Ange to Tottenham Hotspur


Ange to Tottenham Hotspur

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Monoethnic Social Club
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sydneyfc1987 - 22 Oct 2021 12:03 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 9:43 AM

How was that a questionable penalty? It was a blatant handball.

Unnecessary? Probably. Lucky? sure. 

And how did we "lose comfortably" with the winning goal being within a bees dick of the goal-line tech ruling it no-goal? 

I don't care what anybody says, the performance vs France was top notch. We pressed intelligently and held our shape and thus they were out of ideas for entire match. Would of been a famous point if not for Pogba's lucky winner.

Sorry "questionable" is probably a little harsh.... Fortuitous is probably more appropriate, you are right :)
As for the rest of the game, maybe we where watching two different matches? 


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AnthonyC - 22 Oct 2021 1:20 PM
sydneyfc1987 - 22 Oct 2021 12:03 PM

Another brave defeat. Aren't you sick of that yet. Those days, for that sort of sentiment, should be long gone. Tell me, was losing to Japan another of those brave defeats that we should be proud of?

Ange had one of the lowest success rates of a Socceroos coach, it literally was the epitome of the 'Brave Defeat'
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huddo - 22 Oct 2021 3:08 PM
AnthonyC - 22 Oct 2021 1:20 PM

Ange had one of the lowest success rates of a Socceroos coach, it literally was the epitome of the 'Brave Defeat'

He got them to the world cup. Did not get the backing of the ffa, so he preferred to walk.
He has achieved more than any other Aus coach. 
Can't deny it, haters will always exist.
You got nothing.
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jaymz - 22 Oct 2021 1:22 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 11:44 AM

Well to be fair, he has never come out and 100% explained to the public why he quit. Just gave vague comments. TBH the way he left was quite gutless, he left the players high and dry before quitting and for all his talk about changing the way we view ourselves as a football nation couldnt even explain the reason why he was stepping down. So people are left to speculate. He did what he felt was best for him, so no judgement on that part. Maybe he felt Japan was too good to refuse. But the least he could have done is explained his reason to the public given all the talk he had previously about wanting the public to discuss tactics more, wanting us to not be happy with just being at the WC but actually believing we can win it, and wanting us to have the confidence that we can attack and win. All that was undone when he left and to this hasnt given a clear reason why.

I still standby the fact that if he had explained it for whatever the reason it was be it Slater getting his mate the job, the hopeless FFA, the Japan offer being too good, he would not have undone the years of work he put in earlier to change Australian football.

Another person who has never come out to the public and explained 100% why he quit/was sacked is Alan Stajic but he seems to get a lot more of a favourable review by "new football", I can't figure out why????
I can't say I am surprised by people's take on this and to be brutally honest I was just as disappointed with how it seems to have played out if he did indeed quit out of spite or pride or whatever.. But that is the big "if" for me... Its easy for everyone to speculate but the "facts" are that we the public don't know "the facts". Would it be the first time someone did a Gladys and resigned from a position before being pushed? Or a coach was told that his contract (as far as I am aware, valid only up until actual qualification and NOT including 2018 world cup tournament) was not going to be renewed and he would be given an opportunity to step down from the role rather than be publicly humiliated????
The only FACTS that can be measured is that Angie is a bloody good coach. At least as far as his amazing collection of silverware (on two different continents, hopefully soon to be three) in such a short career can attest too.  Taking on a "job" like Celtic is an indication, at least to me, of a coach of conviction and courage, not of cowardice. I hope he does well for the Bhoys, and win loose or draw I think the effort and attitude alone is starting to impress some of the more reluctant supporters over there. Results matter - its not a closed off cartel franchise league after all and I guess we can judge if he is good enough by the end of the season - if he gets given that long that is :) 
Bottom line is that all the vitriol and latent racism from some on here is opinion, NOT fact.
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huddo - 22 Oct 2021 3:08 PM
AnthonyC - 22 Oct 2021 1:20 PM

Ange had one of the lowest success rates of a Socceroos coach, it literally was the epitome of the 'Brave Defeat'

And yet he was sitting on the bench in the ONLY cup final the Socceroos have EVER won??? Go figure?
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Stenson - 22 Oct 2021 3:26 PM
huddo - 22 Oct 2021 3:08 PM

He got them to the world cup. Did not get the backing of the ffa, so he preferred to walk.
He has achieved more than any other Aus coach. 
Can't deny it, haters will always exist.
You got nothing.

