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scott20won
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+x+x[quote]There is no argument that football quality is better in colder weather.
There is also no argument less people are watching football in winter.
So...Less money and better football vs more money and worse football.
Or start /finish in winter,have a summer break.
Or stop playing during the day in summer..No. 35C games.At night its rarely going to get above 25C. All though the word quality is often used in this argument, it's probably the incorrect word. The players are still the same. The skill level is still the same. However the 'quality' is perceived as higher by the audience in colder climates because the pace is higher and sustained throughout the full 90 minutes. So in essence we are seeing more of the players' best. You would also be hard pressed to find a professional player or coach that doesn't prefer the colder months. Game day (or night in the A-Leagues case), is only one aspect. It's important to remember that professional players train nearly every day. The colder months would allow for more intense training sessions during the daytime which could potentially result in better performances on game day. During the summer months, training isn't called off because of the heat, but the session intensity is often relaxed during those really hot days. ”All though the word quality is often used in this argument, it's probably the incorrect word. The players are still the same. The skill level is still the same. However the 'quality' is perceived as higher by the audience in colder climates because the pace is higher and sustained throughout the full 90 minutes. So in essence we are seeing more of the players' best. You would also be hard pressed to find a professional player or coach that doesn't prefer the colder months. “ Audience as in fans means a better spectacle. Audience as in scouts means a better shopfront
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Enzo Bearzot
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+x+x@Jegga. Spot on. Some these guys are borderline delusional. Football CAN survive in winter. But not as a full-pro league. Which means players will not be training as much and as often,the facilities will be worse, because the money won't be there to be full time, and hence the standard will decline. So the reason for going to winter seasons in the first place- the football quality-will no longer exist. Then what? They just haven't thought this one through... Going by the ratings, your comment on surviving only as a semi pro league applies to summer as well.I do think that what this argument should be taking into account is the fact that, given the A League's current situation (which is utterly unlike AFL or NRL, who have commenced their seasons rather than tacked on a belated, half arsed ending) is highly anomalous and in this context the ratings offer not even a skerrick of an indication of what winter ratings would be for a conventionl season. I'm not saying that they would be better - just that what we have is not any kind of valid basis for an argument. Does it? Was it in summer that 60,000 fans turned out for a club game in Sydney.? ..yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a $350 million broadcast deal, had mainstream sponsors like Hyundai, Harvey Norman, KFC Nissan, Webjet, Caltex? ... yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a half million peak viewers for a Grand Final? ..yes, yes it was. All of this happened in the last fours years. Not a generation ago. FOUR YEARS AGO. The sort of numbers you would no see in your most intense wet dream of winter football. But go ahead, repeat the mistakes of the past. I understand where you and the others are coming from. People just to have to learn the lessons for themselves.
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Enzo Bearzot
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWinter Football simply has to happen despite of the obstacles. Just put the game up, as its best possible product, and let it compete with the other codes on its merits. Honestly, at its best, it stands up very well. Lol no it's not, the ratings have been absolutely shocking. Mate, go and watch Ninja Warrior, it has good ratings. Don't waste your time on this guy or the small cabal of Aussie Rules trolls that he runs with. He's just a serial pest sent here to do the bidding of the AFL Yeah just the latest of stooges on here that "doesn't mind the sokkah" but resents football culture and just wants the A-League to resemble AFL-lite so it's more familiar to them. I want the a-league to survive and be the biggest it can be. Poor strategic directions will hasten its death. If you want Australia to produce the best players possible in an ever competitive global game then any strategic decision should reflect that. Not on crowds or metrics but on football development. That's fine but lower metrics = less money in the long term. That means a good chance there will be part time footballers in the a-league, less money for academy systems etc.. You're just posted full of assumptions without any evidence this will happen. If ratings drop over the long term explain to me how the TV rights will maintain their value? No one knows the future, but you have make decisions by analysing the past. And recent history has shown the tv rights value has dropped dramatically due to lowering of ratings. If ratings drop again then so will the tv rights. Less rights = less amount to pay players. The only thing I could say is the future of broadcasting possibly will be streaming, the way Foxtel isn't going to survive in the long term unless its through massive handouts. Data needs to find how many still would prefer to watch via TV broadcasting over streaming services via a smart TV now and going forward. Metrics were below in the summer too, so I dont think things would improve as much as people like even if we stayed in the warm summer months. Its a hard slog either way. I just want a football league like everywhere, not this metrics bullcrap because the game will keep going in circles if they try to find the perfect sweet spot which might not exist anyway. You can't always get what you want. But you might just get what you need. Please explain. Sure. You are not willing to learn from the past. You have to experience the lesson yourself first hand. But it is what you need, because there is no other way to convince you you are wrong on this. And I guarantee when you get what you want, you'll never speak of pro winter football in Australia ever again.
