Joffa
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Quote:Fifty years of love and its lessons By Les Murray | 10 November 2009 The late 1950s have a lot to answer for. Like giving rise to a poppy field of new football clubs that have recently been celebrating their 50th anniversary, despite now lingering somewhat in the shadow of ‘new football’. I’ve been to a few of these in recent times, the latest being the celebration of South Melbourne FC’s half a century as a club. Held at the Crown Palladium, it was a glittering night in which emotion and nostalgia overbore the shimmer, the champagne and the long dresses. There were over 600 guests, most of them paying $220 for a seat. Former players, coaches, officials and undying fans came from everywhere, many from Greece and others from other corners of the world. One fan diverted his holiday voyage to Florida to be there. John Margaritis, an iconic former player and coach, flew in from Athens (and then was forced to speak on stage in Greek because he had forgotten most of his English, or so he claimed). Con Nestorides, whom you would now call a ‘marquee player’ if he came here as a 37-year old superstar, as he did in 1966, was hunted down in Athens and thrust in front of the video camera to send a goodwill message. Now 80, he looked sprightly, smiling and fit. Others not so youthful. One old timer, a source of vibrant spectacle when he played for the club in the early 1960s, was unable to negotiate the stairs to the stage to receive his award. He could have stayed at home but he chose to come, despite the cane and the debilitations, and many in the room were thrilled to see him again. Leo Anezakis, president of the club when it won its first national league title in 1984, a lovely and decent man, spoke to me about those times, how his sense of dedication to the club taxed him to the point where it nearly destroyed his business. More easily recognised men of a more modern era mingled in the room, embracing and exchanging regrets about not seeing each other more often: Peter Tsolakis, Ange Postecoglou, Mickey Petersen, Kimon Taliadoros, Paul Trimboli, Mehmet Durakovic, Con Boutsianis. Emotion filled the air and the night was thick with the powerful sense of bonding that football, and only the sense of belonging to a football club, can provide. The passion and loyalty for football, and for a football club, was everywhere in the room, so much so that one felt a wish to be able to bottle it and somehow transfuse it into ‘new football’. But of course that’s easier said than done. The A-League clubs don’t have this because for a start they don’t have 50 years of history but more importantly because, as one colleague put it to me, they are franchises not clubs. Still, there are lessons to be drawn for the franchises which, so far, have appeared to exist more for the directors and the investors than the fans, the complete reverse to what has been the case at South Melbourne FC for half a century. George Vassilopoulos, club president through the 1990s, made a stirring speech about loyalty, sacrifice, love and untiring dedication to a club and about giving something back to the fans. A modern chairman, one suspects, would only orate about money, the bottom line and the need to win trophies. Football clubs are primarily about people, something South Melbourne has not forgotten over 50 years but which the A-League, five years into its life, is yet to learn. http://www.theworldgame.com.au/blogs/lesmurray/fifty-years-of-love-and-its-lessons-255307
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RedEyeRob
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A great blog from Les.
"Leo Anezakis, president of the club when it won its first national league title in 1984, a lovely and decent man, spoke to me about those times, how his sense of dedication to the club taxed him to the point where it nearly destroyed his business."
I said this the other day on another thread, in today's age it's the other way around, it's the business taxing the clubs. I have a shit load of faith in the FFA and i do trust that they are looking at these clubs and their future involvement with the game. I have a good feeling that Lowy's masterplan will include them somewhere once the game has properly established itself. Where else are we going to find clubs for the A2 League that Lowy talk's about?
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Smecar
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RedEyeRob wrote:A great blog from Les.
"Leo Anezakis, president of the club when it won its first national league title in 1984, a lovely and decent man, spoke to me about those times, how his sense of dedication to the club taxed him to the point where it nearly destroyed his business."
I said this the other day on another thread, in today's age it's the other way around, it's the business taxing the clubs. I have a shit load of faith in the FFA and i do trust that they are looking at these clubs and their future involvement with the game. I have a good feeling that Lowy's masterplan will include them somewhere once the game has properly established itself. Where else are we going to find clubs for the A2 League that Lowy talk's about?
note to take a look at Victorian Champions League junior thread, just another buffer for older clubs to never see the light of a national competition again
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Benjamin
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I suspect that the A2 league is smoke and mirrors. All talk to placate FIFA, etc, whilst the world cup bid is on. Be interesting to see if Lowy keeps talking about it if we don't win hosting rights for either tournament.
