At my workplace our official start time is 7am. We have a bell that goes at 6:57am that means "get to your stations" and then a 7am "start work" bell. Smoko bell rings at 9am, and we have 15minute smoko. At 9:12am a "get back to your stations" bell, then 9:15am "start work bell". A bell at 12md for lunch, 12:27 for get back, 12:30 for start work. Bell at 3:30 for home time. Note: we don't have a bell that says "3 minutes until your break". 

So yeah, some places really do care about the micro-minutes. 

Not sure why business should compensate you for missing out on family time.  Should businesses pay compensation for students missing out on study time?  Should business pay new fathers for missing out on baby time? 

Absolutely.  Our taxes are so competitive at the moment, we are seriously losing ground quickly.  Every other country is cutting tax to attract investment, meanwhile we persist with the delusion because we're 'Australia' we are somehow immune from tax competitiveness.  

One of these things is not like the other.

Well if we drop tax rates, then going after muli-nationals that pay 0 tax should happen at the same time if not before as a pre-cursor.

-PB

We operate 'normal business hours' (between 7am and 6pm) and charge penalty rates outside these hours and weekends.

My director explained that our staff are contracted to normal business hours and legally we are entitled to penalties for having to work outside these hours. I do not know how these changes will affect people who don't work shift work like myself.

It "only" affects retail and hospitality staff. I say "only" because that's a huge portion of the workforce many of which are going to have less money to spend. Awesome fillip for the economy that's already growing very slowly!

What a terrible decision by the government.

They are going to have less money to spend, however there are currently lots of people who have no income other than centrelink who may soon find themselves with a job, particularly in regional areas where jobs for retail and hospitality workers are sparse. Isnt that a good thing for the budget and the economy? Jobs n all?

Implying that businesses will put more people on simply because they have more money. Trickle down economics has been disproven time and time again by almost every group with half a brain cell between them.

Rocks in peoples heads. I swear.

Trickle down economics hasnt been disproven. Only fucking retards who dont understand economics say stupid shit like "twickle down economics has been dispwoven time and time again hur durrr" because they think it makes them sound egdy and intellgient. If twickle down economics then why is just about country cutting corporate tax? Business obvious want to expand their revenue base and they need money to do that, only cynical assholes reason that all they will do is pocket the extra cash. Thankfully Fair Work understood the greater economic argument and made a rational decision rather than reaching for the Socialist Alliance manifesto.

Classy.

1. They only pay corporate tax on profits. If businesses want to spend money to improve their revenue base they can do so without penalty.
2. Competing on tax rate alone is a race to the bottom which we can't possibly win. There are other reasons for multinationals to setup here
3. Abetz stacked the fair work commission so it's not surprising they came to this conclusion.

So small businesses only have a small number of staff on a Sunday anyway. Let's say the savings from this decision mean they can afford to put 2 extra people on a Sunday (that's a generous scenario already). How does that unemployed person now getting 1 shift per week suddenly solve un/underemployment?

It's also funny that the people who say "working a Sunday is no different to any other day" coincidentally work jobs that mean they personally never have to work one.

Mcjules, its not difficult.

If a company is paying out less on wages, it can invest more in growth
We will lose if our tax rates remain uncompetitive. Companies will look to invest in low tax burden countries where they can maximise profits and shareholder interest. Cant be too complacent.

People are seriously delusional if they think businesses are suddenly going to be putting on more staff each sunday thanks to the savings from the penalty rates, they'll just pocket the cash and operate as normal. 

I'll be down $50 to $80 each week now, a real kick in the teeth. Thankfully I don't live pay check to pay check but it still hurts. So many people already out there struggling to make ends meet, this won't be good for the economy. 

Invest in what growth? We will "lose" what?

As for companies in low tax burden countries they are already doing that now and paying no tax here.

-PB

Not in any diminishing how silly these cuts are, but super LOL at the ALP trotting out a bloke called Trent who works at coles who says he will lose $109 a week from these new changes.

