|
Feed_The_Brox
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 3.3K,
Visits: 0
|
i totally agree re the long preseason. but do football fans in Australia have the patience to support 30+ games when there is no pro/rel? you can probably say that CCM and Wellington are out of the running already and don't have a lot to play for. can you imagine another 30 games of going through the motions?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Bocca
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 1.1K,
Visits: 0
|
The 22 season option is not an option and won't happen. That leaves us with a 33 game season or some form of uneven fixture. Neither of those is ideal though. An uneven fixture for a couple of years is liveable, especially since going from 27-33 and then back to 26 (for fourteen teams) wouldn't work IMO. Ideally long term 16 teams and 30 games should be seen as optimal.
|
|
|
|
|
someguyjc
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.1K,
Visits: 0
|
+xThe 22 season option is not an option and won't happen. That leaves us with a 33 game season or some form of uneven fixture. Neither of those is ideal though. An uneven fixture for a couple of years is liveable, especially since going from 27-33 and then back to 26 (for fourteen teams) wouldn't work IMO. Ideally long term 16 teams and 30 games should be seen as optimal. I reckon they will go with an uneven fixture for a few seasons. I wouldn't be surprised if they also make some tweaks to the finals format and add a couple of games. I'm kinda in the anti-finals camp so I would rather see 33 games and first past the post. That will never ever happen here though.
|
|
|
|
|
paulc
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
Visits: 0
|
In regards to point of difference - you can’t use London’s EPL teams as vindication of having another HAL team within 2 km of the other two. There’s so much difference in population, football culture, competition for sponsors and other sports that this discussion should be dropped immediately.
In a resort somewhere
|
|
|
|
|
paulc
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
Visits: 0
|
@someguy Finals is an attractive proposition in all respects. Ticks more boxes than not. If everything else fails in the league there is one thing that won’t with the advent of more games and that is the quality will improve and the players / clubs become more battle hardened for international competition. Games become more entertaining because they will be more professional and there will better international competiveness and success. We should be playing 9 months of the year at least.
In a resort somewhere
|
|
|
|
|
bettega
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+xThe 22 season option is not an option and won't happen. That leaves us with a 33 game season or some form of uneven fixture. Neither of those is ideal though. An uneven fixture for a couple of years is liveable, especially since going from 27-33 and then back to 26 (for fourteen teams) wouldn't work IMO. Ideally long term 16 teams and 30 games should be seen as optimal. I reckon they will go with an uneven fixture for a few seasons. I wouldn't be surprised if they also make some tweaks to the finals format and add a couple of games. I'm kinda in the anti-finals camp so I would rather see 33 games and first past the post. That will never ever happen here though. You might be right, if 22 and 33 games are completely unacceptable, that leaves either sticking with the current 27 games (you play half the clubs 3 times), or maybe going to 26 games in anticipation of a future 14 club comp where we'll definitely go to 26 games. They'll be tempted by the 26 games because it means the Sydney and Melbourne teams will get an extra derby amongst the 3 clubs.
|
|
|
|
|
Feed_The_Brox
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 3.3K,
Visits: 0
|
+xI reckon they will go with an uneven fixture for a few seasons. I wouldn't be surprised if they also make some tweaks to the finals format and add a couple of games. i can forsee the McIntyre Final 8 system (as used by the AFL/NRL) adopted once we hit 14 teams. 26 games and 4 weeks of finals. moving to 30 games and 4 weeks of finals when we go to 16 teams. thats just about the optimum for mine.
|
|
|
|
|
P&R will fix it 2.0
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
+xIn regards to point of difference - you can’t use London’s EPL teams as vindication of having another HAL team within 2 km of the other two. There’s so much difference in population, football culture, competition for sponsors and other sports that this discussion should be dropped immediately. Yeah, there's no way Sydney United and Marconi could develop a rivalry
|
|
|
|
|
Bocca
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 1.1K,
Visits: 0
|
I don't mind a split competition something like this in the interim before getting to at least 14 teams. 22 Home and away season. Then split into two groups of six. The top 6 play each other once to fight for the Premiership and positions in finals (top four). The bottom 6 play each other once to fight for four spots in the FFA cup.
|
|
|
|
|
Waz
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 19K,
Visits: 0
|
Bizzarly Bocca that could work.
