With the kiddies about to start soon, a good time to keep an eye on this for 2015. Happy New Year all.

Thanks Arthur, when I have time look forward to listen to that link.

krones, I hear you re Fathers incl mothers as well.
Your qld based so I don't know what rules apply for jnr rep but down here the 2 clubs I've been associated with the last years once your kid is selected rules and stds are quite specific that all parents are to shut up from the sideline, no screaming blahblah from the sideline only the coach giving instructions but encouragement is fine.
Got to say I used to head over to the opposite sideline having some stoopid boistrous parents - wish they'd learn to stfu and that their kid isn't ronaldo !

The small player is an issue at hand for donkeys years - obviously they keep picking those jnrs who grow earlier for the sake of having big units out run out jump the yet to develop kid who many times has more skill and better read of the game.
You see this at every trial I imagine around the country - I can understand the logic but why not have a criteria pick the bigger kids capable of being the CB pairings and maybe 1 CM for example ?
Resource has always been our anvil as you mention therefore regional areas are not being looked at enough for talent - I don't know what can be done to improve this anbody have ideas ?

Barca you posted in one post :
"the best will eventually go to the a-league or to AIS/NTC not to the NPL which is seen as secondary. Thats the FFA's aim.They are trying to rebuild the pathways which were broken along time ago probably before the NSL ended to when the A-League started, its about funnelling the talent to the a-league level more efficiently".

During trails prior to xmas from one guy I know close to FNSW had mentioned from this years Regional League finish that up to 40 kids will be selected to filter into A-League academies that as we know are in the making so seeing your post makes me feel that at least things are going ahead to a degree.

Get dad to stop telling him to kick it. AND HOW TO FUCK DO YOU DO THAT when dad thinks my boy has a fantastic boot.

Just listened to the first half, interesting his point about sponsorship f tournaments.
I do however think that a lot of the rest has been done by people on this forum or suggested by people on this forum. ie a national skills test (promise but never came)

I do however have a problem with the small player pool notion , if you have a small player pool why do you burn so many promising players at the stake and why do you only look in the capital cities for talent instead of all over the country. the qas is 2000km from cairns how many kids play between cairns and Brisbane. A regional state team of 20 is put together for the entire state outside of Brisbane. ffs is that the best use of your player pool?

2nd half now

http://www.beyondthepitch.net/podcasts/edition/index.cfm/beyond-the-pitch/2015/01/02/tom-byer/


Listen and learn what should be done.

theres no solution at the moment and that's the reality. its very bad and has turned a lot of people away from the sport.
the only way would be if the clubs were performance based somehow, which would force the clubs to field and find the best players in the league. but It wont happen.

don't know what to say. its all f&#@d at the moment.

unless you have a solution of course...
I remember thinking once I would find a kid from Overseas that's a pro footballer. put a gopro on him and send him to trials for the state league clubs just to show how fake it would be.
its the same process. they put the kids in a corner, let them wear some bibs and chase eachother like headless chickens,
then tell them they didn't make it lol.
the same would happen to the kid with the go pro.

hmmmmmmmm ](*,) ](*,)

Good discussion, was a worthy topic to put up. No point having a professional league here if we're pushing kids away 9and their parents) from the game due to insanely high rego fees!

The solution is easy (independent money)+( coaches well paid for good results) results are not only but must include results on the field as well as development, again depending on the age. We need a national approach to community clubs ie cowboys league clubs offering jobs training and opportunities for players as well as an independent income source for Areas or zones to pay for great coaches.

http://www.brotherstsv.com.au/

put $1000000 into junior rugby league each season +jobs for players. fees for rugby league juniors $85 with a free pair of socks and shorts.

Well something has to be done guys, or else it will only get worse. No point moaning about it, we need to create solutions to the problems head on rather than putting it in the too hard basket.

here here + not what you know who you know.
From jnrs up politics, hidden agendas right through to npl.
Fat chance this ever getting sorted out.

Just to prove my point what happened to all the QAS players, if they were the best of the best NPL clubs would of gobbled them up. but no only some got gigs.

But it is still all about who's daddy has the most money

You have to realise there are many factors for getting a player to play at the top level a lot has to do with coaching too and player pathways, thats why the current structures are in place.
More needs to be done no doubt, but nothing is perfect here.


The current elite pathways are:

Skillaroos
NTC
A-League.

Ive seem the talent there and they are quite promising although very young and physically need to grow more but unfortunately it only goes to the few given how limited it is, also a lot of players go overseas given how much talent there is outside of the system.

But it seems there is more talent outside of the current player pathway from what you are saying, thats why the FFA want to get the NPL clubs and eventually the a-league clubs to all chip into player development to maximise the large talent pool in this country.

But also unfortunately there isn't enough money to go around at all levels, which is why the costs have gone up at NPL level, the A-League you will feel will can handle it(I Hope). But below that it seems it could take a while for the NPL to find its own niche at that you would think.

But the best will eventually go to the a-league or to AIS/NTC not to the NPL which is seen as secondary. Thats the FFA's aim.They are trying to rebuild the pathways which were broken along time ago probably before the NSL ended to when the A-League started, its about funnelling the talent to the a-league level more efficiently.






