Why the Dutch seem to have forgotten how to play soccer


Why the Dutch seem to have forgotten how to play soccer

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Arthur
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Justafan wrote:
Barca4Life wrote:
Justafan wrote:
This is what I am seeing with the SAP at grass root club level is either teams focusing too heavily on 1 or 2 skills such as RWTB or 1v1 or passing or just trying to win.

Why not just focus on all 4 key skills at the SAP age? rotating the skills over the year. The thing that I feel gets lost in the FFA NC is the individual creativity part. My belief is let them play and encourage them to do different things on a field i.e. if someone is dominating the game dribbling ask them in the second half can they put a through ball to the forwards? to mix their game up.

To me being able to make the killer ball is being individually creative as dribbling through everyone.

I would also like to see some additional focus on shooting drills especially at 10 to 12 age group.

Just my thoughts or else we will create similar 1 dimensional players as the Dutch appear to be doing.


Well in SAP from what i've seen all core skills are taught every 6 week basis, and often get rotated.

But you're right i would like to see the coaches just let the players to encourage to use all core skills rather than focus one or two things depending on the situation during training on during the weekend.

To let players create their own style and build confidence and creativity this needs to happen, or else we will create robots which harm in long term.

It seems like the results of this are happening for the dutch from what i've seen from them.


From my experience I would agree and say that the SAP at grass root level is slowly improving and some clubs are really making a effort (heard some good things from coaches at other clubs) but I would say at Miniroo level the majority is still not doing this. I have played teams at the beginning of the year and then at the end of the year and I have seen very little improvement in those teams, if any.

Just the other week doing a coaching course I was talking to one coach who's focus was just on passing and then the coach to the left of me was talking about just doing RWTB as they can learn passing later.

One thing I have noticed with new coaches is their willingness to talk about doing a coaching course, this was something I did not hear often when I first started. The clubs are also starting to push this more. Of course what you do after the course is up to the individual coach.

But at least most know what the 4 key skills are now, a couple year of ago most could not even tell you this.

Interesting comments regarding coaches philosophies at coaching course.
Fundamental problem at clubs in Australia is coaches at clubs running their own football philosophies.
A footballer in Australia starting at 6 years of age by the time he's 18 could have had 12 coaches with 12 different philosophies and conflicting messages.
To develop elite footballers you need clubs providing football philosophies on a long term development process implemented by coaches not coaches providing players with one year snapshots of their football philosophies.
Player development needs to be seen much like the education system, primary school and high school with educational building blocks that are age appropriate and consistent.
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krones3 wrote:
we are handing over well trained players to shit coaches


Classic quote for me love love it.....

Shit coaches end up with quality juniors based on two factors;
1. Dumb luck
2. They are "aquirers of talent".

Edited by Arthur: 26/12/2015 08:28:39 AM
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Found this beauty right now, explains accurately about the dutch style and how they should not abandon ship but go back to what made them successful stylistically.

Bit long but great read. =d>

Contains some videos and graphs too, can't copy for some reason ](*,)

Quote:
The Dutch School is alive and well, just not in the Netherlands

GUEST   on 22 December, 2015 at 01:33

By Pieter Zwart – This article previously appeared in Dutch on football blog Catenaccio.nl

The Dutch School is dead. With a classic 4-3-3 formation, the Dutch national team failed to qualify for Euro 2016, despite there being 24 places up for grabs. Dutch clubs are being slaughtered every time they cross the border. Even Ajax have concluded that things have to change, with head of academy Wim Jonk, the last defender of Johan Cruijff’s philosophy, being forced out. Even Cruijff distanced himself from Ajax after that incident in the same week in which current national team coach Danny Blind yielded to the call of playing a defensive 5-3-2 against Wales(!). Dutch football has lost its ideological feathers and even the media’s heralding of the Dutch School seems to have softened: It’s time for realism and pragmatism.

Before we ritually bury this ideology, we first have to answer the question: What actually is the Dutch School? The first issue is that this has never been properly defined. A Google search for ‘The Dutch School’ only turns up information on the Golden Era in Dutch art, the 16th century. Even the KNVB are unclear on what is meant with ‘The Dutch School’. Asking around on Twitter, it quickly became clear that there is not one clear definition or understanding of what it means. The descriptions of what the Dutch School should contain can simply be brought down to three categories:

The Dutch School is the Netherlands 1974 World Cup (Or another team)
At first instance, this definition seems plausible. Did the Dutch play according to the Dutch School in the 1974 World Cup? The answer to that question is a clear ‘yes’. But when we’re exploring this definition, it soon turns out to be far too narrow. When one would ask what a chair is, any chair would do as an answer, even though this chair is a fairly specific one.

The team of 1974 undoubtedly has the characteristics of a ‘Dutch School team’, but not all of characteristics of that team (for example playing with a false nine) are necessary to actually play the style for which the Dutch School stands for. This is what makes using one team as a benchmark way too simplistic. The answer is more likely to be found in several teams with the predicament of the Dutch School. Just like the definition of a chair can be applied to chairs of several styles, ‘football’ doesn’t limit itself to one definite description of the game.

The Dutch School is 4-3-3 (fill in your favourite formation)
This definition seems plausible at first glance, just as the previous one. The Dutch played a 4-3-3 formation during the ‘74 World Cup and this goes for most teams in the Eredivisie currently as well. However, this description has similar quirks compared to the previous definition. The ‘Dutch School chair’ might not be a ‘chair’ in this comparison, but just a piece of furniture consisting of four legs. In most situations this might come near the truth, but it doesn’t account for its exceptions.

