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Quote:
Foreign property buyers offered residency

From:
AAP November 21, 2012
9:36AM

FOR half the price of the average Australian home, you can own a luxury property in Spain outright, and it comes complete with dual residency.
Yes, it's true.

In an attempt to offload debts crippling Spanish banks, the nation's government will offer residency rights to foreign property buyers who spend more than more than 160,000 euros ($A197,000).

While $200,000 wouldn't even buy a studio apartment in most Australian capital cities, it's more than ample for a luxury home in upmarket parts of Spain, including beachfront suburbs.
Russian and Chinese buyers are being targeted but it is understood the real estate scheme will be available to all foreigners, and may include residency for the entire European Union.
"We have proposed to the other ministries that for residents who acquire a home in Spain for more than 160,000 euro that will automatically entail a residency permit," Spanish Trade Minister Jaime Garcia-Legaz said in an article published by British newspaper The Times this week.
.
With some five million Spaniards out of work, the number of people unable to maintain repayments and forced to leave their homes continues to rise, with reports claiming 300 evictions per day in the first half of 2012.

In November, Spain's government announced a two-year halt to evictions of vulnerable home owners after the practice was linked to acts of suicide.

Spain's residency offer, which aims to revive the construction industry, is more attractive than similar schemes in Ireland and Portugal where buyers are offered such rights only after buying houses worth more than 400,000 euro or 500,000 euro respectively.
Bad debt in Spanish banks rose to a record 10.7 per cent of the loan total, about 182 billion euros ($A225.8 billion), in September, with institutions desperate to offload the crippling assets.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/realestate/investing/foreign-property-buyers-offered-residency/story-fndcursx-1226520952618

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Hamas dragging body on the road of suspected Israeli collaborator.

Reminds me of that alleged yemeni spy who was crucified on the street.





Edited by aussie4ever4: 22/11/2012 12:16:11 AM

Edited by aussie4ever4: 22/11/2012 12:16:27 AM
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benelsmore wrote:
Mozilla wrote:


People need to look past the whole 'Muslim vs Jews' when taking a perspective on this topic. This is about human rights, the fact that Israel committed genocide to a populous of people who are still suffering and growing ever smaller, (look at LRO's pic a few pages back). People need to stop looking at current politics so much and look at what has occured in the past and how it is still affecting the people now.


If I had a $ for every time i'd seen the quoted garbage posted. You're holding Israel to a higher standard.

What occurred in the past is the arab league attempted to wipe out the state of Israel numerous times and were humiliated numerous times. Israel has had to defend itself and its population who have been subject to literally 1000's of terrorist attacks from all manners of arab fanaticism.

To summarise my view in laymens terms would be to say Palestine and its people under Ottoman control were defeated and offered a portion of land during the 1922 memorandum by the league of nations following British victory in WWI and the collapse of the Ottoman Empire. Following WWII they started a war and were humiliated. Cue the next 70 years of bitching and moaning about their rights.

Now the smarter arab states sit back and watch the zealous idiots throw themselves at Israel and then complain and draw sympathy from idiots world wide.


You are drawing everything out of context lmao.

'What occurred in the past' - Let's start from the beginning. The original rulers of the land were the 'Canaanites', not Israelites. Canaanites were either Jewish nor Islamic. As time progressed, and Judaism gathered steam, it was proposed that god gave Jews the land (:lol:). The Zionist movement (a racially motivated one at that) was one that spurred the notion that the land was promised via 'god'. Finally, when the time was right, Britain decided to hand 57% of Palestinian land for the state of Israel. Leaving 43% for the recent owners (forget historical wars and fucking godly promises).

At the time of the land hand over, there were 340,000 Arab residents occupying the land. These residents were driven to make way for a Zionist state. Zionism meant that Palestinian refugees mounted quickly. By the end of '48, there were round about 800,000 in total. And here you are, stating that the Arabs were the bad guys and Israelites were just 'defending themselves'. Actually, I guess you're right. I guess the Palestinians really should have just have sat back and let themselves get raped up the ass.

Some quotes by some famous Zionists who had hoped for their god reservated land beforehand..

'We shall spirit the penniless population across the frontier by denying it employment. Both the process of expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly.' - Theodor Herzl

'We must expel the Arabs and take their places and if we have to use force, to guarantee our own right to settle in those places ­ then we have force at our disposal.' - Ben Gurion

'Cue the next 70 years of bitching and moaning about their rights'. You're right, human rights aren't a big deal :roll: FFS they have slowly been constricted to shrink ever smaller by the US supported state of Israel. They have arrived at a point where they must poke to generate any type of support for their rights, but instead receive a heavy punch to the face.

Israel wants Palestine completely wiped out. They are a Zionist state that have been feeding propaganda worldwide to paint Arabs as bad guys, while they go about with their dirty work. It has occurred from the beginnings of the British land giving and it continues now. A popular myth that you probably believe is that Arabs sold off their land to Jews with a smile on their face..

'In the area allocated to the Jewish State there are not more than 520,000 Jews and about 350,000 non-Jews, mostly Arabs. Together with the Jews of Jerusalem, the total population of the Jewish State at the time of its establishment, will be about one million, including almost 40% non-Jews. such a [population] composition does not provide a stable basis for a Jewish State. This [demographic] fact must be viewed in all its clarity and acuteness. With such a [population] composition, there cannot even be absolute certainty that control will remain in the hands of the Jewish majority .... There can be no stable and strong Jewish state so long as it has a Jewish majority of only 60%.' - First Israeli PM 'Ben Gurion in a speech addressing the Central Committee of the Histadrut on December 30, 1947

'I am for compulsory transfer; I don't see anything immoral in it.' and 'we have to state the principle of compulsory transfer without insisting on its immediate implementation.' - In speech to the Jewish Agency, 1948

Of course this is 'not true' in the eyes of Israelis, they need to look look the good boys with an excuse when locking in a bunch of ravenous animals.

What about that famous line about wanting to drive 'Jews into the sea'? That was actually quoted from Zionist Ben Gurion in 1961, via the Israeli Knesset.

‘The Arabs’ exit from Palestine…began immediately after the UN resolution, from the areas earmarked for the Jewish state. And we have explicit documents testifying that they left Palestine following instructions by the Arab leaders, with the Mufti at their head, under the assumption that the invasion of the Arab armies at the expiration of the Mandate will destroy the Jewish state and push all the Jews into the sea, dead or alive’.

This was then spun out by Zionists and used to masquerade as a quote from an Arab to play a part in justifying the Israelis reign of terror against the Palestinians.

