National second division is kicking off with or without FFA


National second division is kicking off with or without FFA

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Monoethnic Social Club
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MarkfromCroydon - 24 Jan 2021 10:38 PM
Who benefits from semi professionalism?

Not the players. They lose out as they can’t train and play full time.

Not the fans as they see a lower quality than fully professional players who are improving through full time training and playing.

Not the juniors as their fees are used to subsidise the payment of semi professional seniors.

Only the board members and ‘big men’ of the mono ethnic social clubs in the NPL benefit. They can promote their businesses without spending too much and tell everyone what great people they are for supporting their ‘community’. 

Of course the mono ethnic social club itself also benefits by keeping the sport small and semi professional. If you’re a club with a (insert cultural background identify here) and you draw your support base from really only that community, you’re limited in your ability to draw new fans and new sponsors from outside that community. So what do you do if you’re one of those clubs?
You piss and moan about non-existent racism and blame Lowy, or FFA or Foxtel or whoever else instead of growing your own club into a fully professional football club that cannot be left out of any top tier league.

Meanwhile real football people seek to grow the sport in this country and that can only be done by having more full time professional clubs.

Dont forget to mention the pumpkin seeds and also the flares and ethnic cleansing in the stands..... The real football people care about preventing such things. Dont worry mate Id be bitter about NPL if my kid got passed up for a better one too (which is what I assume is your story otherwise I cant understand your bizarre  obsession with npl and "professionalism") but sometimes you just have to accept it and move on. Go watch your better standard of 26 games of "professional"  football knowing full well that the players actually shinning this year came from that very same shit, semi pro, self serving ethnic shitstorm called the NPL.....
You see division and hatred and exclusivity in the tiers of soccer below Aleague, I see unity of purpose. If you dont feel involved or included at a particular club thats on you and suggesting otherwise is a f#cking bigoted cop out.... 

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isn't the npl already semi-professional? It is not clear if this helps. I hope it does
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Who benefits from semi professionalism?

Not the players. They lose out as they can’t train and play full time.

Not the fans as they see a lower quality than fully professional players who are improving through full time training and playing.

Not the juniors as their fees are used to subsidise the payment of semi professional seniors.

Only the board members and ‘big men’ of the mono ethnic social clubs in the NPL benefit. They can promote their businesses without spending too much and tell everyone what great people they are for supporting their ‘community’. 

Of course the mono ethnic social club itself also benefits by keeping the sport small and semi professional. If you’re a club with a (insert cultural background identify here) and you draw your support base from really only that community, you’re limited in your ability to draw new fans and new sponsors from outside that community. So what do you do if you’re one of those clubs?
You piss and moan about non-existent racism and blame Lowy, or FFA or Foxtel or whoever else instead of growing your own club into a fully professional football club that cannot be left out of any top tier league.

Meanwhile real football people seek to grow the sport in this country and that can only be done by having more full time professional clubs.

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MarkfromCroydon - 22 Jan 2021 10:52 PM
Arbor has quite rightly come out and said any NSD must be professional.

The only people who don’t want full professionalism are the NPL clubs.

All real football people want a fully professional NSD.

Is Mick Lynch a football person would you say?
https://mobile.twitter.com/MickLynch_Age/status/1352415651000803328  
The FFA mouth piece ( or should that be douche nozle) Rugari  pops up  in a little whiney defensive cameo on this one too... 
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MarkfromCroydon - 22 Jan 2021 10:52 PM
Arbor has quite rightly come out and said any NSD must be professional.

The only people who don’t want full professionalism are the NPL clubs.

All real football people want a fully professional NSD.

So by your logic  the Aleague owners and the FFA must NOT be real football people as they dont want ANY second division in this country, let alone a fully professional one. Well said I agree with this.
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MarkfromCroydon - 22 Jan 2021 10:52 PM
The only people who don’t want full professionalism are the NPL clubs.

im pretty sure they'll be stuck in 3rd teir when 2nd division happens.

NPL clubs who has the drive and the vision will help Australian football strive to be the best it can be

just leave the slackers behind
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Arbor has quite rightly come out and said any NSD must be professional.

The only people who don’t want full professionalism are the NPL clubs.