This becomes clear when discussing the 4-3-3 formation. According to one, the Dutch School uses 4-3-3 with attacking full backs, whereas another says the libero defender is crucial to the system. While the two styles might fit in separate formations, it is highly unlikely a manager uses three of its four defenders to push into midfield. Apart from that, is the focus of the midfield the attacking No.10, or is it the holding midfielder? Is it necessary for the wingers to have chalk on their boots? Accepting such definitions will lead to many teams being considered teams playing according to the Dutch School, without actually doing that, or teams adopting ‘Dutch School’ principles but not being accepted as such due to formation. High profile exceptions to this are the counterattacking 4-3-3 deployed by Jose Mourinho’s Chelsea, or the 3-4-3 Ajax used in 1995 to win the Dutch their last Champions League. If 4-3-3 is accepted as an essential part of defining the Dutch School, a team such as the 1995 Ajax one would be excluded, even though it is widely accepted as one of the pinnacles of Dutch football.

At the same time, it turns out that the 4-3-3 is one of the most popular ways to describe what the ‘Dutch School’ is. At some Dutch clubs, there is even a constitutional demand for 4-3-3 to be the leading formation for the first team. And so, a fairly innocent description has led to a dogma that is now threatening Dutch football as a whole. When you think a chair always needs to have four legs, you won’t be thinking of a three- or even a two-legged one.

The Dutch School is applying principles of the game that lead to attractive football (fill in your principles here)
This third and last definition is the best one to actually apply. It is not too specific neither is it too abstract. The principles of play describe ‘the piece of furniture with legs and a seat’ that makes for a chair. By adding the mission of ‘playing attractive football’, the sentence itself becomes more of a concept, as for example ‘a comfortable chair’. The Dutch School demands ‘the chair of football’ not only to be able to be sat upon, but also to be comfortable. Entertaining the crowd (the comfort part) becomes a goal in itself.

In the end, it leads to the following definition: ‘The Dutch School is committing to the plays of principle that lead to attractive football, ending in as positive a result as possible’. This covers both the principles of play the Dutch School and the result it should lead to in a proper fashion.

Principles of play

Without any clear other definition or ‘definer’, the best source to turn to in order to answer this question is Johan Cruijff. An essential part of the Ajax teams of the seventies as well as the Dutch 1974 team, he is someone who has influenced two clubs (Ajax & Barcelona) that purport themselves as disciples of the Dutch School and who as a manager has had his say in the evolution of both clubs over the last few decades and, arguably, European football in general.

Johan Cruijff has never been clear about his principles of play. But we can extract nine of his previous quotes that describe his vision on football.

Keeping the field small
‘If I need to defend the whole garden, I am the worst, if I need to defend only a small part of it, I am the best: It all has to do with metres, nothing more’.

The foundation of the Dutch School is using spaces to its optimum. The most revolutionary aspect of the Oranje in 1974 was that the offside trap was used as a weapon for attack. The back line stormed forwards, limiting the space of the opponent and often conquering possession. “To be clear: Playing on offside is an attacking move,” Cruijff wrote in De Telegraaf. “Because the offside trap decides the size of the playing field.”

Cruijff then explained the logic between keeping spaces limited whenever the ball is not in possession. “Things are often too easy for the opponent. By giving them two or three metres, they appear better footballers than they actually are. When you’re limiting them, they often turn out to be way worse. Therefore, you must prevent your opponents from looking better than they are.”

This distinction is often already made before actually losing possession. Cruijff states that distances between players, especially in the axis of the team, should never be too big. Crucial within all of this is creating lines, creating the option of closing in as a formation whenever possession is lost.

Since 1974, keeping play compact has become more and more important. For international coaches, compactness has become the magic word. This principle of the Dutch School has become more important and more widespread than ever before.

Direct pressure after losing possession
‘Whenever possession was lost, the striker turned into the first defender and that attitude ran through the whole team. It is essential in transition’.

In order to attack, it is necessary to keep focus for whenever the ball is lost during transition. Cruijff explains that by doing this, a team can be prevented from dropping back into its own half whenever the ball is lost. “Defending needs to occur on every position of the field, it costs less energy than when a team doesn’t have to get back to its own half in order to gain possession and score a goal.”Apart from saving energy, Cruijff sees direct pressing when possession is lost as the right strategy from a defensive point of view as well. “That way, your opponent remains under your control, by keeping spaces small and taking away any depth in their play”. An extra advantage of applying pressure when the ball is lost is that the opponent probably needs a lot of energy to regain possession while lacking a proper organisation, making it easier for the team to recover possession.

In modern football this tactic is often described as counterpressing, a widely discussed and documented phenomenon. ‘Counterpressing is the best playmaker in the world’, said current Liverpool manager Jürgen Klopp when he was at Borrussia Dortmund. His former rival Pep Guardiola uses the same principle for his teams.

3. Defending spaces rather than opponents
‘When a player is not marked, he cannot get away from marking either’

As a coach, Johan Cruijff understood that a team can be active without being in possession. ‘You can be dominant with or without the ball’. The only way to manage the last one is by applying zonal marking. The opposition has to adjust to the positioning of the team that way. When that is combined with keeping the field small and pressing, it will leave the opponent without a moment of rest.

Cruijff has a personal reason for preferring zonal marking to man-marking too. He is too much of a lover of football to give the greats an actual task. “I love creative players,” he said. “I would never try to eliminate a player like that from play by getting him a man-marker. I would look at which players are looking for him and would try to make that impossible. If the creative player only receives half of the passes he usually gets, he is only half the problem he usually is.”

These days, zonal marking is the golden rule for almost all big competitions. Managers have found out that a good organization can mask a lack of quality in a side. The Eredivisie is an exception to the rule in that.

Depth over width
‘A playing style in which a pass wide is unacceptable’

Johan Cruijff is allergic to passes wide in build-up play. He is insistent on the midfield getting the ball inside opponents’ half and while facing the opposition goal. To make that possible, Cruijff insists that a pass forwards always trumps a pass sideways in terms of philosophy.

