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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]Also $5.5 billion for the cancelled submarine contacts. Crickets. Might be repeating myself here but at $800 billion debt at just 2% (don't know the actual rate) interest thats $43 million dollars a day in interest. $1.8 million an hour, every hour of every day. Anything in the papers? Nope. I can remember when labour were $150 billion in debt and they never shut up about it. When they talk about media bias they should at least recognise that it swings both ways. Labor didn't have a world wide pandemic that's dragging into its fourth year. The media- even the Labor friends at Fairfax and the ABC- know that reporting on the debt will not interest the public. For a start, the public got lots a free money. Right so how is this any different from the GFC when Rudd doled out free money here, there and everywhere? Biggest financial crisis since the depression but that didn't matter apparently. The media never shut up about it. In fact they still bang on about it. The frustrating thing is ppl don't care. Some moron said to me the other day the line of 'Liberals know how to manage money'. He couldn't name one policy that increased society's wealth or living standards, and moronically listed labor ones. In the end, he shrugged his shoulders and said 'well, they're all as bad as each other. That's what the country is dealing with - people who at the end of the day don't actually have an idea or stance, no matter what they try to pretend. They just piss with the wind. This economic success has been under the coalition, and for 20 of the last 26 years. Don't tell me you believe it was all down Labor's 6 years in office? ha ha what, dig every natural resource, sell your national assets and squander 90% of it? A grade six could manage that Awesome handling there.
And yet Labor couldn't be trusted to do it by the Australian public for 20 out of 26 years.
Look around you. Most of what you own and enjoy has happened under the coalition.
Like universitiy education, Medicare, intervening to save national treasures from development…
thanks LNP!
It was Labor's Dawkins that brought in HECS in 1988/89. It was Gillard that created the policy that has led to the $300,000 degree.
My parents remember a time before Medicare ie Medibank They say it was better-they paid their premiums and they got to their doctors within a reasonable time-real surgeons rather than the kids in training clocking up the hours and the botched work in the public hospitals Medicare gives you today, unless you have a benevolent surgeon on hand.
Not sure what "national treasures" you mean?
So now you're anti medicare?
HECs is/was fair enough when it started back years ago when it was a nominal amount. My HECS debt was about $12k when I finished. It's becoming a way more serious debt burden now for young people particularly in lower paid degree qualified jobs like engineering, nursing, science, veterinary science, physios etc.
Not sure why you don't up and move to America where your profits-before-people, trickle-down economic theories and lack of empathy towards your fellow man is more aligned with your principles.
Medicare should be a safety net, not a free for all. You think Medicare is some jewell in the crown? Go and compare the surgical outcomes of public hospitals and those of private surgeons. You get what you pay for.
HECS was never fair. Its more of a burden now because Gillard said to the Uni's: charge what you want for as many places as you want. Leading to expensive degrees, over-supply of graduates, declining standards and lower paid professional degrees like the ones you mention.
Why would I move when I have a government that has aligned with my principles for most of work life. You're the one who doesn't like that. You leave.
Medicare should be a free for all. Private health insurance shouldn't exist or if it does then there shouldn't be perverse cross subsidisation and 'incentives' for higher earing peoples to be forced into it. Why should I pay 4 times the medicare levy/tax amount and then be forced to take out private health insurance instead of being able to be treated at a quality public hospital with quality facilities and doctors? Ridiculous. Raise taxes or the medicare levy and stop forcing people into private health. If it's that good then it should be able to stand on it's own 2 feet.
Full fee degrees became a thing when University funding was drastically cut forcing universities to charge higher and higher fees. What a surprise. And as you did remind us 20 of the 26 years the LNP was in government so it was mainly them responsible.
You don't get it. Once you make a service free, then it gets abused by both patients and doctors. As a public hospital friend of mine said: "Half the time I;m treating the worried well coming in with trivial things, because it costs them nothing".
All want their sick certificate though.
Who are you going to increase the taxes on? The 50% of workers that pay nothing and will vote you out? The 20% that pay around 75% already? How much more do you want them to pay? Increasing taxes will never fly. And very few experienced surgeons will work every day for Medicare rates. No chance in hell. So now what-no wants to pay more, and only the trainees work for Medicare rates.
Yep because poor people don't deserve high quality health care.
This is you, summed up in a a nutshell.
Fuck 'em they're poor. If they want better healthcare get a better job.
Rolls eyes. As I said Medicare should be a safety net. You will not get a surgeon to do cataract surgery for $600 Medicare public rate when they charge $2000+ privately (plus theatre and aneasthetics). You'll get the registrars.
So you're OK with poor people getting a lesser standard of healthcare.
That's the crux isn't it? You are OK with that.
I'm not and that's the difference between you and me.
And before you ask me how they should pay for it they should either raise taxes or increase the medicare levy. I'm OK with paying more tax if it means a more equitable health system.
You will not able to offer everyone first class standard of care without conscripting doctors outside of wartime which has been tested in Court and found to be illegal.
That's a fact.
And I can tell you if its you or someone you love who is given the trainee whilst someone who has not contributed a cent is given the experienced surgeon you will not accept it. Spare me the moralzing.
Again this is the difference between you and me. It's not an either / or proposition.
You bet your arse you can get good healthcare if you pay doctors correctly in the public health system and if that means taxes go up, taxes go up.
I'd rather little Johnny gets his scoliosis fixed up by the best orthopaedic surgeon in Australia in the public system so he can spend the next 50 years paying tax and being a productive member of society rather than get butchered by some bloke we pinched from a 3rd world country (don't start me on how immoral that is) and then spend the next 50 years on welfare with an opioid addiction because it wasn't done right.
Australia already taxes those who actually pay tax much more than most OECD nations. If you want higher taxes, then it needs to be spread wider. Its absurd Australia has the lowest or second lowest GST in the OECD. And it would last for a parliament period before it was inundated and the payments capped or even reduced.
Its not the third world doctors that are the doing the bulk of the butchering-its the trainee registrars in the public system. Ever wonder why the doctors are so young? Because public hospitals are training hospitals. That's what you get for "free". People learning on YOU.
And if you want a glimpse of what your utopia looks like, look at Britain's NHS. Accessible for the public? Sure? What are the outcomes like for them? Umm err, we' d rather not say. No-one I know who has worked under both the NHS and Australia's hybrid public/private system would choose the NHS. Thats what free universal helathcare looks like.
Again I'm happy for taxes to be raised if it means equitable healthcare.
Increase the GST if that's what it takes.
Like I said little Johnny paying a million dollars in tax over his working life because his back was fixed properly is a great result even if the surgeon charges $25k to fix him up. What a great return on investment. You should be all over that.
Funny thing is we are now taxed more under LNP.
Only ppl that arn't are their donors. For example, ExxonMobil haven't paid tax for 10 years (was 30 billion in 2019) What a joke. Now might be the first year in ten Multiple waves of income tax cuts have been announced and some implemented under the coalition to address the rise in income taxes, This is in spite of the Labor-Greens alliance announcing policies that would increase taxes and divisive campaigns by Labor based on lies eg Top End of Town. Companies pay tax on profits, not revenue. If Exxon is not, then that is tax evasion and they should be charged with criminal tax offences. Do you have evidence that Exxon avoids paying tax on profits in Australia? [/quote]They paid zero tax on 33 billion in income....you reckon their overheads were 33 billion? Or they used loopholes with off shores....set up by....well well well Well they explained it like this: https://www.exxonmobil.com.au/News/Newsroom/ExxonMobil-Australia---Tax-FactsAnd they paid tax last year too.
So now you're using an oil companies PR to defend them? Who would do that....
I won't even bother to post links, but a short search sees multiple articles from reputable sources investigating this issue.
