From all reports were they made by trained coaches?

I'm assuming you are linked with Marconi. Do we know each other?

Edited by Decentric: 9/11/2013 10:34:14 AM

I've seen other footage of the NSWPL too.

What I'm saying is that even from observing the one game I can make appraisals of their ability, technical and tactical, like a number of other trained coaches at the event.

I've also spent some time discussing the game with the South coach. He was disappointed they didn't win baed on the balance of play.

Bigger people in FFA have suggested than the current talent base is cause for concern in the bigger states. They also concede Tassie is fast closing the gap in underage teams. Notwithstanding, the bigger states have playing stocks at elite level that are cause for concern at this point in time.

It is not my opinion about the huge gap that exists between NPL and HAL, but an A League coach's opinion. We all want the gap to close.

South Hobart were the top team in the state.

Unequivocally, they should have represented Tasmania on merit.

South Hobart also represented Tasmania on merit.... but you are trying to downplay them, claiming "oh, we beat them easily; they only scraped home in most of their games" etc etc

Go teach your grandma to suck eggs, decentric....

Reading this thread with interest. Decentric, from all reports it was a very convincing win by united whilst playing very poorly. You seem to have concluded that fnsw PL is below your expected standard based on watching that one game. If that is the case you are a goose or a troll looking for a reaction. If it's the latter, I guess you succeeded.

Most clubs in NSWPL lose their best young players to one of the HAL clubs every year, and without any or little training compensation so to suggest there are no players capable of stepping up is bollocks. Marconi loses players to them every year as do our neighbors United, Bonnyrigg, Blacktown etc...

I've evaluated Sydney United in semi-professional, pro coaching criteria. They came up short.

South Hobart has a feeder area of about 30 000 or 40 000. This is the first year they've played state league, which is a step up from the old Tassie regional leagues only the season before.

SU have had years of supposed tough competition against Blacktown, Sydney Olympic, Marconi and the like. Our state TD emphasises this point. They should be match hardened.

Sydney has a population of 4 million. There are 2 HAL clubs and how many state league clubs?

Hobart has a population of 200 000 with 5 state league clubs.

I said Rudan is very knowledgeable. He knows a lot more about football than me. It is is embarrassing that you can suggest I think I know more than him!#-o

Rudes looked like he was very frustrated with the way his team played against South Hobart. It is hard to change bad habits. One HAL coach I've spoken to is frustrated that state league players struggle to make the step up to the HAL.

As coaches, FFA, and the KNVB coach education I've had, stress doing most of the coaching on the training track and at half time. Rudes was going berserk!

Edited by Decentric: 8/11/2013 01:12:32 PM

This really intrigues me. What relevance does the population of NSW have? It's closer to 7mil than 8, by the way. Not that either figure is relevant

Firstly, the state of NSW itself is split between a number of federations (eg NNSW).
Secondly, does the population of Bourke, Broken Hill or Parkes really have any impact on Sydney United?
Thirdly, United is within walking distance of two other large clubs - Marconi and Bonnyrigg White Eagles. Aside from them, you've got Blacktown City and Blacktown Spartans from the NSWPL who are in the west of Sydney. So just within the top league United is competing with 5 clubs for talent. Then you've got 6 clubs in NPL2 who are out West as well
The argument of NSW having a population of 7 million is irrelevant.

The other irrelevant argument is the amateur/semi-pro argument. I'd bet that both sides train the same amount of times a week. Every single player in both squads would have a full time job along with their part-time football commitments. Further to that, the United players werent paid for the NPL so, technically, they were also amateurs during the NPL series.

They won the Grand Final after winning 2 penalty shootouts to get there. They finished well behind the best side in the league during the regular season.

Winning the GF doesnt make them the best side in SA

Decentric > Rudan , LOL

Put your medals on the table

What you seem to forget is that Campbelltown represented South Australia on merit.

The perception you seem to have is that they were unworthy of representing South Australia.

Yet they won a competition to do this. In that particular competition they're the best team in South Australia in 2013, or another team would have won it.

Sydney United have a coach, Mark Rudan, who demonstrates great knowledge on TV, and is highly trained with recent FFA coach education at a very high level. However, his team didn't reflect his knowledge base.


When one looks at aspects of KPIs, Sydney United were substandard in most, ostensibly for a semi-pro team from a state with circa 8 million , playing an amateur club from a state with 500 000.


We know we are an amateur league in the Apple Isle, even in the NPL. It surprised many stakeholders in football that, Sydney United, a semi-pro side played like that. Who has coached these guys to play the football they did on Sunday, up through the development ranks?

What does this say about the NSWPL? What is going on with their development systems? Han Berger said the standard of Tasmanian football is equal to other parts of Australia now. This was b greeted by ridicule in some parts of the inter web. After seeing the football served up by the NSWPL premiers, Sydney United, in the Oz NPL final, there is validity in Berger's proposition.



Sydney United often did not take the ball away from opponents with the first touch.

SU were often unable to play effective first touches in tight spaces.

They were frequently inaccurate with short passing under squeezing pressure.

SU's passing over range was often poor.

The 1v1 attacking skills were often disappointing.

There were frequently heads down when running with the ball.

Players seldom checked when marked heavily.

There was slow handling speed from SU.

SU players were too reliant on one foot and general one-sided play.

The game sense was often questionable from SU players.

SU often hoofed straight long balls up into the mixer for easy heading duels for South CBs.

