So this model that stops clubs overspending has seen 9 of them go insolvent in 14 years. And the only difference between this and the NSL is the name of a club (excluding 3) carried on

We all know this model is fucked and I get a feeling whoever is in charge will try to push the same shit forward

We need FIFA to be running our game. Australia is too bias

shizen

Who thought we'd ever be calling for FIFA to help us with our corporate governance issues.

BUT WE ARE UNIQUE

No, there's more differences between the A league and the NSL (and AAFC for that matter). Under FFA and with the A league, we have had 9 professional Australian teams employing at any one time at least 162 full time professional football players, on a minimum salary of around $55k per year.

The difference is that the Lowys have run the A League like their shopping centres. All of the employees have been paid at least a fair and reasonable wage, whilst the small businesses (franchises) leasing the retail space (spot in the league) have had to pay high rents (licence fees and reduced distributions).

With the NSL, and the AAFC model, the small businesses (clubs) are looked after by the league, but the employees (players) are slave labour.

Yes, the Lowy's have a real problem with the model favouring the rights of young Australian football players over the rights of wealthy clubs and their wealthy board members, many of whom have successful business and millions of dollars in assets.

You make me laugh ^_^

What is your fixation on salaries of players? Do you really think that clubs are going to try and screw players down to $10k/year? Thanks to the global market (as well the domestic market competition) any club that seeks to screw players over wages will simply cease to exist as players can freely move to where they are fairly valued. If anything, existing restrictions in place harm Australian footballers because they are unable to earn the same amount for the same job as their overseas counterparts.

The big bad EPL (which is, you know, owned by wealthy board members and the such) seems to cope with wages just fine - Huddersfield are bottom of the list with an average annual wage of ~$1.85 million/year. That seems ok to me, does it not? Sure, the A-League won't be reaching that level any time soon, but it's a false analogy and, frankly alarmist, to suggest that club owners being in control of the league is going to lead to poorer workplace arrangements for footballers when you have repeatedly failed to provide statistical evidence proving this will occur.

Walnuts, I have not yet seen one commitment from AAFC or NPL clubs that if they participate in a second division, they wil pay all of their squad at least the minimum wage. When I see that, I will shut up about it.

So I just did a quick check and the annual minimum wage is approx $36,000/year - do you honestly think that a club is going to try and pay full time players less than this figure?

my club was handed back to the FFA because it was running at a loss by a person who loved our game but couldnt operate the club like a business
Griffin steps in , steadies the ship but alienates the fans and the govt

We need a person in between... Griffin's demands are too extreme  and the FFA are control freaks

expand the A league first
have a national second division
Pro/Rel once the two leagues are estabilshed , teams are self sufficient..

What are your thoughts on the CEO of a struggling non profit organisation getting paid $1.3m?

Not really, this is classic negotiation technique. Go all in, so there is room to move when the eventual negotiation and compromises take place. If they go in with less they will have to compromise on more.

Isn't it closer to $25K?

The national minimum wage is currently $18.29 per hour or $694.90 per 38 hour week (before tax). (https://www.fairwork.gov.au/how-we-will-help/templates-and-guides/fact-sheets/minimum-workplace-entitlements/minimum-wages#what-is-the-national-minimum-wage-order)

694.9 x 38 = $24,696.20

Try $694.90 x 52 weeks = $36,134.80

Ah correct, brain is working well this week.

$300 Million lost in 13 years and yes the ones who benefitted the most are the players.

But I am here to tell all the haters who wouldn't accept that the A-League is a failed business model;

I told you so!

Australian football going great guns at the moment....

Why would they have to pay the minimum wage? Unlike in other industries, if clubs try and underpay the true value of their services, which is reflected by the market, then they will cease to exist. No club could afford to screw all their players over wage wise, if many of the other clubs are paying a lot more. The effect would be detrimental to the club as it would linger at the bottom of the ladder and then get relegated. This would happen because all the good players would move to other clubs that are paying more fairly. In essence, your claim that clubs would take players for a ride is in effect incorrect, because in the end the club themselves would be shooting themselves in the foot.

You can't have a minimum wage for football players if the market doesn't warrant it. That would be like me going up to my local football association and asking to be paid 55k.
Second tier comps should in essence work as amix of semi pro/pro until it builds naturally and more funds are brought into the league. whether through tv distribution rights from the top league down or through corporate sponsorships or rich benefactors that come in and want their club to compete more and hence decide to pay their players more. IN a semi pro league, clubs can't demand players to play for peanuts, players will volunteer as they try to increase their own exposure and try and get noticed by a bigger club. Think of it as an internship. 

Nothin like that Strayan Sporting Landscape.

