Ukraine


Ukraine

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not all heroes wear capes!

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky virtually addresses the US Congress on March 16, 2022, at the US Capitol Visitor Center Congressional Auditorium, in Washington, DC.
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Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 9:05 AM
Munrubenmuz - 11 Mar 2022 3:58 PM

Never forget, Trump was right.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/16/us/politics/hunter-biden-tax-bill-investigation.html

"Federal tax prosecutors generally fight to keep jurors from knowing whether defendants have paid their back tax bills, arguing that the crime happens when the return is falsely filed or not filed at all"

Hunter Biden was also lining up meetings for pay with his then Vice President father in Ukraine whilst alsoworking in Ukraine for an obscene salary in a job he literally knew nothing about.  And not paying his taxes.

I reckon that's dirt enough, wouldn't you say?

What you should be concerned about is how your side of the media sought to bury this.  By exyension how do you actually know what you read abut Ukraine is not propaganda.

all of this is inference by Trumpkins, there are no facts backing up this conspiracy theory and you know it
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Munrubenmuz - 24 Mar 2022 3:05 PM
Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 9:05 AM

Yes, yes I see. Nepotism by an unelected presidential opponent is a fair pretext to withhold hundreds of millions of dollars in military aid to an ally .

Cool.

So unusual and ridiculously out of the ordinary was the request that the conversation was reported immediately afterwards.

Immediately after the Trump–Zelenskyy call ended, White House national security aides discussed their deep concerns, with at least one National Security Council (NSC) official alerting White House national security lawyers.[31][32] A text message between a State Department envoy to Ukraine and a Ukrainian official showed the envoy understood from the White House that a Zelenskyy visit with Trump was contingent upon Ukraine's investigating a conspiracy theory about alleged Ukrainian meddling in the 2016 U.S. presidential election.[33]


And? 

Biden held back aid until after a Ukraine government official was sacked. 

Besides who better than the Ukraine government to investigate allegations of meddling in US democracy by people in Ukraine.  And what better motivator than to withhold money of they don't?

Anyway, Trump was mistaken:  the meddling was closer to home with Clinton's Russiagate claims and the Steele Dossier that she and the Democrats literally paid  to get written.
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cesspit - 24 Mar 2022 3:29 PM
Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 9:05 AM

all of this is inference by Trumpkins, there are no facts backing up this conspiracy theory and you know it

Haha.  Good one.
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When you actually look at the long history of the US and Biden's involvement in the last 10 years in Ukraine, a country most people would not be able to find on a map, doesn't that ring alarm bells that something has been up for a while?  Why their interest in Ukraine?.  Democracy my arse. The US wants this war.
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Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 3:45 PM
When you actually look at the long history of the US and Biden's involvement in the last 10 years in Ukraine, a country most people would not be able to find on a map, doesn't that ring alarm bells that something has been up for a while?  Why their interest in Ukraine?.  Democracy my arse. The US wants this war.

Yeah I wonder why the US would be interested in a liberal democracy on Russia's doorstep that wants to join the EU and possibly NATO.

Baffling. 


https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/trump-s-zelenskyy-call-key-point-amid-russia-s-ukraine-n1291960?cid=sm_npd_ms_tw_ma



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Edited
2 Years Ago by Munrubenmuz
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Munrubenmuz - 24 Mar 2022 4:03 PM
Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 3:45 PM

Yeah I wonder why the US would be interested in a liberal democracy on Russia's doorstep that wants to join the EU and possibly NATO.

Baffling. 


https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/trump-s-zelenskyy-call-key-point-amid-russia-s-ukraine-n1291960?cid=sm_npd_ms_tw_ma

this Enzo clown probably isn't even vaccinated
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Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 3:38 PM
Munrubenmuz - 24 Mar 2022 3:05 PM


And? 

Biden held back aid until after a Ukraine government official was sacked. 

Besides who better than the Ukraine government to investigate allegations of meddling in US democracy by people in Ukraine.  And what better motivator than to withhold money of they don't?

Anyway, Trump was mistaken:  the meddling was closer to home with Clinton's Russiagate claims and the Steele Dossier that she and the Democrats literally paid  to get written.

And? Lol. You clown.

Biden wanting a corrupt official sacked before providing funding is suspect how?! Weren't you saying they had a corrupt government. There's a world of difference between asking for dirt on an opponent and giving aid on the proviso that a corrupt official is booted. No aid given anywhere is unconditional.

And the dossier. The dossier that contains details on Trump getting pissed on by 2 prostitutes? That dossier? Occams razor tells you that that story is more likely true than not.

It's no small wonder why Trump was so friendly to Putin.







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Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 3:45 PM
When you actually look at the long history of the US and Biden's involvement in the last 10 years in Ukraine, a country most people would not be able to find on a map, doesn't that ring alarm bells that something has been up for a while?  Why their interest in Ukraine?.  Democracy my arse. The US wants this war.

