I just read about it on the FFA website, i would like to know what you guys/coaches think about whether its made a impact in grass roots level?

Discuss? :-k

To early to tell, but from first impressions it is not far reaching enough. Needs a major sponsor to help fund the model.

Agree with these sentiments, though I think they have the model right, sponsorship would go a long way.

Failure.

A poor mans Project 22.

We didn't have a Project 22 in Victoria, but by all reports the FFA wants to do away with it and replace it with Victoria's zone competition. Lucky you.

Isnt this program have a sponsor anyway? The Johnny Warren Foundation?:-k

Not enough Kiwi input.

This

Edited by spathi: 20/8/2011 01:09:13 AM

Zone comp in NSW?

lol

Been there, done that.

Rehashing old, tried and subsequently dumped ideas.

Circus.

I'd like to see P22 tried again in a couple of years after NSW has had the reform go through the place. P22 had to fight with one hand tied behind its back - the likes of Marconi (and others) did all they could to derail them, banning their players from trialling, and refusing to play them in competitive matches.

The FFA has done a great job in reforming the highest levels of the game, if they do the same at State League level and bring these self-serving clubs to heel then I'd love to see P22 tried again, and properly this time - with full state youth league participation.

Until such time as the state league is properly reformed, there is no point trying to gauge the success or otherwise of innovative projects like P22 and Skillaroos - these projects have been hampered at every stage by the old establishment powerbase, worried about what it could mean to their little clubs.

success in that football brisbane runs it own program(age 8-11) at 6 centres and gold coast runs it own program , these wouldnt be in place if the FFA hadnt taken the lead. The FFA with one coach for qld for their program is rather lite in both funding and personel.

Huh?

NFI.

P22 played in PYL, and were hopelessly outclassed.

And, FYI, P22 was the brainchild of the old outgoing FNSW board.

Is it true that the SAP will be extended in NSW as a result of Project 22 being disbanded, what does it mean for the current coaches, players of that program(Project 22) will they be invited to SAP?

Hardly matters.

All the half decent coaches go to clubs who have a long history of success.

P22 got the chaff.

Edited by judy free: 29/8/2011 07:53:39 AM

Most of the P22 parents I've spoken to in our region are going down the SAP path. They are not even considering Metro league.

Marconi made sure of that by banning their players from trialling with P22. More obstructionism from the recalcitrant old guard trying to hold on to relevance with all they've got. Roll on the state based revolution.

Banning?

Erm, you do realise that Marconi and P22 played in the same competition (PYL) where all clubs (incl. P22) compete for players from the same talent pool, and all players are free to chase a spot at any club they fancy.

You can't "ban" players that are not registered with your club, FFS. :lol:

Good Choice...

Yeah we are going down the Metro League path as I'm hoping it will be less of a commitment and with a bit of luck they get to wear full mariners kit on gameday.:)

Erm...that's just obfuscation. Some of the boys who'd been with Marconi juniors the previous few years wanted to go and trial with P22 (or their parents did as it was free). Marconi, fearful of losing their nice little earner, put out communication to all the Marconi juniors saying that if anyone had tried out for P22 they would not be welcome back at Marconi. I am only aware of Marconi doing this, but it wouldn't surprise me if the others did as well.

Which is why many of the best (though not all) juniors stuck with paying exhorbitant fees to the big state league clubs, and P22 got mostly second-raters. Whereas it should be the other way around, as all talented juniors should have free access to the best coaching in this country, not be charged between 2K and 6K per season (plus "optional" camps, etc) by clubs only interested in self-perpetuation. Should be a game for all, not just the middle class. Talk about the pond needing to be drained...

Fearful of losing a nice little earner? :lol:

FFS, there's a 100 or so kids, in each age group, that miss out on selection......but you knew that.

No shortage of punters to hand over their money.

Additionally, thuper, talented players stuck with clubs for three reasons:

a) better coaching

b) playing alongside the best players

c) long and proven history of development

Projects like P22 have come and gone a million times before...........only mild fascination this time 'round came from small sections of the new dawn.

Chips, let me put a theory to you. Instead of pricing out kids whose parents can't stump up the thousands of dollars p.a., and instead of starting up new projects like P22, how about compelling these State League clubs to charge juniors not more than the cost of playing for a local club? (say up to $300. OK, $500 since they are reps and require more training, with perhaps $100 topup from the State and National bodies).