But for some time to come, it will be all *poke poke poke* from the hapless Palestinians against the Israelis, who will then respond with wails of injustice to justify shooting them back in the face.
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Funnily enough, the word Palestine comes from the name Phillistine who were regarded as the israelites worst enemy. They are believed to come from Europe via the sea and inhabitated the modern day gaza strip. The arabs revived the name Palestine with this in mind.

Many Jews fled Europe to Palestine but were also met with hostility there, with the jews now wanting there own country the British could not solve the dispute and left it in the hands of the UN, the UN came up with the two party solution which the arabs rejected and then the war began.

According the bible the original Israelites conquered the caanites, whether or not this happened idk, i think its kind of undecided. Interesting history in the ancient near-east.


Edited by aussie4ever4: 22/11/2012 04:26:20 PM
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Mozilla wrote:
benelsmore wrote:
Mozilla wrote:


People need to look past the whole 'Muslim vs Jews' when taking a perspective on this topic. This is about human rights, the fact that Israel committed genocide to a populous of people who are still suffering and growing ever smaller, (look at LRO's pic a few pages back). People need to stop looking at current politics so much and look at what has occured in the past and how it is still affecting the people now.


If I had a $ for every time i'd seen the quoted garbage posted. You're holding Israel to a higher standard.

What occurred in the past is the arab league attempted to wipe out the state of Israel numerous times and were humiliated numerous times. Israel has had to defend itself and its population who have been subject to literally 1000's of terrorist attacks from all manners of arab fanaticism.

To summarise my view in laymens terms would be to say Palestine and its people under Ottoman control were defeated and offered a portion of land during the 1922 memorandum by the league of nations following British victory in WWI and the collapse of the Ottoman Empire. Following WWII they started a war and were humiliated. Cue the next 70 years of bitching and moaning about their rights.

Now the smarter arab states sit back and watch the zealous idiots throw themselves at Israel and then complain and draw sympathy from idiots world wide.


You are drawing everything out of context lmao.

'What occurred in the past' - Let's start from the beginning. The original rulers of the land were the 'Canaanites', not Israelites. Canaanites were either Jewish nor Islamic. As time progressed, and Judaism gathered steam, it was proposed that god gave Jews the land (:lol:). The Zionist movement (a racially motivated one at that) was one that spurred the notion that the land was promised via 'god'. Finally, when the time was right, Britain decided to hand 57% of Palestinian land for the state of Israel. Leaving 43% for the recent owners (forget historical wars and fucking godly promises).

At the time of the land hand over, there were 340,000 Arab residents occupying the land. These residents were driven to make way for a Zionist state. Zionism meant that Palestinian refugees mounted quickly. By the end of '48, there were round about 800,000 in total. And here you are, stating that the Arabs were the bad guys and Israelites were just 'defending themselves'. Actually, I guess you're right. I guess the Palestinians really should have just have sat back and let themselves get raped up the ass.

Some quotes by some famous Zionists who had hoped for their god reservated land beforehand..

'We shall spirit the penniless population across the frontier by denying it employment. Both the process of expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly.' - Theodor Herzl

'We must expel the Arabs and take their places and if we have to use force, to guarantee our own right to settle in those places ­ then we have force at our disposal.' - Ben Gurion

'Cue the next 70 years of bitching and moaning about their rights'. You're right, human rights aren't a big deal :roll: FFS they have slowly been constricted to shrink ever smaller by the US supported state of Israel. They have arrived at a point where they must poke to generate any type of support for their rights, but instead receive a heavy punch to the face.

Israel wants Palestine completely wiped out. They are a Zionist state that have been feeding propaganda worldwide to paint Arabs as bad guys, while they go about with their dirty work. It has occurred from the beginnings of the British land giving and it continues now. A popular myth that you probably believe is that Arabs sold off their land to Jews with a smile on their face..

'In the area allocated to the Jewish State there are not more than 520,000 Jews and about 350,000 non-Jews, mostly Arabs. Together with the Jews of Jerusalem, the total population of the Jewish State at the time of its establishment, will be about one million, including almost 40% non-Jews. such a [population] composition does not provide a stable basis for a Jewish State. This [demographic] fact must be viewed in all its clarity and acuteness. With such a [population] composition, there cannot even be absolute certainty that control will remain in the hands of the Jewish majority .... There can be no stable and strong Jewish state so long as it has a Jewish majority of only 60%.' - First Israeli PM 'Ben Gurion in a speech addressing the Central Committee of the Histadrut on December 30, 1947

'I am for compulsory transfer; I don't see anything immoral in it.' and 'we have to state the principle of compulsory transfer without insisting on its immediate implementation.' - In speech to the Jewish Agency, 1948

Of course this is 'not true' in the eyes of Israelis, they need to look look the good boys with an excuse when locking in a bunch of ravenous animals.

What about that famous line about wanting to drive 'Jews into the sea'? That was actually quoted from Zionist Ben Gurion in 1961, via the Israeli Knesset.

‘The Arabs’ exit from Palestine…began immediately after the UN resolution, from the areas earmarked for the Jewish state. And we have explicit documents testifying that they left Palestine following instructions by the Arab leaders, with the Mufti at their head, under the assumption that the invasion of the Arab armies at the expiration of the Mandate will destroy the Jewish state and push all the Jews into the sea, dead or alive’.

This was then spun out by Zionists and used to masquerade as a quote from an Arab to play a part in justifying the Israelis reign of terror against the Palestinians.

But for some time to come, it will be all *poke poke poke* from the hapless Palestinians against the Israelis, who will then respond with wails of injustice to justify shooting them back in the face.


Can you not see a wider problem? They constantly refer to times when Moses was a boy. No one knows anything concrete from back then because its all he said she said, with many native populations being nomadic. Both claim they were there first and both will use religion to justify murdering the civilians of the opposition.

As for this Zionist crap, I was waiting for it. What you have just done is group all of Israel together as Zionists when really that's as stereotypical as calling all Maoris bludger's who eat maccas off the roof of their beaten up cars. When it comes to people hating Israel, blaming Zionists for everything is about all they've got.

I like your quotes by the way. Both followed serious conflicts, 1948 being the 6 day war and 1961 was strikes against Egypt and Jordan. Perhaps if I had time to quote mine following serious conflicts I could make any country look like racist psychos. It doesn't help that you use quotes for the extremists either. Perhaps I should source some Hamas quotes as a representation of the arab league and all Palestinians?