Since when has being able to find a country on a map ever stopped the US from sticking their grubby noses in everywhere?

'Can you name a country?'  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umpalMtQE50




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Edited
2 Years Ago by Munrubenmuz
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cesspit - 24 Mar 2022 4:12 PM
Munrubenmuz - 24 Mar 2022 4:03 PM

this Enzo clown probably isn't even vaccinated

Log in, log out and still can't get any bites.


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Munrubenmuz - 24 Mar 2022 4:19 PM
Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 3:38 PM

And? Lol. You clown.

Biden wanting a corrupt official sacked before providing funding is suspect how?! Weren't you saying they had a corrupt government. There's a world of difference between asking for dirt on an opponent and giving aid on the proviso that a corrupt official is booted. No aid given anywhere is unconditional.

And the dossier. The dossier that contains details on Trump getting pissed on by 2 prostitutes? That dossier? Occams razor tells you that that story is more likely true than not.

It's no small wonder why Trump was so friendly to Putin.






The only clown here is you.  A perpetuallly angry clown.  How does that even work?  But here it is.

The Steele Dossier has been discredited on numerous accounts.


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Munrubenmuz - 24 Mar 2022 4:03 PM
Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 3:45 PM

Yeah I wonder why the US would be interested in a liberal democracy on Russia's doorstep that wants to join the EU and possibly NATO.

Baffling. 


https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/trump-s-zelenskyy-call-key-point-amid-russia-s-ukraine-n1291960?cid=sm_npd_ms_tw_ma

Liberal democracy.  Haha. That's funny.

[Edit]  Zelensky is a  comedian so there is that.
Edited
2 Years Ago by Enzo Bearzot
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Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 5:02 PM
Munrubenmuz - 24 Mar 2022 4:03 PM

Liberal democracy.  Haha. That's funny.

[Edit]  Zelensky is a  comedian so there is that.

What is your actual problem with Ukraine?

Is it Biden and 'woke' leftists or is it something else? The MSMs narrative? What?


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Munrubenmuz - 24 Mar 2022 6:13 PM
Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 5:02 PM

What is your actual problem with Ukraine?

Is it Biden and 'woke' leftists or is it something else? The MSMs narrative? What?

 I have no problem with the Ukraine people.  At all.

 Yes I have problem the Biden's abusing their political power in Ukraine for personal gain.

I have a problem with how the US interfered in Ukraine's internal affairs, Destablizing their elected government and then claiming that its democracy that they are fighting for. 

And I absolutely detest the MSM's narrative that Russia's actions are simply those of a deranged mad ma, an Hitler Mark 2, and that there is nothing more to this war than that.

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Enzo Bearzot - 24 Mar 2022 6:39 PM
Munrubenmuz - 24 Mar 2022 6:13 PM

And I absolutely detest the MSM's narrative that Russia's actions are simply those of a deranged mad ma, an Hitler Mark 2, and that there is nothing more to this war than that.

Yeah, somewhere in between the poisoning of political opponents and the murder of dozens of journalists the liberal elitist "MSM" have created this bizarre myth that Putin is bit of a prick.

Totally unfair of course.  They should focus on his softer side. 

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some thing like 10x missiles already have hit Ulkraine then the entire syria conflict in five years 
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tsf - 25 Mar 2022 11:04 AM
some thing like 10x missiles already have hit Ulkraine then the entire syria conflict in five years 

Wow, maybe the US can send Putin some of those humanitarian Napalm canisters they have been using to roast people alive since 1947, that is such a more civilized way to treat unarmed farmers.
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So the Ukrainians hit a couple of ships today in a harbour and then the defence minister (I think) said thanks to the Russian journalists that were on board broadcasting their positions.

https://www.skynews.com.au/world-news/ukrainian-navy-claim-to-have-destroyed-russian-warship-docked-at-a-port-carrying-military-aid-to-vladimir-putins-soldiers/news-story/7dbf325aa1f9b16d1db8bafb4119ae20

I would have though the US or Britain would be watching all of this live via their military satellites and giving Ukraine real time information and intelligence on troop and armour movements.


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Monoethnic Social Club - 25 Mar 2022 12:57 PM
tsf - 25 Mar 2022 11:04 AM

Wow, maybe the US can send Putin some of those humanitarian Napalm canisters they have been using to roast people alive since 1947, that is such a more civilized way to treat unarmed farmers.

Putin doesn't need those. He has thermobaric weapons which suck the lungs out of your body and been used extensively since Chechnya. (And in Syria.)

See also chemical weapons and phosporic weaponry.

But yes the US have an equally set of disgusting weapons.


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Munrubenmuz - 25 Mar 2022 1:16 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 25 Mar 2022 12:57 PM

Putin doesn't need those. He has thermobaric weapons which suck the lungs out of your body and been used extensively since Chechnya. (And in Syria.)

See also chemical weapons and phosporic weaponry.

But yes the US have an equally set of disgusting weapons.

