Whole comp.

The odds of some day playing pro football are long.

The odds of needing a 9 to 5 job to pay the rent are short.

I'm completely at ease with that.

I don't have too much patience to argue sockah theory with inexperienced tossers.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I like it!!! Maybe if I get Frankie Farina to do some private coaching for him at a few hundred bucks an hour he may get into the NYL side by the time he is 15.

pay for him to be a coached for 3 years and then have 1 on 1 coaching 8 weeks before trials , the same coach that is a selector will find it hard to say no to someone he has coached. Alot of selection is based on what they were like 3 years ago and coach doesnt want to change his mind as promises have been made.

one of the few kids i have seen that could have made it at euro academy 3 years ago is now a nuffin player but still selected.

Congratulations.

It takes a big person to admit this.

The majority of 442 forum would agree with you.

Depends on the football insight of fathers.

As Aussiesrus says, some fathers have insight into football.

According to Aussie, Rogic was overlooked as a triallist in programs.

I'm certainly a fan of the FFA NC, but, like most, I'm not aware of all the selection processes and people conducting them across the country within FFA. Few are. Mistakes are often made. In this state, we still have a belief amongst too many coaches that players must be of a certain physical stature to play rep football.

Cahill was also overlooked for rep teams at trials. He was told he was too small.

Any advise or views please (sydney based) - I'm sure many know the changes for PL then Elite 1 and 2.
Jnrs (12's to 15's) haven't got a state comp therefore the clubs omitted still will form squads and enter the local comps (nothing wrong with that imo) and nuture the kids for 16's and their future.
Does anyone have info and comments positive/negatives on clubs like Gladesville Magic/Northbridge etcetc....

I'm not actually coaching him as such, just had a lot to do with teaching him football, whether via advice or watching on TV (an invaluable tool I might add - not enough kids watch the game). I'm coaching his 6 a side team atm, but this is the first and last time.

3 or 4 across the whole comp or just in their side???

haha I'm somewhere between 2 & 3. I didn't realise I came across as such a dick when being 2 so will try much harder to be 3.

Edited by neverwozza: 22/11/2012 04:03:21 PM

Hmmm I THINK I HAVE A SOLUTION!!

Bear with me here...

We all know talent is a nuisence and their parents don't pay the bills.

What needs to be done is open the selections to the highest bidders.

The end result is clubs get mega rich and buy themselves into A-League. Then the highest bidders in A-League get selected for Socceroo duty.

FFA get mega rich and buy FIFA officials which in turn buys Australia the world cup.

No more financial worries for clubs, No more selection headaches and useless trials. No more worrying about tiny gate takings. Atmosphere's can be replaced by loudspeakers with crowd tapes and a DJ pushing the ahhh and oooh button. And of course a button for the ref abuse. No more pressure for players to perform.

See the solution is simple really...

Judy,

Your under some delusion kids listen to their parents. Don't have kids of your own?

Despite my best efforts just sometimes they have find out for themselves. As much as I hated wasting my time as I knew his outcome 30 years ago, as a parent we just support our kids. No matter if it was ping pong or thumb twiddling. That's what parents do. Weird eh...

thupercoach,

Consistency can only come with playing higher level. The more you coach him the less he will appeal to other coaches. Get him in somewhere ASAP.

All this is moot really. The Sth African lads are taking over. Big tall strong lads with loads of street skill and no birth certificates. A coaches dream come true.



Edited by Aussiesrus: 22/11/2012 03:21:03 PM

I think I've written this before, but here goes again;

In elite junior/youth sport there are three categories of parents.

1) crazed whining sideline stalkers who hate the coach and speak negatively about everybody

2) fanatics who outwardly love the coach and shout loudly about the fact at any opportunity

3) laid back realists who watch and enjoy from afar

Categories 1 and 2 trade places regularly over the course of a season. Category 3 is a smallish group who, if in the system long enough, can become contaminated.

In short, elite junior/youth sport is a veritabe shitfight. Always will be, regardless of which sport or the location. Put it down to human nature. At the end of the day if you can't stand the heat then get outa the kitchen. And, may I suggest that every so often look at yourself in the mirror and make an honest assessment of your own role as a supposed supporting parent.

Yes, agree, my arrogance is obvious.

No other way around it if people want to hear the cold, hard and sobering reality (sans a 5,000 word essay).

The real sad part about all this? When these crazed parents (90% are at least borderline yet not conscious of it) kids hit mid 20's or early 30's they'll look back at their youth (when they were highly influenced by parents) and wonder WTF was that all about and for what reason?

