I've never considered myself a "leftie" but Enzo and Moron make me feel like I've become one. 

Are we playing conservative talking point bingo or something?

-PB

You will see in all my other post that I acknowledge and recognise that the US economy is doing well under Trump. This is why I question whether people actually care about the Ukraine matter at the end of the day.

It's called Trump Derangement Syndrome.

People are just hating on Trump for the hell of it despite him putting the runs on the board.

It's actually quite sad how some people are so one eyed or brain washed.

agreed, by those who only see their side of the politics.....no matter the dislike of Trump as a person and persona he is recovering alot that the Obama's and fellow leaders could/should have done.
The maths back him up them the facts but you can't please them all.

Unbelievable! You actually think Greece and the other Eurozone economies have different rules when it comes to debt.

Every country has the potential to be a Greece. This country actually had better socialist programs than Australia did. It was very progressive in that it had a great pension system, free medical, university degrees were free and so on.

Now look what has happened.

It wasn't the only country of course - Spain, Portugal, Ireland and Cyprus were in the same boat.

And Italy is on the verge and hanging on only just.

The GFC hit many countries.

I just can't believe how delusional you guys are.

Please let me once again try and explain things to you in simple terms. You can only borrow for as long as you can service your debt. This applies to all countries. And even if you don't borrow and have a debt and go into recession, then the debt to GDP ratio increases. If you borrow on top of that, it increases further. And as the recession deepens, Government receipts tighten and decrease, thus reducing its ability to service its debt. This reduces the credit rating and increases the interest rate it needs to service, thus compounding things further.

If the debts are not serviced, then countries will not accept your trade in your currency because the risk is it will become worthless as inflation increases.

Then eventually, you have a meltdown and a banking crisis as property prices free fall, leaving all debts unsecured.

Don't ever believe it will not happen in Australia. A credit crunch is inevitable in ALL countries. But the more debt there is, and the bigger the deficit, the worse the calamity.

The Great Depression of the 1930s hit the global economy to point of famine. It WILL happen again.

Lol you have no clue about  government  debt do you? Also we are not greece.  Unless you want the lnp  to borrow  over What They  can pay back. Even America  is in debt.  Spending  it on infrastructue , health ,education et el  is  needed and not hording  it to pork barrel people like you who only see oh money 

Stop swallowing the Socialist Cool Aid .

Someone always has to pay, one way or the other.  Again See Greece.

But I don't expect Socialists to understand the concept of Paying For It,  because its always Someone Else's Money they spend, so it doesn't matter to them.  Until it does.

Oh the Magic Money Theory (MMT).  Government debt doesn't matter because the government can just "print" more money, and spend as much of it as it wants.

One wonders why every African despot doesn't just get himself a laptop with and Excell spreadsheet and just keeping adding zero's to the national currency reserves.

Look up Hyerinflation in the Weimar republic to see where that leads.

Government debt matters because if you don't pay your debts, others will refuse to trade with you in your currency. See Greece.

At the other end, government debt is only a problem if you can't manage it ie you can't make the repayments and the borrowing costs are too highl.  But right now interest rates are low so its not a problem.  If they go up who knows?

 If the US economy tanks under Trump you'll be blaming it all 100% on Trump.  But when it booms you want the Democrats to take credit for it.?  Yeah, nah.

The share markets went through the roof more or less immediately after he got in. 

Tarriffs don't work, right?  Wrong.  The Chines product now costs more so the US consumer might buy a competing product which is better value.  This hurts the Chinese.  If they buy the Chinese product anyway, the tax goes to the government and the money stays within the US to be spent on the US people.  Either way the Chinese need to come to the party rather than undercutting the world with cheap labor and at the same time opening ther markets to the world

Trump has more than enough positives he could claim his own in the election campaign, if he could only stop of engaging with the moronic far left Democrats.

One serious question. were you-and by you I mean all the other Trump haters-before I posted them actually aware of any of the economic performance under Trump figures above?

  Or will you just hate Trump and will do so no matter what?