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libelous
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+x+x+x@Jegga. Spot on. Some these guys are borderline delusional. Football CAN survive in winter. But not as a full-pro league. Which means players will not be training as much and as often,the facilities will be worse, because the money won't be there to be full time, and hence the standard will decline. So the reason for going to winter seasons in the first place- the football quality-will no longer exist. Then what? They just haven't thought this one through... Going by the ratings, your comment on surviving only as a semi pro league applies to summer as well.I do think that what this argument should be taking into account is the fact that, given the A League's current situation (which is utterly unlike AFL or NRL, who have commenced their seasons rather than tacked on a belated, half arsed ending) is highly anomalous and in this context the ratings offer not even a skerrick of an indication of what winter ratings would be for a conventionl season. I'm not saying that they would be better - just that what we have is not any kind of valid basis for an argument. Does it? Was it in summer that 60,000 fans turned out for a club game in Sydney.? ..yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a $350 million broadcast deal, had mainstream sponsors like Hyundai, Harvey Norman, KFC Nissan, Webjet, Caltex? ... yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a half million peak viewers for a Grand Final? ..yes, yes it was. All of this happened in the last fours years. Not a generation ago. FOUR YEARS AGO. The sort of numbers you would no see in your most intense wet dream of winter football. But go ahead, repeat the mistakes of the past. I understand where you and the others are coming from. People just to have to learn the lessons for themselves. You’re ‘cherry picking ‘ of course but the fact is the a league is now starting from ‘ground zero ‘. James Johnson has said it will now be football first not metrics. I believe we fans should wait to see the ‘whole package ‘ before we start stressing out.
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Enzo Bearzot
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+x+x+x+x@Jegga. Spot on. Some these guys are borderline delusional. Football CAN survive in winter. But not as a full-pro league. Which means players will not be training as much and as often,the facilities will be worse, because the money won't be there to be full time, and hence the standard will decline. So the reason for going to winter seasons in the first place- the football quality-will no longer exist. Then what? They just haven't thought this one through... Going by the ratings, your comment on surviving only as a semi pro league applies to summer as well.I do think that what this argument should be taking into account is the fact that, given the A League's current situation (which is utterly unlike AFL or NRL, who have commenced their seasons rather than tacked on a belated, half arsed ending) is highly anomalous and in this context the ratings offer not even a skerrick of an indication of what winter ratings would be for a conventionl season. I'm not saying that they would be better - just that what we have is not any kind of valid basis for an argument. Does it? Was it in summer that 60,000 fans turned out for a club game in Sydney.? ..yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a $350 million broadcast deal, had mainstream sponsors like Hyundai, Harvey Norman, KFC Nissan, Webjet, Caltex? ... yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a half million peak viewers for a Grand Final? ..yes, yes it was. All of this happened in the last fours years. Not a generation ago. FOUR YEARS AGO. The sort of numbers you would no see in your most intense wet dream of winter football. But go ahead, repeat the mistakes of the past. I understand where you and the others are coming from. People just to have to learn the lessons for themselves. You’re ‘cherry picking ‘ of course but the fact is the a league is now starting from ‘ground zero ‘. James Johnson has said it will now be football first not metrics. I believe we fans should wait to see the ‘whole package ‘ before we start stressing out. Cherry picking? The league went form zero to $120 million annual revenue in 2018. Starting from Ground zero? Nooooo. Ground zero is kicking off in a decrepit Olympic Park in Melbourne hoping that someone, anyone, shows up to watch. The expectations for the new FFA are higher than that, I'm afraid.
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libelous
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+x+x+x+x+x@Jegga. Spot on. Some these guys are borderline delusional. Football CAN survive in winter. But not as a full-pro league. Which means players will not be training as much and as often,the facilities will be worse, because the money won't be there to be full time, and hence the standard will decline. So the reason for going to winter seasons in the first place- the football quality-will no longer exist. Then what? They just haven't thought this one through... Going by the ratings, your comment on surviving only as a semi pro league applies to summer as well.I do think that what this argument should be taking into account is the fact that, given the A League's current situation (which is utterly unlike AFL or NRL, who have commenced their seasons rather than tacked on a belated, half arsed ending) is highly anomalous and in this context the ratings offer not even a skerrick of an indication of what winter ratings would be for a conventionl season. I'm not saying that they would be better - just that what we have is not any kind of valid basis for an argument. Does it? Was it in summer that 60,000 fans turned out for a club game in Sydney.? ..yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a $350 million broadcast deal, had mainstream sponsors like Hyundai, Harvey Norman, KFC Nissan, Webjet, Caltex? ... yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a half million peak viewers for a Grand Final? ..yes, yes it was. All of this happened in the last fours years. Not a generation ago. FOUR YEARS AGO. The sort of numbers you would no see in your most intense wet dream of winter football. But go ahead, repeat the mistakes of the past. I understand where you and the others are coming from. People just to have to learn the lessons for themselves. You’re ‘cherry picking ‘ of course but the fact is the a league is now starting from ‘ground zero ‘. James Johnson has said it will now be football first not metrics. I believe we fans should wait to see the ‘whole package ‘ before we start stressing out. Cherry picking? The league went form zero to $120 million annual revenue in 2018. Starting from Ground zero? Nooooo. Ground zero is kicking off in a decrepit Olympic Park in Melbourne hoping that someone, anyone, shows up to watch. The expectations for the new FFA are higher than that, I'm afraid. Starting from ‘ground zero ‘ in terms of its position in the whole pyramid. As I say let’s wait to see what is proposed for the game as a whole.
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heyitsrobbie1984
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You’re ‘cherry picking ‘ of course but the fact is the a league is now starting from ‘ground zero ‘. James Johnson has said it will now be football first not metrics. I believe we fans should wait to see the ‘whole package ‘ before we start stressing out.
This. Absolutely this.