I'm also not necessarily saying Israel is good or bad. Both share the blame. What rubs me the wrong way is everyone saying "oh poor little Palestine" when they share the guilt. They are JUST AS TERRIBLE as Israel.

If I was Israeli i'd want Palestine gone too. Why would you want a hostile neighbor? Please explain why Israel shouldn't want to get rid of Palestine when it's clear peace is impossible.
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Quote:

Australia to abstain from vote on UN status for Palestine

DateNovember 27, 2012 - 2:25PM Read later

Julia Gillard has compromised on her opposition to Palestinian membership in the United Nations – deciding Australia will abstain when the contentious vote is put in the General Assembly.

Ms Gillard told Labor caucus this morning she did not believe the resolution proposing Palestine be given a similar standing in the UN to the Vatican would advance peace talks with Israel.

But after strong lobbying by both Left and Right factions, Ms Gillard said Australia would not oppose the bid.

Former foreign minister Gareth Evans has also been heavily involved, briefing MPs on the issue and warning Australia would stand on the ''wrong side of history'' by opposing the bid.

A planned motion by Labor backbencher Andrew Leigh calling for Australia to back Palestinian membership has now been withdrawn.

Israel has steadfastly opposed the Palestinian manoeuvre, warning it breaches promises not to make a unilateral declaration of statehood.

Ms Gillard had last year directed Australia to vote against Palestinian membership of the UN cultural body, UNESCO.

She said a yes vote would achieve nothing and set back the peace process.

But the decision to abstain will mark a break with the US, expected to side with Israel.

A majority of countries are expected to back the resolution.

Follow the National Times on Twitter



Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/political-news/australia-to-abstain-from-vote-on-un-status-for-palestine-20121127-2a4ld.html#ixzz2DPmRfbqK

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The world disagrees with the No camp.
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Aussie4ever4 wrote:
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Hamas dragging body on the road of suspected Israeli collaborator.

Reminds me of that alleged yemeni spy who was crucified on the street.





Edited by aussie4ever4: 22/11/2012 12:16:11 AM

Edited by aussie4ever4: 22/11/2012 12:16:27 AM


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lol this shit goin down in Egypt is rofl.

-PB

https://i.imgur.com/batge7K.jpg

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UN vote 138-9 in favour of recognising a Palestinian non member observer state, with 41 absentees.

The 9 who voted against:
Israel
United States
Canada
Czech Republic
Marshall Islands
Micronesia
Nauru
Palau
Panama

Lol. Israel + US (A nation run by Jews) + A bunch of tiny irrelevant islands have probably been payed off by the US to vote against


Edited by Mozilla: 1/12/2012 11:20:46 AM
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Quote:
Lol. Israel + US (A nation run by Jews) + A bunch of tiny irrelevant islands have probably been payed off by the US to vote against

Those abstaining is as good as a vote against. I like the way you conveniently ignored Canada and the Czech Republic.

But all the other nations all have a vested interest in keeping on the US's good side.
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Quote:
Scrapping the dollar bill could save the US $4.4 billion

by: Kevin Freking From: AP December 02, 2012 11:14AM

IT is the world's most iconic unit of currency. But the American $1 bill could be headed for the scrapheap.

Congressional auditors say doing away with dollar bills entirely and replacing them with dollar coins could save taxpayers some $4.4 billion over the next 30 years.

Vending machine operators have long championed the use of $1 coins because they don't jam the machines, cutting down on repair costs and lost sales.

But most people don't seem to like carrying them. In the past five years, the US Mint has produced 2.4 billion Presidential $1 coins. Most are stored by the Federal Reserve, and production was suspended about a year ago.

Experts say that while it would be expensive to replace machines, the fact that coins can stay in circulation for up to 30 years, while paper bills only have four to five year lifespans, outweigh the initial costs.

"We've never bitten the bullet to remove the $1 bill as every other Western economy has done,’ said former director of the U.S. Mint Philip Diehl said. "If you did, it would have the same success the Canadians have had."

The latest projection from the Government Accountability Office on the potential savings from switching to dollar coins entirely comes as lawmakers begin exploring new ways for the government to save money by changing the money itself.


Notes versus coins. The Americans may soon follow Australia in swapping dollar notes for coins.
.The Mint is preparing a report for Congress showing how changes in the metal content of coins could save money.

The last time the government made major metallurgical changes in U.S. coins was nearly 50 years ago when Congress directed the Mint to remove silver from dimes and quarters and to reduce its content in half dollar coins.

Now, Congress is looking at new changes in response to rising prices for copper and nickel.

At a House subcommittee hearing the focus was on two approaches:

•Moving to less expensive combinations of metals like steel, aluminum and zinc.
•Gradually taking dollar bills out the economy and replacing them with coins.

The GAO's Lorelei St. James told the House Financial Services panel it would take several years for the benefits of switching from paper bills to dollar coins to catch up with the cost of making the change.

Equipment would have to be bought or overhauled and more coins would have to be produced upfront to replace bills as they are taken out of circulation.

But over the years, the savings would begin to accrue, she said, largely because a $1 coin could stay in circulation for 30 years while paper bills have to be replaced every four or five years on average.

"We continue to believe that replacing the note with a coin is likely to provide a financial benefit to the government,'' said St. James, who added that such a change would work only if the note was completely eliminated and the public educated about the benefits of the switch.

Even the $1 coin's most ardent supporters recognize that they haven't been popular. Philip Diehl, former director of the Mint, said there was a huge demand for the Sacagawea dollar coin when production began in 2001, but as time wore on, people stayed with what they knew best.

"We've never bitten the bullet to remove the $1 bill as every other Western economy has done,'' Diehl said. "If you did, it would have the same success the Canadians have had.''

Beverly Lepine, chief operating officer of the Royal Canadian Mint, said her country loves its "Loonie,'' the nickname for the $1 coin that includes an image of a loon on the back. The switch went over so well that the country also went to a $2 coin called the "Toonie.''

Australia switched to a $1 coin in 1984 and the $2 coin followed four years later.

The Mint's report, which is due in mid-December, will detail the results of nearly 18 months of work exploring a variety of new metal compositions and evaluating test coins for attributes as hardness, resistance to wear, availability of raw materials and costs.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/business/scrapping-the-dollar-bill-could-save-the-us-44-billion/story-fn7j19iv-1226528271700

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Mozilla wrote:
UN vote 138-9 in favour of recognising a Palestinian non member observer state, with 41 absentees.

