Had a link now lost it. The astronomically ridiculous waste of money to be confirmed tomorrow. Allianz to be knocked down and rebuilt at 45k (the same capacity) and ANZ to be rebuilt as a 75k stadium. $2 billion cost. Ridiculous stuff. 

What?????
Why?

Political suicide  The previous Baird government had a sound plan. It appears as if the NSW state government is run by the SCG Trust board.

Link anyone?

related article/

As suggested in the article, if they were to do anything to Moore Park now it would be to improve transport links and the surrounding area. Such a waste of money to upgrade a relatively decent stadium.

Well they are doing that with the SE Light Rail. But, demolishing the stadium is an awful waste of money when there are so many many pressing needs for infrastructure spending throughout Sydney. When you step back from looking at it from a football perspective its actually pretty disgusting. 

Sydney has appalling transport infrastructure which is the result of decades of kicking the can down the road. It really hits home not only when you go to Sydney and get stuck somewhere/everywhere, but also when you live in Europe where a subway/metro is like a basic human right. People are amazed when I show them how big Australian cities are. Then they are shocked when I tell them Sydney with 5 million people doesn't have a subway. Prague with the same population as Adelaide has one and is currently looking to expand it. And the city of Brno with 400,000 people is investigating building one as well. Kiev has a 3 line metro with half 2/3 the population of Sydney and Melbourne despite being flat broke and a war zone. And smug aussies call these former communist countries "second" world! I'll take 5 minute commutes in the second world over hours in cars in the first world any day.

Am I missing something here or does Allianz Stadium have fuck all to do with the Sydney Swans

Good to see the AFL having an opinion on what can and cant be built for other sports, considering the upgrade of the GWS stadium which needs free tickets to reach 40% capacity

If this happens Melbourne needs to step up.

I can see AFL "selling out" / filling Etihad for AFLX as part of a diabolical scheme to be able to say to the Vic gov "we need money, we want to sell Etihad and build Eddie's Victoria Stadium but you have to pay for most of it. because we need a world class rectangle field for AFLX." 

It forces MV to Aami park, AFLX can go head to head with them on the same day next door (& MC) and they can charge the FFA to use the stadium. 

Won't  happen.  Itll be political suicide on dan Andrews part  and most people in  melbourne including the media hate the idea  and the afl own etihad stadium so they won't ever think of knocking down a stadium that's only 20 somethinget years old

I think its more about the value of the land than how old the stadium is. AFL seem to be the masters of getting money. This was from today/-

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-11-22/woohoo-lions-one-step-closer-to-springfield

Id love to know the logic in rebuilding Allianz at the same capacity. Its get filled maybe once a year when theres a derby. Every other tenant gets nowhere near close. Yet theyve been spinning all this crap about needed world class stadiums etc. If theyre going to knock down and rebuild at least make a 30k stadium that caters to the demands of the tenants far more. That would be too logical and not cater to the nonsensical dogma 

theyre saying its a deathtrap. The capcity isnt the issue. You may die if you go to a match there. 

It's so the ARU can keep their major events east, away from the unwashed working class that they hate and the SCG Trust benefit from being able to still host these events without losing any of their pricey stadium membership seats.

Agreed Allianz should downsize to 30k and have ANZ as your showpiece venue for the big blockbuster matches of either both rugby codes and football.

https://www.facebook.com/WideWorldOfSports/videos/1729130800450722/


Videos

Fuckers doing SFS first. 

45 000 

Fiorentinas new one is 40k







Not sure what you can get in Australia for the money promised.  Also need room for the rugby in goal areas.

While a record number of Australians are homeless and landless. No I cannot support that. Football is great, but the basics for the people in this country come first. 

It's a farce but the NSW government is awash with money at the moment following a massive boom in stamp duty and the sell-off of the poles and wires.  And there's an election in the offing.  Just this week they splurged $100 million on refunded regos for toll users in Sydney.

its actually unbelievable.

i can't remember a bigger waste of money by a government - ever. 

there should be riots over this.

