Get em paddy

probably the highest level an Aussie has ever coached?

Postecoglue currently coaching i the champions league. Also if you count Dr Joe Venglos as Australian then he coached Aston Villa in the nineties - Dr Joe was a Slovak who ended his career in Australia before then working his way up as a coach to eventually become the Socceroos coach. After that he became Assistant for the Czechoslovakian national side and eventually the full manager coaching at a euros. After that moved into club management coaching both Aston Villa and Celtic in the nineties - he was the one who brought Viduka to Celtic. Very interesting figure who seems to have been forgotten by the australian public. Similarly Tony Dorigo who is probably our best ever player. Certainly the best CV. 

Would love to claim him but no. A true titan of the game. He managed a hand full countries around Europe and Asia. He also managed a few firsts. After the velvet divorce he was the first ever coach of Slovakia. He was also the first foreign manager (with exception of Ireland) in the top english tier - ever. Not just premier league era.

He was very much a Slovák. He's a hall of famer and been announced their manager of the century.He died with his family around him in Slovakia.

His nickname "gentleman" is apt and also kind of funny. Because he earned that moniker in both England and Slovakia independently of each other. Character always shines through.

Not sure that Venglos ever played in Australia but he certainly coached Sydney FC Prague who were a very famous team in the late 50s and sixties.However I would not count him as an Australian.As an aside prior to Venglos Prague were coached by Stefan Cambal who played for Czechoslovakia in the 1938 WC.

Wow, I had no idea Joe Venglos had an Australian connection.  Interesting post.

Joe Venglos appears a lot with old biographies of Aussie footballers and other Aussie football writers - Les Murray, Mike Cockerill, Matthew Hall.

Even though Ange is coaching in the Champ League ATM, which is really good - day in day out, week in and week out, the French League 1 is a very high standard. I had a good look at it a few years ago when it was on Fox. It is fantastic that Paddy K is coaching in it.

The mid ranked teams and lower ranked teams in Ligue 1 would only be matched by EPL, German, Italian, Spanish, Brazilian and Argentinian leagues.

Even Italian teams? Terrible league, they can't even make the World Cup. And German not much better, can't even make it out of the group stages. May as well come back to the A-League.

I think there is objective data available confirming performance wise, that these are the top seven leagues in world football. 

They is despite  italy's recent inconsistent performances as a national team  - failing to qualify for the last two World cups in 2018 and 2012, whilst in between winning the   2020/21  Euro Champs.

Germany qualified easily for Qatar, but were bundled out easily. There has been a lot of recent German introspection abut their national team failing to meet expectations.

@tomw

Sarcasm is wasted on Decentric mate, he is not part of the milieu that comprehend it.

May not have the cattle on the park like we used to, but we're building up a good handfull of managers abroad which is just as important. Big credit also to patty for managing at a higher level than he played 

Off we go. How exciting. On BT in UK. Surprised it's not on dazn in Germany. 

Maybe a side dig at FTBL to make them seem useful for once and we can use this as the official Kisnorbo watch thread :D

Goalless draw to start. Probably need to best Nantes who are below them but it's one game to start.

I know it's been heavily discussed but how I'd crave Tilio to go to Troyes. Bos is bound to go abroad but A league is fine for now. It's actually Ligue 1 but Troyes have been yoyoing for ages that I see them as incredibly weak and thin. Hopefully Kisnorbo changes that and a dream one or two Australians who can bolster the team would be awesome. 

Maybe he'll take Genreau and breathe life back into his career which has stalled this season. Although I note Genreau left MC for MacArthur when Kisnorbo became manager so maybe Paddy doesn't rate him that highly. Happy for Garang to stay at Mariners for now with Montgomery who looks to have the makings of a very good manager but if he did move to Europe would prefer him loaned to Troyes in a top development league than go to some English lower league club. 

Sorry Stefan Cambal was in the 1934 Czech WC squad and won  a runners up medal.H did coach Sparta Prague in the mid nineteen 70s who were a well known club and who played in many European competitions as they were frequent winners of the Czech league.

Sparta is still considered the big boy of the Czech league, especially after Slavia circled the drain 10 years ago. However on the park, they have been overtaken by Plzen for a number of years.

I hope Kisnorbo does well in France.He was a steady player and had Melbourne City playing good football.He had a good mentor in Mombaerts.

