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Mighty Mariners
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The only one of the three i would have taken is Carle.
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afromanGT
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Chipperfield doesn't have the pace to be a serious threat and I'd hardly say that Basel face top class opposition on a regular basis.
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Vaughn2111
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Covo wrote:but at the end of the day had a simple scoring opportunity and didn't attack it - that volley showed a lack of confidence more than anything else Volleying home at the back stick isn't that easy, not only with the timing of the ball but the angle as well. 2 options as a striker, give the volley everything you've got or try to use the pace of the ball and guide it in. At the range Macdonald was at he chose the right option, it just didn't come off for him.
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Covo
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Putting it out there. Only form goal scorer in a 1st division Euro league atm is none other than Chippers. Would love to see Pim loose him up the field to score a winner at the death.
Feel sorry for McDonald, but at the end of the day, even though he has been played out of position, he's had guilt-edged chances to score and failed several times. New Zealand game was a perfect example. Worked spaces and held the ball well considering his stature - but at the end of the day had a simple scoring opportunity and didn't attack it - that volley showed a lack of confidence more than anything else...how many times has Kennedy just stepped up and nodded the same type of ball home? In position or not if he's not taking those chances then he's a liability compared to someone who does.
Plan B atm might be a Kennedy/Rukya combo?
Agree it would have been nice to see Pim to force tactical changes. The players seem to get more attacking and press higher when falling behind but I'm not sure I'd count on that being enough to force a game if we go down a goal in the main event. Heres hoping we never get in that situation.
Good luck boys!
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afromanGT
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Quote:The fact that half of NZ players came from the A League and did a good job against the Socceroos shows that Pim's approach to Oz Soccer is basically flawed. five of their squad came from NZ State League. Another eight players came from the A-League. That's either a poor reflection on the aussies that they couldn't beat a domestic based side, a terrible reflection on Pim's tactics for the same reason, or a woeful reflection on Pim's philosophy regarding aussie players. Quote:Simple:
-----------Macca---Kennedy-------------
Kewell----------Cahill------------Bresh
---------------Valeri------------------
Wilky------Neill----Williams---Emmo
----------------Schwarz----------------
Perhaps Culina for Wilky. And not happy with Beauchamp, but who else? I was impressed with what we saw from Valeri when he was on the pitch and Williams rocked socks and played some very neat football against Japan when we played them last year. Wilky is far more useful at left back than in the midfield, Chipperfield is going to get done for pace every single time. Given that we nolonger have the luxury of Macca up front I'd probably be playing Culina in the midfield in a 4-2-3-1 formation...but again, still not ideal when we're just lofting the ball at Kennedy. Kennedy's big, but he doesn't have the physical strength to hold back players.
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Joffa
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Quote:Boro striker dumped from World Cup squad 11:17am Wednesday 26th May 2010 * Print * Email * Share * Comments(0) * Photograph of the Author * By Scott Wilson » MIDDLESBROUGH striker Scott McDonald has been surprisingly axed from Australia’s latest provisional World Cup squad. McDonald was one of three players released yesterday after coach Pim Verbeek reduced his 31-man squad to 28 in the wake of a 2-1 friendly win over New Zealand. The Boro forward failed to find the target in Australia’s opening World Cup warm-up game, extending his barren international run to 16 matches in the process. And while Verbeek showed considerable faith in him during the Asian round of qualifiers, he finally decided to wield the axe just 19 days before Australia play their opening World Cup fixture against Germany in Durban. The news will come as a bitter blow to McDonald, who had been expected to start all three of the Socceroos’ group games. Instead, Verbeek has opted to go with just two out-andout strikers – Josh Kennedy and Nikita Rukavytsya – supplemented by former Leeds and Liverpool attacker Harry Kewell. “Scotty is a typical twostriker player, and that’s also where he feels happy,” said the Australia boss. “But we don’t play with two strikers. We play with one striker up top and wingers, so Scotty doesn’t fit in this system. He knows it, and he tried everything.” McDonald’s departure leaves two Boro players battling for a place in Australia’s final 23-man squad, goalkeeper Brad Jones and defendercum- midfielder Rhys Williams. Williams was not involved against New Zealand, but Jones was a second-half replacement for Reading goalkeeper Adam Federici as Australia came from behind to record a 2-1 win. Federici had been at fault for New Zealand’s opener, and Jones’ strong showing has enhanced his chances of being the number one replacement for established first choice Mark Schwarzer. Jones was not the only Boro player putting in an effective night’s work in Melbourne, as striker Chris Killen scored New Zealand’s goal in the 16th minute and also hit a post. The All Whites striker pulled away to the back post to break the deadlock, and clattered the woodwork with a volley moments later. Killen, due to become a free agent at the end of next month, is expected to retain his place in New Zealand’s starting line up when they play their next warm-up game against Serbia on Saturday. “Chris Killen is a good finisher and, in combination with Shane Smeltz, we have seen what he can do in and around the box,” said New Zealand boss Rikki Herbert. http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/sport/8185751.Boro_striker_dumped_from_World_Cup_squad/?ref=rss
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Vaughn2111
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imnofreak wrote:He held it up very well.