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AJF
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+x+x+x+x+x@Jegga. Spot on. Some these guys are borderline delusional. Football CAN survive in winter. But not as a full-pro league. Which means players will not be training as much and as often,the facilities will be worse, because the money won't be there to be full time, and hence the standard will decline. So the reason for going to winter seasons in the first place- the football quality-will no longer exist. Then what? They just haven't thought this one through... Going by the ratings, your comment on surviving only as a semi pro league applies to summer as well.I do think that what this argument should be taking into account is the fact that, given the A League's current situation (which is utterly unlike AFL or NRL, who have commenced their seasons rather than tacked on a belated, half arsed ending) is highly anomalous and in this context the ratings offer not even a skerrick of an indication of what winter ratings would be for a conventionl season. I'm not saying that they would be better - just that what we have is not any kind of valid basis for an argument. Does it? Was it in summer that 60,000 fans turned out for a club game in Sydney.? ..yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a $350 million broadcast deal, had mainstream sponsors like Hyundai, Harvey Norman, KFC Nissan, Webjet, Caltex? ... yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a half million peak viewers for a Grand Final? ..yes, yes it was. All of this happened in the last fours years. Not a generation ago. FOUR YEARS AGO. The sort of numbers you would no see in your most intense wet dream of winter football. But go ahead, repeat the mistakes of the past. I understand where you and the others are coming from. People just to have to learn the lessons for themselves. You’re ‘cherry picking ‘ of course but the fact is the a league is now starting from ‘ground zero ‘. James Johnson has said it will now be football first not metrics. I believe we fans should wait to see the ‘whole package ‘ before we start stressing out. Cherry picking? The league went form zero to $120 million annual revenue in 2018. Starting from Ground zero? Nooooo. Ground zero is kicking off in a decrepit Olympic Park in Melbourne hoping that someone, anyone, shows up to watch. The expectations for the new FFA are higher than that, I'm afraid. SA never had zero revenue so not sure where you are getting your figures from. Plus like how you conveniently forgot to mention the fox deal goes to zero in about 12 months time so unless people suddenly become interested you will be back at Olympic park before you know it.
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df1982
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+x+x+x@Jegga. Spot on. Some these guys are borderline delusional. Football CAN survive in winter. But not as a full-pro league. Which means players will not be training as much and as often,the facilities will be worse, because the money won't be there to be full time, and hence the standard will decline. So the reason for going to winter seasons in the first place- the football quality-will no longer exist. Then what? They just haven't thought this one through... Going by the ratings, your comment on surviving only as a semi pro league applies to summer as well.I do think that what this argument should be taking into account is the fact that, given the A League's current situation (which is utterly unlike AFL or NRL, who have commenced their seasons rather than tacked on a belated, half arsed ending) is highly anomalous and in this context the ratings offer not even a skerrick of an indication of what winter ratings would be for a conventionl season. I'm not saying that they would be better - just that what we have is not any kind of valid basis for an argument. Does it? Was it in summer that 60,000 fans turned out for a club game in Sydney.? ..yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a $350 million broadcast deal, had mainstream sponsors like Hyundai, Harvey Norman, KFC Nissan, Webjet, Caltex? ... yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a half million peak viewers for a Grand Final? ..yes, yes it was. All of this happened in the last fours years. Not a generation ago. FOUR YEARS AGO. The sort of numbers you would no see in your most intense wet dream of winter football. But go ahead, repeat the mistakes of the past. I understand where you and the others are coming from. People just to have to learn the lessons for themselves. You know, in a March-November season the grand final would be played outside of AFL/NRL season, whereas now it IS played during their seasons. So a grand final could well get higher ratings. Similarly, the 60,000 Sydney derby was played in October, which is not summer, and will still be part of the regular season. What's the minimum squad spend to maintain full-time professionalism? The salary cap in the first season was $1.5m, and that was 100% full-timers. Take inflation into account and you could introduce a salary floor of say $1.8m to maintain full-time status. Broadcasting would only need to be $21.6m per year (+ production and admin costs) to cover this for 12 clubs. The bigger clubs could continue to pay more than what broadcasting covers (as they do now), but without rules on marquees etc. could achieve more rounded and better squads for their money. So the idea that going to winter means semi-pro football is totally bogus. Player pay will likely go down dramatically, but not so far that players won't be able to be on full-time wages. Finally, you can't really use current Foxtel ratings as a measure of interest in a winter A-League. Right now, Foxtel is burying the comp (probably to devalue it in the eyes of rival broadcasters): showing games on 507, with no pre-match and zero promotion. So it's only the hard core tuning in. And since they lost PL rights a lot of the football fans in this country have abandoned their subscriptions. Optus, on the other hand has 850k football fans subscribing to their service. That is a base you can appeal to, particularly if you play over the European season break.
