Drachmas at the going rate prior to its drastic devaluation from high inflation bought about by excessive Quantitative Easing.

The EU, was threatening Greece with all kinds of things such as the debt would remain in Euro. They also threatened Greece with withholding the bail out, which btw were nothing more than new loans and not haircuts.

There are still some hard core elements in the Syriza Party which are anti EU, and it is only a matter of time before they have the numbers to challenge Tsipras' leadership. Add to this a number of other anti EU parties like the fascist Golden Dawn, and a couple of others such as the Greens etc.

If Greece leaves EU, it will be apocalyptic for them in the short term. The UK in comparison is EASY.

But even so, the hard times for Greece will only be short to medium term and not 50 odd years by remaining in the EU.

My tip is that Holland and Denmark are next to leave - NEXIT and DEXIT.

After this, it will be GREXIT!

Greece's institutions are fine since the old pro EU PASOK and ND Party have been obliterated.

Greece has one of the strongest Military in the world, with a sytrong Military Eite which can take over Government if an apocalypse comes to fruition. Junta and Coup in actual fact and Greece has done this before.

Edited by Aikhme: 1/7/2016 11:34:08 AM

what happening...there the unelected European commission and European MEP taking a hard fixed line, and then there the European heads of state (countries PM and president)

unelected European commission, want a EU super state, they want to do away with the power of the European heads of state. they want to do away with state army and Police, and control it all .....unelected European commission want to take a very hard line on the UK. they want to show other countries what will happen when the UK leaves

but it's the European heads of state (countries PM and president) who have to deal with what to do with the 3 million plus EU citizen now living in the UK, what do when 1m maybe 2m plus mostly Eastern European EU citizen coming back to the EU work forces

also, the UK has a massive €80 billion trade deficit with the EU, placing trade tariff on UK will cost Germany massive jobs, as the EU can't move fast enough to make new trade agreements to cover this loss...it the European heads of state who will pay the prices and start losing there job when this starts

factor no body talking about
UK is not Norway....the UK is one of 5 permanent UN security council members, this carry very real power that the EU commission will never have, if the UK start using this power, they can make the EU life very different

UK military is still the biggest most powerfully military in Europe...when you look at the fact Australia spends $1000 USD per person on it's military , and see every European country spend less per person, do you understand how weak they are...UK military along with France, are the only military that can respond

the idea that the EU countries can hit the UK hard on trade, but also then want the UK to pay to help protect the East Europe , and help with the UN,,,,hmmm

EU you can have there free movement of peoples principle, but that prices will be job, and that prices will to double spending on the military (which would still be 30% less then what Australia spends per person on Australia military)

Some EU countries are very strong militarily.

Greece, Italy, Spain, and France to name just a few.

The pending EU-Canada trade deal has been held up for years by a dispute with Greece about the naming rights for feta cheese

:lol: 8 years trade talk, being hold up by feta cheese

Edited by adrtho: 1/7/2016 02:07:39 PM