Ok here's one....the have over 500 entities in teh Bahamas - u think that's ok, cause their PR ppl wrote some wriggly BS?
https://thenewdaily.com.au/finance/finance-news/2019/03/20/top-10-tax-exxon-mobil/
+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". The only thing missing from your posts was "Let them eat cake". Meanwhile Melton, one of the fastest growing population centres in Australia after DECADES of campaigning still won't have a hospital at least by 2029 . . https://www.theage.com.au/politics/victoria/after-decades-of-campaigning-melton-to-get-new-public-hospital-20210704-p586ow.htmlThis in a Victoria, the Massachusetts of Australia, Labor heartland. Until the last election that when 40% voted for independents. Now for the luxury of an electrified train They'll have their hospital 10 - 15 years before we get our first submarines. You know those ones we paid the French $5.5 billion dollars for. Oh I forgot. We're not getting anything for that $5.5 billion. Cool and normal. That isn't the point but whatever lets focus on saving theatres and opera houses over actually having a hospital for one of the biggest growing areas in the country in a state governed by the party who is apparently representing the people in that area. The important thing is We Feel Good because We Did Something ( TM) aka virtue signalling. You're both caricatures of the Leftist SJW's [/quote]Says the bloke who thinks poor people can suck it when it comes to health care. Again you just deal in stereotypes and make misrepresentations. Medicare should be a safety net so that everyone has access to health care. The reason why everyone get free public hospital care is because they are teaching hospital with the odd consultant. This is necessary of course because that's where the next generation comes from and they have to learn on someone. With your solution to increase taxes to abolish private health, you will still need to work out who gets which surgeon. And if you're family is paying around $8k in taxes for this-which is what will need to happen- you think you should not have choice about the doctor you see? Will you give up your place on the operating table with an experienced surgeon for someone else and take theirs with the registrar because someone will need to. And I guarantee that once you make it a free for all to see a cponsultant, the money will run out quicker than you think. You'll then end up with the NHS style where doctors will be required to reign in the costs by jump through administrative hoops and face limitations on what they can and can't offer for treatment
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]Also $5.5 billion for the cancelled submarine contacts. Crickets. Might be repeating myself here but at $800 billion debt at just 2% (don't know the actual rate) interest thats $43 million dollars a day in interest. $1.8 million an hour, every hour of every day. Anything in the papers? Nope. I can remember when labour were $150 billion in debt and they never shut up about it. When they talk about media bias they should at least recognise that it swings both ways. Labor didn't have a world wide pandemic that's dragging into its fourth year. The media- even the Labor friends at Fairfax and the ABC- know that reporting on the debt will not interest the public. For a start, the public got lots a free money. Right so how is this any different from the GFC when Rudd doled out free money here, there and everywhere? Biggest financial crisis since the depression but that didn't matter apparently. The media never shut up about it. In fact they still bang on about it. The frustrating thing is ppl don't care. Some moron said to me the other day the line of 'Liberals know how to manage money'. He couldn't name one policy that increased society's wealth or living standards, and moronically listed labor ones. In the end, he shrugged his shoulders and said 'well, they're all as bad as each other. That's what the country is dealing with - people who at the end of the day don't actually have an idea or stance, no matter what they try to pretend. They just piss with the wind. This economic success has been under the coalition, and for 20 of the last 26 years. Don't tell me you believe it was all down Labor's 6 years in office? ha ha what, dig every natural resource, sell your national assets and squander 90% of it? A grade six could manage that Awesome handling there. And yet Labor couldn't be trusted to do it by the Australian public for 20 out of 26 years. Look around you. Most of what you own and enjoy has happened under the coalition. Like universitiy education, Medicare, intervening to save national treasures from development… thanks LNP! It was Labor's Dawkins that brought in HECS in 1988/89. It was Gillard that created the policy that has led to the $300,000 degree. My parents remember a time before Medicare ie Medibank They say it was better-they paid their premiums and they got to their doctors within a reasonable time-real surgeons rather than the kids in training clocking up the hours and the botched work in the public hospitals Medicare gives you today, unless you have a benevolent surgeon on hand. Not sure what "national treasures" you mean? So now you're anti medicare? HECs is/was fair enough when it started back years ago when it was a nominal amount. My HECS debt was about $12k when I finished. It's becoming a way more serious debt burden now for young people particularly in lower paid degree qualified jobs like engineering, nursing, science, veterinary science, physios etc. Not sure why you don't up and move to America where your profits-before-people, trickle-down economic theories and lack of empathy towards your fellow man is more aligned with your principles. Medicare should be a safety net, not a free for all. You think Medicare is some jewell in the crown? Go and compare the surgical outcomes of public hospitals and those of private surgeons. You get what you pay for. HECS was never fair. Its more of a burden now because Gillard said to the Uni's: charge what you want for as many places as you want. Leading to expensive degrees, over-supply of graduates, declining standards and lower paid professional degrees like the ones you mention. Why would I move when I have a government that has aligned with my principles for most of work life. You're the one who doesn't like that. You leave. Medicare should be a free for all. Private health insurance shouldn't exist or if it does then there shouldn't be perverse cross subsidisation and 'incentives' for higher earing peoples to be forced into it. Why should I pay 4 times the medicare levy/tax amount and then be forced to take out private health insurance instead of being able to be treated at a quality public hospital with quality facilities and doctors? Ridiculous. Raise taxes or the medicare levy and stop forcing people into private health. If it's that good then it should be able to stand on it's own 2 feet. Full fee degrees became a thing when University funding was drastically cut forcing universities to charge higher and higher fees. What a surprise. And as you did remind us 20 of the 26 years the LNP was in government so it was mainly them responsible. You don't get it. Once you make a service free, then it gets abused by both patients and doctors. As a public hospital friend of mine said: "Half the time I;m treating the worried well coming in with trivial things, because it costs them nothing". All want their sick certificate though. Who are you going to increase the taxes on? The 50% of workers that pay nothing and will vote you out? The 20% that pay around 75% already? How much more do you want them to pay? Increasing taxes will never fly. And very few experienced surgeons will work every day for Medicare rates. No chance in hell. So now what-no wants to pay more, and only the trainees work for Medicare rates. Yep because poor people don't deserve high quality health care. This is you, summed up in a a nutshell. Fuck 'em they're poor. If they want better healthcare get a better job. Rolls eyes. As I said Medicare should be a safety net. You will not get a surgeon to do cataract surgery for $600 Medicare public rate when they charge $2000+ privately (plus theatre and aneasthetics). You'll get the registrars. So you're OK with poor people getting a lesser standard of healthcare. That's the crux isn't it? You are OK with that. I'm not and that's the difference between you and me. And before you ask me how they should pay for it they should either raise taxes or increase the medicare levy. I'm OK with paying more tax if it means a more equitable health system. You will not able to offer everyone first class standard of care without conscripting doctors outside of wartime which has been tested in Court and found to be illegal. That's a fact. And I can tell you if its you or someone you love who is given the trainee whilst someone who has not contributed a cent is given the experienced surgeon you will not accept it. Spare me the moralzing. Again this is the difference between you and me. It's not an either / or proposition. You bet your arse you can get good healthcare if you pay doctors correctly in the public health system and if that means taxes go up, taxes go up. I'd rather little Johnny gets his scoliosis fixed up by the best orthopaedic surgeon in Australia in the public system so he can spend the next 50 years paying tax and being a productive member of society rather than get butchered by some bloke we pinched from a 3rd world country (don't start me on how immoral that is) and then spend the next 50 years on welfare with an opioid addiction because it wasn't done right. Australia already taxes those who actually pay tax much more than most OECD nations. If you want higher taxes, then it needs to be spread wider. Its absurd Australia has the lowest or second lowest GST in the OECD. And it would last for a parliament period before it was inundated and the payments capped or even reduced. Its not the third world doctors that are the doing the bulk of the butchering-its the trainee registrars in the public system. Ever wonder why the doctors are so young? Because public hospitals are training hospitals. That's what you get for "free". People learning on YOU. And if you want a glimpse of what your utopia looks like, look at Britain's NHS. Accessible for the public? Sure? What are the outcomes like for them? Umm err, we' d rather not say. No-one I know who has worked under both the NHS and Australia's hybrid public/private system would choose the NHS. Thats what free universal helathcare looks like. Again I'm happy for taxes to be raised if it means equitable healthcare. Increase the GST if that's what it takes. Like I said little Johnny paying a million dollars in tax over his working life because his back was fixed properly is a great result even if the surgeon charges $25k to fix him up. What a great return on investment. You should be all over that. Funny thing is we are now taxed more under LNP. Only ppl that arn't are their donors. For example, ExxonMobil haven't paid tax for 10 years (was 30 billion in 2019) What a joke. Now might be the first year in ten
Multiple waves of income tax cuts have been announced and some implemented under the coalition to address the rise in income taxes, This is in spite of the Labor-Greens alliance announcing policies that would increase taxes and divisive campaigns by Labor based on lies eg Top End of Town.