Edited by Barca4life: 3/1/2015 03:30:04 PM

It's not a load of crap mate it's reality.
And fyi I did play elite at junior level, my dad was an elite player who was fortunate enough to play in the euro cup (the old champions league) in the 70s and my other brothers have also played overseas.
I have had first hand experience with running a club and have seen the things that go on. Coaches get told who to play depending on sponsorship etc.
following that the ais etc only scout the odd player from the "premier league" and don't bother looking at super league or div 1 etc.
Kids go on trials and aren't even looked at. It's always the same kids from last year etc. it's a shame.
Over the years I have seen so much talent go wasted because there's no clear pathway.
I mean if you look at an npl club what is the reward for having the best team? Nothing. So they obviously need to make financial decisions on who plays and charge an arm and a leg. $1000 to play "elite" football. What a joke elite football should be better funded and more focus put on identifying the "best" talent and making sure they get through the correct pathways to become better players.
It's a massive shame. I wish I could help those kids get through. The politics behind it are too strong.

Im sorry but what a load of crap that said!
You should realise there is a big gap between grassroots and the very elite level and another difference which is important if a kid wants to make it as a elite player compared to a player who just wants to enjoy the game but environments are completely different.

There are many elite players who are not just talented but also they have worked very hard to get to where they want in their careers, to call them sugar daddies/rich kids or what ever you want to call them without knowing how much they have to go through to make it.
I agree with everyone there are issues in grassroots which are very concerning but i don't think its fair to make a comment like to say the level of the a-league reflects on the level of costs of the game of grassroots. There are a lot variables between the two its silly!

And coming from myself where i tried to make it as a elite player unfortunately ended with injury i know there is a big difference unlike your self which you don't know about well enough….

And from that pool 'sav' we have the A League and the National Team. Last night 1st played 2nd. You only have to read the comments on this forum about the quality, it just reflects the football philosophy of our nation. You mate are spot on what goes on.
The saddest bit is this new guy from Belgium thinks he will improve things at grassroots...I feel sorry for him because he actually doesn't know that the biggest problem is the ROT in the system.

The problem sis in Sydney anyway is that the football nsw takes a large chunk of the rego money and gives nothing back, I mean the club still has to deal with council organise refs attend f$$κing district meetings complete reports for football nsw pretty much do everything using volunteers yet the club gets nothing. I mean if they are charging 200 rego for a normal comp not state league fnsw takes 120 as a flat fee for doing nothing at all.
On top of that the elite clubs charge thousands and chose players that their family's can fund to play so not the best players. Then the scouts and ais only look at these top comps ie npl and don't look at other players that are playing at a lower level because they couldn't afford the comp even though they are better raw talents then the shit thats playing.
How do I know this? I was in the committee of a club for a while. I saw so much wasted talent it made me sick.
It's a big disgrace if you ask me

Exactly, the NPL came from the NCR instigated by the FFA under Buckley.

I was only saying that fees are high because clubs have many expenses, not just wages. No doubt that wages are a huge expense though and, indirectly, rego fees help cover these. But many people basically imply that clubs collect the money from juniors and then set it aside to pay their first grade players. I'd be surprised if more than 10/20% of fees ended up in players' pockets at most clubs. Most would be covering player wages through sponsors, sugar daddies and community backing. You'd be silly to base your entire business model on junior fees

Why only the State Federations? What about the national body?

This may not be in regards to NPL but more so youth in general.
Atlas says it all - here in nsw its ridiculous.
RL - my son last season U14's costed me $1120 + incidentals - trialed for another club this coming season got selected costs $1700.
I had heard same club from last went up to $2400 ?!

This is driving many kids to other sport. The Federations in every state should be ashamed of themselves for turning the working man's game into an elite sport.

WNPL QLd juniors is half the price of 2014,
still shit as there are now 9 Brisbane clubs up from 6 , so its divisional standard at a premium price.
had enuff of this shit , moving abroad.

Like I said originally in this thread, it's hard to know where each clubs expenses go to.

And like I said, the specific example of some NPL clubs using the extra rego to pay first grade is something I've seen first-hand. I don't believe every single NPL club does it, but I believe a large amount of them do, to some degree.

That's a simplistic way of looking at it.

How much of that 2k pays for:
- kits
- gear
- rego
- insurance
- coaching
- ground hire/maintenance
- ref fees
Etc

You make it sound like the only expense a club has is first grade wages.

The junior fees issue is much, much more complicated than first grade fees. It's a structural issue with the entire sport, one that the FFA havent addressed and, if anything, have further cemented

The norm in Sydney in 2014, 12 yr olds paid $2400 if in NPL1 or level below at NPL2, as did 13s,14s,15s,16s and 18s. That's 6 age groups per club by 24 clubs....THAT'S a lot of money!

My contacts in Vic are advising me that clubs like South Melbourne and Bulleen are charging the $2000 per child (including extra money for 'Spring Training' sessions). I also understand that the clubs are getting around the '3 training sessions per week' the FFA mandates, by employing private contractors to do the 4th trainign session. Keizer or Keiser Training it's called.

Then my context is coming from a Victorian one. Having prepared a budget for an NPL CLub the out goings are very high.
From Coaching fees, facilities costs, FFV Fees, Referee Fees, Match Day requirements etc. etc. are all much higher than previously or in "Community Comps".

There are definitely some NPL clubs in Newcastle that do it. I wouldn't be surprised if it is more common than you think.

If hypothetically juniors rego fees are 2k, and the eg I used of 1k of it goes to first grade player payments. If there are 16 kids per team, and let's say you have U6s-U16s with one team in each year group, that's 160 kids. If 1k of the kids 2k is being used for player payments, the club has funded half their player payments solely with this rego money. I wouldn't exactly say barely scratching the surface - it is a very good (budget-wise) way to pay for half your team.

I doubt very much that money from kids regos is going to finance player payments, if it does happen its the exception rather than the rule.
Besides for the bigger clubs with player payment budgets exceeding $300K junior fees barely scratch the surface.