All real football people want a fully professional NSD.
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BTW Apart from Arnie saying that the AAFC plan wont work because nobody mentioned goalkeeping coaches and medical staff (or some such bullshit, sorry I never can understand what that muppet is saying) has anyone heard a single peep from FFA or Rugari on this? ANYTHING AT ALL? 
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paulc - 22 Jan 2021 3:54 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 21 Jan 2021 9:12 AM

Irrelevant to the comments I made.

Just giving you more options. You wont follow South because they are Greek.
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paulc - 22 Jan 2021 4:06 PM
MarkfromCroydon - 21 Jan 2021 8:19 AM

Some would like to run it like a whiff from an oily rag which won’t serve it’s purpose. It needs to be a good, clear stepping stone to the A-League but from the figures thrown around it seems to be marginally better than the NPL and not close enough to the midway point.

I don’t think it has to be fully professional albeit it is preferred, but it has to be a quantum leap to where they are now.

Realistically how many clubs could be sustainably professional in a second division? Enough to have a whole division? Why not at least start out with a structure that allows clubs to compete while remaining semi-pro, and if they have the wherewithal to move to a fully pro set up over time then they can. Much like how the National League works in England.
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while they say it will start at 12, I think they will start at 8 clubs because if the NSD fails you could merge it into the A-league easily into a 20 team comp
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MarkfromCroydon - 21 Jan 2021 8:19 AM
Typical shithouse report from the AAFC (Association of Arseholes, Fuckwits and Cockheads).

The fake plastic mono ethnic social club NPL clubs have a vested interest in trying to keep the game semi-professional, small and inaccessible in this country.

Of course any NSD must be fully professional, but these shysters will not go for that. It’s time these clubs got out of the way and stopped interfering and let the real football people keep on trying to grow the sport in this country.


Some would like to run it like a whiff from an oily rag which won’t serve it’s purpose. It needs to be a good, clear stepping stone to the A-League but from the figures thrown around it seems to be marginally better than the NPL and not close enough to the midway point.

I don’t think it has to be fully professional albeit it is preferred, but it has to be a quantum leap to where they are now.

In a resort somewhere

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Monoethnic Social Club - 21 Jan 2021 9:12 AM
paulc - 21 Jan 2021 4:48 AM

Dont worry Paulie. No need to follow the Greeks in the NSD, most of the other clubs participating will be monoethnic too...  You must feel like the naughty kid on Christmas morning holding your lump of coal... hahahahah

Irrelevant to the comments I made.

In a resort somewhere

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Feed_The_Brox - 21 Jan 2021 8:47 AM
df1982 - 19 Jan 2021 9:12 PM

No thanks. There are already 5 NSW teams in the AL. they were cut early in the process during the last round of expansion because they do not have the $$$. I have never been to WIN Stadium, but I have heard people say the stadium is tired and outdated and is in need of an upgrade. Let them enter the second tier and see how they perform before giving them the opportunity for promotion. 

For mine, team 13 must be Canberra and team 14 must be either Brisbane2 or Tassie. And I would start the expansion process now. we need to go to 14 teams by no later than 2023.

Your first point is meaningless: yes, there are 5 NSW teams, but none are in Wollongong, which is its own city, just like Canberra, Hobart, Gold Coast, etc., and should be considered on that basis. The reason it didn't make the grade for the last expansion was that Fox explicitly wanted teams from Melbourne and Sydney due to ratings (apparently people outside the big metro areas don't count), and Gallop wanted more derbies. Which has backfired, since neither expansion side is exactly going gangbusters, and the excitement of the derby has been significantly diluted in the process.

You should get some better information about the stadium. It was recently upgraded with a new main grandstand on the western side. I think the eastern side could do with seating to replace the grass hill (although apparently there are issues with soil erosion since it is situated right on the beach). It has the feel of a proper football ground, has a perfect capacity for A-League matches, and is ideally located in the Wollongong CBD. You can't ask for more, really.

If you want to fast track expansion, then Wollongong and Canberra are the best options. Both are essentially ready to go. Both have viable stadiums and serve decently sized population areas. The Wolves have one of the best NPL squads in the country, and Canberra already has a set-up for W-League and Y-League teams (and a whole NPL division of its own to draw players from).