Cruijff explains that this principal is mainly important when the opposition is trying to put pressure on the team. “When the ball is only passed sideways, the risk occurs where you get trapped. By choosing the way forward – without blindly booting it forward – you can exclude this risk.”

In the last few decades, football has increasingly become a sport in which transitional play has become crucial. Teams are often well organised, meaning they are often only vulnerable when possession is lost. During the most recent World Cup, on average fewer than three passes were needed to score a goal. Especially when the ball is won, preferring a ball forward over one sideways is crucial as the opponent is more likely to be surprised at that specific point in a match.

5. Build-up play through the centre
“The problem starts with playing in the full-backs. At that point, you only have a quarter of the field left to you. With that 25 percent, the full-back has to manage and when the opponent puts pressure on those full-backs, there is little left to do but pass it back to the keeper’.

To be able to dominate, as much possession as possible is needed at the centre of the field. When the players are positioned well, the players in the centre naturally would have several options to pass the ball to. This makes it more difficult for the opposition to disrupt the building-up from the team.

The idea of a full-back being responsible for the build-up play from defence leaves Johan Cruijff, naturally, in disgust. He thinks the full-backs should only be used in attack and not when the ball is in the attacking team’s own half. As coach at Barcelona, Cruijff used two footballing defenders in Ronald Koeman and Pep Guardiola in his defence. This enhanced the use of wingers and strikers whenever they were moving between the lines. The thought behind this is that the attackers can actually lay off the ball to a midfielder, who then would have the play in front of him.

As for previously managed principles, this has become more of a norm rather than an exception in international football. The German FA (DFB) for example divides the field into five different areas.
The most central area is seen as the most valuable. From the most central lane on the pitch, you can go each way and from there, you’re closer to the goal. Given that this is always a crowded area, it also leaves you with less time to make decisions. As a result, a lot of attention goes out to the so-called half-spaces. These lanes are in a quite central position as well, but there’s not as much pressure applied to players in possession there and it leaves the player with the option of playing a diagonal pass that is difficult to defend. Pep Guardiola always tried to pull all kinds of tricks in order to dominate the centre. At Barcelona, Lionel Messi often transformed into an extra midfielder, whereas his Bayern sees their full-backs offer extra back-up in the middle.

6. Third man and triangles
‘This has nothing to do with positional play. Because the third man can’t be reached. Which is why you see 30 balls back to the keeper per game’.

When Johan Cruijff discusses team passing, he often talks about triangles and getting a third man involved. The theory behind getting a third man involved is simple: The positioning of a team, according to Cruijff, is optimal when a player has two options in possession.

The so-called third man is a result of a coming-together of several triangles on the field. The third man is the player that starts to move once two team-mates start to set up a passing move. In practice, this is very difficult to defend. The opponent is often focused on the two players passing, but instead of seeing a one-two play out, the defender can be caught out by a third option presenting itself.

The fact that Cruijff often pleas for a 4-3-3 is a result of him wanting to see those triangles on the field rather than a love for the formation in itself. “Four at the back and four in midfield has no chance of functioning properly. The triangles fall away. You must always have triangles, because only that ensures a player of having two options in possession.”

For teams who prefer possession, creating triangles is still crucial. Successful coaches such as Thomas Tüchel, Pep Guardiola, Luis Enrique, Louis van Gaal, Marcelo Bielsa and Jorge Sampaoli have all acknowledged and emphasised the value of this.

Creating one-on-ones
‘If my attacker comes into a one-on-one, I always say: “’Let him sort it out’’. The players then say: ’’But we can help him’’ My answer then is: “At first, there is a chance of you walking into his space and second, you’ll pull a second defender in and 2 vs 2 is more difficult than 1 vs 1”.’

For Johan Cruijff, creating one vs ones is an important attacking weapon. The former No.14 assumes a team has an attack with exceptional qualities. The goal of the passing game of a team is to get these players into a position where they can take somebody on, resulting into a situation where the attacking team has more men in attack than the opponent in dangerous positions.

Cruijff sees too many teams where this principle isn’t applied, or is misunderstood. “Now Robben gets on the ball and the right back and the striker move towards him. Instead of a 1 v 1, it turns into a 3 v 3 and the previous advantage is now gone”. This principle works the other way as well: When an attacker can be brought into a one-on-one position this should always be preferred to a pass wide.

According to Guardiola, this principle of play counts for every team sport. “The secret is to overawe your opponent in numbers at one side of the pitch, causing your opponent to re-shuffle in order to avoid becoming defensively prone at one side. By creating a majority on one end, you draw the opposition that way and it leaves you with the chance to hit them at the other end.”

Interchanging of positions
‘Put one in as a striker, make it a tutti frutti’

Another important principle of play of Johan Cruijff is creating and profiting from operational spaces. This idea of Cruijff originates from his playing career, when he as a striker started to roam more and more to lose his markers. This caused the striker position to become more of an operational space: Other players, such as left winger Piet Keizer, right winger John Rep and midfielder Johan Neeskens profited from this by getting into this area and causing confusion.

The interchanging and usage of space are good ways of disorienting a well-organised opponent. At the same time, this is the most important thought behind Total Football: When a left forward is capable of defending and a left full back is capable of attacking, they can interchange depending on the situation. This asks a lot from the players, especially in terms of football intelligence, but when applied well it leads to a flexible formation that is hard to contain for any opposition.

In modern football, Universality is a core principle. Players are expected to have qualities that will allow them to play in several positions and several roles. That tendency was predicted in the 80’s by then-AC Milan manager Arrigo Sacchi, who said: “Football will evolve into a game that more and more will exist as one big midfield”. What the Italian meant was that the spaces would get smaller, leaving less space for the true specialists in football. The playmaker who doesn’t defend, the winger who only keeps track of the line he’s running next to, the poacher in the striker position and the butcher-type defender: These were the type of players that were close to extinct.

