That's what I've learned from the last six months, and the last three games have borne that out. Grella has been comfortably ensconced as the worst player consistently starting for us, while Moore's lack of top-level match practice has been damningly obvious against even middling international-quality strikers.

This performance against the USA pretty much solidified my opinion and my worst fears - that Grella is shit, and an unnecessary risk in a position of strength in depth, yet will start regardless, and probably get sent off or put our defence under pressure in other ways, like tonight - and that Moore's complete lack of pace and his turning circle like a Mack truck will get found out by strikers with any sort of pace and mobility, of which the teams in our group have plenty.

We have better players with more match fitness in better form than these two players. Please, Pim, don't start them*.





*Even though, since you have no imagination or plan B whatsoever, they will start, and I knowe they will.

I tend to agree but I would put Moore in

MOORE has been comfortably ensconced as the worst player consistently starting for us

Moore has been awful, but Grella has been the true liability of this team - other players have covered for Moore's mistakes, but Grella has nearly gotten himself sent off in every warmup match, and has been responsible for conceding possession so poorly at times that no defenders have had time to cover (and not only for the first goal vs. USA)

Thats what shits me most - EVERYONE is covering for Moore.

His return for the WC was selfish in that it robbed us (pim) of trialing competent replacements (sasha Ogenovski ect...) Pim just locked him in cause the team loved him and he was "experienced".

True Grella has been dangerouse. We have a shite load of midfielders.

Perhaps keep Culina as the Defending Midfielder and bring some one else on for more holding/attacking position?

Should change the title to


"Grella & Moore: Liabilities Who Cannot Start Against Germany but will"

Anyone who knows a jot about football could see that these two were outrageously out of their depth to the point where it stood out - why not put Valeri/Jedinak for Grella, or any old donkey/Beauchamp in for Moore? Couldn't do any worse...

+1

Grella is playing like shite, but will start, the team that has started the last 2 fixtures will probably start against Germany (was about to type Japan)... Moore too and Beauchamp should start (wouldn't of dreamed of saying that a month ago) he's just a liability with his pace and his positioning it's time this horse be put out to pasture (a manny quote from Black Books)


Moore out Beauchamp in
Grella out Valeri in (showed alot of vision with his passing recently and is capable of doing the hard work but maybe not aswell as Grella is capable of)

I think everyone but Pim thinks beauchamp & valeri should be brought in for Grella & Moore but on the other hand most people also understand Pim isnt one to drastically change his line-up. I really hope he steps up and removes the underperforming players but my hopes arent high.

Moore would not be so bad if he had a decent covering midfielder. Likewise Grella if the back 4 were more solid. Grella is more exposed though and needs to step up.

i think craig moore and vince grella must have nude pictures or a sex tape of pim verbeek and are using it to blackmail him.

otherwise why else would a human being play those 2?

Edited by beersandwich: 6/6/2010 08:15:45 AM

The USA game was the perfect opportunity to test a Valeri/Jedinak combo in the centre of midfield. Culina should have been pushed to the right in place of Richard Garcia and Beachamp should have started in the back four.

Wasted oppurtunity IMO.

Some sobering stats stolen from TWGF - and I know stats don't tell the whole story - but...



With Grella 2008-2009
260308 China 0-0 Australia
010608 Australia 1-0 Iraq
070608 Iraq 1-0 Australia
190808 Australia 2-2 South Africa
110209 Japan 0-0 Australia
060609 Qatar 0-0 Australia
170609 Australia 2-1 Japan
050909 South Korea 3-1 Australia
101009 Australia 0-0 Netherlands

Without Grella 2008 and 2009 ("Best available" A-squads only)060208 Australia 3-0 Qatar
140608 Qatar 1-3 Australia
060908 Netherlands 1-2 Australia
100908 Uzbekistan 0-1 Australia
151008 Australia 4-0 Qatar
191108 Bahrain 0-1 Australia
010409 Australia 2-0 Uzbekistan
100609 Australia 2-0 Bahrain
120809 Ireland 0-3 Australia
141009 Australia 1-0 Oman
181109 Oman 1-2 Australia

2010 World Cup Preparation
Start vs New-Zealand
Substituted at half-time (Score: 0-1)
Full-time (Score: 2-1)

Start vs Denmark
Substituted at 70 min (Score: 0-0)
Full-time (Score: 1-0)

Start vs USA
Full game (Score: 1-3)

2W 5D 2L with, 11W 0D 0L without :oops:

I agree Grella should be dropped, for Valeri. But I'd play Moore against Germany. I'd drop Garcia for Vidosic. I'd even think about starting Ruka for Kennedy.

Wow.

that is a damming statistic... maybe abit more open defensivley but fuck that really does say something

Right on the money. both have been awful. Unfortunately, Grella will start and i think Moore will start the first two games, costing us the first and nearly costing us the second befor Pim sees sense and puts beauchamp in.

=d> =d> =d>

interesting stats . would cahill read about the same? since grella and cahill are part of the epl and both are considered automatic 1st team choices over the last few years.
probably not since cahill has been injured.

though its interesting pulling up stats like this you just got to remember that grella has come under a lot of scrutiny as of late. I do at times wonder if he's actually bringing anything to the team currently from the last few starts he has made and if he is capable of producing quality for a whole game. Its a teams sport and to put the blame on grella on all those less than stellar results are unfair. I totally understand that the post was made that it doesn't give you the full story but these are stats politicians are good at mis-using :P




Edited by Bryan: 6/6/2010 07:42:47 PM

Amazing stats.

On a positive note those stats do suggest we are a good chance of at least a draw.

Maybe Grella and Moore will get red carded when Germany thrash 9 men Australia. Then we can play other players for the two matches we need to get results in.

Im really not happy with Moore playing but in his defense, he was happy to retire from international football years ago when he wasnt up to playing in the prem anymore. He probably thought that Beachamp would do ok in Bundsleiga or equivilant. (and with Milligan doing ok in France or similar, patrick doing ok in champions league, North doing better etc etc) The truth is that none of these players have stepped up. The fact that patrick was our first choice to partner Neil and he plays in the third tier. A couple of years ago I thought we would have Neil still defending against Torres/Rooney/insert any of your favourite prem strikers not defending against the best in Turkey (no offense to their comp). And probably Beachamp playing in Germany. If these guys were playing better Moore wouldnt have been asked back and wouldnt be needed.

I think Valeri is a good player (playing better than Grella at the momment) but at nearly 26 its time he stepped up to Serie A or similar. He doesnt need to go back to Inter and be in their starting XI but at least a little better than Serie B.

(sorry if this makes no sense. Again I have forgotten my rule to only post here when sober)

Moore is a bit slow, but OK. Grella is a liability though, I agree with that.

That's probably the understatement of the cup s_r

It's unacceptable at this level that other players have to cover for you. Moore has no place in the national side and players like Bosnar and Ognenovski if nothing else are at least PHYSICALLY up to the task, and just as technically apt.

Grella has no place in the team either, he has been turned into a hatchet by Allardyce and when the one thing we don't have a problem is, is midfielders, there's no reason for him to be there. He's basically in the squad for the same reason Moore is. You could have Culina, Valeri, Carle (yeah, coming from ME, preferring Carle to Grella. Never thought I'd say that.), Jedinak, even Musialik would be better.