Tassie needs to build a rectangular stadium to be in consideration. And Brisbane needs to focus on building its first A-League appropriate stadium, let alone its second. They can be considered for expansion to 16 teams.
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MarkfromCroydon - 21 Jan 2021 8:19 AM
Typical shithouse report from the AAFC (Association of Arseholes, Fuckwits and Cockheads).

The fake plastic mono ethnic social club NPL clubs have a vested interest in trying to keep the game semi-professional, small and inaccessible in this country.

Of course any NSD must be fully professional, but these shysters will not go for that. It’s time these clubs got out of the way and stopped interfering and let the real football people keep on trying to grow the sport in this country.


Lollllllll

Viennese Vuck

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MarkfromCroydon - 21 Jan 2021 8:19 AM
Typical shithouse report from the AAFC (Association of Arseholes, Fuckwits and Cockheads).

The fake plastic mono ethnic social club NPL clubs have a vested interest in trying to keep the game semi-professional, small and inaccessible in this country.

Of course any NSD must be fully professional, but these shysters will not go for that. It’s time these clubs got out of the way and stopped interfering and let the real football people keep on trying to grow the sport in this country.


Hahahaha thats awesome dude... agree with you, let the real football people at FA and APL grow the sport , they've been killing it for the last few years.
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4 Years Ago by Monoethnic Social Club
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paulc - 21 Jan 2021 4:48 AM
Monoethnic Social Club - 20 Jan 2021 9:16 PM

LOL at your conspiracy theories. 

Instead of of blaming everyone else for their ills, why don’t you encourage SMHellas to broaden their base and grow into an all encompassing club for other communities as well. One day it may be treated seriously if it does.

Dont worry Paulie. No need to follow the Greeks in the NSD, most of the other clubs participating will be monoethnic too...  You must feel like the naughty kid on Christmas morning holding your lump of coal... hahahahah
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df1982 - 19 Jan 2021 9:12 PM
Wolves would have to be one of the best prepared existing clubs for making the step up to A-League level. They have a great side on the pitch (national NPL winners in 2019), a perfect home ground, large support base, club history, and one of the country's best regional talent supply lines. They just need a backer, but there should support for an A-League team in the local business community.


No thanks. There are already 5 NSW teams in the AL. they were cut early in the process during the last round of expansion because they do not have the $$$. I have never been to WIN Stadium, but I have heard people say the stadium is tired and outdated and is in need of an upgrade. Let them enter the second tier and see how they perform before giving them the opportunity for promotion. 

For mine, team 13 must be Canberra and team 14 must be either Brisbane2 or Tassie. And I would start the expansion process now. we need to go to 14 teams by no later than 2023.

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Typical shithouse report from the AAFC (Association of Arseholes, Fuckwits and Cockheads).

The fake plastic mono ethnic social club NPL clubs have a vested interest in trying to keep the game semi-professional, small and inaccessible in this country.

Of course any NSD must be fully professional, but these shysters will not go for that. It’s time these clubs got out of the way and stopped interfering and let the real football people keep on trying to grow the sport in this country.


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Monoethnic Social Club - 20 Jan 2021 9:16 PM
soccerfoo - 20 Jan 2021 8:17 PM

I get your frustration but weve been waiting 16 years whats 2 more? If thats what it takes to have the kind of system that they should have looked to set up back in 77 with the first inklings of a national league then it will be worth the wait.... This is a big step for the sport here megale, much bigger than the unbundling you keep mentioning, maybe not for the professional side but clubland and the national teams of all ages both mens and womens will greatly benefit from this if it goes ahead imo.The major hurdle, as always, will be the cartel Lowey the bastard set up in 2005.  JJ and some at FA may want this to go ahead  but there are still Fat Nick and dumb Greg to contend with and uncle scumbag Frank has his hand deep in their pockets squeezing their tiny ballakia. My personal conspiracy theory is that they engaged the AAFC to create a financial report for this thinking the wogs will tear each other apart before agreeing to anything and so they can always state they tried a second division but it failed at the gate. Ask yourself this,  its been 2 days now and, unless I missed it, not a peep out of FA, APL or PFA.....not even an acknowledgement that a significant report has been drafted in line with their 11 principals and as per the committee the FFA established to create an evaluation task force for such a thing.... What about or famous soccer journos, Especially that arsehole Rugari?  They are quick to jump on any A league feel good story and love to write about those nasty NSL clubs that cause all the riots, dont pay their players, are un-Australian and want a national second division that they cant even afford ... well AAFC have "shown them the money" why dont these f#ckers reply??? 