I mostly agree here, but spending $2 Billion on Stadiums shouldn't just be thought of as money down the drain. The $2 Billion is jobs, both temporary in the construction and ongoing in the operation. Infrastructure is meant to be a long term investment that ends up paying for itself. Probably less so in this case, because they're replacing existing stadiums. People complained in SA about Adelaide Oval and the money spent on it, but a few years later Adelaide Oval has brought so much money into the SA economy that few would argue it wasn't a good investment.

I like most of the plan for new Sydney stadiums, but Allianz should be rebuilt at 30k like a few have said. Much more responsible and better for the A-league. Not interested in the complaints of the locals who are worried about the 100 trees or the Sydney Swans who really just want more money going toward AFL.

It's the Olympic legacy felt by all the hosts of the last generation. Sydney got it worse than most though. Not only did they build things that were only needed for a few weeks of their EUL...... they incurred the additional expense of remodeling them several times to make them useful.... then failed at that.... and now it's the wrecking ball. 

Barcelona and Atlanta had a similar glut. Greece just let it all rot. And London practically gave the Olympic Stadium to West Ham with the aid of the tax payer.

These events look great but they don't pay off.

I wonder what 2 billion will do to housing and homelessness. 

Its a drop in the ocean compared to the cost of company tax cuts and the amounts that rich people and companies avoid in offshore tax havens.

The biggest farce is that neither stadium was built to an adequate and lasting standard the first time and it is because in Sydney all that matters is some pre-conceived notion of budget and getting things done right is secondary. It is the same reason the Opera House needs expensive renovations and why we don't have a world class public transport infrastructure.

Or in negative gearing with all those "losses" they are making on property they strangely end up owning

Ah...the old 'look over there' defense.

Fair enough.

Would be better off just building another 30k stadium somewhere... i love the new LA stadium. Looks like a glamour club we need more of those in the a-league.

Yes and the New stadium is only going to be a capacity of 22k for LAFC (smaller than Galaxies) but appropriate for the demand considering they will have to shake off the Chivas USA 2.0 tag.

What??, the Sydney Football Stadium is just under 30 years old (it opened around March 1988), and the Olympic Stadium was opened in January 1999, and the NSW Government wants to tear them down, and rebuild them?

I'm from Sydney, and I have to say the NSW Government has no f_ _ _ing idea when it comes to planning/or building good infrastructure, look at Melbourne, now there's a city that gets it right when it comes to planning its stadiums and infrastructure.

Where would they play State of origin. Whilst ANZ goes down?

SCG perhaps?

Money laundering in it's purest form.

But nobody bar concerts and Origin fills them now...

-PB

Olympic Stadium and the Sydney Football Stadium will be demolished and rebuilt

Updated 19 minutes ago

The Olympic Stadium and the Sydney Football Stadium will be demolished and rebuilt in a $2 billion overhaul signed off by New South Wales Cabinet today.

Work at the Sydney Football Stadium site at Moore Park is expected to start next year, followed by the Homebush Olympic stadium in 2019

Senior government sources described this morning's Cabinet meeting as "robust" with some ministers, frustrated at the length of time it had taken to reach a decision, expressing concerns the handling of the issue had been damaging.

It is understood some also raised concerns about the $2.3 billion price tag, up from former premier Mike Baird's original estimate of $1.6 billion.

The package also includes the cost of rebuilding Parramatta Stadium.

The rebuilt Sydney Football Stadium's capacity is expected to be 45,000 people while the Olympic stadium will hold between 75,000 and 80,000 people.

The decision is expected to be announced tomorrow and brings to an end a saga that dragged out for more than 18 months since Mr Baird first detailed his proposal.

That plan would have seen the Olympic Stadium reconfigured to a rectangular venue at a cost of $700 million ahead of a refurbishment of the Sydney Football Stadium.

While the proposal received strong support from the NRL, there has since been furious lobbying by the Sydney Cricket Ground Trust, who control the Sydney Football Stadium, as well as the Australian Rugby Union and Sydney FC to rebuild the Moore Park venue first.

Sports Minister Stuart Ayres backed that option and has spent almost two years tying himself into knots advocating various positions that would get it over the line.