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Jegga7698
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+x+x+x+x@Jegga. Spot on. Some these guys are borderline delusional. Football CAN survive in winter. But not as a full-pro league. Which means players will not be training as much and as often,the facilities will be worse, because the money won't be there to be full time, and hence the standard will decline. So the reason for going to winter seasons in the first place- the football quality-will no longer exist. Then what? They just haven't thought this one through... Going by the ratings, your comment on surviving only as a semi pro league applies to summer as well.I do think that what this argument should be taking into account is the fact that, given the A League's current situation (which is utterly unlike AFL or NRL, who have commenced their seasons rather than tacked on a belated, half arsed ending) is highly anomalous and in this context the ratings offer not even a skerrick of an indication of what winter ratings would be for a conventionl season. I'm not saying that they would be better - just that what we have is not any kind of valid basis for an argument. Does it? Was it in summer that 60,000 fans turned out for a club game in Sydney.? ..yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a $350 million broadcast deal, had mainstream sponsors like Hyundai, Harvey Norman, KFC Nissan, Webjet, Caltex? ... yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a half million peak viewers for a Grand Final? ..yes, yes it was. All of this happened in the last fours years. Not a generation ago. FOUR YEARS AGO. The sort of numbers you would no see in your most intense wet dream of winter football. But go ahead, repeat the mistakes of the past. I understand where you and the others are coming from. People just to have to learn the lessons for themselves. You know, in a March-November season the grand final would be played outside of AFL/NRL season, whereas now it IS played during their seasons. So a grand final could well get higher ratings. Similarly, the 60,000 Sydney derby was played in October, which is not summer, and will still be part of the regular season. What's the minimum squad spend to maintain full-time professionalism? The salary cap in the first season was $1.5m, and that was 100% full-timers. Take inflation into account and you could introduce a salary floor of say $1.8m to maintain full-time status. Broadcasting would only need to be $21.6m per year (+ production and admin costs) to cover this for 12 clubs. The bigger clubs could continue to pay more than what broadcasting covers (as they do now), but without rules on marquees etc. could achieve more rounded and better squads for their money. So the idea that going to winter means semi-pro football is totally bogus. Player pay will likely go down dramatically, but not so far that players won't be able to be on full-time wages. Finally, you can't really use current Foxtel ratings as a measure of interest in a winter A-League. Right now, Foxtel is burying the comp (probably to devalue it in the eyes of rival broadcasters): showing games on 507, with no pre-match and zero promotion. So it's only the hard core tuning in. And since they lost PL rights a lot of the football fans in this country have abandoned their subscriptions. Optus, on the other hand has 850k football fans subscribing to their service. That is a base you can appeal to, particularly if you play over the European season break. Hahaha what an excuse.
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Jegga7698
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+xYou’re ‘cherry picking ‘ of course but the fact is the a league is now starting from ‘ground zero ‘. James Johnson has said it will now be football first not metrics. I believe we fans should wait to see the ‘whole package ‘ before we start stressing out.
This. Absolutely this. I think you'll find that's corporate speak to get the "real football fans" onside. I'm constantly amazed how easily people are duped
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Georgeg
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Football is better but ratings are worse. Doesn’t help that the A-league has disappeared from mainstream view.
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Butler99
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWinter Football simply has to happen despite of the obstacles. Just put the game up, as its best possible product, and let it compete with the other codes on its merits. Honestly, at its best, it stands up very well. Lol no it's not, the ratings have been absolutely shocking. Mate, go and watch Ninja Warrior, it has good ratings. Don't waste your time on this guy or the small cabal of Aussie Rules trolls that he runs with. He's just a serial pest sent here to do the bidding of the AFL Moron, I've been an a-l supporter since the beginning. I just don't like seeing idiot decisions (or potential decisions) being made that make the league commercially unviable LOL if your claims were even remotely true, then you would be supporting the move to winter Football Why would i support a move that would likely erode the revenue base of the competition significantly. Absolutely stupid decisions like these threaten the survival of a-l teams. Because that revenue is gone regardless of which season it is in. The falling ratings happened in summer. You are trying to tell me that the quality of the product doesn't matter, what matters is playing in summer when AFL fans can watch and reducing the salary cap so all the teams are equal. By concentrating on the football we can at least have a proper model and better quality. I'm telling you, you don't need football, you need It's a Knockout or something. What do you mean the revenue is gone? The next season is a 30 mill contract, this is based on the rough viewing average of 30,000 (from memory). The average ratings for winter have been around 10,000! So yes that 30mill a year can go much lower if the FFA want to commit suicide and have the a-l in winter. There will almost certainly be crowd drop offs as well. We'll of course have teams financially collapsing left, right and center but hey, the quality right! As long as the TRUE football supporters are satisfied on a forum then it's all hunky dori Whats happening in the Swans Pies game? Actually watching adl v syd. But of course you've resorted to a cheap shot because the numbers are against your point of view. Got it.. Oh wow, so you think football people will watch football first in winter? I don't care about some vague term "football person" used by douchebags. I care about the numbers as they will dictate future of the league's ability to survive. Winter football has produced on average 1/3 of the viewers as summer football. That's the bottom line. Got it, so build football, i mean soccer, into a format that will get AFL fans to watch and maximise our revenue whilst not producing better football, sorry soccer, or soccer players....is that it? As I have claimed before, this guy just another Aussie Rules troll/pest and everything he has written since i made that claim has simply confirmed it. My goodness, This is extremely cultish behavior! All I did was bring up the glaringly obvious fact that the winter ratings for football are shit. And if you want to go down this path it will be financially perilous for a league in which teams are already barely surviving. But I guess this reality doesn't matter.... I don't give 2 shits if the ratings are going to be shit. these players and future stars should be playing in conditions which they can actually push themselves past their limit. i certainly don't want starts to push themselves in summer and get a heat stroke as a result. Stars will be playing overseas. There won’t be too many stars here. And that’s the best outcome for australian football.
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Butler99
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+x+x[quote]There is no argument that football quality is better in colder weather.
There is also no argument less people are watching football in winter.
So...Less money and better football vs more money and worse football.
Or start /finish in winter,have a summer break.
Or stop playing during the day in summer..No. 35C games.At night its rarely going to get above 25C. All though the word quality is often used in this argument, it's probably the incorrect word. The players are still the same. The skill level is still the same. However the 'quality' is perceived as higher by the audience in colder climates because the pace is higher and sustained throughout the full 90 minutes. So in essence we are seeing more of the players' best. You would also be hard pressed to find a professional player or coach that doesn't prefer the colder months. Game day (or night in the A-Leagues case), is only one aspect. It's important to remember that professional players train nearly every day. The colder months would allow for more intense training sessions during the daytime which could potentially result in better performances on game day. During the summer months, training isn't called off because of the heat, but the session intensity is often relaxed during those really hot days. So why haven’t wellington been the best team in the comp and games in Wellington the most intense??
