So who should he select?  Craphead or Shithead?  Shit is crap.

Don't blame the FFA.  Blame the players union who hold the game to ransom so that we see hacks lie Matt Simon on good coin at the same time kids get charged $1000's and then wonder why the NT is crap

In the end, you can’t blame the players for losing to a team like Jordan????

Who the else can get the blame, they’re the ones playing the game, should we blame the stadium staff or the bus drivers???

Ummm i didnt blame the FFA i blamed the PFA which is there union pretty much consistently asking for more money which was seen to be acceptable during the golden gen when we were on a high but now the players are rubbish they still expect the big money 

I think is it like 6k a day the last world cup they didnt win a game and each player pocked about 70k in 10days....on top of that Bert pocked 1 million for not winning a match...

As for selecting players i simply meant you cant blame players that dont preform on anyone but the manager it is his job to chose the players to do the job. Fair enough if you are playing a superior side and lose but when you are the favourite there is no excuse the only person to blame in the coach

You can also blame the FFA for that. Agreements have to be agreed upon from both parties

its not the players fault losing the Jordan game ?
Davstar you have too much arnie hate to see through the rubbish most of our players perform on the pitch, its arnies fault lol......
bad pass's, not reading the game or their opponent, starting off ike they are in 4th gear, being owned the whole 1st half lost it there and then.
I don't care of arnies wages or the players, just go in hard 110% give it your all - you don't notice that much tbh.
Our injuries have weakened us to a degree but even with them we certainly haven't been convincing.

this is true but back in the day a 6k match payment for a player like Cahill, Kewell, Dukes, Neil etc was actually CHEAP these guys where up there in the top leagues and would earn triple that in Pounds NOT Dollars to play for there club i think Cahill was on around 10 million Pounds a season for Everton in his prime 

Was Cahill, Kewell shit when he struggled in his opening game against Oman in 2007? your off your rocker if you think it is not good enough to beat a no body team like Jordan, ill admit the team isnt strong but pretty much 90% of our team would get into there starting line up in a heart beat 

The goal was coped was clear poor set piece tactics and if you knew anything about football you would blame the manager for the goal we coped fair enough he CANT put the ball in the back of the net himself but he can make the team organised enough to not cope a soft set piece.  

I do not hate GA i just think he is a shit manager at this level and the fact is he has failed in Asia every time in his career doesnt fill me with confidence 

The players themselves are the one having to mark opponents in set pieces full stop, backline talk to each other whos got who and to the halves.
The manager is to blame regards football fundamentals that players should know themselves full stop from their jnr days lol.....
You bet the team isn't strong enough but its communication common sense amongst yourselves getting organised.
A nobody team like Jordan, this is another mind set problem amongst some here, they are not nobodies anymore and we've struggled against them in the past with better players, all these teams are farfar more organised and competitive, we don't respect this much.
Just look at nobodies in this tournament, Philippines giving it to SK losing just in the end, India, of all countries India win a game.
Viets have done ok you can on and on, why, they are desperate to play these players, throw themselves into it 110% - some of ours don't imo, they don't play with urgency I see others doing.
Lets just agree to disagree, players are responsible on the pitch, no matter who is selected or not !

Happy to agree to disagree but you are wrong and simply dont listen to common sense....So put it this way 

You are a Liverpool fan and you are on the verge of winning the league for the 1st time in over 20 years right? 

Do you think you would be on top of the ladder if you still had Rodgers in charge? - keep in mind Rodgers spent A LOT more money on players then Klopp has. 
Im a Man U fan just look at us now we have sacked Jose and all of a sudden we look like a team again. Jose was bitching the players were not good enough but the truth is his mentality and tactics werent a good fit for united.

the manager is the most important person in the team there is a reason in 2006 Under Guus we made it to the round of 16 in the world cup narrowly beaten by Italy but in 2007 we got knocked out of the asian cup in the knockout round under GA WITH THE SAME PLAYERS! against much poorer opposition. 

Agree to disagree all you like but the evidence is there if the players arent motivated it is the managers job to motivate them all the blame falls on the shoulders of GA 

Teams like Jordan are no bodies that is why it is called a 'shock result' because they shouldnt be a problem for a squad of professional players and a coach who is paid on a similar level to best coaches in the world. Im sorry but If football fans cant see that then Football in Australia is in a lot of trouble. 