Although every club has to be entered in to the ffa Cup imo so maybe in your version the bottom 6 play off with the top 2 going into the R32 and the remaining 4 are drawn to play each other as part of the qualifying round.
|
|
|
|
|
bettega
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
+xBizzarly Bocca that could work. Although every club has to be entered in to the ffa Cup imo so maybe in your version the bottom 6 play off with the top 2 going into the R32 and the remaining 4 are drawn to play each other as part of the qualifying round. good compromise
|
|
|
|
|
primtech
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 172,
Visits: 0
|
Regarding number of rounds with a 12 team league, it wouldn't surprise me if we get a 22 round home and away season until we go to 14 teams at which point we go to a 26 round home and away season. It would depend massively on Fox Sports and any criteria around how many games min/max allowed in the contract.
Currently we have 135 regular season games + 5 finals games. A 12 team season of 22 rounds would get us 132 regular season games+ you could reintroduce home and away finals for the top 2 teams and an extra chance prelim final for loser of that series. You would end up with only 1 less game overall than what we have currently. Could put up with that for a season or two if it means a proper home and away draw.
|
|
|
|
|
crimsoncrusoe
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 6.9K,
Visits: 0
|
@Paulc
Lol lol lol...we cant because we are different.FFS
Have you any facts to support your paranoid opinions?....We are not different....we are inbred NRL and AFL wannabes thats all.
You can have teams close together and far apart.There are far more important issues than closeness to another team.
What is considered close to a Brisbane Roar or Adelaide United or Perth Glory ?Where they play their games?Where they train? Where the most fans come from?
If a new team thinks they have a point of distinction and can afford to fund a team ,then they should be allowed to play.All this exclusion nonsense is counterproductive.
Anyone should be able to start a new team anywhere.It's up to them to make it a success.
There is only one reason we have to put up with this nonsense and that is because we dont have a football pyramid.Protecting the elite clubs in the first tier cartel is the first priority.It shouldnt be.
|
|
|
|
|
Feed_The_Brox
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 3.3K,
Visits: 0
|
+xAlthough every club has to be entered in to the ffa Cup imo so maybe in your version the bottom 6 play off with the top 2 going into the R32 and the remaining 4 are drawn to play each other as part of the qualifying round. i don't mind that
|
|
|
|
|
Arthur
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 5.1K,
Visits: 0
|
If the Australian National First Division is about Football, about succeeding at an International Level and about respecting the Global Football Model then the answers are simple;
16 or 18 team National First Division Competition
16 or 18 team National Second Division Competition
Third Tier State Based competitions with a National Play off.
Boutique Stadiums.
That's all you need.
If its about the current owners somehow clawing back their loses then the above won't happen.
|
|
|
|
|
paladisious
|
|
Group: Moderators
Posts: 39K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts No they're not big enough on their own. If it was up to me there'd be a full pyramid with multiple large national divisions above state leagues with p/r throughout as Arthur posted above but there needs to be a method to insert new teams with new investment targeted at finding an audience somewhere in that pyramid. Nobody's investing in a 20k seat stadium for a team that has to start out in State League 5. Conflating Star Wars round with this topic doesn't help your argument as it has nothing to do with adding new teams, and only you would try and put a negative spin on Honda playing here.
|
|
|
|
|
P&R will fix it 2.0
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts Nobody's investing in a 20k seat stadium for a team that has to start out in State League 5. Good, they can chuck in to one of the A2 clubs looking to go up Promotion of the best A2 team is the method by which you insert new teams into A1. If you are for P&R that's how it will be
|
|
|
|
|
paladisious
|
|
Group: Moderators
Posts: 39K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts Nobody's investing in a 20k seat stadium for a team that has to start out in State League 5. Good, they can chuck in to one of the A2 clubs looking to go up Promotion of the best A2 team is the method by which you insert new teams into A1. If you are for P&R that's how it will be A2 would be ideal.
|
|
|
|
|
P&R will fix it 2.0
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts Conflating Star Wars round with this topic doesn't help your argument as it has nothing to do with adding new teams, and only you would try and put a negative spin on Honda playing here. You're the one trying to reach new audiences, And the FFA didn't pick Honda for his football skill or Star Wars because it wins Oscars
|
|
|
|
|
Barca4Life
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K,
Visits: 0
|
+xWhat @Barca4life said. Too much BS floating around and we’ve been choking in it for ten years. Let’s have a roadmap that gets us to a League with 34 regular season games. F’ck clean air and f’ck Fox complaining about the additional costs. Australia needs to aim for something where it can effect the bottom line in the global market. If the FFA want it to be a true football league, they need to do that by creating the parameters that will have world class players, coaches and football culture which is closely aligned to the world's best. If the FFA want it to be a monopoly that takes account to what Foxtel want and making into a big bash style of the tournament without making reference to the global market, then watch the national team in the future because they will have no hope of doing well. They stuck between a rock and a hard place and dont know where they should go where its obvious for all of us. Do they want the a-league to a true football league that will benefit the national team and the overall game in australia or a league that will only fit for the rich stakeholders with short term purposes?