I'm not hating, I never have, I admired him at Roar and Victory, I backed him at the Socceroos, and have followed him at Marinos and Celtic, if you would have read further back you would have seen I backed him.
My point was at the jab at BVM's efforts at the WC and it being another brave defeat. it was a brave defeat, but noting the 44% success of AP, I'm stating the bloke was very adept at the Brave Defeat with the Socceroos.
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Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 3:41 PM
jaymz - 22 Oct 2021 1:22 PM

Another person who has never come out to the public and explained 100% why he quit/was sacked is Alan Stajic but he seems to get a lot more of a favourable review by "new football", I can't figure out why????
I can't say I am surprised by people's take on this and to be brutally honest I was just as disappointed with how it seems to have played out if he did indeed quit out of spite or pride or whatever.. But that is the big "if" for me... Its easy for everyone to speculate but the "facts" are that we the public don't know "the facts". Would it be the first time someone did a Gladys and resigned from a position before being pushed? Or a coach was told that his contract (as far as I am aware, valid only up until actual qualification and NOT including 2018 world cup tournament) was not going to be renewed and he would be given an opportunity to step down from the role rather than be publicly humiliated????
The only FACTS that can be measured is that Angie is a bloody good coach. At least as far as his amazing collection of silverware (on two different continents, hopefully soon to be three) in such a short career can attest too.  Taking on a "job" like Celtic is an indication, at least to me, of a coach of conviction and courage, not of cowardice. I hope he does well for the Bhoys, and win loose or draw I think the effort and attitude alone is starting to impress some of the more reluctant supporters over there. Results matter - its not a closed off cartel franchise league after all and I guess we can judge if he is good enough by the end of the season - if he gets given that long that is :) 
Bottom line is that all the vitriol and latent racism from some on here is opinion, NOT fact.

Some girls couldn't sleep in the same beds as their player-partners so it was a 'toxic culture'!?/!()....
Was it something else perhaps, Alan's body deoderant?
Edited
4 Years Ago by Stenson
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Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 3:44 PM
huddo - 22 Oct 2021 3:08 PM

And yet he was sitting on the bench in the ONLY cup final the Socceroos have EVER won??? Go figure?

It doesn't mean he didn't have alot of 'Brave Defeats', all 3 of his WC games were 'Brave Defeats'. I'm grateful he got us the trophy, but it doesn't change the statistics
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huddo - 22 Oct 2021 3:53 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 3:44 PM

It doesn't mean he didn't have alot of 'Brave Defeats', all 3 of his WC games were 'Brave Defeats'. I'm grateful he got us the trophy, but it doesn't change the statistics

Fair enough, statistics dont lie I suppose. Personally I still think that 3-2 loss to Holland was the greatest loss Australia ever had at a Mundial, but if everyone else thinks we have had a better national team coach in the last 20 years then .........
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Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 3:41 PM
jaymz - 22 Oct 2021 1:22 PM

Another person who has never come out to the public and explained 100% why he quit/was sacked is Alan Stajic but he seems to get a lot more of a favourable review by "new football", I can't figure out why????
I can't say I am surprised by people's take on this and to be brutally honest I was just as disappointed with how it seems to have played out if he did indeed quit out of spite or pride or whatever.. But that is the big "if" for me... Its easy for everyone to speculate but the "facts" are that we the public don't know "the facts". Would it be the first time someone did a Gladys and resigned from a position before being pushed? Or a coach was told that his contract (as far as I am aware, valid only up until actual qualification and NOT including 2018 world cup tournament) was not going to be renewed and he would be given an opportunity to step down from the role rather than be publicly humiliated????
The only FACTS that can be measured is that Angie is a bloody good coach. At least as far as his amazing collection of silverware (on two different continents, hopefully soon to be three) in such a short career can attest too.  Taking on a "job" like Celtic is an indication, at least to me, of a coach of conviction and courage, not of cowardice. I hope he does well for the Bhoys, and win loose or draw I think the effort and attitude alone is starting to impress some of the more reluctant supporters over there. Results matter - its not a closed off cartel franchise league after all and I guess we can judge if he is good enough by the end of the season - if he gets given that long that is :) 
Bottom line is that all the vitriol and latent racism from some on here is opinion, NOT fact.

could be that he was unfairly dismissed? And got a payout and apology from the FFA
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huddo - 22 Oct 2021 4:04 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 3:41 PM

could be that he was unfairly dismissed? And got a payout and apology from the FFA

Apology? Do you mean that mealy mouthed statement from Heather? What about unfair dismissal, I cant remember anything being mentioned? These are all speculations from what I can tell yet we choose to believe them yeah?
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Munrubenmuz - 22 Oct 2021 2:36 PM
theFOOTBALLlover - 22 Oct 2021 11:55 AM

When did he just quit?!

