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Denis Yera
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When it comes to teaching your child about shapes, shape tracing worksheets are a great way to teach your child to recognize them. Children are naturally playful and can get easily distracted. They also tend to pay less attention during lessons. However, it is important to engage their interest by providing fun games and hands-on activities. Aside from shape tracing worksheets, you can also use a shape collage for your child to boost his or her recognition skills.
Denuwo
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CroatianDaniel
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At my school in QLD, a form of English and a form of Maths is always compulsary. In the junior grades (8, 9, 10) EVERY STUDENT had to do a semester of every subject that our school offerred.
SOSE was an introduction to Modern History either taught in year 9 or 10
Year 10 Advanced Science was an introduction to what chemistry and phsyics could be like.
Health and Physical Education (HPE) had components of Senior HPE (more theory based) and Recreational Studies (more practical based).
Year 10 Computer Studies gave students an idea of what Senior Business and ICT would be like
Woodwork and Metalwork gave students a look into what subjects like Construction, Engineering Studies and Furnishing Studies.
Drama/Media Studies was combined into one subject to give students a look at what that could be like in Senior Grades
And Cooking or Early Childhood had to be taken for one semester to give students a look at the hospitality side of things.
Despite my school not having all the latest technologies and being very poor on reputation, I cannot fault them at all when it comes to giving me and my peers the best possible education.
So to answer your question I believe a form of English studies has to be compulsary for students in year 11 and 12, it teaches so many life skills, and is probably the best subject in preparing students for tertiary education, even the non-OP english is great, as it shows students what the real world is like and enchances students' skills so they have better opportunities to get a good job and what not.
Sorry for the long read but I just wanted to put my 2 cents in :)
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ozboy
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jlm8695 wrote:I mean, if you have done Math all your life from K-10 and you still don't know how to add, well that's a problem with the individual, or the way it has been taught. Science is an iffy one, but again, it has to remain the students decision.
I did General Math last year ( year 11 for me) and it really was bullshit. All you needed to know were very basic, simple formulas and to make it mandatory would be a waste of a subject allocation for many students. The science taught in schools must be very basic then. It is very difficult to do science without maths. Maths is a foundational block of science. For example, the table of elements taught in physics/chemistry is based on mathematically theory.
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jlm8695
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afromanGT wrote:Quote:Well in Victoria English is not mandatory, as long as you pick up Literature instead. Lit is an english subject. You have to do at least on english language subject. Yeah my bad, thought the question meant english as the core subject, not an english language subject.
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afromanGT
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Quote:Well in Victoria English is not mandatory, as long as you pick up Literature instead. Lit is an english subject. You have to do at least on english language subject.
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jlm8695
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Well in Victoria English is not mandatory, as long as you pick up Literature instead. Math and Science should not be compulsory in the senior years (11 and 12). I mean, if you have done Math all your life from K-10 and you still don't know how to add, well that's a problem with the individual, or the way it has been taught. Science is an iffy one, but again, it has to remain the students decision.
I did General Math last year ( year 11 for me) and it really was bullshit. All you needed to know were very basic, simple formulas and to make it mandatory would be a waste of a subject allocation for many students.
Edited by jlm8695: 3/10/2012 12:59:25 PM
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ozboy
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Science and Maths should be compulsory subjects long before English (aka basic philosophy/psychology/sociology) should be compulsory.
We'd have a lot less problems in society today if Science was compulsory over English. Critical thinking would do wonders
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afromanGT
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It's not entirely the fault of the school system. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. They teach the content and it's not always their fault if the students don't learn anything from it. I've watched kids hand in papers written in leet speak.
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ricecrackers
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rocknerd wrote:What does it matter, the English language has been destroyed by internet and text speak as well as a move to computers, young people today have less and less of a grasp of how to construct sentences and how to articulate a point in an essay.
It was bad enough when I was going through school, that they removed grammar from the curriculum, now days kids are needing to be taught how to write legibly for their HSC!
But yes it should as well as 1 science, Nath and a computer class that helps you understand the finer points of computers to an equivelant of a Cert II at TAFE. it wasnt destroyed by the internet, it was destroyed by an education system that failed to teach grammar and many of the basics for too long the public school system is to blame, not the internet
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afromanGT
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English will ALWAYS be a university prerequisite in this country unless we're invaded by a non-english speaking country.