If the 'old' clubs want to play in a national comp again, the only way I can see them doing it is if they get their own sponsors, form their own competition, and operate separately from the FFA. A tall order and very unwise to try it without a lot of long term contracts in place before they start.
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RedEyeRob
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Benjamin wrote:I suspect that the A2 league is smoke and mirrors. All talk to placate FIFA, etc, whilst the world cup bid is on. Be interesting to see if Lowy keeps talking about it if we don't win hosting rights for either tournament. I hope you're wrong. Lowy i think has a lot of character so i'd be disappointed if he'd say that to appease FIFA and not want to follow through on it one day. Quote: If the 'old' clubs want to play in a national comp again, the only way I can see them doing it is if they get their own sponsors, form their own competition, and operate separately from the FFA. A tall order and very unwise to try it without a lot of long term contracts in place before they start.
I agree. I think it is up to these clubs to make something of it instead of waiting around. I guess it would be slightly similar to how the EPL started when those clubs 'broke away' from the then 1st Division league in an attempt to make a better league that would benefit all the lower leagues in England. Only difference was the EPL and the Football League had agreed to it all! The FFA don't want to know about it. There is no other governing body. What a monster task.
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Benjamin
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I hope I'm wrong too.
I also sincerely hope that the FFA take advantage of existing clubs if they do add a second division. I don't see they have any other option simply because there aren't enough parties interested in an A1 license, so I can't see where else they will get bids for an A2. Seriously, if 3 bids couldn't raise enough for West Sydney, Canberra couldn't raise enough, then why do people believe that a franchise bidding system will be able to find strong enough bids to support teams in 8-10 'new' territories?
A 'revamped' FFA (in other words, 'professionally') administered NSL-like competition, playing below and separate from the A-League, with a lower salary cap, loan arrangements with A-League sides, all providing more options for players, better scouting ops for A-League franchises, and - dare I say it, an environment in which clubs could prove their financial status and crowd control abilities prior to potential re-entry to the big time.
It's a dream - but dreams are fun.
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Forestman
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There will come a time when there is HAL 2 but it is way down the track. 5 year franchises just can't afford to think that far ahead. That's why they should be 20 year franchises instead. In time one hopes that the HAL clubs will develop the loyalty and bond in the club like the old NSL clubs.
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Benjamin
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To be fair Forestman, most of the old NSL clubs had a hardcore of support that stuck with them through thick and thin, but for the most part it made Gold Coast United look like a well supported club. There were only a few clubs that regularly managed reasonable crowds at the time. My problem has always been the way the clubs were disenfranchised rather than the fact that they were disenfranchised.
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Mahmoud Ahmadinejad
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Forestman wrote:There will come a time when there is HAL 2 but it is way down the track. 5 year franchises just can't afford to think that far ahead. That's why they should be 20 year franchises instead. In time one hopes that the HAL clubs will develop the loyalty and bond in the club like the old NSL clubs. Dear man from forest, This is the problem with the A-league and to some extent, it's fans. They constantly talk of 'franchises', as if it were some fast food chain. Football clubs should not be franchises nor should they be referred to using this term. You see, Football clubs are pillars of the community and to survive, they must have history, heritage, culture, community integration and so forth. The A-league 'franchises' as you refer to them, seem to have a problem connecting with the community and their fan base seems fragile. I would even compare their fan base to those who eat fast food, always changing their preferences, one day it's McDonalds, the next day KFC and so forth. I think the NSL clubs provide a stellar example for A-league clubs on how to successfully integrate within their local communities. South Melbourne during the NSL did indeed receive crowds akin to most A-league clubs; remember they achieved this with no marketing a budget of their own, let alone did the NSL have as much exposure as the A-league to the main stream media or a television rights package like the one that exists with Foxtel. If the A-league wants to succeed, I think they should look to lessons from the past. Regards, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad President, Islamic Republic of Iran
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Forestman