Companies pay tax on profits, not revenue. If Exxon is not, then that is tax evasion and they should be charged with criminal tax offences. Do you have evidence that Exxon avoids paying tax on profits in Australia?
They paid zero tax on 33 billion in income....you reckon their overheads were 33 billion? Or they used loopholes with off shores....set up by....well well well [/quote]Well they explained it like this: https://www.exxonmobil.com.au/News/Newsroom/ExxonMobil-Australia---Tax-FactsAnd they paid tax last year too. So now you're using an oil companies PR to defend them? Who would do that.... I won't even bother to post links, but a short search sees multiple articles from reputable sources investigating this issue. Ok here's one....the have over 500 entities in teh Bahamas - u think that's ok, cause their PR ppl wrote some wriggly BS? https://thenewdaily.com.au/finance/finance-news/2019/03/20/top-10-tax-exxon-mobil/
+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". The only thing missing from your posts was "Let them eat cake". Meanwhile Melton, one of the fastest growing population centres in Australia after DECADES of campaigning still won't have a hospital at least by 2029 . . https://www.theage.com.au/politics/victoria/after-decades-of-campaigning-melton-to-get-new-public-hospital-20210704-p586ow.htmlThis in a Victoria, the Massachusetts of Australia, Labor heartland. Until the last election that when 40% voted for independents. Now for the luxury of an electrified train They'll have their hospital 10 - 15 years before we get our first submarines. You know those ones we paid the French $5.5 billion dollars for. Oh I forgot. We're not getting anything for that $5.5 billion. Cool and normal.
That isn't the point but whatever lets focus on saving theatres and opera houses over actually having a hospital for one of the biggest growing areas in the country in a state governed by the party who is apparently representing the people in that area.
The important thing is We Feel Good because We Did Something (TM) aka virtue signalling. You're both caricatures of the Leftist SJW's
Says the bloke who thinks poor people can suck it when it comes to health care. [/quote]Again you just deal in stereotypes and make misrepresentations. Medicare should be a safety net so that everyone has access to health care. The reason why everyone get free public hospital care is because they are teaching hospital with the odd consultant. This is necessary of course because that's where the next generation comes from and they have to learn on someone. With your solution to increase taxes to abolish private health, you will still need to work out who gets which surgeon. And if you're family is paying around $8k in taxes for this-which is what will need to happen- you think you should not have choice about the doctor you see? Will you give up your place on the operating table with an experienced surgeon for someone else and take theirs with the registrar because someone will need to. And I guarantee that once you make it a free for all to see a cponsultant, the money will run out quicker than you think. You'll then end up with the NHS style where doctors will be required to reign in the costs by jump through administrative hoops and face limitations on what they can and can't offer for treatment See previous. It's not an either / or which you keep saying it is. What do you mean who gets what surgeon? Train up some more if we're that short. (Or import some from 3rd world countries which need them more than we do rather than spend our money training them here.) Also to your previous point about the lack of a hospital in Victoria, if what you say is true, then you are correct. They should build one and hurry up about it. Perhaps the federal government could give the Vic government some of that $5.5 billion they threw away on non existent submarines. The submarines we're not getting to 2040 at the earliest. Perhaps they need a local member boofing the premier. That's how Wagga got their new hospital.
Member since 2008.
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tsf
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+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place.
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
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+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though.
Member since 2008.
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tsf
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+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. All very salient points. As for billionaires donating, this is incredible that this person would not only publically say this, but feel it's ok to put on her website: https://www.ginarinehart.com.au/gina-rinehart-calls-for-more-places-to-moor-her-yacht-by-brisbane-2032-olympic-games/
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. All very salient points. As for billionaires donating, this is incredible that this person would not only publically say this, but feel it's ok to put on her website: https://www.ginarinehart.com.au/gina-rinehart-calls-for-more-places-to-moor-her-yacht-by-brisbane-2032-olympic-games/ Inherited wealth is the best wealth by all accounts.
Member since 2008.
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]Also $5.5 billion for the cancelled submarine contacts. Crickets. Might be repeating myself here but at $800 billion debt at just 2% (don't know the actual rate) interest thats $43 million dollars a day in interest. $1.8 million an hour, every hour of every day. Anything in the papers? Nope. I can remember when labour were $150 billion in debt and they never shut up about it. When they talk about media bias they should at least recognise that it swings both ways. Labor didn't have a world wide pandemic that's dragging into its fourth year. The media- even the Labor friends at Fairfax and the ABC- know that reporting on the debt will not interest the public. For a start, the public got lots a free money. Right so how is this any different from the GFC when Rudd doled out free money here, there and everywhere? Biggest financial crisis since the depression but that didn't matter apparently. The media never shut up about it. In fact they still bang on about it. The frustrating thing is ppl don't care. Some moron said to me the other day the line of 'Liberals know how to manage money'. He couldn't name one policy that increased society's wealth or living standards, and moronically listed labor ones. In the end, he shrugged his shoulders and said 'well, they're all as bad as each other. That's what the country is dealing with - people who at the end of the day don't actually have an idea or stance, no matter what they try to pretend. They just piss with the wind. This economic success has been under the coalition, and for 20 of the last 26 years. Don't tell me you believe it was all down Labor's 6 years in office? ha ha what, dig every natural resource, sell your national assets and squander 90% of it? A grade six could manage that Awesome handling there. And yet Labor couldn't be trusted to do it by the Australian public for 20 out of 26 years. Look around you. Most of what you own and enjoy has happened under the coalition. Like universitiy education, Medicare, intervening to save national treasures from development… thanks LNP! It was Labor's Dawkins that brought in HECS in 1988/89. It was Gillard that created the policy that has led to the $300,000 degree. My parents remember a time before Medicare ie Medibank They say it was better-they paid their premiums and they got to their doctors within a reasonable time-real surgeons rather than the kids in training clocking up the hours and the botched work in the public hospitals Medicare gives you today, unless you have a benevolent surgeon on hand. Not sure what "national treasures" you mean? So now you're anti medicare? HECs is/was fair enough when it started back years ago when it was a nominal amount. My HECS debt was about $12k when I finished. It's becoming a way more serious debt burden now for young people particularly in lower paid degree qualified jobs like engineering, nursing, science, veterinary science, physios etc. Not sure why you don't up and move to America where your profits-before-people, trickle-down economic theories and lack of empathy towards your fellow man is more aligned with your principles. Medicare should be a safety net, not a free for all. You think Medicare is some jewell in the crown? Go and compare the surgical outcomes of public hospitals and those of private surgeons. You get what you pay for. HECS was never fair. Its more of a burden now because Gillard said to the Uni's: charge what you want for as many places as you want. Leading to expensive degrees, over-supply of graduates, declining standards and lower paid professional degrees like the ones you mention. Why would I move when I have a government that has aligned with my principles for most of work life. You're the one who doesn't like that. You leave. Medicare should be a free for all. Private health insurance shouldn't exist or if it does then there shouldn't be perverse cross subsidisation and 'incentives' for higher earing peoples to be forced into it. Why should I pay 4 times the medicare levy/tax amount