Absolutely fair.... Poor Russia has never had the chance to drop two nuclear weapons on a civilian population though so maybe its time to even the ledger????
Point being "War is hell" and all this jingoistic chest beating from the media is fuelling garbage debate and anxiety for feeble minds ..... nothing else mate.
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Monoethnic Social Club - 25 Mar 2022 1:42 PM
Munrubenmuz - 25 Mar 2022 1:16 PM

Absolutely fair.... Poor Russia has never had the chance to drop two nuclear weapons on a civilian population though so maybe its time to even the ledger????
Point being "War is hell" and all this jingoistic chest beating from the media is fuelling garbage debate and anxiety for feeble minds ..... nothing else mate.

An equally feeble argument is just saying "well what about when x did y?".

Like that justifies anything. 

That mindset is EXACTLY why things happen over and over and over and over again.

"But muuuuuuuuuum he did it first"
"if he jumped off a bridge would you do it too?"


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If John killed someone drink driving should he not try and save a drowning child?

John confronts Gary who threw the child in the river, Gary says "hey, you're one to talk"

John should just leave I guess


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Monoethnic Social Club - 25 Mar 2022 1:42 PM
Munrubenmuz - 25 Mar 2022 1:16 PM

Absolutely fair.... Poor Russia has never had the chance to drop two nuclear weapons on a civilian population though so maybe its time to even the ledger????
Point being "War is hell" and all this jingoistic chest beating from the media is fuelling garbage debate and anxiety for feeble minds ..... nothing else mate.

It's not jingoistic and it's not chest beating. It's one country invading another independent country. People are rightfully upset. Humans are, like it or not, tribal and what we see in the Ukraine is confronting and upsetting. Shit that goes down in the Middle east or Africa is equally bad but outside our frame of reference and is happening to 'others' so we tend to blot it out. (I know if anything comes up regards Israel for example I just tune right out.)

Just because A is happening over there doesn't mean B happening over here doesn't count.

Plenty of people have demonstrated in their millions and argued and long and hard about American involvement in the many conflicts since Vietnam if not earlier. (Many people, me included think dropping 2 atomic bombs on Japan without giving them a demo elsewhere first was a war crime).

I think you are framing this wrong and your anger is misplaced. 


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Edited
2 Years Ago by Munrubenmuz
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Monoethnic Social Club - 25 Mar 2022 12:57 PM
tsf - 25 Mar 2022 11:04 AM

Wow, maybe the US can send Putin some of those humanitarian Napalm canisters they have been using to roast people alive since 1947, that is such a more civilized way to treat unarmed farmers.

Not sure of your point?



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You know it's possible for us to be against both US and Russian aggression? 

And just because we do not wish to see civillians suffer in Ukraine, that does not mean anything other than we do not want to see civillians suffer. 
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Exactly.
It's really pretty simple
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tsf - 25 Mar 2022 11:04 AM
some thing like 10x missiles already have hit Ulkraine then the entire syria conflict in five years 

Yeah, but Whatabbout the Spanish American War in 1898?
And Whatabbout the Anglo-Zulu War of 1879?

Hypocrite.

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tsf - 25 Mar 2022 2:43 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 25 Mar 2022 12:57 PM

Not sure of your point?



That the west have committed atrocities in wars before so Putin gets a free pass at Ukraine.

Well done mono!!  




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Folks we now have scientific proof that anti-vaxxers are Putin apologists

This survey conducted in Canada shows that the unvaccinated were far less supportive of sanctions against Putin's regime

https://www.ekospolitics.com/index.php/2022/03/public-attitudes-to-ukraine-conflict-by-vaccine-acceptance/
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Munrubenmuz - 25 Mar 2022 2:06 PM
Monoethnic Social Club - 25 Mar 2022 1:42 PM

It's not jingoistic and it's not chest beating. It's one country invading another independent country. People are rightfully upset. Humans are, like it or not, tribal and what we see in the Ukraine is confronting and upsetting. Shit that goes down in the Middle east or Africa is equally bad but outside our frame of reference and is happening to 'others' so we tend to blot it out. (I know if anything comes up regards Israel for example I just tune right out.)

Just because A is happening over there doesn't mean B happening over here doesn't count.

Plenty of people have demonstrated in their millions and argued and long and hard about American involvement in the many conflicts since Vietnam if not earlier. (Many people, me included think dropping 2 atomic bombs on Japan without giving them a demo elsewhere first was a war crime).

I think you are framing this wrong and your anger is misplaced. 
This sentence is EXACTLY what I am angry about Muz.....  "Outside our frame of reference"??? C'mon mate what the fark does that mean?  Aren't muslim kids and African kids .... kids?
To alleviate everyones fears I HATE RUSSIA  AND I HATE PUTIN.......  Its not about "whataboutism" its just that I really, really dislike the narrative building up around this latest US "crusade" and it seem to me (Maybe I am wrong) that MSM and social media is LYING to us all. 


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