The 9 who voted against:
Israel
United States
Canada
Czech Republic
Marshall Islands
Micronesia
Nauru
Palau
Panama

Lol. Israel + US (A nation run by Jews) + A bunch of tiny irrelevant islands have probably been payed off by the US to vote against


Edited by Mozilla: 1/12/2012 11:20:46 AM


C.O.N.S.P.I.R.A.C.Y!!!!!

Are the Czechs now all Jews as well?
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Has anybody been keeping an eye on the Egypt situation? What exactly are the details in the constitution?
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The announcements of new occupation outposts (settlements) in retaliation against the worlds recognition of Palestine just shows where the true issue lies. Small minded, petty and wrong.
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benelsmore wrote:
Mozilla wrote:
UN vote 138-9 in favour of recognising a Palestinian non member observer state, with 41 absentees.

The 9 who voted against:
Israel
United States
Canada
Czech Republic
Marshall Islands
Micronesia
Nauru
Palau
Panama

Lol. Israel + US (A nation run by Jews) + A bunch of tiny irrelevant islands have probably been payed off by the US to vote against


Edited by Mozilla: 1/12/2012 11:20:46 AM


C.O.N.S.P.I.R.A.C.Y!!!!!

Are the Czechs now all Jews as well?
Didn't you know?
This may not be a bad thing, the UN may now be able to bring the terrorists under spotlight for continually firing rockets into Israel. Maybe.
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This may not be a bad thing, the UN may now be able to bring the terrorists under spotlight for continually firing rockets into Israel. Maybe.

Given they largely ignore Israel's antics, I doubt it.
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Syrian crisis has just moved a step closer to all out war with other parties.

With NATO and the United States moving Patriot missile systems into the Turkish-Syrian border at Turkey's request, Russia has just unloaded a shipment of superior Iskander missiles to Syria.

It's quite obvious that the Cold War is not over. Sure, on the public face it is, but Russia and America still both trust each other as far as they could throw each other (figuratively speaking), especially now that Vladamir Putin is back in the Russian Presidency.

Watch this space; Going to be interesting. Iran is also gearing up in case the Rebels do over throw Assad. Don't be surprised if they launch a ground invasion to back up Assad's forces should the rebels keep making progress like they have. Even though they're constantly denying using them against their own people, I wouldn't be surprised if Assad has seriously considered using his chemical weapons yet. I wouldn't put him past it to do so, by doing so America has vowed to step in, which would bring in Iran, who would probably launch an attack at Israel too for the heck of it, although I don't know how strong they would be fighting on two fronts.

Quote:
Russia arms Syria with powerful ballistic missiles
Iskanders carry 1,500-pound warhead at 1.3 miles per second
Published: 1 day ago
author-image by Reza Kahlili Email | Archive
Reza Kahlili served in CIA Directorate of Operations, as a spy in the Iranian Revolutionary Guard, counterterrorism expert; currently serves on the Task Force on National and Homeland Security, an advisory board authorized by Congress. He is the author of the award winning book "A Time to Betray" and regularly appears in national and international media as an expert on Iran and counterterrorism in the Middle East.More ↓
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Iskander

Hours after NATO agreed on Tuesday to send Patriot missiles to Turkey because of the crisis in Syria, Russia delivered its first shipment of Iskander missiles to Syria.

The superior Iskander can travel at hypersonic speed of over 1.3 miles per second (Mach 6-7) and has a range of over 280 miles with pinpoint accuracy of destroying targets with its 1,500-pound warhead, a nightmare for any missile defense system.

According to Mashregh, the Iranian Revolutionary Guard media outlet, Russia had warned Turkey not to escalate the situation, but with Turkey’s request for Patriot missiles, it delivered its first shipment of Iskanders to Syria.

Reporting today, Mashregh said the handover occurred when Russian naval logistic vessels docked at Tartus in Syria.

The Iskandar is a surface-to-surface missile that no missile defense system can trace or destroy, Mashregh said. Russia had earlier threatened that should America put its missile defense system in Poland, it would retaliate by placing its Iskander missiles at Kaliningrad, its Baltic Sea port.

Russia’s delivery of Iskanders to Bashar Assad’s embattled regime clearly shows that the security and stability of Syria remains Russia’s red line, Mashregh said. It is unknown how many of these missiles have been delivered but the numbers given are sufficient to destroy any Patriot missiles in Turkey, it said.

The delivery of the missile not only threatens the security of Turkey but also Israel, which would have to recalculate its strategy with its defensive and offensive capabilities.

As reported in a WND exclusive on Dec. 5, Iran’s Islamic regime also sees the toppling of the Assad regime as its red line and has 170 ballistic missiles targeting Tel Aviv in underground missile silos, some with biological warheads.

In August, a commentary in Mashregh, representing the regime’s views, warned America and Israel that further instability in Syria would spark a pre-emptive attack on Israel in which the use of weapons of mass destruction – biological, chemical and even nuclear bombs – won’t be off the table. It stated that certain groups (proxies, such as Hezbollah) have been armed with WMDs and that Israel will be their target.

The Mashregh commentary charged that Israel is one of the conspirators behind the Syrian crisis in order to strategically change the geopolitics of the region and defeat one of the main players in the Islamic world’s “resistance front” (Iran, Syria and Hezbollah). It warned Israel that with the direction it has chosen, “There is a dead end, and the threat of mass killing awaits.”

The Islamic regime in Iran for its part continues to ship arms to Syria via Iraq both by air and ground while its Quds Forces help the Assad regime in killing its own people. To date, over 40,000 people, including many women and children, have died since the Syrian uprising began in March of 2011.

Reports indicate that Assad has decided to use chemical weapons on his own people as a last attempt to save his rule. Speaking in Prague on Monday, U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton warned Syria that the use of chemical weapons would be a red line, indicating that America would retaliate.

Meanwhile, Iran’s supreme leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, has ordered the Guards and its Quds Forces to use all of their capabilities to protect Assad and has threatened war against those helping the rebels in Syria, primarily Saudi Arabia and Turkey, according to a source who had served in the Revolutionary Guards intelligence unit but who has since defected.

The source added that the recent Gaza conflict was a warning to America and Israel that the Islamic regime in Iran can destabilize the region further should the push in Syria continue to topple Assad. The region will witness terrorist attacks, assassinations and incitement for uprisings in countries allied with America as the situation in Syria further deteriorates, the regime has promised, according to the source.

Reza Kahlili is a pseudonym for a former CIA operative in Iran’s Revolutionary Guards and author of the award winning book “A Time to Betray” (Simon & Schuster, 2010). He serves on the Task Force on National and Homeland Security and the advisory board of the Foundation for Democracy in Iran (FDI).
Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2012/12/russia-arms-syria-with-powerful-ballistic-missiles/#1ZRCRbv2gG06IKUY.99


WOLLONGONG WOLVES FOR A-LEAGUE EXPANSION!