and then be forced to take out private health insurance instead of being able to be treated at a quality public hospital with quality facilities and doctors? Ridiculous. Raise taxes or the medicare levy and stop forcing people into private health. If it's that good then it should be able to stand on it's own 2 feet. Full fee degrees became a thing when University funding was drastically cut forcing universities to charge higher and higher fees. What a surprise. And as you did remind us 20 of the 26 years the LNP was in government so it was mainly them responsible. You don't get it. Once you make a service free, then it gets abused by both patients and doctors. As a public hospital friend of mine said: "Half the time I;m treating the worried well coming in with trivial things, because it costs them nothing". All want their sick certificate though. Who are you going to increase the taxes on? The 50% of workers that pay nothing and will vote you out? The 20% that pay around 75% already? How much more do you want them to pay? Increasing taxes will never fly. And very few experienced surgeons will work every day for Medicare rates. No chance in hell. So now what-no wants to pay more, and only the trainees work for Medicare rates. Yep because poor people don't deserve high quality health care. This is you, summed up in a a nutshell. Fuck 'em they're poor. If they want better healthcare get a better job. Rolls eyes. As I said Medicare should be a safety net. You will not get a surgeon to do cataract surgery for $600 Medicare public rate when they charge $2000+ privately (plus theatre and aneasthetics). You'll get the registrars. So you're OK with poor people getting a lesser standard of healthcare. That's the crux isn't it? You are OK with that. I'm not and that's the difference between you and me. And before you ask me how they should pay for it they should either raise taxes or increase the medicare levy. I'm OK with paying more tax if it means a more equitable health system. You will not able to offer everyone first class standard of care without conscripting doctors outside of wartime which has been tested in Court and found to be illegal. That's a fact. And I can tell you if its you or someone you love who is given the trainee whilst someone who has not contributed a cent is given the experienced surgeon you will not accept it. Spare me the moralzing. Again this is the difference between you and me. It's not an either / or proposition. You bet your arse you can get good healthcare if you pay doctors correctly in the public health system and if that means taxes go up, taxes go up. I'd rather little Johnny gets his scoliosis fixed up by the best orthopaedic surgeon in Australia in the public system so he can spend the next 50 years paying tax and being a productive member of society rather than get butchered by some bloke we pinched from a 3rd world country (don't start me on how immoral that is) and then spend the next 50 years on welfare with an opioid addiction because it wasn't done right. Australia already taxes those who actually pay tax much more than most OECD nations. If you want higher taxes, then it needs to be spread wider. Its absurd Australia has the lowest or second lowest GST in the OECD. And it would last for a parliament period before it was inundated and the payments capped or even reduced. Its not the third world doctors that are the doing the bulk of the butchering-its the trainee registrars in the public system. Ever wonder why the doctors are so young? Because public hospitals are training hospitals. That's what you get for "free". People learning on YOU. And if you want a glimpse of what your utopia looks like, look at Britain's NHS. Accessible for the public? Sure? What are the outcomes like for them? Umm err, we' d rather not say. No-one I know who has worked under both the NHS and Australia's hybrid public/private system would choose the NHS. Thats what free universal helathcare looks like. Again I'm happy for taxes to be raised if it means equitable healthcare. Increase the GST if that's what it takes. Like I said little Johnny paying a million dollars in tax over his working life because his back was fixed properly is a great result even if the surgeon charges $25k to fix him up. What a great return on investment. You should be all over that. Funny thing is we are now taxed more under LNP. Only ppl that arn't are their donors. For example, ExxonMobil haven't paid tax for 10 years (was 30 billion in 2019) What a joke. Now might be the first year in ten Multiple waves of income tax cuts have been announced and some implemented under the coalition to address the rise in income taxes, This is in spite of the Labor-Greens alliance announcing policies that would increase taxes and divisive campaigns by Labor based on lies eg Top End of Town. Companies pay tax on profits, not revenue. If Exxon is not, then that is tax evasion and they should be charged with criminal tax offences. Do you have evidence that Exxon avoids paying tax on profits in Australia?
They paid zero tax on 33 billion in income....you reckon their overheads were 33 billion? Or they used loopholes with off shores....set up by....well well well
Well they explained it like this: https://www.exxonmobil.com.au/News/Newsroom/ExxonMobil-Australia---Tax-FactsAnd they paid tax last year too. [/quote]So now you're using an oil companies PR to defend them? Who would do that.... I won't even bother to post links, but a short search sees multiple articles from reputable sources investigating this issue. Ok here's one....the have over 500 entities in teh Bahamas - u think that's ok, cause their PR ppl wrote some wriggly BS? https://thenewdaily.com.au/finance/finance-news/2019/03/20/top-10-tax-exxon-mobil/ +x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". The only thing missing from your posts was "Let them eat cake". Meanwhile Melton, one of the fastest growing population centres in Australia after DECADES of campaigning still won't have a hospital at least by 2029 . . https://www.theage.com.au/politics/victoria/after-decades-of-campaigning-melton-to-get-new-public-hospital-20210704-p586ow.htmlThis in a Victoria, the Massachusetts of Australia, Labor heartland. Until the last election that when 40% voted for independents. Now for the luxury of an electrified train They'll have their hospital 10 - 15 years before we get our first submarines. You know those ones we paid the French $5.5 billion dollars for. Oh I forgot. We're not getting anything for that $5.5 billion. Cool and normal. That isn't the point but whatever lets focus on saving theatres and opera houses over actually having a hospital for one of the biggest growing areas in the country in a state governed by the party who is apparently representing the people in that area. The important thing is We Feel Good because We Did Something ( TM) aka virtue signalling. You're both caricatures of the Leftist SJW's
Says the bloke who thinks poor people can suck it when it comes to health care. Again you just deal in stereotypes and make misrepresentations. Medicare should be a safety net so that everyone has access to health care. The reason why everyone get free public hospital care is because they are teaching hospital with the odd consultant. This is necessary of course because that's where the next generation comes from and they have to learn on someone. With your solution to increase taxes to abolish private health, you will still need to work out who gets which surgeon. And if you're family is paying around $8k in taxes for this-which is what will need to happen- you think you should not have choice about the doctor you see? Will you give up your place on the operating table with an experienced surgeon for someone else and take theirs with the registrar because someone will need to. And I guarantee that once you make it a free for all to see a cponsultant, the money will run out quicker than you think. You'll then end up with the NHS style where doctors will be required to reign in the costs by jump through administrative hoops and face limitations on what they can and can't offer for treatment [/quote]See previous. It's not an either / or which you keep saying it is. What do you mean who gets what surgeon? Train up some more if we're that short. (Or import some from 3rd world countries which need them more than we do rather than spend our money training them here.) Also to your previous point about the lack of a hospital in Victoria, if what you say is true, then you are correct. They should build one and hurry up about it. Perhaps the federal government could give the Vic government some of that $5.5 billion they threw away on non existent submarines. The submarines we're not getting to 2040 at the earliest. Perhaps they need a local member boofing the premier. That's how Wagga got their new hospital. As you're training these surgeons- which isn't the issue BTW-this can take 15 or more years, how, and where, and who will they train on? As for the Melton hospital: https://www.theage.com.au/politics/victoria/after-decades-of-campaigning-melton-to-get-new-public-hospital-20210704-p586ow.html Caroline Springs waited 14 years for fricken station. Labor heartland, Labor governments. More important to have injecting rooms and letting boys into girls changerooms.