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GloryUTD
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English will stay compulsory in senior high schools (at least for TER students) as long as universities make it the basic prerequisite for any course. And fair enough too, especially since many of the skills that you use in it are vital for uni, from articulation of thoughts and logical thinking to expanding your minds by exploring wider social issues and critical awareness.
Another point: if universities ever drop their English requirements for local students, they will have to do the same for international students too, therefore opening up a world of trouble for themselves, so it's never going to happen.
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leftrightout
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Should English be a mandatory year 11 & 12 subject?
YES.
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Fredsta
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afromanGT wrote:Guys, quote pyramids? Seriously?
It's all well and good that you dropped maths in year 10, Fredsta. But I've got staff who work for me who can't add up change. What a fucking joke! Basic life skills like that are lacking all over the board. True, did you read the last bit of my previous post? I think a system like that would be useful, you teach the kids what they need to know at a more casual pace that they're comfortable with, AND it won't count as a VCE subject.
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afromanGT
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Guys, quote pyramids? Seriously?
It's all well and good that you dropped maths in year 10, Fredsta. But I've got staff who work for me who can't add up change. What a fucking joke! Basic life skills like that are lacking all over the board.
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Fredsta
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RedKat wrote:Fredsta wrote:RedKat, fair call and I agree.
I'm at uni and still have no idea what I want to do with myself, I mean I'm doing a history major because I enjoy the study but I've given no thought to where it will lead me.
I sort of meant more students knowing what they want to study, I've always known what I've wanted to study and have been very strongly aware of what I don't want on my timetable. I studied English, Literature, History, Politics, and Media from 11 onwards as my five subjects, when the careers office tried to talk me into doing a sixth subject I found I just had no interest or motivation to try anything else, and I know this is the case with many others. That's why I reject the idea of subjects like maths and science being enforced upon students as so many gifted students are just completely brain dead at subjects outside their comfort zones, and forcing it upon them would result in a negative impact imo. If its out of their comfort zone, even more reason to make them do it. Life is not about always being in the comfort zone and doing what you want to do. Sometimes you have to do things you don't like because it helps you in the long run. And chillbilly, I would ideally say a maths and science on top of English. However, he did maths as you said so that still gave him some depth. I know some people I could never convince to do a maths and science as well. Least he got some exposure to those skills through maths. Disagree, at that age students are starting to realize what their strengths are and what they want to focus on, forcing choices upon them would do more harm than help imo. I dropped Maths after year 10 as I knew I didn't want to/didn't need to study it, and I dropped Science as it was just pointless for me. I'd probably fail a year 10 maths test right now if you put it in front of me, but I can pay bills and work out change just fine and for me thats the extent of Maths I need in my life. Knowing I always wanted to study History or Journalism, forcing Maths or Science upon me in year 11 and 12 would have been of no benefit and definitely would have harmed my chances of getting into the top tertiary courses of my desire. One thing that I wouldn't be against in regards to Maths is similar to a method my school employed in year 12. As I went to a Catholic school it was compulsory to study Religion yet no one wanted to waste a VCE spot on RE. So what my school did was offer simple short subjects on RE that only ran for the first semester of year 12 and became a study period in second semsester, plus one class each week was scrapped for an extra study period. I could agree with a similar option being offered to students so basic maths skills that will be useful in life can be taught without compromising your study.
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Roar_Brisbane
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RedKat wrote:Roar_Brisbane wrote:RedKat wrote:Fredsta wrote:RedKat, fair call and I agree.
I'm at uni and still have no idea what I want to do with myself, I mean I'm doing a history major because I enjoy the study but I've given no thought to where it will lead me.
I sort of meant more students knowing what they want to study, I've always known what I've wanted to study and have been very strongly aware of what I don't want on my timetable. I studied English, Literature, History, Politics, and Media from 11 onwards as my five subjects, when the careers office tried to talk me into doing a sixth subject I found I just had no interest or motivation to try anything else, and I know this is the case with many others. That's why I reject the idea of subjects like maths and science being enforced upon students as so many gifted students are just completely brain dead at subjects outside their comfort zones, and forcing it upon them would result in a negative impact imo. If its out of their comfort zone, even more reason to make them do it. Life is not about always being in the comfort zone and doing what you want to do. Sometimes you have to do things you don't like because it helps you in the long run. And chillbilly, I would ideally say a maths and science on top of English. However, he did maths as you said so that still gave him some depth. I know some people I could never convince to do a maths and science as well. Least he got some exposure to those skills through maths. At my old high school science was compulsory until year 10. So everyone does get a taste of the subject. You can only do 5 or 6 subject in your senior year, why should I be forced to do science when I want to focus on business. So if you have 5-6 subjects to pick, if english and a maths or science subject is compulsory, you still have 3-4 subjects to pick where you can focus on business. It really isnt the end of the world having one more mandatory subject that teaches you so much important things. Im sure i read somewhere anyway that some firms prefer employing people with a BSc over BCom for example because of how science teaches you to think. Of course thats post graduate but i still think that shows why science is so important to get a full rounding of in school. Math and English are already compulsory. The only science subjects available at my school were chemistry, physics and biology which all clashed with economics, law and accounting. As science was compulsory until year 10, I already had done 3 years of it at high school.
