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Decentric 2
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+x+x+x+x+x+xTo play devils advocate does it matter how many passes there are in a game? Does that just mean the SPL is stronger in different phases of play rather than just possession? I get the argument about the need for touches when players are developing their techniques but that should have happened before u18s. These guys should already have sound techniques. I don't think it's fair to make a blanket statement that the SPL is poor and poor at developing players. To me it's very much more nuanced and comes down to individuals and a bunch of various factors, whether or not it's the right fit for a player. I am making no claims about the quality, but if you learn to play here a certain style where there are around 750 passes per game, go to scotland where outside the glasgow rivals play at 450 passes per game and then try and adjust again either in a european league or the socceroos to many more passes per game, you are radically adjusting what you are used to much more than you would if you went to any other league. Can you still develop? Sometimes. But generally a player would do better in a league that plays a similar way to the roos, the wc or the champions league knockouts. I remember many years ago, Pim said that it was better preparation training for buli 2 than playing in the a league. He tried to clarify that he wasn't criticizing the quality of the league, just said it was poor preparation for playing international footbal. He even defended the quality of the league to a middle eastern journalist, pointing out that AU made the champions league final At the time, a typical a league match had 350 passes per game whereas the socceroos were averaging around 700. Adjusting from the a league with a 350 pass match to a 700 pass match for the roos is not easy, even if your individual quality as a player is good. Unfortunately that nuance was lost and people heard "the a league sucks". Today the a league plays a similar style to the socceroos, the top leagues in europe, decent development leagues in europe like the eredivisie or buli 2 and the champions league. As we saw at the last world cup, while it may not be the same quality as the best leagues, it is good preparation for international football Irvines career took off because of Hibs before moving to St Pauli. A good question here, as another poster and I have discussed off forum, who has improved from playing in Scotland. Irvine has improved as an international in recent times, late in his career, after I thought he was stagnating, and not quite good enough for a Socceroo starting eleven. It seems that he has improved to another level since joining St Pauli in Bundi 2 - appraising him as a Socceroo. Was he stagnating at His? Or did the current amelioration of his game as a Socceroo start at Hibs before joining St Pauli? I think irvine was at the spl till about 23/24 before moving to the championship then in the last few years in buli 2. Looks like he got frozen out in the championship, was a january transfer to hibs where he played 15 games and then went to buli 2. The match fitness would have been useful to reboot his career no doubt Ta.
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grazorblade
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xon statistical significance: The standard deviation is 83.7 and 81.1 for the a league and spl respectively. This means the difference is over 3.5 sigma which is well above the 2 sigma for statistical significance The sample size is too small to draw any meaningful conclusions from. Selecting one round of games is also flawed. That is what I meant by statistically insignificant. but for peace of mind, in case there is a seasonal effect, I looked at the first four games in January not involving the glasgow giants. In the A league it is 826.3 passes per game and the spl is 509.8. Both are pretty close to the average given before That is a significant difference. All the data points to the proposition that Scotland isn't great for developing international level quality players for the Socceroos having validity. The question asked off forum, is which players have improved immeasurably in their performances for the Socceroos by playing in Scotland in recent times ?Also, how their improvement compares to other leagues like Eredivisie, Juniper league and Bundi 2? A lot is made of Souttar ATM, because he is playing EPL - which has a huge profile in Aus. However, Genreau, playing in the equally impressive French Championat, and Kisnorbo coaching there, hardly raises any media column space or interviews by video. I'm perplexed that Arnie advocates playing in the SPL as much as he does for Aussies, apart from playing a lot more games than the AL. I'm also perplexed that he has appointed Luke Wilkshire as a Socceroo assistant coach? There are many more far more experienced, analytical and cerebrally capable trained assistant coaches like Phil Moss, Scott Miller, Jason Culina, Craig Foster, Ross Aloisi, John Anastasiadis et al, available. Arnold disagrees with you. He is far more qualified than you to form an opinion and unlike you he actually watches the SPL. So you are saying Wilkshire is intellectually challenged? Again, I trust Arnold's judgement. I agree that Arnie is far more qualified than me evaluating that the SPL is a decent option for Aussies to play overseas. In terms of results, Arnie is the greatest ever Socceroo coach. Although Bert Van Marwijk took Netherlands to a World Cup Final in 2010. Arnie alludes to the length of the season as being paramount - 40 games in Scotland is far better than 25 games in the AL. I