How to achieve this? Simple. It's a known fact that the reasons these clubs charge so much is to pay their semi-pro players and keep the senior side going. So how about this - a salary cap at State League level for Premier League and Super League? Say to the level of total expenses + 20% of current salary levels. Parallel to that, introduce a rule that says that for each player these clubs sell to a HAL club, instead of getting a measly $3K they get $15K? Suddenly there is a genuine financial incentive for these clubs to keep on producing quality young players for the highest football levels in this country.

I appreciate some players would lose a chunk of their livelihood, but instead of continuing to support average players in their late 20s-early 30s making money out of semi-pro football, or importing some average African, you would force the clubs' hand to develop and play younger players, mainly in the 17-23 bracket. And if done gradually, say over 2-3 years, the financial impact on some of these older existing players would be mitigated.

But the biggest winner would be football, as a result of being able to attract the best talent to rep football, not just those who can afford to pay for it. Screw supply and demand, let's just get more talent into the game.

My problem with elite systems is that it produces elitist kids.
Now I am going to blow some steam here
What I have seen in the past 5 years is an elite system where kids as young as 13 have boots that cost over $200.00 not one pair but 3
They all have the latest skins, replica kits and shin guards.
All of them have a new ball @ $30.00 purchased for them each month or when they are selected into any squad.
Many of them have fathers who are the coach or manager.
They have no sense of humility or sportsmanship and believe that they are already pro footballers.
Now ask them to bring a water bottle or help train younger kids, or train at home or haven forbid fund raise their own travel costs and you may as well talk to the wall.
Mean while at the local bunnings you will see the local rugby club or the hockey club or any number of other clubs putting on a sausage sizzle on a Saturday morning.
I am yet to see a football club.
In my opinion when it comes to finances and early selection our elite youth get it way too easy.


It takes time and pressure to make a diamond not a silver spoon and free lunch.

I'm sure that's not the case for all state league clubs (as opposed to local clubs like mine who do this kind of stuff regularly), but in terms of spoilt middle class brats that's EXACTLY my point - yes we are by far and away the highest participation sport in the country, but until we genuinely make rep football accessable to all and not just the middle class kids, we deny football to really connect with the poorer sections of society.

Even when its free its still a commitment thuper. I've pasted an extract from an article that I read when my eldest was doing P22 and I tell you even though it was free there were no "working class" kids there. The best option I reckon for kids without means is the sports schools like Westfields where training becomes part of their curriculum.

I look at Number 5, cheated of his dream by heavy legs. Summer-borns are similarly outcast. Far more Premiership footballers are born in October and November than in June and July. 'They are bigger and make more of an impact on the pitch,’ White says, 'then, of course, they get selected, better coached and leave the other guys behind.’ What else do you need? Parents with cars and the kinds of jobs where they can drive to training twice a week for 5pm. 'When I went to Manchester United Academy what struck me was the car-park full of smart cars,’ White says. 'The academy is in the middle of nowhere. There is no way you can get there unless you’ve got a car. No way you can get there three or four times a week unless your parents take you. What that is doing is middle-classing the game. The whole system precludes kids from the rougher end of town, because how the hell do you get there?’ Take Theo Walcott, the England starlet, who came through the academy system at Southampton. His father served in the RAF, his mother is a midwife; his grand­father was an RAF Warrant Officer and one of the first black Conservative councillors in Britain.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/4938593/Football-academies-kicking-and-screaming.html

in ingerland some clubs will send a mini bus to pickup and drop off players, also if a player is small and struggling physically then they can play down a year.

Absolutelye fair point. But even so, there may be parents in the lower socio-economic bracket who would be prepared to do the driving, but the paying of $5K+ every year. And yes, the sport high school is definitely the way to go in that case - just look at the number produced by Westfield Sports High. Out our way there is one being set up at Matraville High, hopefully it'll pick up the slack in this area.

But I'll say this much - football better hurry up and do it, or we'll end up middle-classing our game even more than it already is. And for so long as aussie rules/rugby league continue charging juniors $50-60 per year, and our grassroots clubs charge $300 (not even mentioning the rep programs) we'll continue to lose a chunk of good footballing and athletic talent.

Edited by thupercoach: 9/9/2011 05:34:34 PM

Shame about all that loot Frank has pissed down the drain on WC bids, coxswains, rubbish o/s coaches, propping up frachise football, dead beat adminstrators and a myriad of other snouts in the trough. Grassroots coulda done with a small share of all that, eh thuper?

Government money allocated specfically to try and bring the world's biggest sporting event down under.

So Chips...not game enough to tackle my suggestion?