Some good points made in this post, Test Fan, but I think the game plan worked effectively enough when Aus played 48 balls into the pen box, whilst Jordan only played 9 into the  pen box.

We wasted our quantity of balls that went into the pen box.

We also had 18 shots at goal to their 9.  

Ryan made 5 saves and 2 intercepts under pressure, whilst the Jordanian keeper was far busier with 7 saves (mostly fingertip and desperate saves) and 5 intercepts under pressure.

Australia had 5 close misses from shots at goal - Jordan had 2.

Both teams hit the woodwork once.

I recommend to all punters to revisit the game and watch a replay. Without the emotion of the live game, events are often clarified.

After I was horrified at the result on the night, and felt so disappointed with the loss, we dominated apart from squandering the plethora of opportunities on goal that we had.

In terms of shots on goal though, it was far more even in the first half, with 4 shots apiece. The second half Jordan were out on their feet.

 Their time wasting, or genuine exhaustion with all their players cramping up, stifled the game. They desperately needed the rest from their players going down frequently. I'm sure European refs would not have let them get away with it.

A lot of good points made in this post, LFC.

Fair play to you.

This. If the manager was not important at all, then why are all these FA's and clubs paying so much for them? 

They set the strategy, select the players and make the calls. It's up to the manager to get the most use and benefit from the player pool. 

I know from  coaching that sometimes players don't perform on the day for inexplicable reasons, despite them often playing perfectly well in practice.

It can be very frustrating.

I think Arnie' s main mistake was selecting Kruse over Ikon. Ikon did so well comparatively when he came on. But who knows, maybe Kruse looked far better in  training games in the camp?

The other  issue, that Test Fan has alluded to, is that Arnie contrived a game plan for a bigger target forward, but played a smaller target striker, Macca, compared to a bigger target man like Giannou.

To a point.

Guus had a little more luck than Pim, when the teams performed similarly in 2006 and 2010 World Cups.

There are often such fine margins in big games and tournaments.

Good point  you made about the difference between Guus in the WC 2006 and Arnie with the same players in Asian Cup 2007, Coffee Jackal..

 Guus was a much better coach than Arnie then, but Arnie has improved out of sight.

if we get to the second round though, two issues we have now, where we were better under Ange   in 2015, was the cohesion between Ryan- Sains- Spira in 2015, was better than Ryan - Sains - Degenek is ATM.

Sains is not the same CB now, as he was then. It seems as though his unsettled club career has exacerbated his ability as a CB, and he may be more suited to midfield ATM.

Also, Cahill scored a number of important goals in the 2015 tournament, although Luongo and Troisi (not selected) scored the final winning  goals in 2015.

Unless there is great improvement in the heart of defence and converting goals in attack, Ange may have had better cattle, and consequently a better team, in 2015, than Arnie has now.

Ange may also have had more experienced cattle too , injury free, throughout the Asian Cup 2015.

I'm not completely wrong and nor are you completely right, we all see things differently this is not a crime.

Spare me the EPL manager scenarios, through another eye all I saw was whinging cry baby overpaid united players not giving enough and with agenda - IF I was Woodward or whoever I would have given them a piece of my mind and imposed on them some of their weekly wages will be reduced on the grounds of playing like championship players on premium wage, how much they costed the club is a disgrace and you would have pulled the manager in as well to gain a reset.
Anyway enough of that.

Ofcourse the manager is an important piece to the puzzle but the entire squad has responsibility themselves also.
If your not motivated enough just to have been selected your in the wrong place imo, manager motivation or not having that shirt on on the pitch no matter the circumstances you should be giving your all automatically full stop 110%.
IF your a donkey who hasn't marked up a loose player that player is to blame full stop - not that it wasn't discussed during team tactics and game plan ffs.
Like I said thats fundamentals of a player and at this level give me a break blaming the manager no matter who it is.