Coles staff are employed under an enterprise agreement and wont lose a cent.

Awkward. The ALP were probably so eager to inflict maximum emotional rage within the voting public that they forgot to check who these changes actually affect :laugh:

Why the fuck are the media still giving Onion Abbott air time lol?

-PB

I studied economics and business for 4 years at university.  This "retard" has a far greater understanding of it than most.  It has been around since the 19th century and has never truly caught on as the money simply is hoarded by the rich or goes off shore, with income distribution remaining stagnant and in some cases decreasing.  It has also been known to cause a number of near economic disasters, especially in the early years.  Reagan tried it and failed, with his own treasurer turning on his policies.  Even the Pope, the leader of one of the richest, most corrupt and hierarchical organisations on the planet has denounced it (http://w2.vatican.va/content/francesco/en/apost_exhortations/documents/papa-francesco_esortazione-ap_20131124_evangelii-gaudium.html#No_to_an_economy_of_exclusion).  It helps nobody but the rich and the politicians sucking up to them.  

Here is some light reading for you, something which i have done extensively.  I would also suggest any economics textbook you can lay your hands on.  Even the ones in high school taught us that it was bullshit.
http://www.levyinstitute.org/pubs/pn_15_4.pdf
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/12/business/12scene.html
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/jul/21/offshore-wealth-global-economy-tax-havens
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/1982/02/04/recession-economics/

Bone headed to the extreme. He was a SDA delegate too who are the ones that fucked all those Coles workers with that EBA too.

100% this is me. I am not attempting to hide from the hypocrisy of my beliefs either, I know too well I'm giving an opinion that realistically doesn't involve me (until I want my bacon&egg roll on a Sunday morning). 

far out!

Sounds awful...and just so robotic. 

the fact they get you to go to your station 3 minutes before work starts is just diabolical. sounds like a kindergarten. 

You should be compensated for working weekends alright. 

Penalty rates are important. Otherwise, no incentive for the workers. 

The guys in the workshop honestly need it, to some degree. The blue collar mentality at this place is diabolical - give an inch, take a mile. You treat them too nicely, they exploit it. You treat them like robots, they hate the administration. There's no winning - they'll just keep exploiting whatever petty little thing they can.

What I will say about the 3 minute bell is not many people are overly responsive to it, unless the big boss is within eyeshot :lol:

Also, we have to remember they aren't scrapping penalty rates completely, merely reducing them.  That 25% saved can hardly cover many extra employees, particularly in small businesses with only 3 or 4 workers to begin with.

See, when I heard about the cull of penalty rates I assumed the uproar (mostly from millenials, tbf) was because they were completely scrapped. The fact that it is a reduction makes me think it is even less of a problem.

My favourite insight into these penalty rates came from the Betoota Advocate:



http://www.betootaadvocate.com/uncategorized/penalty-rates-collingwood-barista-forced-to-scrap-3-x-mdma-caps-from-weekly-budget/

To be honest that's how a lot of places used to be, Post Offices especially.

-PB

I don't think it will matter to the average voter but this is not a government decision. The FWC are independent and do not consult the government before making decisions.
In saying that, I think this is a great outcome and the FWC has taken too long (3 years) to come to this decision. One of the big issues facing a lot of families in retail and hospitality is underemployment and this decision by the FWC will go someway to helping reduce the rate of underemployment.
When my wife and I were saving for our wedding, she struggled to get enough hours to work. She worked in retail and would basically get 1 or 2 days unless someone called in sick. On Sunday, the store she was at would close at 3pm and so would most of the shops in the area.
Sydney city is basically a ghost town on public holidays and Sunday. I'm looking forward to my favourite Brewery being open on my birthday next year which falls on the Easter long week end.

@pv4, Wish we had that type of accountability in our office, plenty of people regularly rocking up at 9:05, 9:10, grabbing a coffee, making some breakfast and and then starting their day. 

Frustrating af when I'm the one opening up the office in the morning and managing to start at the time we're meant to.