-PB

They cope with wages so fine that the clubs voted to put a form of salary cap in place in 2013 and extended it for another three years in 2016.

Davo, or is that President Trump Davo? I disagree with you 100%.
You may think it's fair and reasonable to exploit Australian youth and engage in slavery, I do not.
There is no logical reason whatsoever why every player in a second division shouldn't be paid at least minimum wage.
Not one person has come up with a valid argument against that proposition. The reason why is clear. There is no ethical argument to support slave labour.

How on earth is it slave labour?

The players that don't want to be there don't have to be, nobodies forcing them.

You haven't given a good reason why it has to be fully pro with minimum wage?

So the W League and Youth League are slave labour. And not only that, but you are OK with it

Not only that but every weekend 90+ NPL clubs engage in slave labour. And you are OK to that also

But "say No to second division slave labour"

Only at the top end of the wage scale though - memories of Leeds and Portsmouth are probably still fresh in the memory, so I can understand nervousness about spiraling wage bills. That said, it only limits the amount spent from the TV money revenue - cash earned through other commercial arrangements is exempt, so the clubs like Man Utd, Man City, Chelsea etc etc with large global revenue sources can still pay mammoth wages to players. No impact on the lower end however, with average wages for the bottom paid players still very healthy.

I've given a few perfectly good reasons why every player in the second division needs to be paid AT LEAST the minimum Australian wage. Read them above. To recap- every worker should be paid a fair wage for a fair days work: We live in a modern western economy that is one of the richest countries in the world and there's no reason why businesses can't pay their staff: It's good for football as it allows players to concentrate fully on football and train and play full-time and not have to get another job. This should make them better players.

Here's some more: Clubs will have to be more accountable and have to be run like proper businesses, which will improve the financial climate of the Football INDUSTRY (Yes it is an Industry) in this country and we should see an improvement in club financial solvency: A fully professional model should encourage external businesses to invest more in sponsorship, knowing they are dealing with a reputable business that pays its staff properly: It sets a minimum financial standard for clubs that is transparent and ensures that any clubs wanting to be in the top divisions know what the minimum standard is. etc etc 

What happens if we don't mandate that ALL players must receive at least the minimum Australian wage?

Australian players (particularly young ones) get treated like slave labour. e.g.. NPL clubs might have a squad of 23, and only pay 15 of the players. You know, the foreign star coming here for his swan song gets the bulk of the money. e.g a club with a particular ethnic social club backing might choose a player from that country that will draw a crowd and then pay him heaps, but the young Australian players in the squad get $0 but the club tells them you're getting the honour of playing in the 'shop window' alongside a legend. This would especially be so in the AAFC model with it's minimal salary cap. That's not good for Australian players.

Players from poor backgrounds will be more likely to give the game away. If you're a fringe player and a late developer, and your family needs you to have a job to bring in some money, at least with the minimum wage you're doing that. Who knows, you might even improve and become a good player in the league over the years. If you're 19 and on the fringe and and doing it for free, you'd probably just quit and get a real day job to earn something.

Players you're not paying can be let go at any time. If you have no investment in them, why keep them?

In short, semi-pro benefits unscrupulous clubs, but does NOTHING for Australian players, particularly young players.

As I've said, all I want is for a minimum starting point where AAFC comes out and says ALL players will be paid at least the minimum Australian wage. As calculated above, that's about $26k for an 8 month contract. There simply is NO reason why they can't do this. That amount of money probably would be less than many of the board members of some of these NPL clubs spend on bottles of wine over dinner in a couple of months.

Nice rant.

Come back when you actually know how many hours worked by each player.

Or the difference between a wage and a salary.

"2nd div needs to be minimum wage? "

Thats like 18 bucks an hour. Lets say maybe 4 training sessions at 1.5 hours plus a game say 3 hours including preparation for a home game. thats 9 hours. So $162. Not many NPL players on less than that! LOL!




"semi-pro does NOTHING for Australian players, particularly young players."
What horse shit!!

Still waiting for someone to come up with just one, just one reason why any player in a national second division shouldn't be paid at least minimum wage. 
It's just not able to be justified.

LOL! what a spud. 

playing a sport you love and getting paid for it = slave labour. every time i play soccer im a slave haha.

what about playing futsal mate? what about going for a jog or working out in the gym? should i get paid for that or am i a slave? 

fmd. 

Funniest thing is none of the behind the scenes guys at NPL clubs get paid anything. its only the players and coaches that get money. And where does it come front? the sponsors AND the rich owners. Yes mate, often the owners PAY the coaches and players out of their own pocket, they aren't making money from them hahaha. Worst slavery I've ever heard of!

No player or coach is going to get paid under $18 per hour so wtf are you on about!