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The announcements of new occupation outposts (settlements) in retaliation against the worlds recognition of Palestine just shows where the true issue lies. Small minded, petty and wrong.


Shouldn't be a problem. Once there is a fully fledged Palestinian state I am certain they will give the Jews in those towns the same rights that Israeli Arabs have. I am sure Jews will be able to vote, work, go to school with Arab kids, represent Palestine in sport, become members of parliament alongside Arabs and generally participate in Palestinian life.

So the building makes no difference to the peace process.
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Shouldn't be a problem. Once there is a fully fledged Palestinian state I am certain they will give the Jews in those towns the same rights that Israeli Arabs have. I am sure Jews will be able to vote, work, go to school with Arab kids, represent Palestine in sport, become members of parliament alongside Arabs and generally participate in Palestinian life.

:lol: No they won't.
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afromanGT wrote:
Quote:
Shouldn't be a problem. Once there is a fully fledged Palestinian state I am certain they will give the Jews in those towns the same rights that Israeli Arabs have. I am sure Jews will be able to vote, work, go to school with Arab kids, represent Palestine in sport, become members of parliament alongside Arabs and generally participate in Palestinian life.

:lol: No they won't.


Oh...

Besides which of course, The Palestinians don't want a peaceful coexistence side by side with Israel but are committed to Israel's destruction, it's in their charter. If they aren't willing to respect Israel's borders why should Israel respect theirs? With the exception of Jordan and Egypt, the Arab and Muslim world does not recognise Israel's right to exist or its borders. Why should Israel recognise theirs?

It would be hilarious to see Netanyahu stand up and announce that from now on Israel does not recognise Lebanon's right to exist - after all it was only established in 1943. :lol: :lol:

Edited by thupercoach: 12/12/2012 09:01:12 PM
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Obama nominates Kerry for Secretary of State

December 22, 2012 - 9:47AM

President Barack Obama named Massachusetts Senator John Kerry as his choice to become the next U.S. secretary of state, saying he has the respect and trust of leaders around the world.

Kerry would replace Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, who has previously said she planned to leave the post. Obama said Kerry would continue the work that she's done to restore U.S. influence globally.

Kerry "is not going to need a lot of on-the-job training," Obama said in making the announcement at the White House today. His fellow Democrat's knowledge of U.S. policy and relationships with foreign leaders "makes him a perfect choice" to become secretary of state, Obama said.

The nomination of Kerry, 69, who is chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, is subject to Senate confirmation and sets in motion a shuffle of Obama's top national security and foreign policy advisers for his second term.

Kerry became the leading contender for the post after Susan Rice, the U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, withdrew from consideration. He is a longtime ally of Obama. At the 2004 Democratic convention where Kerry became the party's presidential nominee, Obama was selected to deliver the keynote address. An Illinois state senator at the time who was running for the U.S. Senate seat he would win that November, Obama gained national attention with his speech.

Quick confirmation

Kerry, a combat-decorated Vietnam War veteran who first became known nationally as a critic of that war, will win quick confirmation from his fellow senators, said Martin Indyk, former U.S. Ambassador to Israel and director for foreign policy at the Brookings Institution in Washington.

The nomination hearings will be conducted by the committee that he's led for the past four years and "after so many years of service in the Senate, he is a popular figure on both sides of the aisle," Indyk said in an e-mail. Kerry has been in the Senate for almost 28 years.

Republican Senators John McCain and Lindsey Graham, who are among their party's leaders on foreign policy issues, praised Kerry and said they expected to give his confirmation support, even if they disagree with him on some issues.

"I think Senator Kerry was a very solid choice by the president," Graham, of South Carolina, said at a news conference with McCain, of Arizona, and Republican Senator Kelly Ayotte of New Hampshire. "He knows most of the world leaders, so when he goes into a country he will be a known quantity."

Clinton's absence

Clinton is recuperating from a concussion she sustained after becoming dehydrated and fainting and wasn't at the announcement or at a memorial service earlier in the day for the late Senator Daniel Inouye of Hawaii. Obama said he talked to her this morning and that she "could not be more excited" about the choice of Kerry.

Obama's comment and a statement from Clinton issued by the State Department saying she spoke to Kerry today to congratulate him leave unanswered questions about her condition and when she'll return to the State Department.

Department spokesman Patrick Ventrell told reporters only that "she continues to be on the mend and continues to recover."

Indyk said following Clinton in the office, Kerry "will likely be focused on taking advantage of her success to negotiate new agreements that will help shape the emerging global order."

Defense, CIA

Obama also will be picking a replacement for Defense Secretary Leon Panetta, who doesn't plan to stay for Obama's second term. Former Nebraska Senator Chuck Hagel, a Republican, is a leading candidate for that post, according to an administration official.

The job of Central Intelligence Agency director also is open. Obama is considering Deputy Director Michael Morell, who took over as acting director when David H. Petraeus resigned last month following the revelation of an extramarital affair, the official said. The other leading candidate for the job is White House counter-terrorism adviser John Brennan.

The president's decision to wait on announcing his choices to lead the Pentagon and CIA reflects political tensions between Obama and Senate Republicans involved in the confirmation process, as well as the end-of-year distractions posed by negotiations to avert the so-called fiscal cliff.

Hagel criticized

Hagel has drawn criticism from some Republicans over past comments opposing the troop surge during the Iraq war, questioning economic sanctions against Iran and citing the influence of the "Jewish lobby" on behalf of Israel. His nomination hearings would be conducted by the Armed Services Committee, where McCain is the ranking Republican.

"I am concerned about many of the comments that he made, and has made, like reference to a, quote, Jewish lobby, which I don't think exists," McCain said. "And I think many of those comments and other positions he has taken will be the subject of the Senate Armed Services Committee."

Confirmation of Kerry for the top U.S, diplomatic post will open a Senate seat in Massachusetts. Among those who may enter the race in a special election to replace him is Scott Brown, a Republican who was defeated in November by Democrat Elizabeth Warren as he sought a full Senate term. Brown won a special election in Massachusetts in January 2010 to fill the seat vacated by the death of longtime Democratic Senator Edward Kennedy.

Potential Democratic candidates for Kerry's seat include members of the state's House delegation, particularly those from the Boston area -- Mike Capuano, Ed Markey, Stephen Lynch and Bill Keating.