Another point on that game especially after D's stats of ball into the box.
Where is the players own thought process during the game, so Macca is up against tall timbers, why persist with cross's that he can't contest with ? and or Arnie's staff should have rectified that as well putting the word out, play behind them OR someone like Mass/Rogic take on the line more to turn them around.
I just can't blame a manager for everything that goes wrong on a pitch - you quoted united, Mou is no idiot in the coaching ranks right barring blowing his own trumpet right but the players themselves performed like spoilt kids not liking to play his way so they gave 110% ? no they didn't - they are to blame they are paid pros to do the job 110% expected from their employer/fans and all.
Manager is the scapegoat and its justified straight away for suddenly the players have their mojo back - I'd be questioning the players on those grounds but its never questioned because the change has corrected it - there is more to it behind the scenes always and the manager is the easiest piece to shift of the squad.

I blame Arnies team the selection of Kruse over Ikon and Macca instead of Giannou as quoted above.
He made the right call taking Risdon off for Grant.
It was a shock result because were the defending champs if we weren't the result wouldn't have been sensationalised as much, we've struggled against them with the 2 previous managers.

We lack goal scorers now more than ever, I feel Boyle would have been a breath of fresh air for us but.......

I think that call was made because of injury to Risdon.

Davstar is all growned up...and he is angry!!

Alright ill take your point...but the reality is we cant just sack and sign players like in club football. The only person we can sack is GA i bloody hope he does well this tournament football needs the push and needs the Socceroos to perform because the brand has fallen a long way, but as I've said in the past anything that less then finals  (unless we play Japan or SK prior) is a disappointment and a under performance that isnt directed at GA that is pretty much every Asian cup we have been in i've said that we still have superior man power compared to the majority of the confederation there is no excuse for a good showing. 

not angry at all just shocked GA is manager and flopping the Asian cup it feels like 2007

Ive never been a big GA fan, but lets wait and see what the rest of the tournament brings. If we dont make it to the quarters I'll be disappointed.
Already think he has made some odd calls, but am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt as i guess ice already written off this AC due to all of the injuries.
In my mind a good manager gets a team to play as more than the sum of its parts. Is able to read the play and adjust the team to plug holes and exploit the opponents, and have a plan B up their sleeve to confound oppositions. I dont feel ive seen all of that yet, but i live in hope.

Arnold in!

im probably more GA out now after the Palestine game then i was after the Jordan game 

Those hoof it in the box tactics arent going to fly against a decent team...We beat a team that isnt even a proper country and all three goals werent from 'good' play more from kick it an run tactics kind of like under 11s....



Arnold needs to be given the boot ill stand by that 

“Those hoof it in the box tactics arent going to fly against a decent team”

Pretty sure that’s all we did when Pim and Holger were our managers and they got us to two World Cups without needing to go the stupidly long way that Ange decided to go.

@Coffee Jackal, c’mon mate, fair’s fair, if Arnie cops it for his tactics and preparation in a loss, including Luongo’s defensive blunder for the conceded goal against Jordan, then he must get credit for some of the aspects of this game. For starters, directed crosses or passes aren’t ‘hoofs’! And if a side is going to park the bus, then it’s legitimate to take them on in the air. All three goals were the result of well directed balls from Rogic, Ikon and whoever sent the third one in. Clearly Arnie knew Palestine would park the bus, we all did, so he set the team up accordingly. Part of his tactics was to include Irvine, and he was dangerous in the box - this is legitimate. Now, we don’t have too many Arzani like players to find other ways through parked buses, so credit where credit is due I say. Arnie in!

Not a chance that Cahill was on 10 million quid a season at Everton.
That equates to 192000 pounds a week FFS. Please research a bit more before spouting shite.

Arnie in, egg on face.

ARNIE = LEGEND

Arnie = In

(For this tournament)

Does the whole Arnie out brigade go quiet when our national side wins? That’s rather superficial, and predictable. There was all sorts of ‘analysis’, if you can call it that, after the Jordan game, and now we have ... crickets! And it was strident too, with replies to anyone and everyone who dared to say something positive. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think Arnie is the best coach in the World, it’s just I don’t think he’s the worst either and I think the circumstances were right for his appointment this time. It might turn out to be a good appointment, or a bad one, but let’s assess it objectively, rather than like mad ideologues!

I think Arnie has been a good appointment. 

Even if we have another shocker and lose to Syria, and the players underperform, he has got a lot right, CH.

I think he will be good in WCQs, in terms of pragmatism in away games too.

ATM I don't think we have the cattle to beat South K and Japan in this tournament - unless Ikon, Mabil Macca, and Giannou, keep  improving their predatory instincts in the pen box.