|
|
|
|
|
P&R will fix it 2.0
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts Nobody's investing in a 20k seat stadium for a team that has to start out in State League 5. Good, they can chuck in to one of the A2 clubs looking to go up Promotion of the best A2 team is the method by which you insert new teams into A1. If you are for P&R that's how it will be A2 would be ideal. P&R firstThe right size for A1 and A2 will only then become apparent
|
|
|
|
|
Barca4Life
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K,
Visits: 0
|
+xIf the Australian National First Division is about Football, about succeeding at an International Level and about respecting the Global Football Model then the answers are simple;
16 or 18 team National First Division Competition
16 or 18 team National Second Division Competition
Third Tier State Based competitions with a National Play off.
Boutique Stadiums.
That's all you need.
If its about the current owners somehow clawing back their loses then the above won't happen.
Graham Arnold once said that the A-league is better than the Eredivisie, is this the message the national team should say when we are nowhere near close even comparing the overall structure to them let alone the overall standard? Let's do that if we want to be an ambitious football nation, otherwise what's the point of the media, coaches, players even talking it up as a potentially serious player when the structures don't even compare?
|
|
|
|
|
paladisious
|
|
Group: Moderators
Posts: 39K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts Nobody's investing in a 20k seat stadium for a team that has to start out in State League 5. Good, they can chuck in to one of the A2 clubs looking to go up Promotion of the best A2 team is the method by which you insert new teams into A1. If you are for P&R that's how it will be A2 would be ideal. P&R firstThe right size for A1 and A2 will only then become apparent How? You'd need an idea of how many teams go up and down, or just have some go up and none down for a couple of years until the right mix is discovered, but I can't see how one ahead of the other matters that much when both need to be done. As the most played sport in the country and with plenty of imports available (including the possibility of cheap ones from within our Confederation) I can't see the issue in expanding both vertically and horizontally at the earliest opportunity.
|
|
|
|
|
paladisious
|
|
Group: Moderators
Posts: 39K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts Conflating Star Wars round with this topic doesn't help your argument as it has nothing to do with adding new teams, and only you would try and put a negative spin on Honda playing here. You're the one trying to reach new audiences, And the FFA didn't pick Honda for his football skill or Star Wars because it wins Oscars If you're tying to say Victory didn't sign Honda for his undeniable skill then you are having an absolute laugh. Exactly the kind of player we should all want to see on our shores. If you can't see the need to grow the amount of audiences that come to games and how that is absolutely necessary for more teams in an expanded pyramid then I just can't help you. Am still unclear what the Star Wars round has to do with any of this, it wasn't part of my point and I'm not trying to defend it.
|
|
|
|
|
P&R will fix it 2.0
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts Nobody's investing in a 20k seat stadium for a team that has to start out in State League 5. Good, they can chuck in to one of the A2 clubs looking to go up Promotion of the best A2 team is the method by which you insert new teams into A1. If you are for P&R that's how it will be A2 would be ideal. P&R firstThe right size for A1 and A2 will only then become apparent How? You'd need an idea of how many teams go up and down, or just have some go up and none down for a couple of years until the right mix is discovered, but I can't see how one ahead of the other matters that much when both need to be done. As the most played sport in the country and with plenty of imports available (including the possibility of cheap ones from within our Confederation) I can't see the issue in expanding both vertically and horizontally at the earliest opportunity. start with 1 Up 1 down then if it's sensible 2 up 2 down If you then find the conditions are ripe for expansion have 3 up , 1 down for a season If it makes sense to contract you have 3 down 1 up (or as the EPL did 4 down 2 up) The important thing is to have P&R established and the risks/rewards generating interest and rewarding effort No-one knows how big it will get, if or when, but P&R supplies the expansion or contraction in a fair and understood way All Expansion does right now is create 2 more mid-table teams and finish the bottom-end teams season even earlier The new audience will be gone as quick as they arrived
|
|
|
|
|
P&R will fix it 2.0
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts Conflating Star Wars round with this topic doesn't help your argument as it has nothing to do with adding new teams, and only you would try and put a negative spin on Honda playing here. You're the one trying to reach new audiences, And the FFA didn't pick Honda for his football skill or Star Wars because it wins Oscars If you're tying to say Victory didn't sign Honda for his undeniable skill then you are having an absolute laugh. Exactly the kind of player we should all want to see on our shores. I didn't mention Victory at all, but I'm sure they're loving having someone else pay for a valuable player taking points off everyone else in the Balanced League. Show me evidence he's making a noticeable impact anywhere except on Victory's points tally and I'll listen
|
|
|
|
|
P&R will fix it 2.0
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts Conflating Star Wars round with this topic doesn't help your argument as it has nothing to do with adding new teams, and only you would try and put a negative spin on Honda playing here. You're the one trying to reach new audiences, And the FFA didn't pick Honda for his football skill or Star Wars because it wins Oscars If you can't see the need to grow the amount of audiences that come to games and how that is absolutely necessary for more teams in an expanded pyramid then I just can't help you..