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. As for aspiration, go and teach Tanya " This 'aspiration' term mystifies me" Plibersek what it means: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=10155570093061728
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. All very salient points. As for billionaires donating, this is incredible that this person would not only publically say this, but feel it's ok to put on her website: https://www.ginarinehart.com.au/gina-rinehart-calls-for-more-places-to-moor-her-yacht-by-brisbane-2032-olympic-games/ Inherited wealth is the best wealth by all accounts. So is your objection to all inheritance or to just some of it and for certain people?
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. All very salient points. As for billionaires donating, this is incredible that this person would not only publically say this, but feel it's ok to put on her website: https://www.ginarinehart.com.au/gina-rinehart-calls-for-more-places-to-moor-her-yacht-by-brisbane-2032-olympic-games/ Inherited wealth is the best wealth by all accounts. So is your objection to all inheritance or to just some of it and for certain people? What objection, who's objecting? The only thing I object to with inherited wealth is those people pretending 'they did it hard'.
Member since 2008.
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. As for aspiration, go and teach Tanya " This 'aspiration' term mystifies me" Plibersek what it means: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=10155570093061728 Nothing I said there isn't a perfect description of someone like you. Do you believe everyone is born equal and has the same opportunities - Yes (as expressed here many times.) Do you believe the ultra wealthy should be taxed more - No (as expressed here many times.) Is obscene wealth OK by you - Yes (that's a guess but I'm thinking that's 99.9% certain.) Should the really rich engage in philanthropy - I'm actually not sure about this one. Please do enlighten us. Which bit do you disagree with?
Member since 2008.
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Muz
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]+x[quote]Also $5.5 billion for the cancelled submarine contacts. Crickets. Might be repeating myself here but at $800 billion debt at just 2% (don't know the actual rate) interest thats $43 million dollars a day in interest. $1.8 million an hour, every hour of every day. Anything in the papers? Nope. I can remember when labour were $150 billion in debt and they never shut up about it. When they talk about media bias they should at least recognise that it swings both ways. Labor didn't have a world wide pandemic that's dragging into its fourth year. The media- even the Labor friends at Fairfax and the ABC- know that reporting on the debt will not interest the public. For a start, the public got lots a free money. Right so how is this any different from the GFC when Rudd doled out free money here, there and everywhere? Biggest financial crisis since the depression but that didn't matter apparently. The media never shut up about it. In fact they still bang on about it. The frustrating thing is ppl don't care. Some moron said to me the other day the line of 'Liberals know how to manage money'. He couldn't name one policy that increased society's wealth or living standards, and moronically listed labor ones. In the end, he shrugged his shoulders and said 'well, they're all as bad as each other. That's what the country is dealing with - people who at the end of the day don't actually have an idea or stance, no matter what they try to pretend. They just piss with the wind. This economic success has been under the coalition, and for 20 of the last 26 years. Don't tell me you believe it was all down Labor's 6 years in office? ha ha what, dig every natural resource, sell your national assets and squander 90% of it? A grade six could manage that Awesome handling there. And yet Labor couldn't be trusted to do it by the Australian public for 20 out of 26 years. Look around you. Most of what you own and enjoy has happened under the coalition. Like universitiy education, Medicare, intervening to save national treasures from development… thanks LNP! It was Labor's Dawkins that brought in HECS in 1988/89. It was Gillard that created the policy that has led to the $300,000 degree. My parents remember a time before Medicare ie Medibank They say it was better-they paid their premiums and they got to their doctors within a reasonable time-real surgeons rather than the kids in training clocking up the hours and the botched work in the public hospitals Medicare gives you today, unless you have a benevolent surgeon on hand. Not sure what "national treasures" you mean? So now you're anti medicare? HECs is/was fair enough when it started back years ago when it was a nominal amount. My HECS debt was about $12k when I finished. It's becoming a way more serious debt burden now for young people particularly in lower paid degree qualified jobs like engineering, nursing, science, veterinary science, physios etc. Not sure why you don't up and move to America where your profits-before-people, trickle-down economic theories and lack of empathy towards your fellow man is more aligned with your principles. Medicare should be a safety net, not a free for all. You think Medicare is some jewell in the crown? Go and compare the surgical outcomes of public hospitals and those of private surgeons. You get what you pay for. HECS was never fair. Its more of a burden now because Gillard said to the Uni's: charge what you want for as many places as you want. Leading to expensive degrees, over-supply of graduates, declining standards and lower paid professional degrees like the ones you mention. Why would I move when I have a government that has aligned with my principles for most of work life. You're the one who doesn't like that. You leave. Medicare should be a free for all. Private health insurance shouldn't exist or if it does then there shouldn't be perverse cross subsidisation and 'incentives' for higher earing peoples to be forced into it. Why should I pay 4 times the medicare levy/tax amount and then be forced to take out private health insurance instead of being able to be treated at a quality public hospital with quality facilities and doctors? Ridiculous. Raise taxes or the medicare levy and stop forcing people into private health. If it's that good then it should be able to stand on it's own 2 feet. Full fee degrees became a thing when University funding was drastically cut forcing universities to charge higher and higher fees. What a surprise. And as you did remind us 20 of the 26 years the LNP was in government so it was mainly them responsible. You don't get it. Once you make a service free, then it gets abused by both patients and doctors. As a public hospital friend of mine said: "Half the time I;m treating the worried well coming in with trivial things, because it costs them nothing". All want their sick certificate though. Who are you going to increase the taxes on? The 50% of workers that pay nothing and will vote you out? The 20% that pay around 75% already? How much more do you want them to pay? Increasing taxes will never fly. And very few experienced surgeons will work every day for Medicare rates. No chance in hell. So now what-no wants to pay more, and only the trainees work for Medicare rates. Yep because poor people don't deserve high quality health care. This is you, summed up in a a nutshell. Fuck 'em they're poor. If they want better healthcare get a better job. Rolls eyes. As I said Medicare should be a safety net. You will not get a surgeon to do cataract surgery for $600 Medicare public rate when they charge $2000+ privately (plus theatre and aneasthetics). You'll get the registrars. So you're OK with poor people getting a lesser standard of healthcare. That's the crux isn't it? You are OK with that. I'm not and that's the difference between you and me. And before you ask me how they should pay for it they should either raise taxes or increase the medicare levy. I'm OK with paying more tax if it means a more equitable health system. You will not able to offer everyone first class standard of care without conscripting doctors outside of wartime which has been tested in Court and found to be illegal. That's a fact. And I can tell you if its you or someone you love who is given the trainee whilst someone who has not contributed a cent is given the experienced surgeon you will not accept it. Spare me the moralzing. Again this is the difference between you and me. It's not an either / or proposition. You bet your arse you can get good healthcare if you pay doctors correctly in the public health system and if that means taxes go up, taxes go up. I'd rather little Johnny gets his scoliosis fixed up by the best orthopaedic surgeon in Australia in the public system so he can spend the next 50 years paying tax and being a productive member of society rather than get butchered by some bloke we pinched from a 3rd world country (don't start me on how immoral that is) and then spend the next 50 years on welfare with an opioid addiction because it wasn't done right. Australia already taxes those who actually pay tax much more than most OECD nations. If you want higher taxes, then it needs to be spread wider. Its absurd Australia has the lowest or second lowest GST in the OECD. And it would last for a parliament period before it was inundated and the payments capped or even reduced. Its not the third world doctors that are the doing the bulk of the butchering-its the trainee registrars in the public system. Ever wonder why the doctors are so young? Because public hospitals are training hospitals. That's what you get for "free". People learning on YOU. And if you want a glimpse of what your utopia looks like, look at Britain's NHS. Accessible for the public? Sure? What are the outcomes like for them? Umm err, we' d rather not say. No-one I know who has worked under both the NHS and Australia's hybrid public/private system would choose the NHS. Thats what free universal helathcare looks like. Again I'm happy for taxes to be raised if it means equitable healthcare. Increase the GST if that's what it takes. Like I said little Johnny paying a million dollars in tax over his working life because his back was fixed properly is a great result even if the surgeon charges $25k to fix him up. What a great return on investment. You should be all over that. Funny thing is we are now taxed more under LNP. Only ppl that arn't are their donors. For example, ExxonMobil haven't paid tax for 10 years (was 30 billion in 2019) What a joke. Now might be the first year in ten [/quote]Multiple waves of income tax cuts have been announced and some implemented under the coalition to address the rise in income taxes, This is in spite of the Labor-Greens alliance announcing policies that would increase taxes and divisive campaigns by Labor based on lies eg Top End of Town. Companies pay tax on profits, not revenue. If Exxon is not, then that is tax evasion and they should be charged with criminal tax offences. Do you have evidence that Exxon avoids paying tax on profits in Australia? They paid zero tax on 33 billion in income....you reckon their overheads were 33 billion? Or they used loopholes with off shores....set up by....well well well
Well they explained it like this:
https://www.exxonmobil.com.au/News/Newsroom/ExxonMobil-Australia---Tax-Facts
And they paid tax last year too.