Lol wut?

Declared that he wanted to create a dynasty at Roar, Victory, in Japan and for the NT. Jumped ship everytime it suited him.

Crapped on about wanting to be near his family when he was in Brisbane only to piss off after Victory to go to Japan where he left his family behind.

Good luck to him. He's entitled too do whatever suits himself but don't try and sanitise what he has done and probably always will do.

Having said all that I do hope he does well at Celtic.

Personally I'd like to see him coach Japan or South Korea. Teams with highly technical players that could implement the style he was trying to achieve with Australia.

But yeah, still a dog for the way he left Australia in the lurch 

So a coach can't leave his club to do bigger and better things? Forget about career progression? What planet are you on?

He built success at basically every club and NT he coached. He can't be expected to stay at each for life. 
Edited
4 Years Ago by theFOOTBALLlover
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numklpkgulftumch - 22 Oct 2021 2:42 PM
Davide82 - 22 Oct 2021 1:41 PM

Yep

Got his fingers burnt in Greece and learned to get out at the top

ended up having to beg for an A-league gig

Saw the writing on the wall in Brisbane and got out.

Same in Melbourne  and same  with Australia.

Almost blew it when he avoided relegation on Goal difference in Japan.  Had a great season the year after and has jumped again.

Will do the same at Celtic but maybe they'll be better off for his stay.

Don't most coaches move on to bigger and better things? Send me a list of all the top coaches that have stayed in the one place.. even guys like Fergie and Wenger started elsewhere before long careers in the EPL.
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theFOOTBALLlover - 22 Oct 2021 4:12 PM
Munrubenmuz - 22 Oct 2021 2:36 PM

So a coach can't leave his club to do better and better things? Forget about career progression? What planet are you on?

He built success at basically every club and NT he coached. He can't be expected to stay at each for life. 

Popa has managed to do the opposite

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Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 4:08 PM
huddo - 22 Oct 2021 4:04 PM

Apology? Do you mean that mealy mouthed statement from Heather? What about unfair dismissal, I cant remember anything being mentioned? These are all speculations from what I can tell yet we choose to believe them yeah?

He was paid a 6 figure sum for the unfair dismissal and was issued an apology.
from Heather and the FFA.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/ffa-issues-formal-apology-to-stajcic-20190531-p51t3b.html

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huddo - 22 Oct 2021 4:16 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 4:08 PM

He was paid a 6 figure sum for the unfair dismissal and was issued an apology.
from Heather and the FFA.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/ffa-issues-formal-apology-to-stajcic-20190531-p51t3b.html

That was a disaster of a situation. Did anyone at FA get the sack?
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huddo - 22 Oct 2021 4:16 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 4:08 PM

He was paid a 6 figure sum for the unfair dismissal and was issued an apology.
from Heather and the FFA.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/ffa-issues-formal-apology-to-stajcic-20190531-p51t3b.html
Sorry not trying to derail the thread but - Payment in lieu of notice and NO statement to the reasons for his termination IS NOT payment as compensation for unfair dismissal, just what he was legally entitled to receive as per his employment contract termination clause. As for the apology .... well Ill leave you to decide if you are satisfied with that... 

"Alen’s contract was terminated by FFA exercising its contractual right of termination by making a pre-agreed payment in lieu of notice. FFA’s decision to do this was reached simply because its Board formed the view, following a process undertaken by management, that the Matildas would benefit from a new coach for the FIFA World Cup in France," the FFA statement read.

"These statements were not made on behalf of FFA and did not reflect the decision of the Board or the reasons why it made that decision. Heather has withdrawn those comments and issued an apology to Alen for having made them."



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theFOOTBALLlover - 22 Oct 2021 4:20 PM
huddo - 22 Oct 2021 4:16 PM

That was a disaster of a situation. Did anyone at FA get the sack?

Heather got free tickets to the World Cup, does that count? :)
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theFOOTBALLlover - 22 Oct 2021 4:12 PM
Munrubenmuz - 22 Oct 2021 2:36 PM

So a coach can't leave his club to do bigger and better things? Forget about career progression? What planet are you on?