But there has been fierce opposition from some members of Mr Ayres' own cabinet, with some scratching their heads as to why a stadium that was built as a state of the art venue for the Sydney Olympics less than 20 years ago should need to such a complete overhaul so quickly.

Rumour is that the new stadium for Allianz will have a 30k mode and a 45k mode. 

Thats good. 

Less visually embarrassing for SFC.

Now watch these two stadiums turned into ovals.

Absolutely pathetic that the Sydney Football Stadium  (aka Allianz) should start before Stadium Australia  (aka ANZ).

The stadium in the middle of Sydney should go first.

Someone has pulled a shifty. 

Smart on their behalf I guess. When the SFS rebuild has a blowout on budget  it will already be built or almost complete. Then if any cost cutting occurs it will be aimed at ANZ. 

This is the worry.

I don't even live there but I can see how stupid this is, it's baseless, some developer must be backhanding someone.

Now watch as the Allianz stadium rebuild suffers from cost blowouts, gobbles up the whole $2 billion and the Olympic Park rebuild gets canned.

More corporate welfare and a glorified government jobs program.

Make whatever arsehole tenant who winds up benefitting from the stadium reconstruction pay for it, not more cronyism.

I get the need for a refurb, but I'd be trying to put at least half of that money into increasing the number of football pitches around suburbia.

Yup - SFS will no doubt soak up the budget and that's the play. NRL really need to lobby hard for Homebush first. They are the biggest player in all of this at the end of the day and can influence the outcome.

Its gobsmacking that Sydney is about to completely blow it's chance to have the best football stadium in Asia. I can't think of any other stadium  in the confederation that ticks all the boxes of retractable roof, rectangular pitch, moveable goal ends, steep gradient and high capacity.

I have zero faith in the NSW Libs ensuring that the SFS project doesn't compromise the full plans for the homebush rebuild.

Berejiklian stares down $2.3bn stadiums revolt

• The Australian
• 12:00AM November 24, 2017
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• ANDREW CLENNELL

  

  NSW Political Editor

  Sydney

  @aclennell

  

Ms Berejiklian opened cabinet yesterday by strongly supporting a proposal from Sport Minister Stuart Ayres to knock down and rebuild Allianz Stadium in Moore Park, in Sydney’s east, from next year to 2019 and ANZ Stadium at Sydney Olympic Park, in the west, from 2019 to 2021.

Ms Berejiklian’s support was despite the cabinet minute pointing out that the benefit-cost ratio for the projects was well under 1, meaning they would not generate more money than their cost to the state’s economy.

Treasurer Dominic Perrottet is understood to have said words to the effect of: “I can’t believe we’re doing this but I have to reluctantly agree to it.”

Many ministers argued that the government should rebuild ­Allianz Stadium only, as it was 35 years old and in serious need of an upgrade, but they were told the NRL was threatening to take the grand final out of Sydney if work did not occur on the 17-year-old ANZ Stadium. One minister labelled it a “vanity project”, The Australian has been told.

Finance Minister Victor Dominello is said to have said: “Four hundred and fifty-eight days ­before the election, this is not something we should be doing.”

Attorney-General Mark Speak­­man told cabinet: “It does not cut the mustard economically or socially.”

Those who spoke out against the projects — or expressed serious concerns about the political effects of spending so much money on stadiums — were Mr Perrottet, Health Minister Brad Hazzard, Education Minister Rob Stokes, Mr Dominello, Mr Speakman, Tourism Minister Adam Marshall and Racing Minister Paul Toole.

Ms Berejiklian is expected to announce this morning that work on Allianz Stadium will begin next year and be completed at the end of 2019. After the 2019 NRL grand final, work would then commence on ANZ Stadium with hopes the stadium could be knocked down and rebuilt by 2021. An “indicative cost” was given to cabinet of up to $1.7bn for ANZ Stadium. Another $600 million is set to be spent on Allianz Stadium. Part of the cost involves ANZ Stadium having a retractable roof.