I'm not obsessed by 'Growth' on it's own
Make football fair to all and I believe it will grow properly, substantially and permanently.
Just like everywhere else in the World.
|
|
|
|
|
P&R will fix it 2.0
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAFL basically has 10 teams playing out of two stadiums in the central business district, go figure, they must be wrong, RIGHT? But of course there must be latent football support sitting in Tarniet and Dandenong not interested in Victory and City, because well, ITS TOO FAR to travel. Theres just tens of thousands of them just waiting for a stadium to be built, so they can support the A-league! That's all its going to take. And there must not be any differentiation between South Melbourne, Victory and City because they will play within kilometres of one another! So this thinking is along the lines of territorial Franchise exclusivity. Everything is the same so don't put them to close together. Spread them out like MacDonalds Stores. Give them an exclusive territory like MacDonalds Stores. Serve up the same menu like MacDonalds Stores. Same packaging as MacDonalds Stores. Hopefully one day we as a sport might decide to structure our Club Football like they do in Germany or France or Spain or most of Europe rather than a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL models. What we all already knew and what was proven with the failure of Heart and the success of WSW is that any new team in a large city that already has a team must have a point of difference. There is more than one way to achieve this point of difference, and both South Melbourne with their history and identity and Team11 and Western Melbourne with their geography are valid answers to this question. Yes all Melbourne AFL teams play centrally. We are not the AFL. We must find that point of difference with new teams when they are introduced regardless of whatever "plastic franchise" or fair dinkum pyramid system exists. There was plenty of social difference between suburbs like Collingwood and Carlton when these teams formed their identities in the latter half of the 1800s, and even though the geography is no longer relevant with the growth of the city rendering most teams' home suburbs as gentrified inner-city postcodes the social and demographic identification absolutely is relevant, wherever their fans are based in Melbourne today. The best question to ask is what those point of differences are now, and for the fastest growing big city in the developed world where will those differences be in 10, 25, 50 or 100 years? The point is this; Do we as a sport want a Football Culture that is based on the Global Football Standard or based on a model based on the USA-MLS or the AUS-AFL-NRL? I feel I acknowledged that point in saying that a point of difference for new teams being added is desirable regardless of whichever model is in place. If we went full pyramid tomorrow we'd still need new teams formed with new investment reaching new audiences to make the most of it, in addition to the fine job current NPL teams are doing. No you wouldn't. Not knowing who the new teams will be makes EVERYONE interested. EVERY A2 club is now the new audience instantly and ongoing No need for Wookies and Japanese language replica shirts Conflating Star Wars round with this topic doesn't help your argument as it has nothing to do with adding new teams, and only you would try and put a negative spin on Honda playing here. You're the one trying to reach new audiences, And the FFA didn't pick Honda for his football skill or Star Wars because it wins Oscars Am still unclear what the Star Wars round has to do with any of this, it wasn't part of my point and I'm not trying to defend it. FFA hired both Honda and Chewbacca for new audiences, targeting some missing ' segment' , no other reason.
|
|
|
|
|
P&R will fix it 2.0
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
Back to the Bullshit Reality Show Dharawal FC? Budding A-League club could assume Indigenous identity
If Southern Expansion wins the race for an A-League licence on December 12, Australian sport could have its first club representative of an indigenous nation. The Dharawal country is set to heavily influence the identity of the football club and could even be included in the name of the franchise, should it be granted entry into the competition. Based in the Sutherland Shire and drawing support from St George and Illawarra regions, the bid's catchment area is almost identical to the boundaries of the Dharawal nation. That hasn’t gone unnoticed by Southern Expansion’s directors who have already engaged a marketing firm to establish their colours, logo and brand in anticipation of being awarded an A-League licence. It's understood Dharawal community elders have already been consulted with over images and names that could be respectfully used for the club.https://www.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/dharawal-fc-budding-a-league-club-could-assume-indigenous-identity-20181128-p50izb.html
|
|
|
|
|
P&R will fix it 2.0
|
|
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.8K,
Visits: 0
|
If you thought Vuvuzelas were bad
|
|
|
|