totally concur with him on number of games. However, outside that, the stats show that Scotland isn't a technical league. It wasn't when I used to watch it. Arnie's Socceroos play very, very sophisticated tactical football, with a number of really smart players - Goodwin, Duke, Irvine, Mooy, Behich, Rowles, Souttar, Degenek, et al. Moreover, the Socceroos under his tutelage, play a technical brand of football at every opportunity. When the A L started it was a roughhouse, physical, second ball league. It has evolved to be a far more technical and tactical league in accordance with the Football Aus curriculum. Maybe the physical body on body contact element of it has declined? Again Arnie is far more qualified than me to appoint Wilkshire as a coach. I'm perplexed when Rene Meulenteen, his chief assistant, is such a smart guy. I think RM has designed most of the Man U academy training ground exercises. They are excellent. Arnie's old CCM assistant, Phil Moss, has taken some terrific training ground sessions for coaches, that I've attended. He has also presented impressive workshop for coaches under Football Aus auspices, that I've been fortunate enough to attend. Ditto the likes of Scott Miller (former Jets coach , now coaching NPL 2 in Vic), et al. These are switched on guys who are well cut out to be head coaches. I would love to hear Arnie's criteria criteria for selecting Luke W, whilst these other guys are probably available. Conversely, Luke Wilkshire only ever talks about getting stuck in, playing for the shirt and physicality as a TV pundit. He has virtually proffered no tactical and technical insights whatsoever, and isn't anywhere near as articulate as most current high level coaches, or other TV pundits like Milligan, Harper, Grace Gill, Georgia Yeoman- Dale, Bruce Djite and Alex Brosque. One of the key factors set out in Football Aus for imparting messages to players, is communication skills. I'm surprised that Wilkshire has even passed the coaching courses? Many experienced coaches I know, used to say to me at current courses, 'it is easy for you because you are a teacher'. They found them cognitively challenging. I'd suggest that if Luke was an ordinary punter, devoid of an illustrious pro career, he would have failed the C, B and A Licences if assessed objectively. Former pros are often fast tracked, and appraised too easily in Football Aus coaching courses. Look at that list of players you posted. The SPL has been important to the development or careers (or both) of Irvine, Mooy, Behich, Rowles and Souttar. It would be interesting to know how much it has been the SPL that has helped them? Mooy and Behich were both good international players at World Cup level before they went to Scotland. Mooy had played in the illustrious EPL and Behich had played in the technically good Turkish league. Kewell says the latter is a good technically as the EPL, but mediocre tactically. Rowles went straight from the A L into sudden death Socceroo WCQs and was astonishingly effective late in the Socceroo WCQ campaign. He was improving fast in the A L with CCM. I don't know much about Souttar? Had he improved a lot in the SPL? Or was it the Championship, and now EPL, which has a advanced his career? When he initially played for at the Socceroos I thought he was quite clumsy on his feet and nimble players tended to get around him. Since he has retained after injury, his footwork in jockeying, delaying and showing, has improved out of site! He must have been skipping, doing a lot of fast feet drills with rope ladders, and doing plenty of 1v1 delaying, jockeying and showing work with a partner on the training track. Souttar played in a total of 15 spl games
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Decentric 2
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 3.1K,
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+x+xTo play devils advocate does it matter how many passes there are in a game? Does that just mean the SPL is stronger in different phases of play rather than just possession? I get the argument about the need for touches when players are developing their techniques but that should have happened before u18s. These guys should already have sound techniques. I don't think it's fair to make a blanket statement that the SPL is poor and poor at developing players. To me it's very much more nuanced and comes down to individuals and a bunch of various factors, whether or not it's the right fit for a player. I am making no claims about the quality, but if you learn to play here a certain style where there are around 750 passes per game, go to scotland where outside the glasgow rivals play at 450 passes per game and then try and adjust again either in a european league or the socceroos to many more passes per game, you are radically adjusting what you are used to much more than you would if you went to any other league. Can you still develop? Sometimes. But generally a player would do better in a league that plays a similar way to the roos, the wc or the champions league knockouts. Today the a league plays a similar style to the socceroos, the top leagues in europe, decent development leagues in europe like the eredivisie or buli 2 and the champions league. As we saw at the last world cup, while it may not be the same quality as the best leagues, it is good preparation for international football Another cogent point, Grazor. The Socceroos called up a left back, who had played a lot in English League One, a few years back. His name escapes me, but he returned to Aus and played for Perth Glory. He said after his first Socceroo game he was amazed at how much football was played on the deck with feet, compared to his English club football.