The new spending comes on top of more than $300m the government has outlaid on Parramatta Stadium and $200m the government spent buying back ANZ from its private operator. The funds will come from the $2.6bn sale of the Land and Property Information service.

It is understood that, as part of the Sydney Olympic Park ­pro­posal, an Olympic museum will be built as a tribute to the Sydney Games.

The replacement for Allianz Stadium will have a capacity of 45,000. The new stadium at Olympic Park will seat 75,000. ­Although the MCG in Melbourne has a larger capacity, it is not an oval so it does not have the same appeal in terms of viewing soccer, rugby league and rugby union.

Those who voiced support for the proposal in cabinet were Ms Berejiklian, Mr Ayres and Deputy Premier John Barilaro. Mr Ayres said that if NSW were to pitch for the women’s World Cup soccer, ANZ Stadium needed to be upgraded sooner rather than later.

Opposition Leader Luke Foley said yesterday: “I can’t and won’t support spending $2.5bn on sporting stadiums. Labor will put schools and hospitals before stadiums. The members of the SCG Trust must exercise more power than the members of Gladys ­Berejiklian’s cabinet.”

Berejiklian stares down $2.3bn stadiums revolt

The real headline for me is even the governments cost benefit analysis is against the proposal.

And the fact that there are literally only 3 members of the Cabinet in favour of it - surely simple democracy dictates it shouldn't go ahead?

I hope that Berejiklian is turfed by her own party or by the voters - whichever comes first. Followed closely by Stuart Ayres.

I don't understand why they want to further reduce the capacity of ANZ. Why 75,000? That sounds a bit too small for a showpiece stadium in a huge city. What's wrong with the current 82,000? Why can Melbourne have the humongous MCG, yet Sydney can't even have an 80,000 capacicity stadium? 

The plans involve retention of the existing roof and exterior. The newly constructed stands will be built with a steeper rake and closer to the pitch around the ground. Removing the oval shape means less circumfrence to work with, so fewer seats can fit in. They don't have the option of building the new stands higher because they need to fit under the existing roof line.

When would Sydney get 80 000 for the soccer? Poor old Arsenal and Liverpool cant sell more seats. 75k is plenty enough for Socceroos, some would say too much for Sydney. 

This is how power works in NSW

• Clover Moore

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Good - the more this shitfight hits the media, the better.

I think the government have severely underestimated how much this could backfire. 

I agree.  Will be interesting to see what position the Daily Telegraph takes as the NRL is a beneficiary.  (Can tell, even without looking, that the SMH will be against it.)
 

Meh, fucking great news for Sydney FC and Sydney FC fans. Hopefully instead of listening to the whingers they just build it well and to last and provide a genuinely good and productive asset.

TBH even the Sydney fan in me is 'meh' about this. A 45k seat rebuild is completely and utterly pointless. This "club mode" is basically code for shutting the top tiers by the looks of things. Big whoop, they're still large empty stands. Meanwhile Sydney is growing at an unprecedented rate and there are no concrete plans for rail infrastructure beyond stage two of the Sydney metro RTS. This city could come to a standstill within 10 years. 

I'm usually not the biggest Clover Moore fan but she is 100% on the money in this opinion piece. 

If the Government wants to seriously do something for the people and the homeless and the sick in Sydney then they should start by addressing the cost of living, particularly home and rental prices.

When I have friends in Japan paying a month what I do a week, I question the logic of working long hours in a shit job just to survive. I honestly cant see myself staying around in these conditions anyway but Sydney will always be my team and no matter where I am, if they have a home to be proud of and that helps them grow then I am happy. I honestly hope they do it right so that it becomes and asset to the public and eventually pays off. If they just build another nothing stadium that lasts 20 years then I will be sad.

Here's the two modes. 45,000 and then 30,000 capacity. That part is definitely a good idea and using the "revolutionary LED signage" should work well.

I still think just building it at 30k would make more sense, but at least if Sydney FC happens to grow into a much bigger club they will have a future-proof venue. Also will be a postiive thing if we ever bid for the world cup again. Still not good enough reasons IMO, but some positives.