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Benjamin wrote:To be fair Forestman, most of the old NSL clubs had a hardcore of support that stuck with them through thick and thin, but for the most part it made Gold Coast United look like a well supported club. There were only a few clubs that regularly managed reasonable crowds at the time. My problem has always been the way the clubs were disenfranchised rather than the fact that they were disenfranchised. As you know I wasn't here when it happened. I probably would have had a problem with both if I was a supporter of the club;) !! I always believe that the club is a separate entity from its fans. 1.You will always get d1ckhead fans who riot, cause mayhem, in spite of repeated efforts by the club to control these misfits. They use the club as a vehicle to cause problems. I feel that these clubs were a victim of bad press exploiting the idiots who in the name of a club have committed these offences. 2.Boards and presidents like players and managers come and go. Sometimes a board harms the future prospect of a club and those that suffer are the future fans. Clubs should always be given a chance as they are a separate entity to those who act in its name. They won't be here tomorrow but the club will be. In essence if a club is helped by the FA to overcome its problems then that club will increase its support in the good times. Also there is nothing wrong with a foreign flag in a clubs emblem......look at AC Milan...they have a ST.George cross there as a remembrance and as a sign of respect for its founders who were English. I do have a problem when clubs are excluded for these purposes but I also want the HAL to succeed and then build a bridge with the past clubs and help them get on board the gravy train via a HAL2 provided they agree to behave themselves.;) ;)
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Benjamin
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100% on the money Forestman. 100%. As I've said, if a club fails, fair enough - it failed. If they lose and get relegated - fair enough. To be kicked out because someone doesn't like the look of you, thinks you have the wrong fans, etc. It's just wrong.
Possibly worth noting - for a long time there was often a big cross of St Andrew on display behind the bench area at Docklands for Victory games. Scottish club? Nooooo. Nay ethnics is thish game, mon.
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Benjamin
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Mahmoud Ahmadinejad wrote:Dear man from forest,
This is the problem with the A-league and to some extent, it's fans. They constantly talk of 'franchises', as if it were some fast food chain.
Football clubs should not be franchises nor should they be referred to using this term.
You see, Football clubs are pillars of the community and to survive, they must have history, heritage, culture, community integration and so forth.
The A-league 'franchises' as you refer to them, seem to have a problem connecting with the community and their fan base seems fragile. I would even compare their fan base to those who eat fast food, always changing their preferences, one day it's McDonalds, the next day KFC and so forth.
I think the NSL clubs provide a stellar example for A-league clubs on how to successfully integrate within their local communities.
South Melbourne during the NSL did indeed receive crowds akin to most A-league clubs; remember they achieved this with no marketing a budget of their own, let alone did the NSL have as much exposure as the A-league to the main stream media or a television rights package like the one that exists with Foxtel.
If the A-league wants to succeed, I think they should look to lessons from the past.
Regards, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad President, Islamic Republic of Iran Great words Mr President. If it wasn't against your religion I'd take you out for a few pints.
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RedEyeRob
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Benjamin wrote:I hope I'm wrong too.
I also sincerely hope that the FFA take advantage of existing clubs if they do add a second division. I don't see they have any other option simply because there aren't enough parties interested in an A1 license, so I can't see where else they will get bids for an A2. Seriously, if 3 bids couldn't raise enough for West Sydney, Canberra couldn't raise enough, then why do people believe that a franchise bidding system will be able to find strong enough bids to support teams in 8-10 'new' territories?
A 'revamped' FFA (in other words, 'professionally') administered NSL-like competition, playing below and separate from the A-League, with a lower salary cap, loan arrangements with A-League sides, all providing more options for players, better scouting ops for A-League franchises, and - dare I say it, an environment in which clubs could prove their financial status and crowd control abilities prior to potential re-entry to the big time.
It's a dream - but dreams are fun. Yep totally agree. I think that it would also open up career opportunities (mostly amateur/part-time; and to a lesser extent full-time) for electronic and print journalists, bloggers, social clubs, internet forums, aspiring commentators, presenters on Internet and community TV, and merchandise stores. It already happens now…there are several football only stores that sell player and supporter gear… they’re propping up everywhere in Adelaide. I’ve seen more of these than AFL exclusive stores. There’s also 1 football show that I know of on community television. Kosmina and Aloisi have their own Internet TV show FFS!! On the topic of dreaming, there is nothing better than driving home late on a Saturday night and flicking on the BBC radio. I love how their coverage of the EPL/Football League travels live right round the country. EPL, Championship and League 1. No game is too small. There’s commentators covering every game and you get nice 2 or 3 minute updates from these throughout the “main game” coverage. It gives such an impression of organisational excellence, unity and outright inspiration for the rest of the world.