Football has become a game that is being played in small spaces, and from that, switching positions and using operational spaces has become more important than ever. Basically any top team has variances on these concepts. For example, look at the amount of midfielders played from the flank, only to create an extra man in the centre of midfield. These type of tactical tricks are more of a rule than an exception these days.

Profit from weaknesses
‘Find the weak spot of your opponent and you have won’

The ninth and last principal from the Dutch School is using the weaknesses of your opponent through tactical tweaks. “The difficult part of an easy match is making your opponent actually play badly”, is what Johan Cruijff once said.

The Dutch School is about trusting your own power, but it also means that you have to use the weaknesses of your opponent by adapting your tactic to the team that you’re facing. Cruijff once said, talking to Amsterdam-based newspaper Het Parool: “I am the street football coach, I try to use any small advantage I can find to my disposal”. A famous trick of Cruijff was to play a player like Michael Laudrup as a striker, leaving the man-markers of the opposition without a reference point.

Pep Guardiola explains how he adapted his Bayern team to an opponent with five defenders:

Guardiola, an apprentice of Cruijff, took this principal of his master to a next level. For him, this is now the core of the job. “I sit down, watch videos and take notes. That’s when a moment of inspiration comes to me”, Guardiola states in the brilliant Pep Confidential. “All of a sudden, I am sure I’ve got it, the solution to us getting a victory. These are the moments that give my job purpose.”

Benchmark

Now that a definition of the Dutch School has been established by nine principles of play, we can test this compared to teams who are famous for being linked to the Dutch School.


It seems these teams are definitely fitting within the definitions of the Dutch School. That does not mean the definition is infallible, but it could well serve as a good starting point discussing what the Dutch School actually is.

Of the selected teams, Vitesse comes closest to playing according to the Dutch School following the nine principles just established, while the standout team of not doing so is the flagship of Dutch football – the national team. Oranje does play ‘Dutch’ to one of the aforementioned definitions, in shaping up in a (possession-based) 4-3-3, but the actual execution of said formation is miles away from the football that Dutch Football’s ultimate protagonist Johan Cruijff actually preaches.

Or, to put it in Cruijff’s words: “There are many people that can say a team plays bad football, there are only a few that can say why a team plays bad football and only a couple can tell what is needed to make a team play better.”

So let’s be cautious with throwing away a whole philosophy because of one wrong interpretation. The Netherlands can easily maintain without the dogma of 4-3-3 or the wingers with their feet rooted to the sidelines. But that does not mean the principles of the Dutch School are dead and buried, because coaches such as Thomas Tüchel (Borussia Dortmund), Jorge Sampaoli (Chile), Michael Laudrup (without club) and Pep Guardiola (Bayern München) have proven successful with modern interpretation of said philosophy. Having said that, these principles of play are hardly a guarantee for success, but the opposite is hardly true either.

Maybe, Dutch football should not be so busy jumping ship when it comes to abandoning its identity, but should focus on re-inventing its original identity. Because the Dutch School is still alive and well, but not in the Netherlands.

This article previously appeared on Catenaccio.nl in Dutch and is written by the great Pieter Zwart, journalist for Voetbal International and one of the editors of leading Dutch independent football blog Catenaccio.nl. We are thankful that we at BeNeFoot were allowed to translate and publish it in English.

The article has been translated by Michiel Jongsma.

The quotes of Johan Cruijff used in this article are from columns in De Telegraaf, his analysis for the NOS, his boek ‘Voetbal’ and books with assembled quotes from Cruijff, such as ‘Je gaat het pas zien als je het doorhebt’ en ‘Johan Cruijjf uitspraken’.

http://www.benefoot.net/the-dutch-school-is-alive-and-well-just-not-in-the-netherlands/


Edited by Barca4life: 24/12/2015 02:13:07 AM
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Barca4Life wrote:

Study Blind, and you come to Dutch soccer's broader problem. He is the best version of the modern Dutch player: clever, comfortable in several positions, a good passer, but neither fast nor strong nor a good tackler or header.

Dutch soccer has reduced the complex game to the pass -- and the short pass at that. As Dutch journalist Michiel de Hoog and data analyst Sander IJtsma diagnosed this week, the Dutch game has degenerated into harmless passing around one's own defense. It's the style that Arsene Wenger has called "sterile domination": you have the ball, but you don't threaten.

Johan Cruyff, father of Dutch soccer, complains: "Holland is world champion [of] passing sideways and back. The buildup is currently the weakest aspect of our game." Barcelona and Germany pass fast near the opposition's goal; Holland passes slowly near its own. The opposition watches the Dutch "knit" until the moment comes to intercept a pass and break.

Germany, Belgium and Spain -- Holland's role models as it starts to rebuild -- produce passers too. Almost every player in Germany's team, even goalkeeper Manuel Neuer, passes like a midfield playmaker. But in addition, their players have what the Dutch call "specific qualities." Bastian Schweinsteiger is a great tackler, Mesut Ozil a dribbler, Mats Hummels can head, Thomas Muller is an unmatched athlete, and so on.

Older Dutch players do have "specific qualities": Robben's dribble, Sneijder's shot, Ron Vlaar's muscles, Van Persie's nose for goal. But Holland's under-30s lack them. In this generation nobody put in the hours repetitively practising tackles or shots or long passes. Every Dutch player was raised as a short passer, because short passing was conceived of as the whole of soccer.

There used to be more to the Dutch game. For about 30 unbroken years until 2004, Holland's sweeper had arguably the best long pass in international soccer: first Ruud Krol, then Ronald Koeman and finally Frank de Boer. But they had no successor, and now Holland has no alternative to knitting its way out from the back. The Dutch buildup has become unsurprising.




Interesting comments here.