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Decentric 2
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 3.1K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xon statistical significance: The standard deviation is 83.7 and 81.1 for the a league and spl respectively. This means the difference is over 3.5 sigma which is well above the 2 sigma for statistical significance The sample size is too small to draw any meaningful conclusions from. Selecting one round of games is also flawed. That is what I meant by statistically insignificant. but for peace of mind, in case there is a seasonal effect, I looked at the first four games in January not involving the glasgow giants. In the A league it is 826.3 passes per game and the spl is 509.8. Both are pretty close to the average given before That is a significant difference. All the data points to the proposition that Scotland isn't great for developing international level quality players for the Socceroos having validity. The question asked off forum, is which players have improved immeasurably in their performances for the Socceroos by playing in Scotland in recent times ?Also, how their improvement compares to other leagues like Eredivisie, Juniper league and Bundi 2? A lot is made of Souttar ATM, because he is playing EPL - which has a huge profile in Aus. However, Genreau, playing in the equally impressive French Championat, and Kisnorbo coaching there, hardly raises any media column space or interviews by video. I'm perplexed that Arnie advocates playing in the SPL as much as he does for Aussies, apart from playing a lot more games than the AL. I'm also perplexed that he has appointed Luke Wilkshire as a Socceroo assistant coach? There are many more far more experienced, analytical and cerebrally capable trained assistant coaches like Phil Moss, Scott Miller, Jason Culina, Craig Foster, Ross Aloisi, John Anastasiadis et al, available. Arnold disagrees with you. He is far more qualified than you to form an opinion and unlike you he actually watches the SPL. So you are saying Wilkshire is intellectually challenged? Again, I trust Arnold's judgement. I agree that Arnie is far more qualified than me evaluating that the SPL is a decent option for Aussies to play overseas. In terms of results, Arnie is the greatest ever Socceroo coach. Although Bert Van Marwijk took Netherlands to a World Cup Final in 2010. Arnie alludes to the length of the season as being paramount - 40 games in Scotland is far better than 25 games in the AL. I totally concur with him on number of games. However, outside that, the stats show that Scotland isn't a technical league. It wasn't when I used to watch it. Arnie's Socceroos play very, very sophisticated tactical football, with a number of really smart players - Goodwin, Duke, Irvine, Mooy, Behich, Rowles, Souttar, Degenek, et al. Moreover, the Socceroos under his tutelage, play a technical brand of football at every opportunity. When the A L started it was a roughhouse, physical, second ball league. It has evolved to be a far more technical and tactical league in accordance with the Football Aus curriculum. Maybe the physical body on body contact element of it has declined? Again Arnie is far more qualified than me to appoint Wilkshire as a coach. I'm perplexed when Rene Meulenteen, his chief assistant, is such a smart guy. I think RM has designed most of the Man U academy training ground exercises. They are excellent. Arnie's old CCM assistant, Phil Moss, has taken some terrific training ground sessions for coaches, that I've attended. He has also presented impressive workshop for coaches under Football Aus auspices, that I've been fortunate enough to attend. Ditto the likes of Scott Miller (former Jets coach , now coaching NPL 2 in Vic), et al. These are switched on guys who are well cut out to be head coaches. I would love to hear Arnie's criteria criteria for selecting Luke W, whilst these other guys are probably available. Conversely, Luke Wilkshire only ever talks about getting stuck in, playing for the shirt and physicality as a TV pundit. He has virtually proffered no tactical and technical insights whatsoever, and isn't anywhere near as articulate as most current high level coaches, or other TV pundits like Milligan, Harper, Grace Gill, Georgia Yeoman- Dale, Bruce Djite and Alex Brosque. One of the key factors set out in Football Aus for imparting messages to players, is communication skills. I'm surprised that Wilkshire has even passed the coaching courses? Many experienced coaches I know, used to say to me at current courses, 'it is easy for you because you are a teacher'. They found them cognitively challenging. I'd suggest that if Luke was an ordinary punter, devoid of an illustrious pro career, he would have failed the C, B and A Licences if assessed objectively. Former pros are often fast tracked, and appraised too easily in Football Aus coaching courses. Look at that list of players you posted. The SPL has been important to the development or careers (or both) of Irvine, Mooy, Behich, Rowles and Souttar. It would be interesting to know how much it has been the SPL that has helped them? Mooy and Behich were both good international players at World Cup level before they went to Scotland. Mooy had played in the illustrious EPL and Behich had played in the technically good Turkish league. Kewell says the latter is a good technically as the EPL, but mediocre tactically. Rowles went straight from the A L into sudden death Socceroo WCQs and was astonishingly effective late in the Socceroo WCQ campaign. He was improving fast in the A L with CCM. I don't know much about Souttar? Had he improved a lot in the SPL? Or was it the Championship, and now EPL, which has a advanced his career? When he initially played for at the Socceroos I thought he was quite clumsy on his feet and nimble players tended to get around him. Since he has retained after injury, his footwork in jockeying, delaying and showing, has improved out of site! He must have been skipping, doing a lot of fast feet drills with rope ladders, and doing plenty of 1v1 delaying, jockeying and showing work with a partner on the training track. Souttar played in a total of 15 spl games Not a lot then. It seems his Championship club shaped him.