Sockah is a sport. To be enjoyed. Parents need to remind themselves that it is their kid's independent leisure time, not theirs. It's not a pathway to riches, fame or indeed a way of life. Any bragging rights that parents feel they've earnt via their kids (apparent) success is short-lived.





Edited by judy free: 22/11/2012 11:34:59 AM

Couple of "cliche" comments JF...I hope not directed over my way though I expect your reply to say in general.
It sure does have some merit from observations be it in any sport but its not my dream FYI.
I'm just giving my kid the opportunity at His want and its up to him to make it or break it as I advise him, walk off knowing you have put in 110% thats all you can do.

I call BS that in selections the first 10-12 are the obvious stand outs - 1-3 are questionable imo here and there no doubt about it....
Ofcourse the fringe parents would whinge, thats in every sport we can all agree here, matching trackys etc LOL yes they should all STFU !
Your arrogance JF is understandable probably having been vented by the many whinging parent over the years I would feel the same but there IS us honest and good ones who know our kids limitations, I can't stand getting involved I keep away most times the opposite sideline people watching, it sure is humourous and sad at times.

I know the process ATB, intimately.

At the end of the day 95% of the whinging and whining comes from parents of fringe players.

And another free tip; if a kid isn't among the top 3 or 4 players in top tier youth league then parents would be infinitely better off channeling their enthusiasm into their kid's education. Unfortunately that rarely happens.

As a father you have two options:

a) drop kid off at trials and return later for pickup

b) join the sideline stalkers and watch, note and rate the quality of your kid's every move and convince yourself he's a shoo-in

And a tip; I always negatively scored any kid who pitched up with his dad in matching tracksuits.

Been reading with a bit of interest for a couple of reasons.

1) Football-wise, is it better to cull the whole system and start from scratch? It's been suggested that we need to get rid of the state teams and open up "elite coaching" to a greater number of kids. Would that widen or shrink the pool of talent? And are we likely to produce more Rogic's and Antonises or fewer as a result?

I understand about parent politics and it's a blight on ALL sports in this country. How do you suggest we get rid of/minimise it?

2) I may be about to dive into the rep thing in about 12 months. My 11 y/o has good talent though isn't consistent enough - almost unplayable one week and "back to the pack" the next. Which is why I am keeping him out of reps for another 12 months until he finds that measure of consistency. If he doesn't I won't bother with reps - I am not married to the idea and my ego isn't tied into his football, though I've had a lot to do with developing him as a player of course. I don't care if he becomes a great footballer or not, just want to see his abilities developed and him play to his potential, and for him to enjoy the game.

As someone who's never had anything to do with the youth rep scene, what should my expectations be? (not of him but of the process)

Damn gimme one of those cubans and i'll crack open a nicely aged tawny and pass you a glass.

Club A might well have no room due to an overload of talent. Club B, C and D might not be so fortunate. Same results at the end of the day. Too many duds shaking hands and too much truly talented walking the plank. This is the wrong part.

The first 10-12 are usually developed by the club inwhich their selection is convaluted by earlier processes. When you speak of the 3,4,5 plus last 2 players the higher you go the more the decision is made for the coaches. These figures appear high in the political effects which you must admit is a huge reduction of spaces for talent.

Anyway when I talk of talent. I mean the truly talented from a neutral perspective looking at ALL the players at the trials. Not the ones who fail year after year after year. For these parents the penny does drop eventually and they send their kids to train snails at snail races or they take up tic tac toe which suits their abilities better.

I think your basing your views on selection processes you have experienced at one possibly two clubs ONLY. You need to get around and see what is happening at most other clubs trials to get a better idea of what most people are complaining about.

I think you will change your views once you see the bigger picture.

Edited by Aussiesrus: 22/11/2012 08:05:58 AM

Club B, C, D..........

The cubans are on me.

Behind every "overlooked talent" is a father who has watched his kids talent and dreams burnt. When I say talent. I mean the truly talented. Not the ones who fail year after year after year. Kapish?

Your close but no cigar.

Edited by Aussiesrus: 22/11/2012 07:26:15 AM

But nonetheless they are fathere of kids who are CONSTANTLY being overlooked by numerous coaches, year after year after year. Penny drop, much? Fathers are generally rotten judges of their kid's true ability.

As for political selections? That's life. Happens in all sports and business. That said, my experiences have repeatedly shown that any political selections have entirely been with the 15th or 16th squad member i.e. fringe players. The first 10 or 12 are the easy selections. The selection of the remaining 3, 4 or 5 is where the coach has to work to earn his beer money.