Next game tomorrow in Strasbourg 

Lens beat psg how good is football 

In 2023, Troyes will be the team I'll be regularly checking the scores.

I've been following Celtic with Ange, but it's getting boring because they always win.

Also, following Hrustic in Serie A, and Mabil in La Liga, they hardly get off the bench, same with Mat Ryan in Denmark.

So it'll be following the fortunes of Troyes to see how Patrick Kisnorbo goes with his coaching.

HT: Troyes up 2-1 away to Strasbourg.

Came back to 2:2 but a late goal sees a 3:2 win for Troyes.

First win since Sept 18. 

There is a lot of pressure on Kisnorbo to keep Troyes in Ligue 1. The league is being reduced to 18 teams from next season. 4 teams will be relegated this season and only two promoted. These 2 recent results are good but if he can get another couple of wins early it would definitely help. I know someone else mentioned it, but Troyes GA is pretty high at 33, so maybe Maty Ryan could be tempted in the Jan transfer window. good for him good for Troyes and Kisnorbo. 

Would love to see PK kick on and raise the Oz coaches profile in Europe. Possible options for Australian players also given the French leagues apparently make it challenging for non-French speaking visa players. 

I don’t know if an Aussie coach will go out and sign Aussie players straight away.
If the player struggles early it puts the manager under immediate pressure.

Think of when Alastair Edwards signed his sons or Poppa as similar scenarios but this is in the bright lights of the French League where the blowtorch is applied if bias is shown.

2-3 win solid job patty 

could be the future Socceroos coach 

https://youtu.be/ZvqTkDhgwlA

Highlights. Some good goals. 

Very bright jumper that one that Kisnorbo wears. Defo not an Ange jumper.

Some nice behind the scenes footage post-game.

https://youtu.be/jRg_hfpcBBM

Allez Estac! Going to keenly follow Kisnorbo’s progress with interest.

to say I'm surprised is nothing against him, just didn't know what to expect, good on him hope he avoids relegation would be huge.

Strasbourg are second last for a bit of measurement. I simply have no idea except Troyes are a low budget yoyo club. Some quickly translated French comments reveal people are glad and maybe even surprised at the more attacking bite the team suddenly has. Here's hoping for a good early run to seal safety and move on from there. 

You can say that again. They've been relegated twice from Ligue 1 in the last 5 seasons. I hope they have good cardiologists in Troyes. 

Big cup game away to Lille tomorrow night. 

2:0 loss to Lille in cup. 

Having said that he mostly played kids because they have 3 matches in a week. 

Big game tomorrow morning V Marseille. Should be a cracker!

Sadly, Kisnorbo lost his first game as coach of Troyes, losing 0-2 to Marseille.

I pretty much expected that.

Marseille isn't far off 2nd place behind PSG and Lens.

It's akin to Nottingham Forrest or Leeds hosting Newcastle at home on current form. 

15 January 2023 -  a big 5-1 loss to LOSC.

Gotta feel for kisnorbo.
Bloke was given a hospital pass with this one.
Plays 6th in the cup, then played 3rd, 6th and 2nd again in the league in his first 6 games in charge. Not an easy Start.

Kisnorbo's Troyes draws 1-1 with Lens, the team second on the French Ligue 1 table.

"[Lens player] Adrien Thomasson's late goal salvaged a 1-1 draw for RC Lens at Troyes but the visitors [Lens] missed the opportunity to move level on points with Ligue 1 leaders Paris St Germain on Saturday."

https://www.espn.com/soccer/report/_/gameId/639804

This means Kisnorbo's Troyes were leading for most of the game, and only conceded a draw at the 88th minute. This was against the number 2 side on the Ligue 1 table, Lens being second to Paris Saint Germain.

Pretty good result for Troyes and Kisnorbo!

Lens being number 2 on the ladder behind PSG in one of the big five UEFA leagues is very impressive. 

It isnt an easy job nor is it an easy place to coach the French league is probably the 5th best league in the world if he can avoid relegation i reckon he will keep post 

 This is the highest club appointment by any Aus coach.  It is definitely the 5th top  league in Europe.

I'm not sure how it compares to he  Brazilian and Argentinian leagues?