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Decentric 2
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After rechecking the Denmark/Scotland UEFA WCQs for 2022 WC in Qatar results, I've made an error.
I stated that Denmark beat Scotland 2-0 both home and away in those WCQs. They didn't . Each time Denmark and Scotland played each other, the home team won 2-0.
The difference was Denmark beat Austria and Israel away. Conversely, Scotland drew with both when they played them away.
I've researched quite a few articles written on Scotland's 6 successive failures to qualify for the last 6 World Cups. They qualified for the last Euros - for the first time in a long time.
One erudite scribe wrote,it has been suggested within the boffins of the football community, that Scotland hasn't sufficiently adapted to the modern game played abroad.
I discovered that the Scottish FA employed a Dutch Tech Dir to rewrite and overhaul the Scottish football curriculum. This is all well and good, but it could be a case like Harry Redknapp in England, repudiating past English Football Assoc Tech Dir, Dan Ashworth, as having nothing to offer.
I'm not sure how much Scottish club coaches are adapting their revamped curriculum?
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Lurker
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+xAfter rechecking the Denmark/Scotland UEFA WCQs for 2022 WC in Qatar results, I've made an error. I stated that Denmark beat Scotland 2-0 both home and away in those WCQs. They didn't . Each time Denmark and Scotland played each other, the home team won 2-0. The difference was Denmark beat Austria and Israel away. Conversely, Scotland drew with both when they played them away. I've researched quite a few articles written on Scotland's 6 successive failures to qualify for the last 6 World Cups. They qualified for the last Euros - for the first time in a long time. One erudite scribe wrote,it has been suggested within the boffins of the football community, that Scotland hasn't sufficiently adapted to the modern game played abroad. I discovered that the Scottish FA employed a Dutch Tech Dir to rewrite and overhaul the Scottish football curriculum. This is all well and good, but it could be a case like Harry Redknapp in England, repudiating past English Football Assoc Tech Dir, Dan Ashworth, as having nothing to offer. I'm not sure how much Scottish club coaches are adapting their revamped curriculum? They most likely aren't. Those coaches jobs are dependent on the only truly important stat in a football game. That is winning. No club in the SPL will adopt a system just because the SFA has a curriculum. So a scribe is erudite because he agrees with your opinion? Years ago, when Japan was trying to improve their football standards they sent their youth to Brazil, not the Neverlands. It worked out well for Japan. Kudos to you for admitting your glaring mistake re Scotland v Denmark.