So now you're using an oil companies PR to defend them? Who would do that.... I won't even bother to post links, but a short search sees multiple articles from reputable sources investigating this issue. Ok here's one....the have over 500 entities in teh Bahamas - u think that's ok, cause their PR ppl wrote some wriggly BS? https://thenewdaily.com.au/finance/finance-news/2019/03/20/top-10-tax-exxon-mobil/ [/quote]+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". The only thing missing from your posts was "Let them eat cake". Meanwhile Melton, one of the fastest growing population centres in Australia after DECADES of campaigning still won't have a hospital at least by 2029 . . https://www.theage.com.au/politics/victoria/after-decades-of-campaigning-melton-to-get-new-public-hospital-20210704-p586ow.htmlThis in a Victoria, the Massachusetts of Australia, Labor heartland. Until the last election that when 40% voted for independents. Now for the luxury of an electrified train They'll have their hospital 10 - 15 years before we get our first submarines. You know those ones we paid the French $5.5 billion dollars for. Oh I forgot. We're not getting anything for that $5.5 billion. Cool and normal. That isn't the point but whatever lets focus on saving theatres and opera houses over actually having a hospital for one of the biggest growing areas in the country in a state governed by the party who is apparently representing the people in that area. The important thing is We Feel Good because We Did Something ( TM) aka virtue signalling. You're both caricatures of the Leftist SJW's Says the bloke who thinks poor people can suck it when it comes to health care.
Again you just deal in stereotypes and make misrepresentations.
Medicare should be a safety net so that everyone has access to health care.
The reason why everyone get free public hospital care is because they are teaching hospital with the odd consultant. This is necessary of course because that's where the next generation comes from and they have to learn on someone.
With your solution to increase taxes to abolish private health, you will still need to work out who gets which surgeon. And if you're family is paying around $8k in taxes for this-which is what will need to happen- you think you should not have choice about the doctor you see?
Will you give up your place on the operating table with an experienced surgeon for someone else and take theirs with the registrar because someone will need to.
And I guarantee that once you make it a free for all to see a cponsultant, the money will run out quicker than you think. You'll then end up with the NHS style where doctors will be required to reign in the costs by jump through administrative hoops and face limitations on what they can and can't offer for treatment
See previous. It's not an either / or which you keep saying it is. What do you mean who gets what surgeon? Train up some more if we're that short. (Or import some from 3rd world countries which need them more than we do rather than spend our money training them here.) Also to your previous point about the lack of a hospital in Victoria, if what you say is true, then you are correct. They should build one and hurry up about it. Perhaps the federal government could give the Vic government some of that $5.5 billion they threw away on non existent submarines. The submarines we're not getting to 2040 at the earliest. Perhaps they need a local member boofing the premier. That's how Wagga got their new hospital. [/quote] As you're training these surgeons- which isn't the issue BTW-this can take 15 or more years, how, and where, and who will they train on? As for the Melton hospital: https://www.theage.com.au/politics/victoria/after-decades-of-campaigning-melton-to-get-new-public-hospital-20210704-p586ow.html Caroline Springs waited 14 years for fricken station. Labor heartland, Labor governments. More important to have injecting rooms and letting boys into girls changerooms. Well of course trainee surgeons have to train somewhere but they should be instructed by the very best people. And if that's in a public hospital so what? What is your actual point? I've already explained it's not an either / or proposition. You are wedded to the idea that this is a win / lose situation. You're rich, you win. You're poor, you lose. It doesn't have to be that way. How can you possibly object to my example of someone getting great medical care so they spend the next 20, 30, 40, 50 years working and paying tax rather than being butchered by a failing medical health system and spending their life on welfare. There are so many examples of this sort of thing it's incredible that a, presumably, 'economic rationalist' like yourself can't see the cost/benefit ratio is way in favour of quality healthcare rather than adequate healthcare. Our system is good. That doesn't mean it can't be better.
Member since 2008.
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Muz
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. As for aspiration, go and teach Tanya " This 'aspiration' term mystifies me" Plibersek what it means: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=10155570093061728 What are you on about. She's making perfect sense. All she's saying is if taxes are higher at $100k that's not going to stop people wanting to earn $100k. That stupid argument gets me every time. Billy Businessman can put on 4 new clients and make 50% more income but oh no the tax rate in that bracket he will move into has gone up 2 cents. Fuck a duck now I'm not going to take on those new clients and increase my income by 50%. I'd hate to be paying an additional 2 cents over whatever the previous tax bracket was. Just as ridiculous as it sounds. Edit: Just noticed that video is over 4 years old. Really are rummaging around in the bottom drawer now aren't you. (Do you have spreadsheet with hyperlinks you've been collecting for years or do you get these from LNP meme pages on twitter?)
Member since 2008.
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tsf
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. oh my
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Enzo Bearzot
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. All very salient points. As for billionaires donating, this is incredible that this person would not only publically say this, but feel it's ok to put on her website: https://www.ginarinehart.com.au/gina-rinehart-calls-for-more-places-to-moor-her-yacht-by-brisbane-2032-olympic-games/ Inherited wealth is the best wealth by all accounts. So is your objection to all inheritance or to just some of it and for certain people? What objection, who's objecting? The only thing I object to with inherited wealth is those people pretending 'they did it hard'. So who are they exactly?
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. All very salient points. As for billionaires donating, this is incredible that this person would not only publically say this, but feel it's ok to put on her website: https://www.ginarinehart.com.au/gina-rinehart-calls-for-more-places-to-moor-her-yacht-by-brisbane-2032-olympic-games/ Inherited wealth is the best wealth by all accounts. So is your objection to all inheritance or to just some of it and for certain people? What objection, who's objecting? The only thing I object to with inherited wealth is those people pretending 'they did it hard'. So who are they exactly? Those people with inherited wealth.
Member since 2008.
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Muz
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. oh my I know. I had to laugh too. He's pigeonholed us long ago and we'll never move from those containers he's put us in.
Member since 2008.
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. As for aspiration, go and teach Tanya " This 'aspiration' term mystifies me" Plibersek what it means: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=10155570093061728 Nothing I said there isn't a perfect description of someone like you. Do you believe everyone is born equal and has the same opportunities - Yes (as expressed here many times.) Do you believe the ultra wealthy should be taxed more - No (as expressed here many times.) Is obscene wealth OK by you - Yes (that's a guess but I'm thinking that's 99.9% certain.) Should the really rich engage in philanthropy - I'm actually not sure about this one. Please do enlighten us. Which bit do you disagree with? 1. Quote one example 2. Quote one example 3. Quote one example. 4. People can whatever they want with their after tax wealth and income.