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Brian Kidd
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+x+x+x+x+x@Jegga. Spot on. Some these guys are borderline delusional. Football CAN survive in winter. But not as a full-pro league. Which means players will not be training as much and as often,the facilities will be worse, because the money won't be there to be full time, and hence the standard will decline. So the reason for going to winter seasons in the first place- the football quality-will no longer exist. Then what? They just haven't thought this one through... Going by the ratings, your comment on surviving only as a semi pro league applies to summer as well.I do think that what this argument should be taking into account is the fact that, given the A League's current situation (which is utterly unlike AFL or NRL, who have commenced their seasons rather than tacked on a belated, half arsed ending) is highly anomalous and in this context the ratings offer not even a skerrick of an indication of what winter ratings would be for a conventionl season. I'm not saying that they would be better - just that what we have is not any kind of valid basis for an argument. Does it? Was it in summer that 60,000 fans turned out for a club game in Sydney.? ..yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a $350 million broadcast deal, had mainstream sponsors like Hyundai, Harvey Norman, KFC Nissan, Webjet, Caltex? ... yes, yes it was. Was it a summer comp when the league got a half million peak viewers for a Grand Final? ..yes, yes it was. All of this happened in the last fours years. Not a generation ago. FOUR YEARS AGO. The sort of numbers you would no see in your most intense wet dream of winter football. But go ahead, repeat the mistakes of the past. I understand where you and the others are coming from. People just to have to learn the lessons for themselves. You’re ‘cherry picking ‘ of course but the fact is the a league is now starting from ‘ground zero ‘. James Johnson has said it will now be football first not metrics. I believe we fans should wait to see the ‘whole package ‘ before we start stressing out. Cherry picking? The league went form zero to $120 million annual revenue in 2018. Starting from Ground zero? Nooooo. Ground zero is kicking off in a decrepit Olympic Park in Melbourne hoping that someone, anyone, shows up to watch. The expectations for the new FFA are higher than that, I'm afraid. And MOST of that $120M per year went straight into the "back pockets" of Frank Lowy and his crooked family, who left nothing behind for the game except chaos!
Football, the TRUE game of Australias 1914-1918 First World War heroes and original ANZACs Aussie Rules, Rugby League and Cricket, the TRUE games of Australias 1914-1918 First World War shirkers, frauds and cowardly draft dodgers”
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df1982
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+x+x+x[quote]There is no argument that football quality is better in colder weather.
There is also no argument less people are watching football in winter.
So...Less money and better football vs more money and worse football.
Or start /finish in winter,have a summer break.
Or stop playing during the day in summer..No. 35C games.At night its rarely going to get above 25C. All though the word quality is often used in this argument, it's probably the incorrect word. The players are still the same. The skill level is still the same. However the 'quality' is perceived as higher by the audience in colder climates because the pace is higher and sustained throughout the full 90 minutes. So in essence we are seeing more of the players' best. You would also be hard pressed to find a professional player or coach that doesn't prefer the colder months. Game day (or night in the A-Leagues case), is only one aspect. It's important to remember that professional players train nearly every day. The colder months would allow for more intense training sessions during the daytime which could potentially result in better performances on game day. During the summer months, training isn't called off because of the heat, but the session intensity is often relaxed during those really hot days. So why haven’t wellington been the best team in the comp and games in Wellington the most intense?? Probably because they have to go and play away in 35-degree temperatures, when at home it's a mild low-20s. They've always had a much worse away than home record (mainly due to the travel, but the climatic difference can't help).
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melbourne_terrace
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+x+xWinter Football simply has to happen despite of the obstacles. Just put the game up, as its best possible product, and let it compete with the other codes on its merits. Honestly, at its best, it stands up very well. Lol no it's not, the ratings have been absolutely shocking. Mate, go and watch Ninja Warrior, it has good ratings. Don't waste your time on this guy or the small cabal of Aussie Rules trolls that he runs with. He's just a serial pest sent here to do the bidding of the AFL Yeah just the latest of stooges on here that "doesn't mind the sokkah" but resents football culture and just wants the A-League to resemble AFL-lite so it's more familiar to them. I want the a-league to survive and be the biggest it can be. Poor strategic directions will hasten its death. Sure thing Concern Troll.
Viennese Vuck
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Brian Kidd
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Group: Banned Members
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWinter Football simply has to happen despite of the obstacles. Just put the game up, as its best possible product, and let it compete with the other codes on its merits. Honestly, at its best, it stands up very well. Lol no it's not, the ratings have been absolutely shocking. Mate, go and watch Ninja Warrior, it has good ratings. Don't waste your time on this guy or the small cabal of Aussie Rules trolls that he runs with. He's just a serial pest sent here to do the bidding of the AFL Yeah just the latest of stooges on here that "doesn't mind the sokkah" but resents football culture and just wants the A-League to resemble AFL-lite so it's more familiar to them. I want the a-league to survive and be the biggest it can be. Poor strategic directions will hasten its death. Sure thing Concern Troll. This GUY is a 100% AFL TROLL!!!!
Football, the TRUE game of Australias 1914-1918 First World War heroes and original ANZACs Aussie Rules, Rugby League and Cricket, the TRUE games of Australias 1914-1918 First World War shirkers, frauds and cowardly draft dodgers”
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Decentric
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+x+xFMD .... a positive story on the A-League??
What is going on !!!