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Decentric 2
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 3.1K,
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+x+xAfter rechecking the Denmark/Scotland UEFA WCQs for 2022 WC in Qatar results, I've made an error. I stated that Denmark beat Scotland 2-0 both home and away in those WCQs. They didn't . Each time Denmark and Scotland played each other, the home team won 2-0. The difference was Denmark beat Austria and Israel away. Conversely, Scotland drew with both when they played them away. I've researched quite a few articles written on Scotland's 6 successive failures to qualify for the last 6 World Cups. They qualified for the last Euros - for the first time in a long time. One erudite scribe wrote,it has been suggested within the boffins of the football community, that Scotland hasn't sufficiently adapted to the modern game played abroad. I discovered that the Scottish FA employed a Dutch Tech Dir to rewrite and overhaul the Scottish football curriculum. This is all well and good, but it could be a case like Harry Redknapp in England, repudiating past English Football Assoc Tech Dir, Dan Ashworth, as having nothing to offer. I'm not sure how much Scottish club coaches are adapting their revamped curriculum? They most likely aren't. Those coaches jobs are dependent on the only truly important stat in a football game. That is winning. No club in the SPL will adopt a system just because the SFA has a curriculum. So a scribe is erudite because he agrees with your opinion? Years ago, when Japan was trying to improve their football standards they sent their youth to Brazil, not the Neverlands. It worked out well for Japan. Kudos to you for admitting your glaring mistake re Scotland v Denmark. The difference is that most coaches in most other countries, equate their mandated national playing style as conducive to successful results. Netherlands, France, Spain, Germany, Belgium, Croatia, Portugal come to mind. That scribe is erudite because he evaluates plausible rationale that addresses the issue - Scotland's repeated failure to qualify for WCs. He didn't allude to ridiculous stuff like some arguing Scottish are genetically inferior, and mentally incapable of working as a team, that were reasons proffered by some, also in the scribe's article - which he dismisses as implausible. I do as well. Other arguments used, were that kids were playing computer games rather than street football in Scotland. This extrapolated to other countries in Europe 12 years ago. KNVB staff coaches and Dutch Tech Dirs in Aus, were elucidating this in 2011. It was a problem all over Europe. Any coaches who repudiated the Football Aus mandated new methodology and holistic national system, have had the game of football pass them by. Frank Farina comes to mind. Those coaches unwilling to change no longer coach professionally. Comparatively, when Netherlands failed to qualify for the 2018 WC, the KNVB commissioned Ed Ten Kate, to immediately conduct a review of their curriculum, and to identify shortfalls in the players they were producing. ETK immediately went to France and Germany, to observe how they were having more success from 2015 - 18, than Netherlands. Netherlands had just come third in the Brazil 2014 WC too. Things change very fast in football. Don't get me wrong. The current Scottish national team is the best they have had for decades ATM. It still isn't good enough though. Despite them finishing close to Denmark in the group, they were easily beaten by Ukraine in the sudden death knock out fixture. Have the Scottish FA sent staff coaches and TDs to observe football methodology in Denmark, Croatia, Uruguay, Portugal, and visited the Tech Depts of their national football federations - all with similar size populations to Scotland, and who regularly qualify for WCs? It turned around quickly for Netherlands by doing it.
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Lurker
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+xAfter rechecking the Denmark/Scotland UEFA WCQs for 2022 WC in Qatar results, I've made an error. I stated that Denmark beat Scotland 2-0 both home and away in those WCQs. They didn't . Each time Denmark and Scotland played each other, the home team won 2-0. The difference was Denmark beat Austria and Israel away. Conversely, Scotland drew with both when they played them away. I've researched quite a few articles written on Scotland's 6 successive failures to qualify for the last 6 World Cups. They qualified for the last Euros - for the first time in a long time. One erudite scribe wrote,it has been suggested within the boffins of the football community, that Scotland hasn't sufficiently adapted to the modern game played abroad. I discovered that the Scottish FA employed a Dutch Tech Dir to rewrite and overhaul the Scottish football curriculum. This is all well and good, but it could be a case like Harry Redknapp in England, repudiating past English Football Assoc Tech Dir, Dan Ashworth, as having nothing to offer. I'm not sure how much Scottish club coaches are adapting their revamped curriculum? They most likely aren't. Those coaches jobs are dependent on the only truly important stat in a football game. That is winning. No club in the SPL will adopt a system just because the SFA has a curriculum. So a scribe is erudite because he agrees with your opinion? Years ago, when Japan was trying to improve their football standards they sent their youth to Brazil, not the Neverlands. It worked out well for Japan. Kudos to you for admitting your glaring mistake re Scotland v Denmark. The difference is that most coaches in most other countries, equate their mandated national playing style as conducive to successful results. Netherlands, France, Spain, Germany, Belgium, Croatia, Portugal come to mind. That scribe is erudite because