It's been 5 pages since I posted this, think it's appropriate

The other barrier is to do away with being a mono ethnic club. Innability and often unwilling to open up to mainstream seems to be a major hurdle for the Croatia's and Hellas' of the world.

Then of course is the imported nationalistic and political violence.

If they can overcome these, no problem. We shall all wish them well.

But so far there little signs that there has been any progress since the NSL days.

The other barrier is to do away with being a mono ethnic club. Innability and often unwilling to open up to mainstream seems to be a major hurdle for the Croatia's and Hellas' of the world.

Then of course is the imported nationalistic and political violence.

If they can overcome these, no problem. We shall all wish them well.

But so far there little signs that there has been any progress since the NSL days.

it is not an assumption it is a FACT that the NSL had a violent Image, I have never said clubs come with a "violent tendencies" they are your words.



"..... but to naively suggest that despite clear historical evidence from the old NSL days, that we should blindly accept the violent consequences of reintroducing these teams."

"..........the logic is on my side and you should be ashamed of yourself labeling people who actually support non violence, (which by definition means a stance against OLD Soccer) as racist."

"......most people don't want ehtnic clubs because of the historical violence.."

These are quotes from you not descriptive but assertions, the use of the term "violent tendencies" by myself is legitimate in this case, as quotes show a bias towards ethnic heritage clubs as being " violent " that is absoluteley clear.

Of course feel free to retract those quotes.


I would never categorise all fans of all NSL clubs in this way-

You seem to be doing the opposite B4.

However you trying to rewrite history on 442 is delusional and misguided.

If you want a debate about the history of the NSL and the ASF and SA anytime. Even SMFC but that is not what this is arguement is about.
The majority here who believe the NSL had a violent image - unlike yourself don't need to defend the indefensible because the FACTS are clearly demonstrable.

You make it sound as if at every game in the NSL there was a riot, a fight or vandalism. The amount of "troubles" is grossly overstated and you know it.
[Edited by backfour: 20/4/2012 03:09:40 PM

The only barriers should be to forfil a set of economic and marketing criteria that is open, transparent and independant.

And allow no barriers for entry of mono ethnic clubs, right? :roll:

It's no coincidence that the pro ethnic club advocates are the mostly the ones wishing the downfall of the A-league.

I dont want the HAL to fail i want it to improve and the only way that will happen is if it becomes its own entity seperate from FFA.

I once flykicked a guy through a mesh fence in Adelaide because he spat on me.

I should have asked what ethnicity he was.

I think NSL die hards need to get over dishing out the racist tag every time someone disses their clubs. Given the dire state NSL until its demise can you blame us for being skeptical of ethnic centric influences? What you think are racial reasons for not wanting you apart of the A league are actually pragmatic, your clubs simply don't have enough supporters to be sustainable and Anglo or other ethnic people like myself don't want to support your clubs. It doesn't matter if they are Greek, Dutch, Chinese, Irish clubs etc those clubs don't represent me I want an AUSTRALIAN club to follow. We want a clubs that appeals to the masses rather than minorities.

I'm also quite sick of hearing about how great the ethnic contribution towards the game is. Isn't a simple thank you lets move on enough? You might have brought the game here (not entirely true..) but you didn't invent it and were more concerned with protecting/celebrating your ethnic roots than engaging the broader communities. There were successes and failures in old soccer and ultimately it failed and needed wholesale changes to give it a fighting chance. The A league isn't about ignoring the past it's about getting on with it and doing what's best for the code to grow and prosper.

Also I think the "us v them" thing is propagated as much by NSL die hards than new soccer fans. Old soccer think they are better than new soccer because they ran the game here for so long and therefore they are entitled to god status, while new fans are fakers and should go back to supporting bogan sports like league and AFL. As long as this attitude of one group being better than the rest persists there will never be reconciliation.

Both of you dodos should read past posts to get your answer, not fabricate one and then pat each other on the back.

Over the last 7 years or so of the a-league, there hasn't been much notable violence. Its not like at every game a riot breaks out. That's actually a pretty unanswerable and badly worded question, to be honest.

Edited by samb: 20/4/2012 03:08:05 PM

They refuse to answer this question because it doesn't suit the agenda.

So violence that occurs between ADL UTD vs MVFC and SFC vs MVFC and other known clashes in the HAL is ethnic,religious,state vs state or all of the above?lol because i dont know if you guy's havnt noticed but there is no ethnic teams in the A League!! so why is there still violence at the games still?

They refuse to answer this question because it doesn't suit the agenda.

So violence that occurs between ADL UTD vs MVFC and SFC vs MVFC and other known clashes in the HAL is ethnic,religious,state vs state or all of the above?lol because i dont know if you guy's havnt noticed but there is no ethnic teams in the A League!! so why is there still violence at the games still?

Which are teams such as......

Please point out a specific passage where I have denigrated the contribution of OLD SOCCER to the establishment and survival of the game.

Did I say you did? Did I not say "Those"?

You will not find one - I have great respect for it's contribution, but also am realistic enough to see it's problems.

I could make a list of what the problems of the NSL where, but the ethniciy debate is boring and crass.

You are now clutching at straws given the failings of your arguments and lack of substance in your position on this debate.

Now thats a laugh B4, once again my argument is simple, the FFA should have an a set of criteria that is open, transparent and an independant assesment of entry into the A-League.

What is wrong with that?

My support of HAL over OLD SOCCER is not a sign of disrespect - it's a vote for progress

Sorry your arguement for exclusion is one based on the assumption that clubs with ethnic heritage come with violent tendancies.