(agree entirely with the sentiment mind you) Plus no more libel/paulc and his tired old snarky comments. Place is on the up. What??? You can’t be serious? Two very different posters. Libel was a sarcastic troll (a veritable Bitter) and has been banned, whilst Paul C is usually a good laugh. The latter is amazing at winding a few people up, but in a good natured way. They have an antithetical attitude to the status quo in Aus football. I enjoy Paul C’s posts. I’d buy Paul a beer.
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Decentric
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+xThe A-league at this time has greatly improved with a host of younger players been allowed to star and take part in the league it can only get better as the young players get more experience self believe in their skills. Football will continue to become a major player in the Aussie sporting calendar and if the FFA has itsTV streaming channel it will skyrocket............charliecat Hope you are right!
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melbourne_terrace
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+xFMD .... a positive story on the A-League??
What is going on !!!
(agree entirely with the sentiment mind you) Plus no more libel/paulc and his tired old snarky comments. Place is on the up. What??? You can’t be serious? Two very different posters. Libel was a sarcastic troll (a veritable Bitter) and has been banned, whilst Paul C is usually a good laugh. The latter is amazing at winding a few people up, but in a good natured way. They have an antithetical attitude to the status quo in Aus football. I enjoy Paul C’s posts. I’d buy Paul a beer. Pull the other one Decentric, Paul has been a stain on the place for over a decade. Saying he had a "antithetical attitude to the status quo in Aus football" is a load of nonsense considering he was the biggest Lowy supporter and spent the first 15 years of the A-League being completely hostile to any change suggested to move the game in a different direction. And that's before you get to the fact that was an openly racist prick.
Viennese Vuck
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Decentric
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+x+x+x+x+x“ A-League news: Mark Bosnich backs switch to winter competition after excellent returnFor the past month, I’ve been conducting my own personal survey with players and coaches of all A-League sides to get the real insight into what the most important people think of the switch to winter football. One of the big arguments against switching back to becoming a winter league is that there’s no clear air in the sporting landscape when you’re going up against the AFL and NRL. But I don’t see any clear air in summer either. There’s no clear air anyway. So what’s the solution? You back yourself and make your product the best it can be. And based on the football we’ve watched over the past month, I think the evidence is overwhelming. The best football is played in winter.
The truth of the matter is none of this would’ve happened had everything not been brought forward by the COVID-19 situation, but the results are there for everyone to see. Football is a game that was meant to be played in the winter — and that has never been more evident than right now. From my personal survey, there’s been no range of answers. Everyone has come back saying the same thing. “What a difference it makes”. “It’s been fantastic”. “We can run all day”. “It’s where football was meant to be”. Whatever the powers that be decide — whether the game is played in summer or winter — I’ll always abide by it, but you can’t ignore the eye test. And from the moment the competition got back underway, you could count on one hand the number of bad halves of football — and have fingers left over.
I speak to the conditioning coaches who are stunned at how fresh the players are after games. Obviously we’ve had a long break, and players are now being asked to play a lot of matches in a short space of time, but they’re recovering so much quicker than they did in the summer. They’re telling their managers that they’re good to go on a two-day break. And it’s resulting in high quality football across the league. We’ve seen Melbourne Victory produce exciting finishes in games where they’ve been 2-0 down, against Brisbane and Western United, by pushing forward and grabbing late goals. That doesn’t happen in the middle of summer, because fatigued teams are scared to play attacking football. I used to feel sorry for players busting their guts on sweltering days, when I’d get phone calls from friends overseas telling me “this game is so slow”. I’d say “but you don’t realise how hot it is”.
It’s all right being in your airconditioned lounge room and going ‘oh it’s a bit slow today’. But when it’s 35 degrees in the summer and humidity is up around 90, chuck your shorts on, go outside to the street and sprint as fast you can for 20 metres. Stop, have a 20 second breather, and do it again. Do that between 50 and 70 times and tell me how you feel. Because that’s what our players are doing every game. During the summer months there may be some rusted-on AFL or rugby league fans, who if we sign a Del Piero they might flick over. But they’re still going to like their rugby league and their AFL. That’s going to be their sport. But our football supporters love our sport, and for me the biggest thing is to provide the best product possible and to do that you’ve got to provide the best environment possible for the players. And a move to winter does just that.”
https://www.news.com.au/sport/football/a-league/aleague-news-mark-bosnich-backs-switch-to-winter-competition-after-excellent-return/news-story/76298267faacd987f2f040ce988dd0d2
Not one word about how the foxtel winter ratings have been the worst on record. Improving the quality of play is irrelevant when it comes to ratings. The standard of football is not what attracts viewers. Ratings are driven by other factors. You cant say it has no impact. Watching the football since the return has been great and makes you look forward to the next game. Compare that to some of the trash we have seen over the last few summers where it seemed even many people on this forum were questioning why they were watching. The quality of play does not have any impact on ratings. Eurosnobs are not watching the A League because they don't want to. It is as simple as that. Eurosnobs also don't watch the Copa Libertadores, or the Serie A in Brazil, or the Argentine Primera or the Colombian Dimayor etc etc. Those are all high quality leagues (played in oppressive heat for much of the season) and they are not ratings winners in Australia. People watch because they are emotionally interested in the product. That has nothing to do with whether the standard of play is good or bad. If you want to improve ratings, then you must not worry about improving the quality of the league, but rather focus on the marketing, promotion and narrative built around the league. Even if the quality of play is low, people will watch if they have an emotional investment in the product. Interesting, thought provoking post, MFC. The Eurosnob phenomenon is a big issue, but it isn't confined to Aus. I've experienced it in Singapore.