In the new Senate that convenes in January and will include Kerry, Democrats will control 55 seats to 45 for Republicans.

Bloomberg



Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/world/obama-nominates-kerry-for-secretary-of-state-20121222-2bs8w.html#ixzz2FjiqrdFO

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Huffington Post lists the 100 shot dead in week since Sandy Hook as NRA calls for armed cops in every school

From:
AAP December 23, 2012
7:20AM

IN a shocking expose of gun violence in America, The Huffington Post has compiled a list of every US shooting death since the Sandy Hook Elementary School massacre on December 14.

That act of violence claimed the lives of 26 people, including 20 innocent children, at a school in Connecticut.

The Huffington Post reports that the night after Sandy Hook, a gunman pulled behind a car in Kansas City and opened fire, striking a 4-year-old boy in the head.

"He was innocent and he was just lifeless," a bystander said. "All my life I’ve never seen nothing so devastating."

This week doctors declared the boy brain dead.

In the week following the Sandy Hook massacre, bodies were found inside a vacant house, at a car wash, and in a corner store. They were also discovered on a bike trail, in a backyard, inside the front office of a motel, and in a Chevy pickup, the website reports.
All of the bodies had one thing in common: they died from gunshots wounds.

. The Huffington Post spent this week tracking gun-related homicides and accidents throughout the US, and logged more than 100 from Google and Nexis searches. It says there were more than twice that many homicides alone in an average week in 2010.

The deaths included murder-suicides, and ranged from babies through to grandparents.

On Saturday afternoon, a 3-year-old in Oklahoma died after accidentally shooting himself in the head with a gun he found inside his aunt and uncle's house. His uncle is an Oklahoma state trooper.

"Nobody should have to go through something like that," a resident said.

Paul Sampleton Jr., 14, was bound and shot in his Georgia townhome on Wednesday afternoon. His father found him in the kitchen. Police suspect a robbery motive, the website reports.

"He was smiling, listening to music," a friend told a local reporter. "He got on his bus, I got on mine. We were all happy."

The list goes on.

October 2, 2006: Charles Roberts entered an Amish school in Pennsylvania armed with a handgun, sent away male students, barricaded himself and the girls into the school, chained the girls together at the blackboard and shot them, killing five and wounding five others. Roberts, who was not himself Amish, had left suicide notes for his family.

August 5, 2012: Army veteran Wade Michael Page kills five men and one woman and wounds three other people, including a police officer, before taking his own life at the Sikh Temple of Wisconsin outside Milwaukee.

March 10, 2009: Michael McLendon, 28, killed 10 people – including his mother, four other relatives, and the wife and child of a local sheriff's deputy – across two rural Alabama counties. He then killed himself.

April 16, 2007: Seung-Hui Cho, 23, killed 32 people and himself on Virginia Tech campus in Blacksburg. He sent a disturbing manifesto, including images of himself touting guns, and videos to NBC during the attack.

1991 March 24, 1998: Mitchell Johnson, 13, and Andrew Golden, 11, armed with guns stolen from Golden's grandfather, drove Johnson's mother's minivan to Westside Middle School in Jonesboro, Arkansas. They pulled the fire alarm to lure students and teachers out of the school, and in an ambush from the woods, they killed four students and a teacher and wounded another nine students and a teacher.


December 14, 2012: A gunman killed 28 people, including 20 young children, at an elementary school in Connecticut where his mother worked in one of the worst school shootings in US history. He then
turned the gun on himself.

March 21, 2005: Jeffrey Weise, 16, killed his grandfather, a police sergeant, and his grandfather's girlfriend on an Indian reservation in Red Lake, Minnesota, before killing another seven people at his high school.

July 20, 2012: At least 12 people are killed when a gunman enters an Aurora, Colorado, movie theatre, releases a canister of gas and then opens fire during opening night of the Batman movie "The Dark Knight Rises." James Holmes, a 24-year-old former graduate student at the University of Colorado, has been charged with the deaths.

November 5, 2009: Thirteen soldiers and civilians were killed and more than two dozen wounded when a gunman walked into the Soldier Readiness Processing Center at Fort Hood, Texas, and opened fire. Army psychiatrist Major Nidal Hasan is charged with 13 counts of premeditated murder and 32 counts of attempted premeditated murder.

October 16, 1991: A deadly shooting rampage took place in Killeen, Texas, as George Hennard opened fire at a Luby's Cafeteria, killing 23 people before taking his own life. 20 others were wounded in the attack.
George Hennard opened fire in a deadly event in a Killeen restaurant. Picture: AP

April 20, 1999: Students Eric Harris, 18, and Dylan Klebold, 17, opened fire at Columbine High School in Littleton, Colorado, killing 12 classmates and a teacher and wounding 26 others before killing themselves in the school's library.

Miniature crosses commemorate the 10-year anniversary of the Columbine High School shootings, one of deadliest school shooting in modern United States history. Picture: AFP

The expose comes as US President Barack Obama has vowed to take action to stop gun violence and gun lobby group NRA was slammed for calling for armed police in every US school.

US President Barack Obama has said he will take action to stop gun violence, after more than 400,000 people have signed an online petition calling for serious action on gun laws in the wake of the Sandy Hook shooting.

Mr Obama's promise came in response to online petitions signed by more than 400,000 people after last week's primary school massacre, as the US's most powerful pro-gun lobbying group demanded overnight that armed police be deployed to every school in the country.

"In the days since the heartbreaking tragedy in Newtown, Connecticut, hundreds of thousands of you, from all 50 states, signed petitions asking us to take serious steps to address the epidemic of gun violence in this country," Mr Obama said in an online video on Friday. "We hear you."
Mr Obama joined a nationwide moment of silence to mark the passing of one week since the Newtown school massacre overnight. Mr Obama took part in the unofficial national day of mourning at the White House and First Lady Michelle Obama sent an open letter of support for the survivors.

The National Rifle Association (NRA), which defends what it sees as US citizens' constitutional right to bear arms, had been under pressure to respond in the wake of last week's massacre of 20 young children and six school staff.

But the group's leaders, in a combative and determined public appearance, ceded no ground to those calling for tougher gun laws.

"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun," declared NRA vice-president Wayne LaPierre, in the group's first reaction since last week's massacre of 26 children and staff in an elementary school.

"I call on Congress today to act immediately to appropriate whatever is necessary to put armed police officers in every single school in this nation," he said, in a lengthy statement. He took no questions from reporters.

The NRA was ready to help train security teams for schools and work with teachers and parents to improve security measures, and attacked the media and the political class for what he said was demonising gun owners, he said.