There's also a Q&A here - they reckon they'll pay back the investment in 1 year. I reckon they're dreaming, but it's true that these sort of things do tend to pay for themselves after a while. https://www.sydneyfc.com/sites/syd/files/2017-11/Key%20partner%20stadium%20Q%26A%20.pdf?_ga=2.126552329.508187762.1511484459-1081634973.1507881993



Overall... bit of a joke. Bit of a crazy spend of money. But Allianz does need an upgrade, and you would never be able to really make it into a top class stadium without a total rebuild. And turning ANZ stadium into a rectangle will be great for football too. Sydney will have 3 top class rectangular stadiums. Probably means less money for any AFL stadiums in Sydney for a while, which is a good thing...

In regards to 'club mode' at the stadium I hope Sydney FC cap memberships to suit club mode. Build a demand for memberships and tickets.

At the end of the day it doesnt matter what they do with SFS as long as it doesn't affect the Homebush rebuild.

100%

I think it is good that both stadiums will be built and good for the A-League.

I just want ANZ first as it is the Socceroos stadium.

The SFC guy though pffft

“We live in one of the greatest cities in the world and it is vital we have the sporting infrastructure to match.

“As reigning A-League Champions our players and members deserve world class facilities and this announcement will deliver on that.

“I am happy that this decision will benefit our club and football in this country in the long term and I look forward to great times ahead in our new home.”
Sydney FC welcome Allianz Stadium redevelopment | Hyundai A-League

Those reasons dont stack up for me. 

Sydney Football Stadium should be the last stadium in Sydney to be upgraded after
Stadium Australia
Penrith
Campbelltown

Sydney FC want safe standing at new Moore Park stadium

 

• Dominic Bossi

   
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There is no way that tv screen is big enough. 

Looks smaller than now

NSW plans for new $700m Allianz stadium to be half-empty

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by Geoff Winestock

NSW is planning for the likelihood that its new $700 million Allianz Stadium will be more than half-empty most of the time by designing it with an option for a cut-down seating plan.

NSW premier Gladys Berejiklian on Friday confirmed her government had torn up a plan by her predecessor Mike Baird and would knock down and rebuild Allianz Stadium at Moore Park in addition to ANZ Stadium at Sydney Olympic Park raising the total cost by $600 million to over $2 billion.

"This investment means we can compete on the world stage for events such as the FIFA Women's World Cup, the Rugby World Cup, and keep Sydney as the number one sporting destination, Ms Berejiklian said.

But given crowds at Allianz from club rugby union, NRL and A-League are well below capacity, NSW plans to rebuild Allianz with two seating plans: a championship mode for the full 45,000-seat capacity and a "club" mode for only 30,000 where the upper stands will be blocked by a large advertising and information screen.

The decision to spend the extra $600 million knocking down and rebuilding the 29-year old stadium has been attacked by the Opposition as a waste of the one-off windfall from selling the state's electricity network. But it is a major victory for the Sydney Cricket Ground Trust ,and its well connected board including broadcaster Alan Jones, which controls the Allianz site and resented Mr Baird's decision last year to allocate only about $100 million for a cosmetic refurbishment.

Businessman Tony Shepherd, the SCG Trust chairman, welcomed the decision but only named three events which would require the championship mode: a Wallabies Test match, the annual NRL's Anzac Day Cup and the A-League's Sydney Derby which occurs once or twice a year.

Allianz will face stiff competition from ANZ Stadium, which is in the sporting heartland in Sydney's west and will have better facilities including a roof that will give it a "lock" on the concert market, according to one promoter.

Football Federation Australia chief executive David Gallop said he considered redevelopment of ANZ Stadium to be particularly important because there were big stadiums in other Australian cities and Sydney needed a big rectangular stadium of its own.

Mr Berejiklian also confirmed she would knock down the existing 45,000 seat Allianz stadium in November next year just before the 2019 election, which will prevent ALP reconsidering the government's plan if it wins the next election.