he evaluates plausible rationale that addresses the issue - Scotland's repeated failure to qualify for WCs. He didn't allude to ridiculous stuff like some arguing Scottish are genetically inferior, and mentally incapable of working as a team, that were reasons proffered by some, also in the scribe's article - which he dismisses as implausible. I do as well. Other arguments used, were that kids were playing computer games rather than street football in Scotland. This extrapolated to other countries in Europe 12 years ago. KNVB staff coaches and Dutch Tech Dirs in Aus, were elucidating this in 2011. It was a problem all over Europe. Any coaches who repudiated the Football Aus mandated new methodology and holistic national system, have had the game of football pass them by. Frank Farina comes to mind. Those coaches unwilling to change no longer coach professionally. Comparatively, when Netherlands failed to qualify for the 2018 WC, the KNVB commissioned Ed Ten Kate, to immediately conduct a review of their curriculum, and to identify shortfalls in the players they were producing. ETK immediately went to France and Germany, to observe how they were having more success from 2015 - 18, than Netherlands. Netherlands had just come third in the Brazil 2014 WC too. Things change very fast in football. Don't get me wrong. The current Scottish national team is the best they have had for decades ATM. It still isn't good enough though. Despite them finishing close to Denmark in the group, they were easily beaten by Ukraine in the sudden death knock out fixture. Have the Scottish FA sent staff coaches and TDs to observe football methodology in Denmark, Croatia, Uruguay, Portugal, and visited the Tech Depts of their national football federations - all with similar size populations to Scotland, and who regularly qualify for WCs? It turned around quickly for Netherlands by doing it. Maybe the SFA understands that the Scottish national team is low priority to the majority of Scottish fans who care much more about how their club is doing. They definitely know they can't dictate to SPL sides the style they are to play. I have been to Hampden and watched Scotland play. The atmosphere, when compared to Rangers v Celtic, was subdued.In fact there was far less passion than watching St Mirren v Morton (an SPL side playing a Championship side). I get that as an Australian you find it difficult to accept but International football is not as important as you think it is.
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Balin Trev
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+x+x+x+xAfter rechecking the Denmark/Scotland UEFA WCQs for 2022 WC in Qatar results, I've made an error. I stated that Denmark beat Scotland 2-0 both home and away in those WCQs. They didn't . Each time Denmark and Scotland played each other, the home team won 2-0. The difference was Denmark beat Austria and Israel away. Conversely, Scotland drew with both when they played them away. I've researched quite a few articles written on Scotland's 6 successive failures to qualify for the last 6 World Cups. They qualified for the last Euros - for the first time in a long time. One erudite scribe wrote,it has been suggested within the boffins of the football community, that Scotland hasn't sufficiently adapted to the modern game played abroad. I discovered that the Scottish FA employed a Dutch Tech Dir to rewrite and overhaul the Scottish football curriculum. This is all well and good, but it could be a case like Harry Redknapp in England, repudiating past English Football Assoc Tech Dir, Dan Ashworth, as having nothing to offer. I'm not sure how much Scottish club coaches are adapting their revamped curriculum? They most likely aren't. Those coaches jobs are dependent on the only truly important stat in a football game. That is winning. No club in the SPL will adopt a system just because the SFA has a curriculum. So a scribe is erudite because he agrees with your opinion? Years ago, when Japan was trying to improve their football standards they sent their youth to Brazil, not the Neverlands. It worked out well for Japan. Kudos to you for admitting your glaring mistake re Scotland v Denmark. The difference is that most coaches in most other countries, equate their mandated national playing style as conducive to successful results. Netherlands, France, Spain, Germany, Belgium, Croatia, Portugal come to mind. That scribe is erudite because he evaluates plausible rationale that addresses the issue - Scotland's repeated failure to qualify for WCs. He didn't allude to ridiculous stuff like some arguing Scottish are genetically inferior, and mentally incapable of working as a team, that were reasons proffered by some, also in the scribe's article - which he dismisses as implausible. I do as well. Other arguments used, were that kids were playing computer games rather than street football in Scotland. This extrapolated to other countries in Europe 12 years ago. KNVB staff coaches and Dutch Tech Dirs in Aus, were elucidating this in 2011. It was a problem all over Europe. Any coaches who repudiated the Football Aus mandated new methodology and holistic national system, have had the game of football pass them by. Frank Farina comes to mind. Those coaches unwilling to change no longer coach professionally. Comparatively, when Netherlands failed to qualify for the 2018 WC, the KNVB commissioned Ed Ten Kate, to immediately conduct a review of their curriculum, and to identify shortfalls in the players they were producing. ETK immediately went to France and Germany, to observe how they were having more success from 2015 - 18, than Netherlands. Netherlands had just come third in the Brazil 2014 WC too. Things change very fast in football. Don't get me wrong. The current Scottish national team is the best they have had for decades ATM. It still isn't good enough though. Despite them finishing close to Denmark in the group, they were easily beaten by Ukraine in the sudden death knock out fixture. Have the Scottish FA sent staff coaches and TDs to observe football methodology in Denmark, Croatia, Uruguay, Portugal, and visited the Tech Depts of their national football federations - all with similar size populations to Scotland, and who regularly qualify for WCs? It turned around quickly for Netherlands by doing it. I get that as an Australian you find it difficult to accept but International football is not as important as you think it is. Scottish NT fans can accept it - maybe cos they never do anything at Euros or make WCUPs?! But it doesn’t mean Australian fans have to think it’s ‘not important’. try saying international football is not that important to Argentina fans while you’re at it 😂
