Use them or lose them: Give youngsters minutes or lose a generation says Graham Arnold [Comments]


Use them or lose them: Give youngsters minutes or lose a generation...

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Use them or lose them: Give youngsters minutes or lose a generation says Graham Arnold

https://www.ftbl.com.au/news/use-them-or-lose-them-give-youngsters-minutes-or-lose-a-generation-says-graham-arnold-537055



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Relative to other top Asian countries where are our Olyroos compared to our Young Socceroos and Joeys?

If the younger ones are at relatively the same position as the Olyroos it is the lower level of development that we need to bring up to standard as a priority so that by the time they are Young Socceroos they are at the standard of the A-League or 2nd division competing for starting positions.  That will give us players who have been playing regularly at a professional level for a couple or more years making up our Olyroos squad.

If it is at the Olyroos level that we drop behind the top Asian countries then simply creating more opportunities should be enough to build the quality of our Olyroos squad.


Edited
4 Years Ago by Gyfox
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I’ve been against it for a long time, but after seeing teams like Perth and Sydney fielding dads army every season I’d totally support mandatory aged players in starting 11 and match squad. Minimum 3 u23s Australians in starting 11 and further minimum 3 u20s in match day squad. No visa Gk allowed.
Edited
4 Years Ago by Dan_The_Red
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I reckon we should be forcing clubs to play younger players, two under 20s for each match day squad. It will not have too much impact on the football and could unleash some exciting prospects who have a chance to move too bigger leagues. Once we have a broader based league, promotion and relegation..etc you could remove this. However, we are a small league with few opportunities we need to expand our talent pool by forcing clubs to change. 
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Interesting comments from Arnold. When he was coach of Sydney he didn't give youth much opportunity when it came to playing time in the A league. Now that he is an age group he can see it from a different perceptive.
But it is good to see this year more youngsters are getting game time (in some teams). is this partly due to the expansion to 11 teams and will this be more of a trend next year when the league goes to 12 teams.
I'd be in favour of mandatory aged players in match day squads.   How else is D'Agostino going to get any game time at Perth.
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I want clubs to be careful with recruitment of foreign journeymen from League 1 and recycling of older locals. 
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Gyfox - 27 Jan 2020 1:39 PM
Relative to other top Asian countries where are our Olyroos compared to our Young Socceroos and Joeys?

If the younger ones are at relatively the same position as the Olyroos it is the lower level of development that we need to bring up to standard as a priority so that by the time they are Young Socceroos they are at the standard of the A-League or 2nd division competing for starting positions.  That will give us players who have been playing regularly at a professional level for a couple or more years making up our Olyroos squad.

If it is at the Olyroos level that we drop behind the top Asian countries then simply creating more opportunities should be enough to build the quality of our Olyroos squad.


Its a good point because the Joeys tend to do well but when it falls down is between 17 to 21 which is in the heart of the Young Socceroos and has negative consequences for the Olyroos.

An expanded a-league, reserve league with more games like unlike the current y-league version and ultimately a national 2nd division.

These things kind come quick enough for Australian football.
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Ultimately the clubs can do what they want, its not their task to follow the national team its in the mind of the vision of the club in wish they choose.

Of course things like a salary cap and no transfer/loan system don't help as this discourages clubs to develop players.

But we just need more avenues to open up, this will create a market for the clubs that want to develop players over others who want to buy.

Expand the a-league, 2nd division and reserve league would go along way.
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If the cap was scrapped the teams at the top will be using predominately established players as they chase a title, where as teams at the bottom will be predominately youth. This then creates a platform for the best youth to work their way upwards and we'll see better players come through

In a league where 11 teams have an equal salary and are expected to win the title, the only teams that are going to try mainly youth are those who don't want to spend money, and they typically don't last long

A mandatory youth rule isn't the answer. We need to stop working around the flaws that our broken system continues to produce, and instead do away with our broken system




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Barca4Life - 27 Jan 2020 4:43 PM
Ultimately the clubs can do what they want, its not their task to follow the national team its in the mind of the vision of the club in wish they choose.

Of course things like a salary cap and no transfer/loan system don't help as this discourages clubs to develop players.

But we just need more avenues to open up, this will create a market for the clubs that want to develop players over others who want to buy.

Expand the a-league, 2nd division and reserve league would go along way.

Expansion of the league is key. Needs to go to 14 teams. At least this creates more Aus spots that need to be filled.
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bluebird - 27 Jan 2020 4:47 PM
If the cap was scrapped the teams at the top will be using predominately established players as they chase a title, where as teams at the bottom will be predominately youth. This then creates a platform for the best youth to work their way upwards and we'll see better players come through

In a league where 11 teams have an equal salary and are expected to win the title, the only teams that are going to try mainly youth are those who don't want to spend money, and they typically don't last long

A mandatory youth rule isn't the answer. We need to stop working around the flaws that our broken system continues to produce, and instead do away with our broken system

Bingo

Mandatory restrictions don't work - the visa player restriction is enough.
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richv - 27 Jan 2020 3:32 PM
Interesting comments from Arnold. When he was coach of Sydney he didn't give youth much opportunity when it came to playing time in the A league. Now that he is an age group he can see it from a different perceptive.
But it is good to see this year more youngsters are getting game time (in some teams). is this partly due to the expansion to 11 teams and will this be more of a trend next year when the league goes to 12 teams.
I'd be in favour of mandatory aged players in match day squads.   How else is D'Agostino going to get any game time at Perth.