It looks like the Dutch will be be doing what other countries did with them - studying what is occurring in Belgium, Germany and Spain.
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theFOOTBALLlover wrote:
krones3 wrote:
Barca4Life wrote:
Decentric wrote:
biscuitman1871 wrote:

Not sure why you would say SAP should be done on 8 week cycles. It is a 6 week cycle just like in the Game Training phase and the Performance phase.



I used to coach on the other half of the pitch from the head state SAP coach running his program. We played practice matches against them to work in with the 8 week cycles.

Two weeks were allocated to first touch, striking the ball, 1v1 attacking and defensive skills and running with the ball each with two weeks allocated to each core skill. We played them once a fortnight.

The system must have changed.




Edited by Decentric: 17/10/2015 08:11:35 AM


My criticism with SAP it does include Shooting and Heading.

The current youth teams aren't as strong in defensive 1v1s either from what ive seen them.


My criticism is why create creative players to hand them over to mediocre coaches.

ie the NPL system
coaches all clones of each other.


Problem is that most of the coaches in the NPL have come through the old system and have a lot of experience (which is what clubs are looking for). If you don't have the experience, you'll probably have to know someone to get a chance.

I spent two years as an assistant at a club in NSW Super League (second tier). It was then that I was given the chance and coached at the club for three years in NSW State League 1 (third tier). Now I'm finally coaching in NPL1 and I'm only in my mid 20's. There wouldn't be many my age around.

So the problem is opportunity. The best coaches aren't always the ones coaching in NPL1. Just the ones with the most experience.

You are right i keep thinking there must be others out there and not just the same regurgitated names over and over again.

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krones3 wrote:
Barca4Life wrote:
Decentric wrote:
biscuitman1871 wrote:

Not sure why you would say SAP should be done on 8 week cycles. It is a 6 week cycle just like in the Game Training phase and the Performance phase.



I used to coach on the other half of the pitch from the head state SAP coach running his program. We played practice matches against them to work in with the 8 week cycles.

Two weeks were allocated to first touch, striking the ball, 1v1 attacking and defensive skills and running with the ball each with two weeks allocated to each core skill. We played them once a fortnight.

The system must have changed.




Edited by Decentric: 17/10/2015 08:11:35 AM


My criticism with SAP it does include Shooting and Heading.

The current youth teams aren't as strong in defensive 1v1s either from what ive seen them.


My criticism is why create creative players to hand them over to mediocre coaches.

ie the NPL system
coaches all clones of each other.


Problem is that most of the coaches in the NPL have come through the old system and have a lot of experience (which is what clubs are looking for). If you don't have the experience, you'll probably have to know someone to get a chance.

I spent two years as an assistant at a club in NSW Super League (second tier). It was then that I was given the chance and coached at the club for three years in NSW State League 1 (third tier). Now I'm finally coaching in NPL1 and I'm only in my mid 20's. There wouldn't be many my age around.

So the problem is opportunity. The best coaches aren't always the ones coaching in NPL1. Just the ones with the most experience.
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Barca4Life wrote:
Decentric wrote:
biscuitman1871 wrote:

Not sure why you would say SAP should be done on 8 week cycles. It is a 6 week cycle just like in the Game Training phase and the Performance phase.



I used to coach on the other half of the pitch from the head state SAP coach running his program. We played practice matches against them to work in with the 8 week cycles.

Two weeks were allocated to first touch, striking the ball, 1v1 attacking and defensive skills and running with the ball each with two weeks allocated to each core skill. We played them once a fortnight.

The system must have changed.




Edited by Decentric: 17/10/2015 08:11:35 AM


My criticism with SAP it does include Shooting and Heading.

The current youth teams aren't as strong in defensive 1v1s either from what ive seen them.


They should be part of striking the ball.

The SAP I knew had little heading in it.
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Barca4Life wrote:
Decentric wrote:
biscuitman1871 wrote:

Not sure why you would say SAP should be done on 8 week cycles. It is a 6 week cycle just like in the Game Training phase and the Performance phase.



I used to coach on the other half of the pitch from the head state SAP coach running his program. We played practice matches against them to work in with the 8 week cycles.

Two weeks were allocated to first touch, striking the ball, 1v1 attacking and defensive skills and running with the ball each with two weeks allocated to each core skill. We played them once a fortnight.

The system must have changed.




Edited by Decentric: 17/10/2015 08:11:35 AM


My criticism with SAP it does include Shooting and Heading.

The current youth teams aren't as strong in defensive 1v1s either from what ive seen them.


My criticism is why create creative players to hand them over to mediocre coaches.

ie the NPL system
coaches all clones of each other.
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Decentric wrote:
biscuitman1871 wrote:

Not sure why you would say SAP should be done on 8 week cycles. It is a 6 week cycle just like in the Game Training phase and the Performance phase.



I used to coach on the other half of the pitch from the head state SAP coach running his program. We played practice matches against them to work in with the 8 week cycles.

Two weeks were allocated to first touch, striking the ball, 1v1 attacking and defensive skills and running with the ball each with two weeks allocated to each core skill. We played them once a fortnight.

The system must have changed.




Edited by Decentric: 17/10/2015 08:11:35 AM


My criticism with SAP it does include Shooting and Heading.

The current youth teams aren't as strong in defensive 1v1s either from what ive seen them.
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biscuitman1871 wrote:

Not sure why you would say SAP should be done on 8 week cycles. It is a 6 week cycle just like in the Game Training phase and the Performance phase.



I used to coach on the other half of the pitch from the head state SAP coach running his program. We played practice matches against them to work in with the 8 week cycles.

Two weeks were allocated to first touch, striking the ball, 1v1 attacking and defensive skills and running with the ball each with two weeks allocated to each core skill. We played them once a fortnight.

The system must have changed.




Edited by Decentric: 17/10/2015 08:11:35 AM
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Decentric wrote:
Justafan wrote:

From my experience I would agree and say that the SAP at grass root level is slowly improving and some clubs are really making a effort (heard some good things from coaches at other clubs) but I would say at Miniroo level the majority is still not doing this. I have played teams at the beginning of the year and then at the end of the year and I have seen very little improvement in those teams, if any.