As I've always consistantly said, if you don't like the selection process at club A then go elsewhere. But at some stage you need to face up to life's realities.

Not harsh, just don't see the value in perpetuating a suburban myth.

Behind nearly every "overlooked talent" is a father who's had his dreams burnt.

Not doing their kids any life favours by playing the eternal blame game.

Here it comes :-({|=

Edited by Aussiesrus: 22/11/2012 07:17:08 AM

Judy,

That's the way. Give it to these clueless dads. None of them have ever played football and are all blind at the trials.

Never mind the informed highly skilled football selectors that unthankfully give up their time from their busy daytime jobs as potatoe farmers or toilet cleaners at woolies or the morbidly obese couch potatoe coaches that struggle to put down their 5 pizza's and 3 garlic bread dinners. The ethnic coaches that can't say no to his relatives but knows "no" in english. The coach who respects the sponsors kids. The coach who knows who pays his coaching wages. The coaches pub drinking buddies. The coach who forks out 50k to have the job because his coaching skills amount to zip.

These are the people who give up their time to make these informed football selections that are developing the youth and shaping the future of top tier football in this country. Let's all crack a tinnie and celebrate their contributions for without them we couldn't have failed so miserably!!

Han Berger is right in one respect. The people and coaches making these decisions are generally poorly skilled or convaluted in the art of talent identification. Han won't make that mistake when his redraft is put together. Should extend his tenure by a few mill.

I've seen trials where in half a game the unsigned triallists flogged the signed side by 8-0. And yep they completely culled the 8-0 in half a game winning side. I've seen too many outstanding players culled and duds shaking hands at the end of the trials for my liking over the years. If that doesn't tell a person there is something seriously wrong nothing does.

Having said that though there are some (very few) TD's and coaches I agree with and highly respect their decisions. These are very few and far between. We need more like them and less like the above.

In a nutshell there are too many side issues and most political affecting the selection process. I do not know how these issues can resolved but until it does the cream will have such limitations in their opportunities that most just simply give up. This is also reflected in NSWPL spectator numbers. 2-3 hundred people attend these matches and are mostly relatives of players because the general public know of the issues and refuse to pay to watch the duds play. The general public would rather save the entry fee and go watch the local park football and spend their hard earned on a snag roll and coffee. Even the local park clubs get bigger attendances than NSWPL first grade matches.

Not all dads have never played football or are blind at trials and enjoy highly skilled jobs as tomato farmers, cleaners and coach potatoe's.

Some dads actually know what they are talking about and the general public can't ALL be wrong ;)

Edited by Aussiesrus: 22/11/2012 06:41:01 AM

Can't comment on it as I have no kids, never around the situation with trials etc.

No need to be harsh though - We're all going on about the lack of pathways for kids and the troubles with getting kids selected. It seems everyone has lost notice of the fact that talent identification is a skill unto itself, why do you think scouts for big clubs get paid big bucks?

You see, cream ALWAYS rises to the top.

But in truth 90% of these "mistakenly ovelooked" comments are made by clueless dads who refuse to accept thier kid's own genuine lack of talent. Even if rejected by multiple coaches and selectors over many years.

Totally sucks but
Don't despair I know of a few players that over the years have been mistakenly overlooked they went back to club had great seasons and came back a few years later better than ever.

Edited by krones3: 21/11/2012 07:33:05 PM

Edited by krones3: 21/11/2012 07:33:34 PM

+1 Aussiesrus....
It pains me to agree on this, like you having seen this in my youth some 30yrs ago as well I see this again and worse imo. Started 2 seasons ago with my 2nd son.
I was just at a Trial last night for he, watching from the sideline another Father I know had mentioned of a Trial attended some 2wks ago I couldn't be there, he pointed out this solid moving forward cutting through the defense had shown great glimpe's at this prior Trial and was staggered he wasn't included/picked, out 1st culling.
Having watched him most of the night - he sure scored some goals but held the ball too long at times, this probably worked against him but could be coached out him at only 12 turning 13 next year.
I asked were the other forward options much better ? only a few but not worthy of being out so soon.

Another hurdle - my boy having played for a current PL club last 2seasons, new youth coach comes in for 2013 and the Trials were hardly open to anyone, I'm advised he brought over some 7-9 players from the area he came from and before we parents knew it Teams had been picked closed shop full stop a month or so back.
That meant none of last seasons Div1 boys had a chance at all...yer loving youth football not !

Edited by M.L.: 21/11/2012 06:28:13 PM