Excellent point regarding Arnold not playing youth , the only one that came through SYD has been Gersbach .
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I'm still against mandatory selection rules. Gifting players a spot is hardly good for sharpening a players hunger for the game.

The half arsed nature of the A-League is half the reason we have these problems.
- The seasons too short for backup players to get enough breakthrough games thanks to injury, suspension or fatigue.
- There is not enough teams and thus not enough starting spots in top tier football.
- The salary cap encourages teams to prioritise utility players who can potentially fill several roles rather than spending a bit to sign up some talented kids specialised in a specific role.
- No second division means even less opportunities for first team football.
- The Y league is just utterly pointless in its current format. They might as well scrap it if they keep up with this half arsed effort.

If we still have this problem after fixing all that, then we should consider it.

Viennese Vuck

Edited
4 Years Ago by melbourne_terrace
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Barca4Life - 27 Jan 2020 4:43 PM
Ultimately the clubs can do what they want, its not their task to follow the national team its in the mind of the vision of the club in wish they choose.

Of course things like a salary cap and no transfer/loan system don't help as this discourages clubs to develop players.

But we just need more avenues to open up, this will create a market for the clubs that want to develop players over others who want to buy.

Expand the a-league, 2nd division and reserve league would go along way.

This. 

We need more professional opportunities via more teams and allow youth to win spots based on merit. Otherwise it's just another form of rigging the competition.

(VAR) IS NAVY BLUE

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Barca4Life - 27 Jan 2020 4:39 PM
Gyfox - 27 Jan 2020 1:39 PM

Its a good point because the Joeys tend to do well but when it falls down is between 17 to 21 which is in the heart of the Young Socceroos and has negative consequences for the Olyroos.

An expanded a-league, reserve league with more games like unlike the current y-league version and ultimately a national 2nd division.

These things kind come quick enough for Australian football.

If it is the 17-21 group that starts to lag behind then we need U16, U18 and U20 NPL competitions to be 16 teams, 30 games per season.  It gets an increase in the number of players on the pathway and gives them more games.  Similarly the top NPL squad should have many U age players involved because they are better prepared for the tougher all age competition.  Add the 2nd division, reserve league and expansion of the A-league and then we have a complete development system.
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Gyfox - 28 Jan 2020 11:31 AM
Barca4Life - 27 Jan 2020 4:39 PM

If it is the 17-21 group that starts to lag behind then we need U16, U18 and U20 NPL competitions to be 16 teams, 30 games per season.  It gets an increase in the number of players on the pathway and gives them more games.  Similarly the top NPL squad should have many U age players involved because they are better prepared for the tougher all age competition.  Add the 2nd division, reserve league and expansion of the A-league and then we have a complete development system.

I agree that the NPL seasons can go a bit longer too, the more games the merrier for our players when developing.

We still don't play enough games at all levels.
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Meh

Without relegation just put an AL club in Canberra that is fully u23s. Perhaps with a rolling squad. So any other club can loan a player for any amount of time but they are not allowed to play against their parent club. 

Imagine no cap for this club. No visa players. No religion too.



Edited
4 Years Ago by scott20won
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bluebird - 27 Jan 2020 4:47 PM
If the cap was scrapped the teams at the top will be using predominately established players as they chase a title, where as teams at the bottom will be predominately youth. This then creates a platform for the best youth to work their way upwards and we'll see better players come through

In a league where 11 teams have an equal salary and are expected to win the title, the only teams that are going to try mainly youth are those who don't want to spend money, and they typically don't last long

A mandatory youth rule isn't the answer. We need to stop working around the flaws that our broken system continues to produce, and instead do away with our broken system

I don’t think mandatory youth rule would work either. Most likely end up with most clubs playing a player in the same position.
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arnold is a hypocrite

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/sydney-fc-seeking-stability-for-aleague-clash-against-newcastle-jets-20180102-h0ccc7.html


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I still recall that because i remember thinking what a short sighted douche he is.

Funny now the shoe is on the other foot how quickly he changed his tune.


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Dan_The_Red - 27 Jan 2020 3:05 PM
I’ve been against it for a long time, but after seeing teams like Perth and Sydney fielding dads army every season I’d totally support mandatory aged players in starting 11 and match squad. Minimum 3 u23s Australians in starting 11 and further minimum 3 u20s in match day squad. No visa Gk allowed.

bring it in for FFA cup at least.. I'd go one further and if you play an aussie striker more than 25 times a season you should get bonus from FFA for youth dev.
GO


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