One thing I have noticed with new coaches is their willingness to talk about doing a coaching course, this was something I did not hear often when I first started. The clubs are also starting to push this more. Of course what you do after the course is up to the individual coach.

But at least most know what the 4 key skills are now, a couple year of ago most could not even tell you this.


SAP should be done in 8 week cycles. 2 weeks should be assigned to each of the 4 core skills in that time frame.

Interesting point about new coaches talking about attending FFA coaching courses. A lot of older and experienced coaches feel threatened by coaching courses.

With the 4 core skills even some senior NPL coaches are not aware of them if they did advanced coaching courses before the last 2 years to gain accreditation.

A lot of the core skills training is done in earlier coaching courses, considered community coaching courses. It is a useful exercise for a coach at any level to really hone in on 4 different aspects of technique.

Getting back to the thread topic, I wonder what they are doing in Holland regarding core skills in training? In Kuper's article there is a contention that 1v1 skills are not encouraged in the top Dutch academies.

Edited by Decentric: 16/10/2015 08:28:45 AM


SAP is planned on 6 week cycles. The four core skills are rotated within the 6 week cycle and each is given the same amount of time.

So if training twice a week that would be 12 training sessions with 3 sessions allocated to each of the four core skills.

The coach's plan needs to cover off:
equal rotation of the four core skills; specific aspect identified for each skill for duration of cycle; reference to one of the three relevant Ball Possession Key Principles from the Team Model; the main Player Tasks for the coach to concentrate on.

Not sure why you would say SAP should be done on 8 week cycles. It is a 6 week cycle just like in the Game Training phase and the Performance phase.

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Eastern Glory wrote:
krones3 wrote:
we are handing over well trained players to shit coaches

Are you implying that only the coaches teaching the junior years are quality?


I would say that the majority of senior coaches are shite....
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Justafan wrote:

From my experience I would agree and say that the SAP at grass root level is slowly improving and some clubs are really making a effort (heard some good things from coaches at other clubs) but I would say at Miniroo level the majority is still not doing this. I have played teams at the beginning of the year and then at the end of the year and I have seen very little improvement in those teams, if any.



One thing I have noticed with new coaches is their willingness to talk about doing a coaching course, this was something I did not hear often when I first started. The clubs are also starting to push this more. Of course what you do after the course is up to the individual coach.

But at least most know what the 4 key skills are now, a couple year of ago most could not even tell you this.


SAP should be done in 8 week cycles. 2 weeks should be assigned to each of the 4 core skills in that time frame.

Interesting point about new coaches talking about attending FFA coaching courses. A lot of older and experienced coaches feel threatened by coaching courses.

With the 4 core skills even some senior NPL coaches are not aware of them if they did advanced coaching courses before the last 2 years to gain accreditation.

A lot of the core skills training is done in earlier coaching courses, considered community coaching courses. It is a useful exercise for a coach at any level to really hone in on 4 different aspects of technique.

Getting back to the thread topic, I wonder what they are doing in Holland regarding core skills in training? In Kuper's article there is a contention that 1v1 skills are not encouraged in the top Dutch academies.

Edited by Decentric: 16/10/2015 08:28:45 AM
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Eastern Glory wrote:
krones3 wrote:
we are handing over well trained players to shit coaches

Are you implying that only the coaches teaching the junior years are quality?


I dont know what things are like nowadays, but in the older days that did largely sum things up, as a general rule at least. For some reason 80-90% of coaches decided to stop teaching at the Senior level. Have things changed?
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Barca4Life wrote:
Justafan wrote:
This is what I am seeing with the SAP at grass root club level is either teams focusing too heavily on 1 or 2 skills such as RWTB or 1v1 or passing or just trying to win.

Why not just focus on all 4 key skills at the SAP age? rotating the skills over the year. The thing that I feel gets lost in the FFA NC is the individual creativity part. My belief is let them play and encourage them to do different things on a field i.e. if someone is dominating the game dribbling ask them in the second half can they put a through ball to the forwards? to mix their game up.

To me being able to make the killer ball is being individually creative as dribbling through everyone.

I would also like to see some additional focus on shooting drills especially at 10 to 12 age group.

Just my thoughts or else we will create similar 1 dimensional players as the Dutch appear to be doing.


Well in SAP from what i've seen all core skills are taught every 6 week basis, and often get rotated.

But you're right i would like to see the coaches just let the players to encourage to use all core skills rather than focus one or two things depending on the situation during training on during the weekend.

To let players create their own style and build confidence and creativity this needs to happen, or else we will create robots which harm in long term.

It seems like the results of this are happening for the dutch from what i've seen from them.


From my experience I would agree and say that the SAP at grass root level is slowly improving and some clubs are really making a effort (heard some good things from coaches at other clubs) but I would say at Miniroo level the majority is still not doing this. I have played teams at the beginning of the year and then at the end of the year and I have seen very little improvement in those teams, if any.

Just the other week doing a coaching course I was talking to one coach who's focus was just on passing and then the coach to the left of me was talking about just doing RWTB as they can learn passing later.

One thing I have noticed with new coaches is their willingness to talk about doing a coaching course, this was something I did not hear often when I first started. The clubs are also starting to push this more. Of course what you do after the course is up to the individual coach.

But at least most know what the 4 key skills are now, a couple year of ago most could not even tell you this.

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krones3 wrote:
we are handing over well trained players to shit coaches

Are you implying that only the coaches teaching the junior years are quality?
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we are handing over well trained players to shit coaches

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Some interesting comments from a few posters in this thread. One thing to remember is the FFA NC is a hybrid approach ostensibly from the best of French, Dutch, Spanish and German curricula.