A player with his skills and calibre should be on the plane 100%. especially with guys like vido and ruka running off him in the later stages of the game. however in saying this it is possible for JK to nod down the ball for them as well
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imnofreak
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He held it up very well, especially in the second half.
I don't care whether he fits the system perfectly or not. A player with his skills and calibre should be on the plane
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Tyson_85
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imnofreak wrote:Tyson_85 wrote:I think the point with Pim is that he isn't looking for goals from the front man, it's the mid field players coming on and off what ever the target man can provide to them that Pim hopes that goals will come from. Well if he doesn't want goals from the front man, why all the fuss about Macca not scoring? He provides more opportunites for others than JK does. Exactly, I actually thought he was pretty good on Monday night considering how shit hte midfield were he actually held the abll up well.
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imnofreak
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Shar wrote:Just a different perspective here: At least now if we get spanked at the WC, we will have 2 fan faves with clean hands to come back into the squad under the new coach to inspire the team to glory @ the Asian Cup 6 months later. Getting dropped from the squad could be a blessing in disguise for them.
Edited by Shar: 26/5/2010 01:27:54 PM I hope the new coach picks Macca for the AC and he fires us to glory!
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Shar
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Just a different perspective here: At least now if we get spanked at the WC, we will have 2 fan faves with clean hands to come back into the squad under the new coach to inspire the team to glory @ the Asian Cup 6 months later. Getting dropped from the squad could be a blessing in disguise for them.
Edited by Shar: 26/5/2010 01:27:54 PM
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imnofreak
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Tyson_85 wrote:I think the point with Pim is that he isn't looking for goals from the front man, it's the mid field players coming on and off what ever the target man can provide to them that Pim hopes that goals will come from. Well if he doesn't want goals from the front man, why all the fuss about Macca not scoring? He provides more opportunites for others than JK does.
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Carso87
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imnofreak wrote:
I agree our defence is fragile, but you know the saying - The best form of defence is attack!
This is true to a point. And I still don't think Macca is the answer here either. For him to really work, we really need a striker more in the Viduka mould playing alongside him. I don't think Jesus cuts it on that front.
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Tyson_85
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I think the point with Pim is that he isn't looking for goals from the front man, it's the mid field players coming on and off what ever the target man can provide to them that Pim hopes that goals will come from.
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imnofreak
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I wholeheartedly agree on the Kewell point. He is a waste up front. He is no better at the lone striker role than Macca! If Pim starts him up front on his own it will be laughable.
I agree our defence is fragile, but you know the saying - The best form of defence is attack!
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SackMerrickPlease
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It is just frustrating! I think Pim did a great job to qualify us for the WC. But that was 9 months ago and at that point I was hopeful he would try something different. Why does he persist with a system that does not suit the players at hand? It got us results against a bunch of average Asian countries (although a little lucky at times). But seriously how will we score goals in the WC when all the opposing teams have solid, tall and strong defenders. If we go down a goal what will he do? Last world cup we had options on the bench and players in preferred positions. There is only one way I can see Aus progressing and this is it.