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Decentric 2
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+x+x+x+xAfter rechecking the Denmark/Scotland UEFA WCQs for 2022 WC in Qatar results, I've made an error. I stated that Denmark beat Scotland 2-0 both home and away in those WCQs. They didn't . Each time Denmark and Scotland played each other, the home team won 2-0. The difference was Denmark beat Austria and Israel away. Conversely, Scotland drew with both when they played them away. I've researched quite a few articles written on Scotland's 6 successive failures to qualify for the last 6 World Cups. They qualified for the last Euros - for the first time in a long time. One erudite scribe wrote,it has been suggested within the boffins of the football community, that Scotland hasn't sufficiently adapted to the modern game played abroad. I discovered that the Scottish FA employed a Dutch Tech Dir to rewrite and overhaul the Scottish football curriculum. This is all well and good, but it could be a case like Harry Redknapp in England, repudiating past English Football Assoc Tech Dir, Dan Ashworth, as having nothing to offer. I'm not sure how much Scottish club coaches are adapting their revamped curriculum? They most likely aren't. Those coaches jobs are dependent on the only truly important stat in a football game. That is winning. No club in the SPL will adopt a system just because the SFA has a curriculum. So a scribe is erudite because he agrees with your opinion? Years ago, when Japan was trying to improve their football standards they sent their youth to Brazil, not the Neverlands. It worked out well for Japan. Kudos to you for admitting your glaring mistake re Scotland v Denmark. The difference is that most coaches in most other countries, equate their mandated national playing style as conducive to successful results. Netherlands, France, Spain, Germany, Belgium, Croatia, Portugal come to mind. That scribe is erudite because he evaluates plausible rationale that addresses the issue - Scotland's repeated failure to qualify for WCs. He didn't allude to ridiculous stuff like some arguing Scottish are genetically inferior, and mentally incapable of working as a team, that were reasons proffered by some, also in the scribe's article - which he dismisses as implausible. I do as well. Other arguments used, were that kids were playing computer games rather than street football in Scotland. This extrapolated to other countries in Europe 12 years ago. KNVB staff coaches and Dutch Tech Dirs in Aus, were elucidating this in 2011. It was a problem all over Europe. Any coaches who repudiated the Football Aus mandated new methodology and holistic national system, have had the game of football pass them by. Frank Farina comes to mind. Those coaches unwilling to change no longer coach professionally. Comparatively, when Netherlands failed to qualify for the 2018 WC, the KNVB commissioned Ed Ten Kate, to immediately conduct a review of their curriculum, and to identify shortfalls in the players they were producing. ETK immediately went to France and Germany, to observe how they were having more success from 2015 - 18, than Netherlands. Netherlands had just come third in the Brazil 2014 WC too. Things change very fast in football. Don't get me wrong. The current Scottish national team is the best they have had for decades ATM. It still isn't good enough though. Despite them finishing close to Denmark in the group, they were easily beaten by Ukraine in the sudden death knock out fixture. Have the Scottish FA sent staff coaches and TDs to observe football methodology in Denmark, Croatia, Uruguay, Portugal, and visited the Tech Depts of their national football federations - all with similar size populations to Scotland, and who regularly qualify for WCs? It turned around quickly for Netherlands by doing it. I get that as an Australian you find it difficult to accept but International football is not as important as you think it is. The antithetical view to this, is that if one wants to live in a football backwater, with a tenuous connection to contemporary football practices in the international football milieu, residing in a country that never qualifies for any Continental Championships or World Cups, apart from the last 2020 Euro Champs, it is a defence mechanism to mask one's own national team's perennial failure over 25 years. Most of Scotland's parochial focus in the big international tournaments must be on Socceroo games played in WCs, or Asian Cups, because of the numbers of Aussie players who play club football in Scotland. International football is the pinnacle in football. Elite club football is like watching rich oil sheiks, American tycoons and Russian oligarchs play each other. Money buys success in club football. Teams like Senegal, Morocco, Croatia and Argentina, are too poor to buy international success. They've succeeded in the last World Cup - despite being relatively poor, or having modest national wealth. Long give international football!