He built success at basically every club and NT he coached. He can't be expected to stay at each for life. 

You obviously can't read. Of course he can.  I said good luck to him he's entitled to do whatever he wants.

It's the crapping on bit talking about 'dynasties' and how he's in for the long haul when he isn't that irks people.

And he played the family card to bale on Brisbane but then pissed off to Japan and left the family behind. So there's that too.

Also, spoiler alert, left the NT high and dry. Wouldn't call that 'seeing it through'.





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Munrubenmuz - 22 Oct 2021 4:39 PM
theFOOTBALLlover - 22 Oct 2021 4:12 PM

You obviously can't read. Of course he can.  I said good luck to him he's entitled to do whatever he wants.

It's the crapping on bit talking about 'dynasties' and how he's in for the long haul when he isn't that irks people.

And he played the family card to bale on Brisbane but then pissed off to Japan and left the family behind. So there's that too.

Also, spoiler alert, left the NT high and dry. Wouldn't call that 'seeing it through'.


and IF by some remarkable coincidence you are wrong and Ange was told by Stevie boy at the time that his contract would not be renewed for the tournament and they are bringing in a ringer foreigner because thats what the opinion surveys people told the FFA to do and he can either resign himself or be sacked in public, would you still feel the same way? Would you call that "saving face" or call the FFA dogs?


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Munrubenmuz - 22 Oct 2021 11:24 AM
Davide82 - 22 Oct 2021 11:13 AM

100% agree with all of this. Threw the NT under the bus and sent the FFA into a tailspin months out from the biggest tournament in the world. Weak as piss.

Yep. Indefensible on every level. 

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Stenson - 22 Oct 2021 3:26 PM
huddo - 22 Oct 2021 3:08 PM

He got them to the world cup. Did not get the backing of the ffa, so he preferred to walk.
He has achieved more than any other Aus coach. 
Can't deny it, haters will always exist.
You got nothing.

I don't think you can just brush off any criticism of Ange as "haters".  

After the 2015 Asian Cup I saw the man as a fucking GOD. I bought right in to his message about building a dynasty, changing football in Australia etc. 

I felt, as soon as it became apparent that he wasn't infallible, showing some tactical inflexibility etc, his attitude changed.   He wanted to see more football related discussion from fans and the media, yet reacted poorly when that occurred because he didn't agree with what they were saying.

Maybe he was right, that the criticism came from people that didn't understand what he was trying to do. So what? That is part of being a football manager. To quote Roy Keane, "that's his job". 

I did not want him to quit. I wanted him to see out this "dynasty" he was talking about at the World Cup in 2018. I also don't buy the "the FFA didn't back him" argument.  The FFA at the time were buffoons no doubt, but they were buffoons when Ange was appointed in 2013 as well and if there is one thing that the FFA generally do well it's spending the required money to make sure the Socceroos squad and staff have every available opportunity for success leading up to and at the wold cup (training facilities, catered flights etc).  

I genuinely felt stabbed in the heart when he quit. I've since accepted that it was his, and nobody else, decision to make. That doesn't mean I have to like what he did and I certainly don't have to respect him for it.  I believe he knew that a 0W 0D 3L cup was a distinct possibility and that would reflect badly on him. 

I still acknowledge he is Australia's best manager by far and genuinely wish him to succeed at Celtic. 





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Edited
4 Years Ago by sydneyfc1987
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do you honestly believe that? few things wrong with it.
1. This was before the largest tournament in a 8 year period, and the sacked coach was given Carte Blanche on the coaching style.
2. The route he took us probably netted the the FFA another 4+ million. so financial the FFA would have been delighted.
3. It was 2 week period between the qualification and the resignation.
4. it was a 2 month period till they announced BVM
5. Ange only ever signed until 2018 WC.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/football/2013/oct/23/ange-postecoglou-new-socceroos-coach

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Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 4:47 PM
Munrubenmuz - 22 Oct 2021 4:39 PM
and IF by some remarkable coincidence you are wrong and Ange was told by Stevie boy at the time that his contract would not be renewed for the tournament and they are bringing in a ringer foreigner because thats what the opinion surveys people told the FFA to do and he can either resign himself or be sacked in public, would you still feel the same way? Would you call that "saving face" or call the FFA dogs?


You don't think by now that if this were in any way true it wouldn't have been leaked, by Ange or somebody within the FFA?

Cmon man. He quit!