1. Germany Pump Serbia and Ghana,
2. Aus draw 0-0 with everyone,
3. Ghana and Serbia Draw,
T-W-D-L-GD-P--
G-2-1-0-+3-7--
A-0-3-0-+0-3--
S-0-2-1--1-2--
Gh-0-2-1--2-2
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Carso87
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imnofreak wrote:John 3:16 wrote:Carso, one problem with your Bresc, Kewell and Cahill midfield is that Kewell is listed by Pim as a striker. I agree with you that he should be in midfield, and that allows for another striker in the squad.
Let's not forget that the only game we have ever won at a World Cup was with Kennedy, Aloisi and Cahill all coming on as subs. We need the option of more strikers. +1. We dont have the quality at the back to hold out big teams. We need goals. I honestly think our biggest issue currently is up front. I admit our defense is not as good as it needs to be, but beyond maybe Macca, we don't have a world class striker in our squad, and any option we choose is going to be sub-par. It's unfortunate if Kewell get's played up front, I believe he is a much, much better player coming in off the left (or he certainly used to be, I haven't seen as much of him at Gala as I would like, and don't know what position he plays there). With any combination of the likely midfield trios that will be on the park, Macca would be a bit of a waste really. Jesus will be better in almost any situation, as any of the midfielders will happily pick up a ball he nods down for them. The only benefit we would get from Macca is having the potential to go with the 4-4-2, pairing him and Jesus up front. But then who would we leave out in the midfield? In my opinion, our defense is too frail to not have the 4 at the back in addition to the 2 holding midfielders.
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imnofreak
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John 3:16 wrote:Carso, one problem with your Bresc, Kewell and Cahill midfield is that Kewell is listed by Pim as a striker. I agree with you that he should be in midfield, and that allows for another striker in the squad.
Let's not forget that the only game we have ever won at a World Cup was with Kennedy, Aloisi and Cahill all coming on as subs. We need the option of more strikers. +1. We dont have the quality at the back to hold out big teams. We need goals.
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John 3:16
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Carso, one problem with your Bresc, Kewell and Cahill midfield is that Kewell is listed by Pim as a striker. I agree with you that he should be in midfield, and that allows for another striker in the squad.
Let's not forget that the only game we have ever won at a World Cup was with Kennedy, Aloisi and Cahill all coming on as subs. We need the option of more strikers.
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imnofreak
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Quote: I would prefer the latter, especially when you consider Bresc, Kewell and Cahill through there. Where do you find room for the 3 of them with a 4-4-2? Simple: -----------Macca---Kennedy------------- Kewell----------Cahill------------Bresh ---------------Wilkshire------------------ Chippers------Neill----Beauchamp?---Emmo ----------------Schwarz---------------- Perhaps Culina for Wilky. And not happy with Beauchamp, but who else?
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BackFour
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WTF - with this negativity.
PIM has the score on the board - Qualified for WC, and ASIAN Cup.
Beaten Holland, Ireland and Nigeria, under his watch - not just Asian also rans.
So you guys need to suck it up.
Carle out of form so is dumped as many other players from many teams around the world have, and will also mis the world cup. Holman has improved over the last 2 years, CARLE has not and is out of form, just bad luck.
Macka - is a plan B option, but I'm sure Cahill, Kewell and also be used as "poachers" with Kennedy in 4-4-2 "Plan B" formation, and are far more versatile players than Macka, who in all fairness has had plenty of opportunities.
So very little support far any of the negativity here, if things are looked at sensibly and logically.
Edited by backfour: 26/5/2010 11:32:52 AM
Edited by backfour: 26/5/2010 11:33:57 AM
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Carso87
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I don't know. I think Pim is copping a lot more flak here than he really should be.
Sure, we haven't exactly been great in qualifying, but he has gotten us through, with the best defensive record of any team in the World Cup Qualifiers. A lot of that is on the back of Schwarz, I know, but if you have a keeper that is THAT good, good for the team.
I am a little sad to see Macca not make it, as I think he is a real asset to the team. Unfortunately, he really doesn't fit in at the moment, as good as he is, as we don't have the sort of striker that can play alongside him (I honestly don't know the Kennedy is the man).