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grazorblade
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One interesting fact, the Australia v Uruguay 2005 match had 338 completed passes in normal time by my count (any official stats to cross check this?)
While the individual players were at a much higher technical quality, it is the same style as the modern spl outside the glasgow giants, league 1 and league 2 today and the first few years of the A league.
At the 2006 world cup, we got a bit more progressive after a training camp, but still not as much as even under pim where we averaged around 700 passes per game.
We definitely needed to change, as every other nation did but scotland. It was a painful and difficult change and I don't think we would have changed unless the a league era and the ntc occurs with clean air. It has made it possible to compete at a high level even if we haven't achieved the same club heights as individuals as the generation born in the 70s. So some very good things came out of all the mess of dumping our history
Having said that, what a HUGE cost to throw out our history the way we have and have such a divided football nation. I'm glad we are starting to see records include the nsl era and I was glad to see the ashes trophy found again.
Forgive me for going slightly off topic, but I'm really hoping the nst and eventual p&r heals old wounds. My oma and opa growing up made a little replica germany in their house. Some friends had a little italy, a little greece, a little pakistan. That is just what Australia is. Yeah there are problems, but doesn't anyone else get a bit of green and gold malaria about our multiculturalism? Patriotism is usually associated with monoethnicity, in Australia though, that is not the only strand of patriotism and that is something rare and beautiful about us. Here is hoping some "ethnic club" one day wins the asian champions league after being promoted from the nst. I'll get the green and gold malaria just as strongly as when wsw did
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grazorblade
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Back on topic, passes per game is not the only way the SPL is an outlier. Dribbles per 90 using sofa sore data also has the SPL as noticeably different in style to the a league and the leagues we ultimately want players to end up in
SPL 10.8
A league 16.6
EPL 14.4
Bundesliga 15.6
La Liga 16.1
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socceroos_rsdg
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+xBack on topic, passes per game is not the only way the SPL is an outlier. Dribbles per 90 using sofa sore data also has the SPL as noticeably different in style to the a league and the leagues we ultimately want players to end up in SPL 10.8 A league 16.6 EPL 14.4 Bundesliga 15.6 La Liga 16.1 There's no need to analyze it, SPL is kick and run. Same as the English lower leagues. You need a UK passport to get there, hence it's a shit development league. Thats the main reason why we don't develop players! you need a euro/UK passport to make it! not because of some stupid curriculum some guy who wasn't even successful in football dreamt up about what playing style was popular at the time. Only way Australia can get better is to have more then 11 professional teams so there's more opportunities to develop players.
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grazorblade
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+x+xBack on topic, passes per game is not the only way the SPL is an outlier. Dribbles per 90 using sofa sore data also has the SPL as noticeably different in style to the a league and the leagues we ultimately want players to end up in SPL 10.8 A league 16.6 EPL 14.4 Bundesliga 15.6 La Liga 16.1 There's no need to analyze it, SPL is kick and run. Same as the English lower leagues. You need a UK passport to get there, hence it's a shit development league. Thats the main reason why we don't develop players! you need a euro/UK passport to make it! not because of some stupid curriculum some guy who wasn't even successful in football dreamt up about what playing style was popular at the time. Only way Australia can get better is to have more then 11 professional teams so there's more opportunities to develop players. Well i agree with the last statement. But i think the training techniques have made a big difference
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Arthur
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I was in Scotland in 2016 and 2017, also met with Craig Brown and had a couple of hours talking with him about player development in Scotland. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_Brown_(footballer,_born_1940)To keep it brief he pointed out that the Scotland U16 team had to that time performed well usaully in the top 4 in Europe. Pointed out that the problem they face is the transition from youth to Senior Football, related to game time and lack of first team places due to cheap imports. Sounds familiar. From what I saw at Heart, Hibs, St Mirren, Motherwell, Raith to name some,their junior programs were pretty good, possession and technical based. The biggest advantage in Scotland is it's a scouted market, EPL and Championship Clubs have their scouts everywhere, even when touring sides like ours where there.
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