Tax reform in the US was a 30 year in the making project. It was not a function of Trump though. It was a function of Republicans controlling the White House, Senate and Congress. If either were not Republican controlled (like Congress now), it wouldn’t have happened. Hence the rush to push it through. The US have a very outdated tax system which the reforms fixed. It lowered the headline rate from 35% to 21% but also got rid of the deferred tax regime for foreign earnings meaning they now tax foreign earnings like everyone else.

The reform also makes hiring in the US more competitive again so this would help with the jobs growth. You’re not going to be better than low cost jurisdictions but you’re tipping the scale back slightly.

bruh

What grants and to which companies?

Please provide examples. I have not heard of Government providing grants to business.

And secondly, Government Debt is debt. It needs to be paid back and yes my examples are perfectly valid. A State can't just keep increasing its debt. In case that gasn't sunk into your thick head, then I suggest you research the Global Financial Crisis and what happened to Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Ireland and Cyprus.

Again houseold debt is  nowhere the  same as government  debt you imbecile. Sustainbly borrow ? You mean give out grants to companies that go bankrupt ? Or dont need Grants  in the first place. 

Because economics isn't your forte, think of it as your household budget.

Can you keep spending more than you earn? You can for a while. And you can keep doing it in proportion to wage or income increases. If you buy a rental property, then that is good debt because your income increases along with your debt.

But if you just keep borrowing for things that do not create income and your wage increases don't keep pace, then eventually you will not be able to service your loans and you will have to declare bankruptcy. You will lose everything including the roof over your head.

So in order for the State to spend, it has to tax someone. Tax really isn't a problem. It's a necessity. It becomes a problem when Tax is too much and becomes a dissinsentive to investment and business. When it becomes a dissinsentive to business and corporations and also to productivity and workers, they start to cut back and what happens there is they reduce investing, reduce spending and reduce employment. Therefore tax receipts for the State decline further, thus compounding the problems and the deficit.

That is why we can only sustainably spend and sustainably borrow. Otherwise what we are doing is actually robbing future generations and our own children.

this is the reason why ScoMo won the elections. It's because the vast majority know how the household budget works. The vast majority are trying to balance their own budgets and its proving to be harder and harder.

That started when you all started talking about Trump's impeachment. nearly 4 years ago! lol

Neeeext!

lol this thread has hit it's peak.

-PB

Have you ever heard of Greece, Portugal, Spain, Ireland and Italy? The so called PIGS?

They didn't horde it and now they have the most awful austerity ever inflicted on any population and 30% unemployment.

No, what you say is incredible irresponsible. Governments are only able to spend what is sustainable. There should be a surplus preferably, but if there isn't they can only spend in proportion to projected growth and if they do not or there is a downturn or financial crisis and they remain in debt, then look out. It isn't a good thing. And those who suffer the most are the poor.

You can only borrow if you know your GDP is increasing. If your GDP isn't increasing then your debt to GDP ratio increases and eventually it will become unmanageable to the point where the State cant make payments. Tax isn't an endless tap either because what happens is that business tightens its belts, sacks workers and stops investing. And because there is less employment, there is less tax for the state and things go from bad to worse.  Also Corporate profits decline, resulting in even less tax revenue for the State.

But these are concepts the left does not understand. After all, you don't want a State to horde it. Just spend spend and spend till we collapse. And collapse we will just like Venezuela.

Look, economics isn't your forte. Stick to the A League sunshine! Stick to the A League.

Are You seriously  equalling house hold debt to governemnt debt? Its not the same . All governments  are  in debt. Surpluses are a furphy and are used to pork barrel. We need governments to spend not horde it.

1.What is a surplus-its the government taxing more than they needed to run the country. I hate giving a cent more of my money to government than I am required to do, so a surplus?. F that.

2.  There is good debt and bad debt.  You borrow to buy a house=good debt.  To start a business=good debt but more risk. Labor doesn't understand teh difference between good and bad debt.  To them, its Someone Else's Money, so who cares?

As it stands the evidence against Trump is not impeachable.

Let me get this straight! You are accusing Trump of asking a foreign power to investigate his opponent now? 

Desperate to say the least.

Even if true, who cares?