The declaration caused outrage with his armed-officers idea immediately lambasted by gun control advocates, and not even the NRA's point man on the effort seemed willing to go so far.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/world/obama-vows-action-after-online-petition/story-fnd134gw-1226542151230




Edited by Joffa: 23/12/2012 11:18:32 AM
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Crisis brings disillusionment to Greece


My Greek friends were very perplexed. “Why did Tayyip Erdogan attack us out of the blue, why did he have to pick on us at this particular moment?” they asked, “After all, it is not true, we are not selling any islands!” Apparently, I could not give them a satisfactory answer, as I said that perhaps he is hitting Greece to show his frustration with the credit agencies that are not upgrading Turkey as highly as he would have wanted, and that maybe he wanted to divert the public’s attention from some worrying signals of a slowdown in the Turkish economy, etc. But they were not convinced and one colleague suggested that the “Turks are jealous because, after all, we remain in the euro and they do not.”

Actually, if there is one positive thing that came out of the recent crucial Eurogroup summit in Brussels, it was that the “Grexit” scenario, at least for the moment, has been left out. Greece stays in, the bailout money is gradually being released with lots of conditions attached, and Antonis Samaras’s government is considered by Europeans as the best option for restructuring the economy.

However, despite the S&P’s encouraging statement, what is happening on the ground is quite different. Greeks are about to celebrate the festive season, experiencing unbelievable hardship resulting from a dramatic drop in their income. And things are expected to get worse in the new year. More taxes, higher unemployment, more stringent austerity in the hope that an agreed reform privatization program will kick start the economy. If this does not happen, the Greeks fear that the discussion on whether Greece should remain in the Euro may return.

Under normal circumstances, the job belongs to politicians. However, surveys on the opinion trends of Greek society are showing that the crisis has caused a serious blow to the credibility of the old political party system, in place for at least the last thirty years. It revealed a strong need for new faces and new political narratives. A very interesting survey published in the Sunday edition of the Ethnos newspaper showed that a high percentage of respondents, almost 82 percent, are expecting major changes in the political environment of Greece, while more than fifty percent do not trust the current political structure. What is highly indicative of the impact that the crisis had on society is that a large percentage of respondents wish to see fresh faces managing their country’s future prospects, where technocrats and academics figure prominently. This is quite new. Their dismay with the old political personnel is so strong that only 6.4 percent would like to see old faces from the three parties that make up the current coalition in a government position in the case of a political reshuffling in the new year.

Most Greeks are pessimistic about the new year and do not think that the Samaras government will manage to get the country through the reforms. And most of them do not think that the reforms will lead to neither development nor an exit from the current crisis.

But perhaps the most interesting reading of the survey is that after the dynamic public protests of the last two years, most Greeks have now come to the conclusion that while they would like to get rid of the current political parties, they would not like to replace them with radicalized new parties. They prefer the new political formations to come from the center-left or the center-right. That is not good news for the radical wing of the SYRIZA, the main opposition party that has to placate their own extreme leftists. But it is not good news either for the fascists of the Golden Dawn who are seen by most respondents as just a temporary protest movement and not an ideology.

However, nobody can see a fresh face emerging right now as a serious threat to the old political stock; most players are reshuffling the old pack of political cards. Still, we should not exclude surprises.

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/crisis-brings-disillusionment-to-greece.aspx?pageID=238&nid=37478&NewsCatID=422

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Fiscal cliff risk 'now non-trivial' for Australia
DateDecember 28, 2012 - 2:11PM

America falling off the fiscal cliff would be the most serious jolt to the global economy since the financial crisis, and could be felt on Australian markets as early as Monday morning, economists say.

Saul Eslake, Australian economist with Bank of America Merrill Lynch, said a worst-case scenario for Australia would be a shock to confidence, strengthening of the dollar, a fall in commodity prices, and weaker overall growth.

"The risks are now non-trivial," he said.

Hopes are fading for a political deal to avert a crisis, with the US House of Representatives due to meet on Sunday for an urgent session to try to reach a last-minute deal.

Should a deal fail, it would take some time for the real economic effects to play out globally and in Australia. But the impact on local financial markets could be immediate.

Mr Eslake said a deal now looked unlikely.

“It's hard to see now how they could reach an agreement that deals with the issues comprehensively,” he said.

“The best you could hope for in the remaining three days is some kind of deal that defers some of the measures entailed in the fiscal cliff, to be resolved in the early days of the new congress.”

Under pressure

Peter Dragicevich, a currency strategist at the Commonwealth Bank, said the US equities market and in turn Australian markets would come under pressure on Monday if a deal isn't made.

"The US dollar would be supported, which could see the Aussie dollar drift a little bit lower next week," he said.

"It takes two to three days to write the new legislation. So even if they came up with an agreement tonight, it would still be past the deadline."

Mr Eslake said any real economic impact on Australia could be delayed, as it was during the financial crisis, but the impact on financial markets could be very quick.

"Australian markets are the first to react, but tend to react cautiously and wait for a lead in larger markets, such as Japan and Hong Kong," he said.

“You wouldn't see a seizing up of global financial markets, but there would be some parallels to the financial crisis, in the way the financial crisis caused a recession in the US which spilled over to its trading partners."

“Although we don't do a lot of trade with the US, we do a lot of trade with US trading partners."

Treasurer Wayne Swan has joined the debate, taking to Twitter to laud Australia’s ‘‘resilient’’ economy and highlight the absence of such financial crises back home.

‘‘But even though unlike other countries we have low debt and very strong public finances, we’re not immune from global developments,’’ Mr Swan tweeted.

‘‘The impact of America’s fiscal cliff saga combined with Europe’s deep problems is having a real impact on the entire global economy.

‘‘Of course, we’re seeing the impact first-hand in Australia with the huge whack we’ve copped to our revenue base.’’

Compounding the crisis

While most analysts are predicting the local effects of a crisis to be downward pressure on Australian equities markets and a fall in the Australian dollar, Mr Eslake said there was a chance the dollar could rise, having more of a negative effect on the economy.

“Instead of the dollar going down and providing a cushion for the economy, as it often does, the dollar could rise and thus compound the effects of a crisis," he said.

Cliff talks have continued to dominate market sentiment today, but there is still uncertainty over the effect on local markets, said IG Markets market strategist Stan Shamu.

"No-one really knows what's going on to be honest, everyone is just responding or reacting to these headlines for now," he said.

Other analysts said the effects of the fiscal cliff debate could continue into the new year.