NSW plans for new $700m Allianz stadium to be half-empty | afr.com

State of Origin poised to return to SCG

 

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NSW Government reveals reasoning behind knocking down of Olympic and Sydney Football stadiums

Updated about 2 hours ago

The New South Wales Government has revealed its multi-billion-dollar plan to demolish and rebuild the Olympic Stadium at Homebush and the Sydney Football Stadium at Moore Park.

It claims the state's sporting infrastructure was falling behind the rest of the country and the announcement will cement Sydney as Australia's number one event destination.

But some members of Cabinet, and other stakeholders, are concerned about the blueprint - particularly given the Olympic Stadium is less than two decades old.

When will work start and finish?

The Sydney Football Stadium will be rebuilt as a 45,000-seat venue. Work at the site will start next year with completion expected by 2021.

Construction on the Olympic Stadium will begin in 2019 before the new venue is opened in 2022. The rectangular stadium, described as the "crowning jewel" of Sydney's sporting venues, will have a capacity of 75,000 people.

Asked whether it would have a retractable roof, Sports Minister Stuart Ayres said the Government still needed to assess whether it would stack up financially.

How much will it all cost?

The Government has estimated the cost of replacing the Sydney Football Stadium at $705 million, and the Olympic Stadium at $1.25 billion, subject to a tendering process.

That figure does not include about $300 million to rebuild Parramatta Stadium or the $200 million spent buying back the Olympic Stadium lease, bringing the total cost of the package to about $2.5 billion.

It is significantly higher than the $1.6 billion package first unveiled by former premier Mike Baird in 2016.

Why is the Olympic Stadium being knocked down?

The stadium at Homebush was purpose built for the 2000 Sydney Olympics at a cost of $690 million and has since played host to some of Australia's greatest sporting moments.

Originally designed for 110,000 spectators, it was later reconfigured to a reduced capacity of 83,500.

Premier Gladys Berejiklian thinks it is approaching its used-by date.

"By the time we start construction it would be nearly 20 years old and that was built for an Olympics, it wasn't built for modern, global events and it wasn't built for spectators," she said.

That claim has drawn criticism from former Labor premier Bob Carr, who oversaw the construction of the venue.

"If anyone had said when we made the commitment to Olympic facilities that in the case of the big stadium it would be there for only 17 years and a new one would have to be built, people wouldn't have believed us," he said.

What about the Sydney Football Stadium (SFS)?

Sport Minister Mr Ayres said the SFS had come to the end of its life and it was now only "borderline safe".

He said it also lacked enough female toilets and seats for disabled fans.

"I am not going to be a Sports Minister that locks out women and people with a disability from coming to experience the best sport and entertainment here in NSW," he said.

Both Opposition Leader Luke Foley and Sydney Lord Mayor Clover Moore have criticised the decision, arguing the Moore Park venue does not host the state's biggest games and therefore does not need an overhaul.

What does it mean for the major sports?

The package includes a deal to keep the NRL grand final in NSW for the next 25 years.

In 2020, when both stadiums are under construction, the event will be held at the Sydney Cricket Ground instead.

In 2021 and 2022 it will be played at the SFS before returning to the Olympic Stadium in 2023.

NRL chief executive Todd Greenberg welcomed the announcement, saying it was a "momentous day" for players and fans.

The Sydney Cricket Ground Trust, which controls the SFS, said the plan was "common sense" and without the extra investment the venue would have shut down.

The plan has also been applauded by organisations including Rugby Australia, Football Federation Australia and Cricket NSW.

Mr Ayres said the Government would work with the tenants of both existing venues to find alternative locations while they are under construction.

What will be the political fallout?

The decision-making process up until this point has been messy and the Premier will be hoping the new announcement puts an end to it.

While she insists the plan has broad Government support, it is understood several ministers expressed concerns about the cost during a recent "robust" Cabinet meeting.

Mr Foley is already looking to use the issue to his political advantage, arguing that while the Olympic Stadium rebuild is needed, the work at the SFS is a waste of money.

"I've always said west before east because that's where the people are," he said yesterday.

He will try to make the issue a point of difference in the run up to the 2019 state election.

The Olympic stadium wasn't built for global events

...

...............
wot

-PB