Moreover, the French are producing the top domestic players in Europe ATM. France is the highest ranked national team in UEFA after the Qatar WC.

On a YouTube site, they also state that something like 70% of the French league comprise French nationals. The Spainish have 60% domestic players. Germany and Italy have about 50%  domestic players. The EPL only  just over 30%  domestic English players.

Based on these figures it might be able to deduce  that more French players are playing big five football in UEFA than any other nation, given they also export a production line of top  French players to the other UEFA big four. The French have greater depth and quantity of quality.

Kisnorbo's club Troyes were beaten 4-1 playing away at Toulouse.

Shame.

Thanks for posting, JS.

Kisnorbo's club Troyes playing at home were beaten 3-0 by mid-table Toulouse.

Troyes FC one point away from relegation zone.

Three months to the PSG game.

Any more updates?

Troyes suffers another crushing 4-0 loss playing away at Reims.

I wonder how Postecoglou (and even the likes of a Guardiola) being manager of a struggling team in a top tier league. See how Kevin Muscat bombed when he took a low level Belgian team, but is doing well when he took over high-flying Yokohama FM which, over the past decade, at worst, was a mid-table team with a history of several times being champions

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yokohama_F._Marinos

Is Kisnorbo's trajectory going to be similar to Aussie young players who go to a top League, and bomb out quickly, and have to come back to the A-League?

I wonder if Yokohama FM would have taken Muscat, if Postecoglou had not been so successful there, giving the Japanese the hint that Aussie coaches could produce good results?

It looks like Patrick will be set for another debut somewhere else because his team are going like busteds.

Kisnorbo's Troyes now into the relegation zone after a 0-1 home loss to Montpellier.

Fascinated to see how this unfolds.

Meanwhile in Japan, Kev’s Yokohama just beat their main J1 League rival on their own dung heap to start the season.

Oh no!

Ouch!

Kisnorbo's Troyes beaten 2-1 playing away at Ajaccio -- both teams in the relegation zone.

they lost to the second bottom team and are now second bottom themsleves

I was desperately hoping Paddy could finish mid - table.

France is turning out to the the top international team of the last 20 odd years since 1998 - two World cup titles and two WC runner ups.

Hate to say this, but his position seems untenable and time for him to go. He’s obviously landed in a shitty situation, but if I was a fan, I’d be fuming. 

haha - you think he'll step up any better than Poppa.
Wishful thinking I guess, both have won AL titles, had top players at the time.
At least Paddys was very recent but MV is a pale it once was compared to MC today.

I'm sorry for him....
Red cards last 2 games.
Worst GA to date.
13 games left, huge battle to survive.

Have you guys seen this :
Four clubs are to be relegated to Ligue 2 at the end of the season as the number of clubs will be reduced to 18 starting from the 2023–24 season. As a result, no play-offs will be held at the end of the season. This is the last season played with 20 teams.

Not looking good for him....

Should of taken bos with him 

wont sack him, its a pilot to see if they can find a pathway for coaches to advance via their clubs. CFG see it as long term investment. 

Host Monaco Sunday

Monaco equalise on 80. Ten to go! 

2:1 Monaco just like that. Can't just be the coach when it comes to not closing out games. 

2:2!!!

Not bad ... a 1-1 home draw to third place Monaco. But Paddy still in the relegation zone second from the bottom. And in France's Ligue 1, four teams get the chop.

Did some of the famous johnsmith research skills lead to you posting this?
The correct score was even the post directly before yours

It's a tough season with 4 instead of 2 clubs getting relegated as the league re-sizes its top division. 

Very tough for the 4 relegated from the top division, but good for those  promoted from Div 2.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IcjNZavvuU

Highlights. Well done to get a point. I know it's been discussed and I think he'd have a rough time but if there were any time for Maclaren to have one final stint abroad....Tilio though. This team and level would be ideal for him to play every week.

Another one bites the dust. Troyes, playing away, loses to Lorient 2-0.

Second from the bottom. Eleven more games till the end of the season.

You seem to be oddly excited by Paddy's poor results Mr Smith... Can I ask why?

Ask yourself: Am I (a) excited by Paddy's poor results, or (b) am I a fan of Paddy, and concerned at his poor results?