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Decentric
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Group: Awaiting Activation
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+x+x+x+xFMD .... a positive story on the A-League??
What is going on !!!
(agree entirely with the sentiment mind you) Plus no more libel/paulc and his tired old snarky comments. Place is on the up. What??? You can’t be serious? Two very different posters. Libel was a sarcastic troll (a veritable Bitter) and has been banned, whilst Paul C is usually a good laugh. The latter is amazing at winding a few people up, but in a good natured way. They have an antithetical attitude to the status quo in Aus football. I enjoy Paul C’s posts. I’d buy Paul a beer. Pull the other one Decentric, Paul has been a stain on the place for over a decade. Saying he had a "antithetical attitude to the status quo in Aus football" is a load of nonsense considering he was the biggest Lowy supporter and spent the first 15 years of the A-League being completely hostile to any change suggested to move the game in a different direction. And that's before you get to the fact that was an openly racist prick. I honestly haven't seen any evidence of the last sentence in posts he has posted. Paul was hostile to the NSL, but ostensibly played in it. Yes he was a huge Lowy supporter, but in the context of supporting the HAL as opposed to being a Bitter (who lauded the old NSL). I've had private convos with Paul that remain private. I suggested Paul and Libel have advanced antithetical attitudes to each other. I think Libel should have been banned a long time before he was. The A League ( 15 years) has existed for nearly as long as the NSL ( just over 20 years), and I think a lot of old animosity is being resolved.
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Enzo Bearzot
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Anyone who watched the (great) game last night and stayed on for the post match interview should have take note of two things:
1. Mitchell Duke hinting that his playing future is up in the air BUT any decision will come down to the *money*. Not if its a winter comp, not if there's P and R. M O N E Y.
2. JP DeM the Wanderers coach saying if every team had a player like Diamanti we ie the A-Legaue would not be in the state we are in.
Right there is a summary of what works in this country for football.
1. M O N E Y. Without it, good local players will leave. To get that money, you need eyeballs watching matches. Eyeballs watching is a "metric". Not P and R, not winter com, not something ...something "football reasons". Eye balls watching. Metrics matter....
2. More eyeballs watch when you have quality marquee players that people will pay to watch. We know marquees increase the number of eyeballs watching matches because we had that and it works. Now contrary to popular opinion, the primary role of marquees is NOT to convert more fans to stay on once they leave. Most of these fans are not going stay on to watch the Jason Hoffmans and Matt Simons ran around for 10 years. The marquees primary role is to get eyeballs watching matches when they are here.
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
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+x+x+x+xFMD .... a positive story on the A-League??
What is going on !!!
(agree entirely with the sentiment mind you) Plus no more libel/paulc and his tired old snarky comments. Place is on the up. What??? You can’t be serious? Two very different posters. Libel was a sarcastic troll (a veritable Bitter) and has been banned, whilst Paul C is usually a good laugh. The latter is amazing at winding a few people up, but in a good natured way. They have an antithetical attitude to the status quo in Aus football. I enjoy Paul C’s posts. I’d buy Paul a beer. Pull the other one Decentric, Paul has been a stain on the place for over a decade. Saying he had a "antithetical attitude to the status quo in Aus football" is a load of nonsense considering he was the biggest Lowy supporter and spent the first 15 years of the A-League being completely hostile to any change suggested to move the game in a different direction. And that's before you get to the fact that was an openly racist prick. is that Lowy number 1 or Lowy number 2? Number 2 was bad. Number 1 gave Australian football popularity, media attention, and money it has not ever seen before and will not see again for another generation. Why wouldn't anyone support that and be hostile to changing it?
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bettega
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+xAnyone who watched the (great) game last night and stayed on for the post match interview should have take note of two things: 1. Mitchell Duke hinting that his playing future is up in the air BUT any decision will come down to the *money*. Not if its a winter comp, not if there's P and R. M O N E Y. 2. JP DeM the Wanderers coach saying if every team had a player like Diamanti we ie the A-Legaue would not be in the state we are in. Right there is a summary of what works in this country for football. 1. M O N E Y. Without it, good local players will leave. To get that money, you need eyeballs watching matches. Eyeballs watching is a "metric". Not P and R, not winter com, not something ...something "football reasons". Eye balls watching. Metrics matter.... 2. More eyeballs watch when you have quality marquee players that people will pay to watch. We know marquees increase the number of eyeballs watching matches because we had that and it works. Now contrary to popular opinion, the primary role of marquees is NOT to convert more fans to stay on once they leave. Most of these fans are not going stay on to watch the Jason Hoffmans and Matt Simons ran around for 10 years. The marquees primary role is to get eyeballs watching matches when they are here. Good points, but for at least next season, the chances of having good marquees in the game is a remote one. On the flipside, we might see more youngsters, we all love seeing up and coming players, even if they all end up going overseas. This move to try and increase our transfer revenue is closely related to the need to play more youngsters, which in turn is closely related to everyone embracing the hard, cold fact that we are a devlopment league.
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Jegga7698
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Ratings last on 503 were 14k
Absolute fucking dasister.
Winter football is economic suicide for the league.