LOL at your conspiracy theories. 

Instead of of blaming everyone else for their ills, why don’t you encourage SMHellas to broaden their base and grow into an all encompassing club for other communities as well. One day it may be treated seriously if it does.

In a resort somewhere

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bettega - 20 Jan 2021 9:12 AM
Monoethnic Social Club - 20 Jan 2021 9:03 AM

This is it.
If there is no possibility of promotion to the A-League for the next 15 years, then you'd have to rocks in your head to invest millions into a new club just to play semi-professional football in the NSD.

Agreed that new entities need the carrot of A-League promotion, but I really don't think it's that far off. If the NSD proves to be viable it will only be a matter of time. Probably once the A-League has maxed out expansion to 16 teams, but that will likely be sooner rather than later. I think 2025 is the most likely scenario. The A-League needs something to bring it back to life, and the life-or-death scenario of pro-rel is probably the thing to do it.

I don't really see the licenses as being an issue: the performance criteria can just be changed to not finishing in the bottom two in a given season (or whatever).
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Munrubenmuz - 20 Jan 2021 7:49 PM
calciopoli - 20 Jan 2021 4:48 PM

Canberra is where teams go to die.  There and the Gold Coast.  5k the first year 3k every year after that.

Atm 3k in Canberra would be pretty good for Aleague..... not even trying to be smart.
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calciopoli - 20 Jan 2021 4:48 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 19 Jan 2021 11:44 PM

surely an a league team for canberra utd would be a no brainer?

Yeah, I agree but I wonder why the fabled international investors behind the Canberra bid chose to go as a stand alone license instead of aligning themselves with the Wleague club? 
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soccerfoo - 20 Jan 2021 8:17 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 20 Jan 2021 4:16 PM

Ella mate, it takes too long to do their research. Clubs are keen to come in. Malakes always looking for red tape.
Turn my attention to something else, if something ever actually happens good for football.
Go Hellas!

I get your frustration but weve been waiting 16 years whats 2 more? If thats what it takes to have the kind of system that they should have looked to set up back in 77 with the first inklings of a national league then it will be worth the wait.... This is a big step for the sport here megale, much bigger than the unbundling you keep mentioning, maybe not for the professional side but clubland and the national teams of all ages both mens and womens will greatly benefit from this if it goes ahead imo.The major hurdle, as always, will be the cartel Lowey the bastard set up in 2005.  JJ and some at FA may want this to go ahead  but there are still Fat Nick and dumb Greg to contend with and uncle scumbag Frank has his hand deep in their pockets squeezing their tiny ballakia. My personal conspiracy theory is that they engaged the AAFC to create a financial report for this thinking the wogs will tear each other apart before agreeing to anything and so they can always state they tried a second division but it failed at the gate. Ask yourself this,  its been 2 days now and, unless I missed it, not a peep out of FA, APL or PFA.....not even an acknowledgement that a significant report has been drafted in line with their 11 principals and as per the committee the FFA established to create an evaluation task force for such a thing.... What about or famous soccer journos, Especially that arsehole Rugari?  They are quick to jump on any A league feel good story and love to write about those nasty NSL clubs that cause all the riots, dont pay their players, are un-Australian and want a national second division that they cant even afford ... well AAFC have "shown them the money" why dont these f#ckers reply??? 

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Monoethnic Social Club - 20 Jan 2021 4:16 PM
soccerfoo - 20 Jan 2021 2:49 PM

So you don't want this to happen now? Why mate?
Agree 2023 winter is a bit long to wait but the upside is that at least it gives the NPLs two full seasons of "data" so that performance on the pitch can be used as one of the criteria for the first 12 clubs. Also allows clubs that may not be "strong" enough now to at least get their ducks in a row and make a push for inclusion.
What is the alternative to this, nothing?