Maybe the Dutch are not focusing in 1v1 skills like we are doing? One FFA coach I know visited Germany. They they had 1v1 defensive skills in their curriculum, so we followed suit.

The Dutch are now in the position that most others have been before them. Having to update what they are doing to become more effective.
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Justafan wrote:
This is what I am seeing with the SAP at grass root club level is either teams focusing too heavily on 1 or 2 skills such as RWTB or 1v1 or passing or just trying to win.

Why not just focus on all 4 key skills at the SAP age? rotating the skills over the year. The thing that I feel gets lost in the FFA NC is the individual creativity part. My belief is let them play and encourage them to do different things on a field i.e. if someone is dominating the game dribbling ask them in the second half can they put a through ball to the forwards? to mix their game up.

To me being able to make the killer ball is being individually creative as dribbling through everyone.

I would also like to see some additional focus on shooting drills especially at 10 to 12 age group.

Just my thoughts or else we will create similar 1 dimensional players as the Dutch appear to be doing.


Well in SAP from what i've seen all core skills are taught every 6 week basis, and often get rotated.

But you're right i would like to see the coaches just let the players to encourage to use all core skills rather than focus one or two things depending on the situation during training on during the weekend.

To let players create their own style and build confidence and creativity this needs to happen, or else we will create robots which harm in long term.

It seems like the results of this are happening for the dutch from what i've seen from them.
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Agreed. Versatility is killing the skills of players these days.

Too many cookie cutter players who get thrown into any position, and not enough players who have specific skill sets to suit their position.

The one positive thing I have to add, is that in the recent U16s tournement, the players looked to be excellent at creating chances and making ground in the final third, either by killer passes or beating their man 1v1. If that's couched out of them, then we will end up in the same rut as the Dutch.

The skilful attacking midfielders like Corica and Carle and more recently Rogic and De Silva should never be discouraged from playing the way they do. For everything Jason Culina was (probably my favourite ever player) he rarely created chances through moments of creativity. And we must be careful to ensure that we are bringing through kids both in the mould of Culina and the creative attacking midfielder.
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This is what I am seeing with the SAP at grass root club level is either teams focusing too heavily on 1 or 2 skills such as RWTB or 1v1 or passing or just trying to win.

Why not just focus on all 4 key skills at the SAP age? rotating the skills over the year. The thing that I feel gets lost in the FFA NC is the individual creativity part. My belief is let them play and encourage them to do different things on a field i.e. if someone is dominating the game dribbling ask them in the second half can they put a through ball to the forwards? to mix their game up.

To me being able to make the killer ball is being individually creative as dribbling through everyone.

I would also like to see some additional focus on shooting drills especially at 10 to 12 age group.

Just my thoughts or else we will create similar 1 dimensional players as the Dutch appear to be doing.

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Simon Kuper is one of the best football writers in the world.
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Barca4Life wrote:



Up front, it lacks individualists. Dutch strikers are raised first and foremost to pass, not dribble or shoot. Robben only became a dribbler because he grew up in an isolated northern village near the German border far from the main Dutch academies. There was nobody around to coach the dribble out of him.


His potential successors in the younger generation, Memphis Depay and Ricardo Kishna, repeatedly clashed with Holland's leading clubs. PSV Eindhoven struggled for years to keep Memphis on board, and this summer Ajax sent Kishna to Lazio with a "good riddance." Any Dutch individualist is a system error. No wonder, remarks Dutch coach Fred Rutten, that today's players do best under a manager like Van Gaal who tells them exactly what to do, rather than a freewheeling coach like Guus Hiddink.



Interesting comment about Robben.

Coerver Australia's head coach, Jason Lascar, proudly extols Robben as a Coerver graduate. To be in a Coerver program involves a lot of time working on individual technique in Coerver soccer schools under the strict supervision of a coach. This is the antithesis of Robben operating in isolation in a remote country area as a developing youth.

I've rarely seen Robben do any flashy dribbling techniques, like combinations of inside and outside stopovers and Brazilian rolls and elastics.

He mainly uses a shoulder feint ( body swerve), or Mathews cut ( inside and outside of the foot dribbling, a big component of Coerver), as well as excellent balance, changes of pace, and extremely fast ball carrying to beat defenders. One rarely sees Cristiano Ronolado 's repertoire of incredibly difficult to execute rolls, elastics, in combination with inside and outside step overs.

In 2008 when Wiel Coerver had previously been battling with the KNVB in Holland about developing individual technique, Arie Schans said the KNVB and Coerver had reached a lot of common ground.

At the same time, Dutch national Han Berger, with a team of a dozen co - curriculum writers, set up the Skills Acquisition Program in Australia, with a large onus on developing 1v1 attacking skills.

This had been deemed to be lacking in previous generations of Australian players. Alf Galustian , world head of Coerver (now that Wiel Coerver has died) was a major consultant employed by FFA in writing the SAP.
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Great article, Barca.

Watched Holland play the Czechs.

There is a lot to digest from this article.
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After the fallout of their recent failure, Simon Kuper argues they lost their own identity.

He makes some interest point that also relates to us(Australian Football) as well.

Quote:
The last foreigner to manage Holland was Austrian Ernst Happel. Once a teenage solder in Hitler's army on the Russian front, Happel landed in the Dutch league in the 1960s. He never learned much Dutch, which didn't matter as he rarely spoke, preferring to smoke instead. Famously, he would win his players' respect by placing a bottle on the crossbar during a training session, then knocking it off with one shot of the ball. Mostly, he just drank cognac and played cards.

In 1978, Happel coached Holland to the World Cup final. He died in 1992 -- of lung cancer, unsurprisingly -- but now the time may have come to reincarnate him. I've supported Holland for nearly 40 years, since moving to the country as a child, and have never seen the team at such a low ebb as it is today. It's not just that the Dutch will miss Euro 2016 after a string of humiliating defeats to mid-ranking nations. It's that, like Brazil, Holland seems not to know how to play soccer anymore. The country's traditional style no longer works. Once the world's most intelligent soccer nation, Holland needs to reinvent its game from scratch, probably under foreign direction.