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Jegga7698
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+xRatings last on 503 were 14k Absolute fucking dasister. Winter football is economic suicide for the league. Disaster*
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heyitsrobbie1984
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWinter Football simply has to happen despite of the obstacles. Just put the game up, as its best possible product, and let it compete with the other codes on its merits. Honestly, at its best, it stands up very well. Lol no it's not, the ratings have been absolutely shocking. Mate, go and watch Ninja Warrior, it has good ratings. Don't waste your time on this guy or the small cabal of Aussie Rules trolls that he runs with. He's just a serial pest sent here to do the bidding of the AFL Moron, I've been an a-l supporter since the beginning. I just don't like seeing idiot decisions (or potential decisions) being made that make the league commercially unviable LOL if your claims were even remotely true, then you would be supporting the move to winter Football Why would i support a move that would likely erode the revenue base of the competition significantly. Absolutely stupid decisions like these threaten the survival of a-l teams. Because that revenue is gone regardless of which season it is in. The falling ratings happened in summer. You are trying to tell me that the quality of the product doesn't matter, what matters is playing in summer when AFL fans can watch and reducing the salary cap so all the teams are equal. By concentrating on the football we can at least have a proper model and better quality. I'm telling you, you don't need football, you need It's a Knockout or something. What do you mean the revenue is gone? The next season is a 30 mill contract, this is based on the rough viewing average of 30,000 (from memory). The average ratings for winter have been around 10,000! So yes that 30mill a year can go much lower if the FFA want to commit suicide and have the a-l in winter. There will almost certainly be crowd drop offs as well. We'll of course have teams financially collapsing left, right and center but hey, the quality right! As long as the TRUE football supporters are satisfied on a forum then it's all hunky dori Whats happening in the Swans Pies game? Actually watching adl v syd. But of course you've resorted to a cheap shot because the numbers are against your point of view. Got it.. Oh wow, so you think football people will watch football first in winter? I don't care about some vague term "football person" used by douchebags. I care about the numbers as they will dictate future of the league's ability to survive. Winter football has produced on average 1/3 of the viewers as summer football. That's the bottom line. Got it, so build football, i mean soccer, into a format that will get AFL fans to watch and maximise our revenue whilst not producing better football, sorry soccer, or soccer players....is that it? As I have claimed before, this guy just another Aussie Rules troll/pest and everything he has written since i made that claim has simply confirmed it. My goodness, This is extremely cultish behavior! All I did was bring up the glaringly obvious fact that the winter ratings for football are shit. And if you want to go down this path it will be financially perilous for a league in which teams are already barely surviving. But I guess this reality doesn't matter.... I don't give 2 shits if the ratings are going to be shit. these players and future stars should be playing in conditions which they can actually push themselves past their limit. i certainly don't want starts to push themselves in summer and get a heat stroke as a result. Stars will be playing overseas. There won’t be too many stars here. And that’s the best outcome for australian football. hate to admit this but i think you're right. we want our best to be in europe, and that could cost us an ACL spot and be placed in the AFC cup for a long time
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWinter Football simply has to happen despite of the obstacles. Just put the game up, as its best possible product, and let it compete with the other codes on its merits. Honestly, at its best, it stands up very well. Lol no it's not, the ratings have been absolutely shocking. Mate, go and watch Ninja Warrior, it has good ratings. Don't waste your time on this guy or the small cabal of Aussie Rules trolls that he runs with. He's just a serial pest sent here to do the bidding of the AFL Moron, I've been an a-l supporter since the beginning. I just don't like seeing idiot decisions (or potential decisions) being made that make the league commercially unviable LOL if your claims were even remotely true, then you would be supporting the move to winter Football Why would i support a move that would likely erode the revenue base of the competition significantly. Absolutely stupid decisions like these threaten the survival of a-l teams. Because that revenue is gone regardless of which season it is in. The falling ratings happened in summer. You are trying to tell me that the quality of the product doesn't matter, what matters is playing in summer when AFL fans can watch and reducing the salary cap so all the teams are equal. By concentrating on the football we can at least have a proper model and better quality. I'm telling you, you don't need football, you need It's a Knockout or something. What do you mean the revenue is gone? The next season is a 30 mill contract, this is based on the rough viewing average of 30,000 (from memory). The average ratings for winter have been around 10,000! So yes that 30mill a year can go much lower if the FFA want to commit suicide and have the a-l in winter. There will almost certainly be crowd drop offs as well. We'll of course have teams financially collapsing left, right and center but hey, the quality right! As long as the TRUE football supporters are satisfied on a forum then it's all hunky dori Whats happening in the Swans Pies game? Actually watching adl v syd. But of course you've resorted to a cheap shot because the numbers are against your point of view. Got it.. Oh wow, so you think football people will watch football first in winter? I don't care about some vague term "football person" used by douchebags. I care about the numbers as they will dictate future of the league's ability to survive. Winter football has produced on average 1/3 of the viewers as summer football. That's the bottom line. Got it, so build football, i mean soccer, into a format that will get AFL fans to watch and maximise our revenue whilst not producing better football, sorry soccer, or soccer players....is that it? As I have claimed before, this guy just another Aussie Rules troll/pest and everything he has written since i made that claim has simply confirmed it. My goodness, This is extremely cultish behavior! All I did was bring up the glaringly obvious fact that the winter ratings for football are shit. And if you want to go down this path it will be financially perilous for a league in which teams are already barely surviving. But I guess this reality doesn't matter.... I don't give 2 shits if the ratings are going to be shit. these players and future stars should be playing in conditions which they can actually push themselves past their limit. i certainly don't want starts to push themselves in summer and get a heat stroke as a result. Stars will be playing overseas. There won’t be too many stars here. And that’s the best outcome for australian football. hate to admit this but i think you're right. we want our best to be in europe, and that could cost us an ACL spot and be placed in the AFC cup for a long time Europe is what we want , but they will end up in the Middle East, because they're not good enough for Europe and the pay is better than the the A-League.
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