I've been a fan of Patrick KIsnorbo ever since his days at Leicester and Leeds where he showed great courage as a defender, even with head injuries. I was terribly disappointed when injury robbed him at the last moment of a place in the World Cup 2010 squad, and therefore I was enthusiastic how he brought a sense of fighting spirit as a coach at Melbourne City.

So I'm speaking as a big fan of his, and am troubled by the poor performance of Troyes under his management.

For instance, last weekend, Troyes playing at home only managed a draw against 16th-placed Brest. This helped Troyes climb up the ladder but still in the relegation zone.

I will ask myself nothing of the sort Mr Smith. Just a little curious as to your "approach" to your so called fandom of big Paddy. I cant seem to remember any posts from you about Paddy's career prior to him heading off overseas to try his luck (not that I have tried to look mind you) its just that your "reporting" of another poor result appears (at least to me) to be gloating rather than empathy.... Carry on being you.

Thanks for the good feedback. Your comments reinforced my long-held understanding that social media and the written text is the worst vehicle for communicating true intentions, because there are no visual cues or facial body language to fill in the gaps. Your comments are a good reminder to me, for other areas of communication too. So when I report in the future on defeats to Paddy's team, I'll try to make it clearer in my writing and show that I'm saddened by the result :(

You are very welcome and I agree that communication online can be a quagmire of mixed intentions. I was honestly just curious as to what I perceived as hostility against an Aussie bloke doing his best to forge a career overseas.. all good.

I hope to hear some positive "reports" over the next few rounds against Auxerre and Clemont Foot....  OM may well be a "bridge too far" though... 

Post what you feel Johnno. Mono insults virtually anyone except a couple of his pub mates on here.

Disappointed to see Troyes suffer a 1-0 loss to fellow relegation-struggler Auxerre playing away. If Kisnorbo is going to have any hope of avoiding relegation, Troyes is going to have to beat those teams fighting to avoid relegation, which is not happening.

It is good that we have one Aussie coach, Paddy Kisnorbo, coaching in such a high calibre league as the French top division. A few years ago, when I had access to games, I watched quite a lot of it. It is a very good standard.

In terms of producing outstanding national team players the French have the most consistent team over the last 7 World Cups:

Winners - 1998.

Runners up - 2006.

Winners - 2018.

Runners up - 2022.

I remember an early round exit in 2002.

Can't remember what happened to France in South A 2010 and Brazil in 2014?

I know that many top French players play overseas in the other big UEFA Five, because they all pay higher wages in Germany, Spain, Italy and England. There is a lot going on that is right in French football ATM.

I hope Paddy stays up.

 

It seems your lack of knowledge extends to leagues other than the SPL. The only league that materially backs up your  opinion is the Premier League.

Club	Average Annual Salary	Yearly Wage Bill
1. Paris Saint-Germain	€6,623,478	€152,340,000

This compares to: La Liga 1. FC Barcelona £7,606,400 £190,160,000 Serie A 1. Juventus FC €7,688,250 €102,307,000 Bundesliga 1. Bayern Münich €6,693,333 €180,720,000 Premier League 1. Manchester United £6,517,500 £169,455,000 Lowest Salaries France 18. FC Lorient €255,463 €7,408,440 La Liga 20. Elche CF £230,644 £5,074,160 Serie A 18. Spezia Calcio €196,590 €4,235,000 Bundesliga 18. DSC Arminia Bielefeld €287,767 €8,057,500 Premier League 20. Sheffield United FC £729,888 £19,707,000

I have researched the big five.

There is a Youtube video where it states that the average annual  earnings of players in the UEFA big five are:

EPL - $4 million.

Bundesliga - circa $3 million.

Italy and Spain - circa  $2.5 million.

France - circa $1.3 million. 

Remarkably the quality is basically the same

A good point - even with the income disparity. 

In fact the French league, is arguably the most successful of all - given the French national team has probably been the best of the UEFA big five in the last 7 World Cups. They've won 2 WCs (1998 and 2018) and been runners up in 2 more WCs (2006 and 2022) since 1998.

I wish we had more players ( Genreau) and coaches (Paddy) plying their trade in  the French Championat, even in the lower ranked clubs. It is renowned   as the most physical league, in terms of muscular body on body contact of the UEFA  big five leagues   -despite probably being nowhere near as rugged as Scotland though. Moreover, it is a highly technical and tactical league.