The most obvious layer of the problem is individual quality. The great generation born in 1983 and 1984 is fading. Wesley Sneijder and Robin van Persie announced after Tuesday's 2-3 home defeat to the Czech Republic that they planned to keep playing for Holland, and Van Persie has gone even further. "I want to play for Oranje until I'm 38 or 40," he said recently. "The longest of everyone. That's one of my career goals."

But Van Persie's words suggest a weak grip on reality. Aged 32, he already alternates between scowling alone on Fenerbahce's bench and sitting on Holland's. In this week's double-header against Kazakhstan and the Czech Republic, he won his 100th and 101st caps as a sub, but distinguished himself chiefly through a childish squabble with Memphis Depay in training, and a hilarious headed own goal for the Czechs (though he did later notch a late non-consolation goal for Holland).

Arjen Robben, at 31 still easily the best Dutch player, now injured again, may have something to contribute in the future. His individual genius coupled with the defensive wall erected by Louis van Gaal took Holland to third place in last year's World Cup. But apart from Robben, Holland needs to build on a new generation.

Unfortunately, it isn't a good one. Ajax, the main source of Dutch talent since the 1970s, has produced at best one top-class Dutchman aged under 30, Daley Blind. (The next most prominent Dutch under-30 homegrown Ajax exports may be PSG's reserve Gregory van der Wiel, Ryan Babel of Al Ain in the United Arab Emirates, and Siem de Jong and Vurnon Anita of Newcastle.)

Study Blind, and you come to Dutch soccer's broader problem. He is the best version of the modern Dutch player: clever, comfortable in several positions, a good passer, but neither fast nor strong nor a good tackler or header.

Dutch soccer has reduced the complex game to the pass -- and the short pass at that. As Dutch journalist Michiel de Hoog and data analyst Sander IJtsma diagnosed this week, the Dutch game has degenerated into harmless passing around one's own defense. It's the style that Arsene Wenger has called "sterile domination": you have the ball, but you don't threaten.

Johan Cruyff, father of Dutch soccer, complains: "Holland is world champion [of] passing sideways and back. The buildup is currently the weakest aspect of our game." Barcelona and Germany pass fast near the opposition's goal; Holland passes slowly near its own. The opposition watches the Dutch "knit" until the moment comes to intercept a pass and break.

Germany, Belgium and Spain -- Holland's role models as it starts to rebuild -- produce passers too. Almost every player in Germany's team, even goalkeeper Manuel Neuer, passes like a midfield playmaker. But in addition, their players have what the Dutch call "specific qualities." Bastian Schweinsteiger is a great tackler, Mesut Ozil a dribbler, Mats Hummels can head, Thomas Muller is an unmatched athlete, and so on.

Older Dutch players do have "specific qualities": Robben's dribble, Sneijder's shot, Ron Vlaar's muscles, Van Persie's nose for goal. But Holland's under-30s lack them. In this generation nobody put in the hours repetitively practising tackles or shots or long passes. Every Dutch player was raised as a short passer, because short passing was conceived of as the whole of soccer.

There used to be more to the Dutch game. For about 30 unbroken years until 2004, Holland's sweeper had arguably the best long pass in international soccer: first Ruud Krol, then Ronald Koeman and finally Frank de Boer. But they had no successor, and now Holland has no alternative to knitting its way out from the back. The Dutch buildup has become unsurprising.


The Netherlands head coach was defiant despite seeing his side fail to qualify for the European championships for the first time since 1984.
Moreover, the Dutch have come to undervalue the art of man-marking. When Stefan de Vrij (now with Lazio Roma) was at Feyenoord, he realized that like all young Dutch defenders he had less muscle than his foreign counterparts. Shrewdly, he went to the gym to build himself up. When Feyenoord found out, it told him to stop. Huub Stevens, a Dutch coach recently released by Stuttgart (almost no Dutchmen still coach big foreign clubs), recently told the Dutch NRC Handelsblad newspaper: "Of course I am a believer in ball possession, but for that you have to have the ball. Holland lacks ball-winners."

Up front, it lacks individualists. Dutch strikers are raised first and foremost to pass, not dribble or shoot. Robben only became a dribbler because he grew up in an isolated northern village near the German border far from the main Dutch academies. There was nobody around to coach the dribble out of him. His potential successors in the younger generation, Memphis Depay and Ricardo Kishna, repeatedly clashed with Holland's leading clubs. PSV Eindhoven struggled for years to keep Memphis on board, and this summer Ajax sent Kishna to Lazio with a "good riddance." Any Dutch individualist is a system error. No wonder, remarks Dutch coach Fred Rutten, that today's players do best under a manager like Van Gaal who tells them exactly what to do, rather than a freewheeling coach like Guus Hiddink.

For now, the system that best suits Dutch players is a rapid counterattack from a packed defense. That's what Holland used in its last three good tournaments, Euro 2008 and the last two World Cups. Hiddink and his successor, Danny Blind (Daley's dad), went wrong in the Euro qualifiers by trying to reinstate the traditional Dutch 4-3-3 game with the new tradition of "sterile possession."

But in the long term, Holland needs to reinvent its soccer. It may have to swallow the ultimate humiliation: handing over its national team to a coach from today's most intelligent soccer country, archrival Germany.

Simon Kuper is a contributor to ESPN FC and co-author, with Stefan Szymanski, of Soccernomics.

http://www.espnfc.com/team/netherlands/449/blog/post/2663233/netherlands-fail-euro-qualifying-and-must-start-from-scratch



Edited by Barca4life: 15/10/2015 10:31:38 AM

Edited by Barca4life: 15/10/2015 10:32:29 AM
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