(VAR) IS NAVY BLUE

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huddo - 22 Oct 2021 4:16 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 22 Oct 2021 4:08 PM

He was paid a 6 figure sum for the unfair dismissal and was issued an apology.
from Heather and the FFA.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/ffa-issues-formal-apology-to-stajcic-20190531-p51t3b.html

Plus the CCM gig

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huddo - 22 Oct 2021 5:33 PM
do you honestly believe that? few things wrong with it.
1. This was before the largest tournament in a 8 year period, and the sacked coach was given Carte Blanche on the coaching style.
2. The route he took us probably netted the the FFA another 4+ million. so financial the FFA would have been delighted.
3. It was 2 week period between the qualification and the resignation.
4. it was a 2 month period till they announced BVM
5. Ange only ever signed until 2018 WC.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/football/2013/oct/23/ange-postecoglou-new-socceroos-coach

He knew he'd have 2 World Cups attempts and 6 defeats on his record, and wouldn't be offered a new contract.

Made the right career move to bale, and got mighty lucky he wasn't sacked after Season 1 in Japan.


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Stenson - 22 Oct 2021 3:26 PM
huddo - 22 Oct 2021 3:08 PM

He got them to the world cup. Did not get the backing of the ffa, so he preferred to walk.
He has achieved more than any other Aus coach. 
Can't deny it, haters will always exist.
You got nothing.

4.5 spots for a federation whose best team is around #40 is a travesty in itself.

For Australia to not manage to get in the top 4 would be a total catastrophic failure. 

Struggling to get in thr top 4 is bad enough.

Even Arnold will get Aus to Qatar.  Its not the achievement its made out to be by some

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numklpkgulftumch - 22 Oct 2021 6:09 PM
Stenson - 22 Oct 2021 3:26 PM

4.5 spots for a federation whose best team is around #40 is a travesty in itself.

For Australia to not manage to get in the top 4 would be a total catastrophic failure. 

Struggling to get in thr top 4 is bad enough.

Even Arnold will get Aus to Qatar.  Its not the achievement its made out to be by some

Yeah, a World cup with 2 confederacies doesn't help with the improvement in the other parts of the world. besides if the top only play the top the points needed to improve becomes almost impossible to accumulate.

besides you don't think this is an achievement wait for next qualifiers when the number jumps to 48. that's will be a walk
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numklpkgulftumch - 22 Oct 2021 6:09 PM
Stenson - 22 Oct 2021 3:26 PM

4.5 spots for a federation whose best team is around #40 is a travesty in itself.

For Australia to not manage to get in the top 4 would be a total catastrophic failure. 

Struggling to get in thr top 4 is bad enough.

Even Arnold will get Aus to Qatar.  Its not the achievement its made out to be by some

It’s called the WORLD Cup for good reason. If you just want the top Confeds playing in a tournament just watch Copa America and the European Cup only
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sydneyfc1987 - 22 Oct 2021 5:27 PM
Stenson - 22 Oct 2021 3:26 PM

I don't think you can just brush off any criticism of Ange as "haters".  

After the 2015 Asian Cup I saw the man as a fucking GOD. I bought right in to his message about building a dynasty, changing football in Australia etc. 

I felt, as soon as it became apparent that he wasn't infallible, showing some tactical inflexibility etc, his attitude changed.   He wanted to see more football related discussion from fans and the media, yet reacted poorly when that occurred because he didn't agree with what they were saying.

Maybe he was right, that the criticism came from people that didn't understand what he was trying to do. So what? That is part of being a football manager. To quote Roy Keane, "that's his job". 

I did not want him to quit. I wanted him to see out this "dynasty" he was talking about at the World Cup in 2018. I also don't buy the "the FFA didn't back him" argument.  The FFA at the time were buffoons no doubt, but they were buffoons when Ange was appointed in 2013 as well and if there is one thing that the FFA generally do well it's spending the required money to make sure the Socceroos squad and staff have every available opportunity for success leading up to and at the wold cup (training facilities, catered flights etc).  

I genuinely felt stabbed in the heart when he quit. I've since accepted that it was his, and nobody else, decision to make. That doesn't mean I have to like what he did and I certainly don't have to respect him for it.  I believe he knew that a 0W 0D 3L cup was a distinct possibility and that would reflect badly on him. 

I still acknowledge he is Australia's best manager by far and genuinely wish him to succeed at Celtic. 




Exactly how I feel. Well said. 
GO


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