Ella mate, it takes too long to do their research. Clubs are keen to come in. Malakes always looking for red tape.
Turn my attention to something else, if something ever actually happens good for football.
Go Hellas!
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calciopoli - 20 Jan 2021 4:48 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 19 Jan 2021 11:44 PM

surely an a league team for canberra utd would be a no brainer?

Canberra is where teams go to die.  There and the Gold Coast.  5k the first year 3k every year after that.


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Monoethnic Social Club - 19 Jan 2021 11:44 PM
df1982 - 19 Jan 2021 10:50 PM

I get what you are saying and ofcourse the financial implications of a serious backer willing to throw money into "creating" a team in Canberra would certainly be hard to turn down but why would any investor do this? Why invest in a second tier comp that is going to have minimal revenue generation and probably zero return on investment and no guarantee of ever being linked up with the Aleague? The NSD isnt ultimately about generating profit or revenue and being accountable to shareholders and investors as the clubs pushing for this are all not for-profit, volunteer run clubs and any income stream goes straight back into the club which in turn creates an ecosystem of aspirational clubs that can better their coaching systems, administrators with more experience and professionalism and more importantly player pathways that can lead to the betterment of our national playing pool.

 Sure if this is a commercial success the money will improve professionalism to the point where regular NSD power teams may well become similar to Aleague clubs but I think that is far far into the future if ever. Its not so much who supports it if that makes sense (although obviously a bare minimium of support and interest are needed to pay for the bloody thing) as that is what function the Aleague serves, its more important that it exists..

Dont worry about little Canberra Olympic they may or may not be up to the challenge of national tier soccer but at least the path will be open to them. Of course there are supporters of other NPL clubs that hate Olympic, thats the beauty of it.... If none of the NPL clubs in ACT manage to get enough support behind them AND ambition to make it to the  NSD then clearly there is no market or appetite for national soccer in that market....  Your analogy of South and the Bergers is valid in that we both lost fans to the Victory but not all of them, many Iike myself in the early days, just switched off altogether and didnt pick any team... I know old friends that havent been back to the soccer for 16 years  but this talk of rejuvination has them excited to come back to Hellas. Well, for a club like Canberra Olympic they dont have to loose their fans to a new entity, they can keep their local rivalries and if good enough or strong enough they can ve promoted... Do you not think local ACT soccer will benefit wirh having  3 or 4 clubs all bashing in each others heads to get to the "top" be the big club, attract all the sponsors and best players? Competitiveness, it's a son of a bitch but it creates wonders.

surely an a league team for canberra utd would be a no brainer?
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soccerfoo - 20 Jan 2021 2:49 PM
Forget 2nd div in 2022, in a Winter comp it would min be 2023. Galatas made that Clear!!! on SBS talking with Lucy Z and Nick S. Well, they can shove it whether they have it or not. If the choice is going the long or the short road, it's always going to be the long road.

So you don't want this to happen now? Why mate?
Agree 2023 winter is a bit long to wait but the upside is that at least it gives the NPLs two full seasons of "data" so that performance on the pitch can be used as one of the criteria for the first 12 clubs. Also allows clubs that may not be "strong" enough now to at least get their ducks in a row and make a push for inclusion.
What is the alternative to this, nothing?
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Forget 2nd div in 2022, in a Winter comp it would min be 2023. Galatas made that Clear!!! on SBS talking with Lucy Z and Nick S. Well, they can shove it whether they have it or not. If the choice is going the long or the short road, it's always going to be the long road.
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4 Years Ago by soccerfoo
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df1982 - 19 Jan 2021 10:07 PM
soccerfoo - 19 Jan 2021 3:41 PM

My feeling is that they will expedite a round of expansion to 14 teams very quickly, probably in time for the 2022 winter season. Hence why the last couple of seasons have been 26 rounds, despite how awkward the season structures have been. They seem unwilling to go to 33 rounds with the current 12 team set-up, so going to 14 teams and a strahgt double round-robin makes sense. Hopefully they then go to 16 quickly as well, so we can at least get a semi-respectable 30-round season.

30 rounds are Spot On digga!
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