In addition to this, our squad is very strong across the midfield, and not so strong in the strikers. Would any of you rather us play 2 strikers, one being slightly sub-par, and 4 in the midfield, or keep all our top midfielders in, and play 5 through there and 1 striker? I know personally, I would prefer the latter, especially when you consider Bresc, Kewell and Cahill through there. Where do you find room for the 3 of them with a 4-4-2?
The other two guys, I have no argument against being cut. Carle is a player I really liked in the A-League, but he is just playing a role that other players in the team do better, and more consistently. We really aren't short on creative players in the midfield. And why should he go over Holman? There is a reason Holman plays for one of the top teams in the Eredivisie. His off ball movement is superb, he works as hard as anyone on the pitch, and generally has good vision and touch. I think we saw a lot of that the other night, yet so many of you still persist in bashing him? Whatever.
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funkybluesman
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Seriously, what's with all these people talking about Carle like he's some super amazing player when he can barely get a game in a team struggling to avoid relegation in English lower divisions. It's not like he's carving up the premier league like Kewell was doing as an 18 year old.
Pim has done a remarkable job bringing together a team he usually gets together 1-2 days before each game played. Give them 3 weeks in camp and just see the difference.
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leftrightout
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If anyone has read interviews with Pim he likes players that can adapt. Players that are multi-faceted and can play more then one position. As a coach players that can only play one position is a wasted sub (unless their brilliant). If you can reshuffle a line up with the players on the park that is a good advantage to have as a manager.
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Ecce
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Pim admitted he trained them too hard before the NZ game, so it explains why they were flat, especially the ones who didn't play regularly.
The aim in the World Cup build up is to get them as fit as possible before June 13. That was how Guus played it too. He said that we had to make up for lack of skill with fitness. Last World Cup these guys were superfit by that stage.
Pim's got his system and has chosen his players for it. So everything is still okay as far as I am concerned. I'm glad to see Holman score a goal and the chip by Valeri leading up to it was lovely to see.
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catbert
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Dropping Carle and North is fair enough, but dropping McDonald? Just because he doesn't fit into the system, is preposterous.
They should keep him, so that if we are down against opponents at the world cup, we can bring him on with Kennedy or Kewell.
The fact that he is dropping him because of his position, shows that Pim has no plan B.
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eyesman
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The fact that half of NZ players came from the A League and did a good job against the Socceroos shows that Pim's approach to Oz Soccer is basically flawed. But he's achieved results and the next guy won't be allowed by the FFA to trash the A League. Guus has been given legend status when he was only a mercenary! Let's wait - he will be judged by results...not his choice of players.
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coco84
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no heart. no spark. in 05-06 we were full steam ahead. so much passion and willingness to play. everyone felt this.
this time around but, all politics. not much buzz, and the flame is out. i dont see the team being confident heading into the tournament. i just feel that alot of players this time around are out there on their own, and the dynamics...well, what dynamics? the tactics and style of play has been static since the very beginning of the qualifying stages. there hasnt been a game that i recall that has had the "wow" factor...and yes, i know that being conservative is key to pims plans, but if the guys dont decide to say "fuck this guys, lets bust some skulls and shut people up" then we arent going to get very far.
we need to see our players step up and shake the opposition. intimidate em, take charge and own the ball as if it was your life. "give me the ball you kraut, and your lunch money". we need to be bullies and fight, not take it lying down and be intimidated in the first half, and hope that on the 75th kinute, the opposition gets tired and we can score. it doesnt work like that, unless that shining team quality and morale boost we saw against japan in 06 comes to play.
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afromanGT
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Probably better off putting Wilkshire at LB, Vidosic on the right wing and Emerton at RB.
Pim can't get his head around the concept of multiple strikers on the pitch in one game, that's never going to happen.
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ronald0
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I can see Verbeek playing this formation (assuming everyone is fit):
Kewell
Bresciano Emerton
Cahill
Grella Culina
Chipperfield Neill Moore Wilkshire
Schwarzer
This gives him the option of using Kennedy and Rukavytsya if we are chasing the game (I actually think Pim might surprise us by using more than one striker if we find ourselves in that situation)
I also realise that Kewell isn't a natural forward, but he has played comfortably there before in the past.
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