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. All very salient points. As for billionaires donating, this is incredible that this person would not only publically say this, but feel it's ok to put on her website: https://www.ginarinehart.com.au/gina-rinehart-calls-for-more-places-to-moor-her-yacht-by-brisbane-2032-olympic-games/ Inherited wealth is the best wealth by all accounts. So is your objection to all inheritance or to just some of it and for certain people? What objection, who's objecting? The only thing I object to with inherited wealth is those people pretending 'they did it hard'. So who are they exactly? Those people with inherited wealth. All of them?
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. All very salient points. As for billionaires donating, this is incredible that this person would not only publically say this, but feel it's ok to put on her website: https://www.ginarinehart.com.au/gina-rinehart-calls-for-more-places-to-moor-her-yacht-by-brisbane-2032-olympic-games/ Inherited wealth is the best wealth by all accounts. So is your objection to all inheritance or to just some of it and for certain people? What objection, who's objecting? The only thing I object to with inherited wealth is those people pretending 'they did it hard'. So who are they exactly? Those people with inherited wealth. All of them? Are you thick? The ones who say 'they did it hard'.
Member since 2008.
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. As for aspiration, go and teach Tanya " This 'aspiration' term mystifies me" Plibersek what it means: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=10155570093061728 Nothing I said there isn't a perfect description of someone like you. Do you believe everyone is born equal and has the same opportunities - Yes (as expressed here many times.) Do you believe the ultra wealthy should be taxed more - No (as expressed here many times.) Is obscene wealth OK by you - Yes (that's a guess but I'm thinking that's 99.9% certain.) Should the really rich engage in philanthropy - I'm actually not sure about this one. Please do enlighten us. Which bit do you disagree with? 1. Quote one example 2. Quote one example 3. Quote one example. 4. People can whatever they want with their after tax wealth and income. Tell you what. Rather than me spending 8 hours trolling through old threads with the worlds worst search bar why don't we just circumvent the process and you tell me which one of my statements you don't agree with. Your trite 'quote one example' is a very convenient sidestep. Very, very simply just answer the following. Do us a favour by putting your cards on the table. I'll happily answer any of your questions. Do you believe everyone is born equal and has the same opportunities? Do you believe the ultra wealthy should be taxed more? Is obscene wealth OK by you ?
Member since 2008.
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. As for aspiration, go and teach Tanya " This 'aspiration' term mystifies me" Plibersek what it means: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=10155570093061728 What are you on about. She's making perfect sense. All she's saying is if taxes are higher at $100k that's not going to stop people wanting to earn $100k. That stupid argument gets me every time. Billy Businessman can put on 4 new clients and make 50% more income but oh no the tax rate in that bracket he will move into has gone up 2 cents. Fuck a duck now I'm not going to take on those new clients and increase my income by 50%. I'd hate to be paying an additional 2 cents over whatever the previous tax bracket was. Just as ridiculous as it sounds. Edit: Just noticed that video is over 4 years old. Really are rummaging around in the bottom drawer now aren't you. (Do you have spreadsheet with hyperlinks you've been collecting for years or do you get these from LNP meme pages on twitter?) Are really that fucking dense? The daughter of Slovenian villagers emigrating to Australia ends up as the deputy leader of one of the two major parties in the nation on a salary of hundreds of thousands of dollars and amasses a property fortune IS MYSTIFIED BY THIS WORD ASPIRATION. She even has the gall to accuse the OTHER side that they're only "giving tax cuts to people like them"- as if she's not one of "them" herself ! Unbelievable head up in arse interview. Oh and remember your point about taxes being higher under the coalition. She literally is against the tax cuts Yes its an oldie but a goodie and why Labor is making she keeps her mouth shut this time around.
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. As for aspiration, go and teach Tanya " This 'aspiration' term mystifies me" Plibersek what it means: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=10155570093061728 Nothing I said there isn't a perfect description of someone like you. Do you believe everyone is born equal and has the same opportunities - Yes (as expressed here many times.) Do you believe the ultra wealthy should be taxed more - No (as expressed here many times.) Is obscene wealth OK by you - Yes (that's a guess but I'm thinking that's 99.9% certain.) Should the really rich engage in philanthropy - I'm actually not sure about this one. Please do enlighten us. Which bit do you disagree with? 1. Quote one example 2. Quote one example 3. Quote one example. 4. People can whatever they want with their after tax wealth and income. Tell you what. Rather than me spending 8 hours trolling through old threads with the worlds worst search bar why don't we just circumvent the process and you tell me which one of my statements you don't agree with. Your trite 'quote one example' is a very convenient sidestep. Very, very simply just answer the following. Do us a favour by putting your cards on the table. I'll happily answer any of your questions. Do you believe everyone is born equal and has the same opportunities? Do you believe the ultra wealthy should be taxed more? Is obscene wealth OK by you ? 1. No. But I believe blaming the "system" only gives you an out for so long in this country- you can always do something to better yourself. For example its possible for a girl born to Slovenian villagers to end up as deputy leader of one of the two major parties at the age of 44 on a salary of hundreds of thousands and amass a multi-million-dollar property portfolio along the way. For example. 2. Yes they should if only to neuter the power and influence they have over the democratic process. 3. Define "obscene wealth".
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. All very salient points. As for billionaires donating, this is incredible that this person would not only publically say this, but feel it's ok to put on her website: https://www.ginarinehart.com.au/gina-rinehart-calls-for-more-places-to-moor-her-yacht-by-brisbane-2032-olympic-games/ Inherited wealth is the best wealth by all accounts. So is your objection to all inheritance or to just some of it and for certain people? What objection, who's objecting? The only thing I object to with inherited wealth is those people pretending 'they did it hard'. So who are they exactly? Those people with inherited wealth. All of them? Are you thick? The ones who say 'they did it hard'. LOL. Who are they? Name the wealthy who inherited and "didn't do it hard". Other than Hunter Biden because that wouldn't be fair.
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. As for aspiration, go and teach Tanya " This 'aspiration' term mystifies me" Plibersek what it means: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=10155570093061728 What are you on about. She's making perfect sense. All she's saying is if taxes are higher at $100k that's not going to stop people wanting to earn $100k. That stupid argument gets me every time. Billy Businessman can put on 4 new clients and make 50% more income but oh no the tax rate in that bracket he will move into has gone up 2 cents. Fuck a duck now I'm not going to take on those new clients and increase my income by 50%. I'd hate to be paying an additional 2 cents over whatever the previous tax bracket was. Just as ridiculous as it sounds. Edit: Just noticed that video is over 4 years old. Really are rummaging around in the bottom drawer now aren't you. (Do you have spreadsheet with hyperlinks you've been collecting for years or do you get these from LNP meme pages on twitter?) Are really that fucking dense? The daughter of Slovenian villagers emigrating to Australia ends up as the deputy leader of one of the two major parties in the nation on a salary of hundreds of thousands of dollars and amasses a property fortune IS MYSTIFIED BY THIS WORD ASPIRATION. She even has the gall to accuse the OTHER side that they're only "giving tax cuts to people like them"- as if she's not one of "them" herself ! Unbelievable head up in arse interview. Oh and remember your point about taxes being higher under the coalition. She literally is against the tax cuts Yes its an oldie but a goodie and why Labor is making she keeps her mouth shut this time around. She wasn't mystified by the word 'aspiration' she questioned the relevance of the word in that discussion. Do you honestly think she doesn't know the definition of 'aspiration'? See if you can drag out an essay from when Albo was at Uni as some LNP pleb did a few weeks back. It should be somewhere in under the washing basket. Wasn't my point about taxes being higher but in any case yes they should be against tax cuts. (Her point being tax cuts disproportionally favoured wealthier people.) The money for all this stuff we're getting has to come from somewhere and if that means not cutting taxes then so be it. Let me ask you a question. If both parties go to every election promising tax cuts and then they legislate those tax cuts every time where do you think the money is going come from to pay for our defence, health, aging population etc etc? Where? You can't keep promising tax cuts forever. Eventually it will become self defeating and the country will go broke. Or we can just borrow another $800 billion and kick the can down the road again.. Do you honestly think tax should always be reduced. Every election cycle?