"That is going to be an influential factor for how we are going to start 2013," said Bruce McLeary of Burrell & Co in Brisbane.

"If an agreement doesn't go through there could be some weakness," he said.

The Australian dollar in particular seems very susceptible to the flurry of talk about whether or not a deal will be reached. Bank of New Zealand currency strategist Mike Jones says the dollar has had a rollercoaster ride of late on various bits of good and bad news but that it will head lower against the US dollar as the appetite for risk is reduced the closer America gets to the cliff.

"Sentiment towards the fiscal cliff is causing a lot of volatility in financial markets and the Aussie dollar at present and I guess we've seen sentiment flick from optimism to pessimism in a very rapid short space of time."



Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/business/fiscal-cliff-risk-now-nontrivial-for-australia-20121228-2byr3.html#ixzz2GM7dVHu1

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Yeah let's put armed cops in schools, they'll be the first to die then :roll:

-PB

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paulbagzFC wrote:
Yeah let's put armed cops in schools, they'll be the first to die then :roll:

-PB

Armed Cops? That's a bit of an oxymoron. Generally, most Police Forces are armed.

I assume they're on about arming security guards. Rent-A-Cops. I'd be surprised if at least 90% of rent-a-cops in America weren't armed anyway.

WOLLONGONG WOLVES FOR A-LEAGUE EXPANSION!

Heineken
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Apparently the woman in India who was gang raped on a bus before being thrown off whilst the bus was moving has died from her injuries in a hospital in Singapore.

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Joffa
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Heineken wrote:
Apparently the woman in India who was gang raped on a bus before being thrown off whilst the bus was moving has died from her injuries in a hospital in Singapore.


True

http://www.smh.com.au/world/indian-rape-victim-dies-in-hospital-20121229-2bzxn.html
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Quote:
Republicans choke Obama's 'fiscal cliff' deal

From: AP January 02, 2013 11:08AM

"I DO not support the bill." With those words, the Republicans appear to have committed the United States to recession.

The last-minute deal to avoid the fiscal cliff hit predictable but potentially lethal turbulence Tuesday as rebellious Republicans threatened to scuttle the package because it lacks enough spending cuts and deficit reduction.

The plan, approved 89 to 8 by the Senate early Tuesday, was greeted coolly all over the Capitol, notably after the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office reported the deal would add $3.97 trillion to deficits over the next decade.

Reports suggest the Republican leadership is nowconsidering demanding a further $300 billion in spending cuts.

And adding to complications, the US Senate has retired early for the night - further delaying any possible agreement.

Unless both houses of Congress agree on the deal, automatic spending cuts would take effect tonight and higher tax rates would continue for a second day as domestic financial markets open and presumably react.

Approval in the House of Representatives, where Republicans hold a 241-191 majority, remained elusive. Vice President Joe Biden met for two hours with House Democrats. While he did not find overwhelming enthusiasm, Democrat Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi tweeted that the measure would get a "strong majority" from her party.

At the same time, Republicans met privately for nearly two hours and heard opposition from Majority Leader Eric Cantor, who has a strong following among conservatives.

"I do not support the bill," he declared.

Exiting the meeting, Republican Spencer Bachus said he was among lawmakers who wanted the deal to include more spending cuts.

"We're building a consensus that we have to address spending," he said. "The president won his election; I also won my election."

Adding to the fury was the CBO report, which showed an explosion in new deficits at a time when the nation is struggling to control record debt.

"There was a lot of discontent in that room," said Republican Steven LaTourette.

The congressional turmoil was no surprise. Republicans have long been unhappy with Democrats' reluctance to agree to big spending cuts, and were not pleased the latest deal delayed the automatic across-the-board reductions by two months.

"This does nothing about getting the $16.4 trillion debt under control, said Republican Steve Chabot.

Republicans hope to pass more spending cuts, but doing so could put the entire package at risk. Any change would need Senate approval, and time is running out.

Senate Democratic leaders told members to expect no more roll call votes in the current Congress, which ends Thursday morning US time. If the two houses can't agree, the legislation dies and would have to be re-introduced in the new Congress that convenes at noon that day.

While Democrats would have slightly more members, restarting the process could take time, if only because new lawmakers would want to review the plan.

The deal negotiated Monday would preserve Bush-era income tax rates for all individuals making up to $US250,000 and families making up to $300,000. Taxpayers making more than that would pay higher taxes on capital gains and dividends. And individuals making more than $400,000 - $450,000 for families - would pay a top income tax rate of 39.6 per cent, up from the current 35 per cent.

The plan would also tie the alternative minimum tax to inflation, a big relief for an estimated 30 million taxpayers who could have been hit with higher bills. Other measures include an extension of jobless benefits for the long-term unemployed and avoiding a huge cut in Medicare payments to doctors for a year.

The unease crossed party and ideological lines.

"This punts the problem," said Democrat Raul Grijalva. "It just sets us up for more fights."

House Republicans were not pleased that they had virtually no input into the deal, crafted by Biden and Senate Republican Leader Mitch McConnell.

LaTourette called the plan "a package by a bunch of sleep-deprived octogenarians."

The loudest protests came from the 87 Republican freshmen first elected in 2010, swept into office on a pledge to drastically slash federal spending.

"There is a resignation that the big steps forward my class wanted to take is not possible with this Congress," said Republican Rob Woodall, R-Ga. "Only small steps forward are absolutely possible."

Whether he and others could accept such small steps was the key to approving the deal. Veteran Republicans argued the package was as good as they were going to get.

"Let's recognize we avoided what could have been a terrible outcome," said Republican Tom Cole, R-Okla.

He urged resisting changes. "It's too late in the game," he said. "You can keep tinkering with this, but you're not going to make it perfect."

Democrats seemed more willing to accept the package, but weren't happy about it.

"The difference between a divided government and dysfunctional government is the willingness to compromise," said Democrat Chris Van Hollen. "That means looking at an agreement and deciding whether on balance it helps not Democrats or Republicans, but whether it helps move the country forward."

Democratic leaders wouldn't say how many of the 191 caucus members might vote for the plan, just that they were examining it.

Biden, said Pelosi, discussed details of the deal and "what lies ahead, and difficult negotiations as we go forward."

She said Democrats were "weighing the pros and cons and weighing the equities of not going over the cliff."

Others were more confident. Democarat Joe Crowley flatly predicted the income tax increase would be averted, though Democrat Minority Whip Steny Hoyer said the gridlock was all too characteristic of this Congress.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/crisis-averted-as-obama-strikes-deal-on-fiscal-cliff/story-e6freuy9-1226545956521

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