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GazGoldCoast
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That Les Murray blog was very thought-provoking for a Gold Coast fan, I can tell you!
I posted this question on a Perth blog but no response, maybe you guys would know: has Frank Lowy ever promised that eventually the franchises will be handed over to the clubs? If not, I think he should, even if he puts a 10 or 15 years timeframe in place.
If clubs become self-determining and self-controlling, it will encourage a lot more sense of identity (particularly if there is a 2nd div league biting at our heels).
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Benjamin
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I'm not aware of Lowy making any comments for or against the handing over of licenses. I'd like him to follow the Crawford reports model and completely divorce the FFA from the running of the A-League, put it in the hands of it's own management and give the clubs a chance to influence things (rather than constantly bow to their masters at the FFA).
At the moment there's very little incentive for long term investment in stadia and facilities due to the 5 year licenses. As others have suggested, I'd say that once a franchise has 'survived' it's first 5 years intact, they should be given a 20 year license so that they can really plan for the future. Any new sides coming in can have 5 year 'trials' to prove themselves.
Edited by Benjamin: 12/11/2009 11:25:58 AM
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RedEyeRob
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Forestman wrote:Benjamin wrote:To be fair Forestman, most of the old NSL clubs had a hardcore of support that stuck with them through thick and thin, but for the most part it made Gold Coast United look like a well supported club. There were only a few clubs that regularly managed reasonable crowds at the time. My problem has always been the way the clubs were disenfranchised rather than the fact that they were disenfranchised. As you know I wasn't here when it happened. I probably would have had a problem with both if I was a supporter of the club;) !! I always believe that the club is a separate entity from its fans. 1.You will always get d1ckhead fans who riot, cause mayhem, in spite of repeated efforts by the club to control these misfits. They use the club as a vehicle to cause problems. I feel that these clubs were a victim of bad press exploiting the idiots who in the name of a club have committed these offences. 2.Boards and presidents like players and managers come and go. Sometimes a board harms the future prospect of a club and those that suffer are the future fans. Clubs should always be given a chance as they are a separate entity to those who act in its name. They won't be here tomorrow but the club will be. In essence if a club is helped by the FA to overcome its problems then that club will increase its support in the good times. Also there is nothing wrong with a foreign flag in a clubs emblem......look at AC Milan...they have a ST.George cross there as a remembrance and as a sign of respect for its founders who were English. I do have a problem when clubs are excluded for these purposes but I also want the HAL to succeed and then build a bridge with the past clubs and help them get on board the gravy train via a HAL2 provided they agree to behave themselves.;) ;) Here here =d>
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Forestman
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Mahmoud Ahmadinejad wrote:Forestman wrote:There will come a time when there is HAL 2 but it is way down the track. 5 year franchises just can't afford to think that far ahead. That's why they should be 20 year franchises instead. In time one hopes that the HAL clubs will develop the loyalty and bond in the club like the old NSL clubs. Dear man from forest, This is the problem with the A-league and to some extent, it's fans. They constantly talk of 'franchises', as if it were some fast food chain. Football clubs should not be franchises nor should they be referred to using this term. You see, Football clubs are pillars of the community and to survive, they must have history, heritage, culture, community integration and so forth. The A-league 'franchises' as you refer to them, seem to have a problem connecting with the community and their fan base seems fragile. I would even compare their fan base to those who eat fast food, always changing their preferences, one day it's McDonalds, the next day KFC and so forth. I think the NSL clubs provide a stellar example for A-league clubs on how to successfully integrate within their local communities. South Melbourne during the NSL did indeed receive crowds akin to most A-league clubs; remember they achieved this with no marketing a budget of their own, let alone did the NSL have as much exposure as the A-league to the main stream media or a television rights package like the one that exists with Foxtel. If the A-league wants to succeed, I think they should look to lessons from the past. Regards, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad President, Islamic Republic of Iran Thank you Mr. President. Anytime you are up for a cup of tea or coffee, please let me know.;)
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