Member since 2008.
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAnd speaking of everything you see around you, next time you’re at Sydney harbour you can soak it in and thank labor for having the vision to put a country on the world map.
Where the place be without that wonderful Opera House building and the story behind it?
The funny thing is I am not even 'Labor'....I am def not greens (although I support environmental policies), in fact I have voted plenty of times in the past with a conservative (usually centre) politician. However it is impossible to stand by and see the utter contempt, destruction, selfishness and corruption these nasty LNP imbeciles have put the country and marginalised groups through. The things you're talking about-theatres opera houses, markets are things that those in privileged positions enjoy making issues of and feel good about for "preserving". A train station is not for the priviiged - it's called culture. It;'s how we develop our intellect and thinking - and nice things in life. A market is where we buy our food and people make a living - or are we only allowed to go to Harvey Norman or Wollies for that? FFS, what do you want, a miserble existence with 13 year olds still working in coal mines on every block. What do I want? How about a hospital so that babies don't die because of a lack of one ? Go and talk to hose parents about "culture" and all the "nice things in life" that you have and they don't..see how you go. Fight the inequality So this is exactly why I find leftists such so objectionable. Ignorant. Hypocrites. out of touch. Lacking in self-awareness. No capacity for self-reflection. Basically Fake. You two ARE part of the privileged that you claim to be against. You just can't see it. . What are you on about? I am not against anyone privileged. Hard work deserves success - not corruption and handouts for the elites. Hard ships - lol, ,I was in a war ffs when a kid. People getting shot almost daily. I left that, now speak 4 languages (I dont mean to sound like a hotshot with that) - BUt I know the importance of being rewarded for achievements. Likewise, I feel I am qualified to talk about the importance of a society that takes care of people and gives everyone an opportunity. TBH if people like you planned the world it would be a dark miserable place. Comes down to philosophical differences. Enzo, like many Americans, believe that no one deserves a handout and everyone is born equal with equal opportunities. You and I don't. You can't win. The American/Enzo mindset is weird. (To us.) Warren Buffet says he pays less tax than his secretary and yet when polled if they think taxes on the ultra wealthy should increase most Americans disagree. They have a different mindset. Here, traditionally we've seen wealth as something to aspire to, but obscene wealth as something that's a bit wrong. In the US they think that's fine and dandy. One the other hand at least the Americans have grand tradition of philanthropy. Australia is by all accounts near the bottom of billionaires donating money. (Donating money = WTF!! Enzo's head exploding.) Twiggy giving away $100m a year is pretty cool though. See this is the problem with people like you. You use generalizations, stereotypes and just make things up. As for aspiration, go and teach Tanya " This 'aspiration' term mystifies me" Plibersek what it means: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=10155570093061728 What are you on about. She's making perfect sense. All she's saying is if taxes are higher at $100k that's not going to stop people wanting to earn $100k. That stupid argument gets me every time. Billy Businessman can put on 4 new clients and make 50% more income but oh no the tax rate in that bracket he will move into has gone up 2 cents. Fuck a duck now I'm not going to take on those new clients and increase my income by 50%. I'd hate to be paying an additional 2 cents over whatever the previous tax bracket was. Just as ridiculous as it sounds. Edit: Just noticed that video is over 4 years old. Really are rummaging around in the bottom drawer now aren't you. (Do you have spreadsheet with hyperlinks you've been collecting for years or do you get these from LNP meme pages on twitter?) Are really that fucking dense? The daughter of Slovenian villagers emigrating to Australia ends up as the deputy leader of one of the two major parties in the nation on a salary of hundreds of thousands of dollars and amasses a property fortune IS MYSTIFIED BY THIS WORD ASPIRATION. She even has the gall to accuse the OTHER side that they're only "giving tax cuts to people like them"- as if she's not one of "them" herself ! Unbelievable head up in arse interview. Oh and remember your point about taxes being higher under the coalition. She literally is against the tax cuts Yes its an oldie but a goodie and why Labor is making she keeps her mouth shut this time around. She wasn't mystified by the word 'aspiration' she questioned the relevance of the word in that discussion. Do you honestly think she doesn't know the definition of 'aspiration'? See if you can drag out an essay from when Albo was at Uni as some LNP pleb did a few weeks back. It should be somewhere in under the washing basket. Wasn't my point about taxes being higher but in any case yes they should be against tax cuts. (Her point being tax cuts disproportionally favoured wealthier people.) The money for all this stuff we're getting has to come from somewhere and if that means not cutting taxes then so be it. Let me ask you a question. If both parties go to every election promising tax cuts and then they legislate those tax cuts every time where do you think the money is going come from to pay for our defence, health, aging population etc etc? Where? You can't keep promising tax cuts forever. Eventually it will become self defeating and the country will go broke. Or we can just borrow another $800 billion and kick the can down the road again.. Do you honestly think tax should always be reduced. Every election cycle? That's not what she said. She said she's "mystified where this term "aspiration" comes from". Well she should ask her parents where "aspiration" comes from. But like every inner city regressive, now that she's doin' ok jack, she wants to pull the ladder up. In a progressive tax system, tax cuts will always favour wealthier taxpayers. Its fucking intellectually dishonest to say otherwise. You don't help people who pay zero or little tax by giving them a tax cut because they pay sweet FA tax in the first place. You do it by giving them welfare payments. Labor and the greens knew this but they went on a path of division and setting people against each other. The people saw through the lies. Income tax revenue has increased as a proportion of government revenue and more of the burden is being carried more than ever by the higher income earners. Its right that there is a re-calibration of who pays what.
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 15K,
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These 'gotcha' questions by the press are becoming tiresome. (And the lack of respect by the journos has gone next level. One thing to ask a tough question and insist it be answered but not with such vitriol. Calm the fuck down fellas.) Having said that Albo should be better across his policies. He's giving an easy free kick to Scomo. Adam Bandt handled it best. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=465601105361074Like he said it should be a 'contest of ideas' not a general knowledge quiz.
Member since 2008.
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Burztur
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 9.1K,
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+xThese 'gotcha' questions by the press are becoming tiresome. (And the lack of respect by the journos has gone next level. One thing to ask a tough question and insist it be answered but not with such vitriol. Calm the fuck down fellas.) Having said that Albo should be better across his policies. He's giving an easy free kick to Scomo. Adam Bandt handled it best. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=465601105361074Like he said it should be a 'contest of ideas' not a general knowledge quiz. Agreed. It's cheap journalism.
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
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+xThese 'gotcha' questions by the press are becoming tiresome. (And the lack of respect by the journos has gone next level. One thing to ask a tough question and insist it be answered but not with such vitriol. Calm the fuck down fellas.) Having said that Albo should be better across his policies. He's giving an easy free kick to Scomo. Adam Bandt handled it best. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=465601105361074Like he said it should be a 'contest of ideas' not a general knowledge quiz. All the Greens have is ideas. Its actually paying for them and making them work where their problems are.
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tsf
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 14K,
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+xThese 'gotcha' questions by the press are becoming tiresome. (And the lack of respect by the journos has gone next level. One thing to ask a tough question and insist it be answered but not with such vitriol. Calm the fuck down fellas.) Having said that Albo should be better across his policies. He's giving an easy free kick to Scomo. Adam Bandt handled it best. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=465601105361074Like he said it should be a 'contest of ideas' not a general knowledge quiz. Tik tok generation.
Everything is done with the idea of producing a 15 second social media clip.
Having said that it looks like deliberate targeting at albo
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