Sydney frequently didn't look where they were playing the ball, even if they had time on it !

Sydney United seemed unable to create angled passing lanes, with the body position to play forwards, due to squeezing and full pressing other Tassie NPL teams sometimes respond better to, than Sydney United did against South. Even when they had their heads up, SU still played lots of taboo straight balls. Even most youth rep teams don't play straight balls.

SU couldn't often string more than 3 successive passes together, particularly in the attacking half, because of inadequate and incorrect movement off the ball. Did the players have an absence of coaching cues to achieve this end through the development ranks, when results were paramount for these footballers?


SU players didn't seem to have a clear enough concept of supporting the player on the ball, and if they did, they created the wrong angles for an effective passing lane.

SU just managed to maintain shape, but still had too much distance between the lines. This afforded South too much time and space on the ball. Eventually, SU disgracefully started running out of gas against an amateur team towards the end of the game. This is even with 11 SU players versus 10 South players.

SU wide players were often receiving the ball at the incorrect angle to their opponent. Optimally, they should be in a line with the opponent, so they break the line with the first touch. It was absent from SU.


The strengths of Sydney United, were physical strength, speed over the turf, solid 1v1 defensive skills, good use of the body in physical contests and they tackled well.

They also had effective defensive shape with the back four throughout most of the game and were hard to break down. They were much more clinical around goal than South Hobart. However, these are common traits of Aussie footballers from past epochs.

I want to see NSWPL champs, play better football than they did. In a small state like this, we want to see football to aspire to. Normatively, Sydney United should only be a shade below the HAL in standard. Empirically, Sydney United would not look out of place in the Tassie V League.

Any neutral observer from Europe watching the game, would have thought it was a contest between two teams from the same league. There should be a chasm of difference in standard between the premiers of Tassie V League and the NSWPL. There wasn't.




In the past, South have been outclassed by VPL teams in pre-season games. In the last game when I saw them play Bentleigh Greens it may have been a draw. A few seasons ago the likes of Melbourne Knights and South Melbourne were far too good for South.

From watching them play the games I did, no.

Implicit in the word domination, there are connotations of circulation football being played against most opposition. it was not always the case. South may have been a bit fitter than the opposition. Hence, winning games late in contests.

Our club beat them decisively in one game and drew the other in the V League, I think. It wasn't till they played interstate competition that I started to rate South. I thought that our V League club was better over the two games.

Edited by Decentric: 7/11/2013 11:04:23 PM

I think every single aspect.

results dont matter even at senior level. No need for a league table

They only lost one game and finished 15 points ahead. Would you classify that as being "dominant" or not?

Don't you ever look at a league table...?:lol:

At the start of the season this South Hobart team were a rabble, if they lost matches its not suprising.
Look at this video, they were very amateur looking and they seem to have gotten reinforcements, plus they look like they were very casual and unfit at the start of the season. Looking at them versus Sydney United they would have not only have gone undefeated they would not have lost a match either if they were at that standard during the whole of the V-league.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hx-A0liV7Wo

They won quite a number of games in the last few minutes, after being very close contests.

I wasn't aware South were 15 points in front of the second team on the ladder.

If I had the chance to buy Zeljko a beer and have a chat, that would be well down the list past mentioning his gambling :twisted:

Here, here =d>

I found this quote interesting. They finished on top by 15 points and only lost one game all season. How is that not a dominant force?

the problem still exists today as id did 30 years ago of nepotism and chronism and arse licking parents, along with club football directors who select players based on vested interests and ulterior motives.......

until such time as an accurate selection and scouting structure is implemented there is little hope of identifying real quality prospects......so many top quality players give up at youth level due to the crap that goes down and the favouritism, lost to the flawed system by the age of 17-18, preferring to chase pussy and piss because the system has failed them........


14-20 players out of 10 teams with a player pool of say 20 over 8 years is absolutely fuck all......something like 0.00125%.....

i have been involved in running NSWPL and NSWSL clubs coached and managed for over 15 years and besides what i have stated above the governing body does little by way of direction with it's on again off again relegation and promotional paths that change at the drop of a hat to suit their own needs and the needs of the favourite clubs.....

What "Cup"? Campbelltown got lucky in three games- two of them by penalty shootouts! A 27 game league season was the real test of consistency in SA.

You just can't let it go, can you?

Speaking for Sydney, I think the following are ex-NSWPL:

Janjetovic, Necevski, Powell, Gligor, Jurman, Warren, Mallia, Chianese, Triantis, Petkovski, Urosevski and Dotti that I can think of.

And in previous years Sherlock and Cole came from Olympic.

That's not bad IMO.

Don't forget a few will get a start in NSWPL youth sides and then get picked up by the NYL team.

If you're saying that we're not identifying 24-25 year olds playing NSWPL and bringing them into the HAL that's a different matter. Not being someone who watches a great deal of NSWPL I can't comment on their standard.

Either way, you can't compare where we're at with 6-7 years ago when there were nowhere near as many young boys being brought through from NSWPL and into HAL.

well that ain't doing such a crash hot job of identifying the better NSWPL players who can step up....

I think that's changing which is why we're seeing more young guys in the HAL than before.

totally agree

another problem is the A-League coaches and staff do not want to take risks, they are all guilty of lack of development and vision.....

it's very simple...:d ...the tasmanians have the advantage of playing with their relatives......;)