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Roar_Brisbane
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RedKat wrote:Fredsta wrote:RedKat, fair call and I agree.
I'm at uni and still have no idea what I want to do with myself, I mean I'm doing a history major because I enjoy the study but I've given no thought to where it will lead me.
I sort of meant more students knowing what they want to study, I've always known what I've wanted to study and have been very strongly aware of what I don't want on my timetable. I studied English, Literature, History, Politics, and Media from 11 onwards as my five subjects, when the careers office tried to talk me into doing a sixth subject I found I just had no interest or motivation to try anything else, and I know this is the case with many others. That's why I reject the idea of subjects like maths and science being enforced upon students as so many gifted students are just completely brain dead at subjects outside their comfort zones, and forcing it upon them would result in a negative impact imo. If its out of their comfort zone, even more reason to make them do it. Life is not about always being in the comfort zone and doing what you want to do. Sometimes you have to do things you don't like because it helps you in the long run. And chillbilly, I would ideally say a maths and science on top of English. However, he did maths as you said so that still gave him some depth. I know some people I could never convince to do a maths and science as well. Least he got some exposure to those skills through maths. At my old high school science was compulsory until year 10. So everyone does get a taste of the subject. You can only do 5 or 6 subject in your senior year, why should I be forced to do science when I want to focus on business.
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chillbilly
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RedKat wrote:chillbilly wrote:RedKat wrote:Fredsta wrote:Riv of Canberra wrote:PE should be compulsory too, because there are just too many fat kids and people in their early 20s nowadays. I didn't do PE after year 10 but going from the work my friends did when we were in year 12 there was very little actual physical components to the subject and it was almost entirely theory. People saying English shouldn't be compulsory because they don't need to know about Shakespeare clearly under estimate the necessity of English in developing skills that will be highly influential in later life. English teaches you to think critically and express yourself fluently, plus it teaches us how to structure our writing which can be useful in future employment. I think at the end of the day students should have freedom in selecting their subjects and should be able to tailor their timetables to match their study/employment plans, but I think an element of English should be compulsory even if it is the most basic skills class imaginable. I personally dropped Maths and Science after year 9/10 because I always knew I wanted to play to my strengths and study English and Humanities subjects.
I found when I eliminated Maths and Science I really enjoyed school, and it allowed me to concentrate on what I enjoyed, which was hugely beneficial in helping me attain a good score to study my course. If I was forced to study Maths and Science my score would have dropped significantly and school would have been far less enjoyable, which is why I'm against enforcing subjects upon students, proper guidance and education on tertiary/employment prospects should be enforced so that students can make informed choices about their own future. Agree with all the non bold stuff. The last part I disagree with. No one really knows what they want to do with their lives in year 10 or 11 or even year 12. I only decided what I wanted to do at the end of year 12. Ive had friends who've wanted to do something their whole high school years and then decide its not for them. Theres a lot of people who get into what they've dreamt of doing for so long and realise it isnt for them and they're stuck because they taylor made their subjects to get into the degree. Of course there are no prerequisites so they can transfer but they lost out on 2 years of developing the skills needed for that degree. I agree totally with your comments on English. Scientific teaches so to be analytical in a different way to English and brings in a lot of logic. Maths is also exceptionally important in teaching more ways of logical thinking and problem solving. Its why i think english, science and maths should all be mandatory. Im not sure how its like in other states but if we take NSW for example. Theres 6 units that could be taken up in maths, science and english. That still allows for 4 units at least of the persons own choosing, and even 6 if they want to do 12 units and then one of the mandatory subjects dont count. On further thought if you made english and maths or science compulsory thats 4 units mandatory and the rest is up to the student to decide which really isnt that big a jump from the current 2 mandatory units of English. At the end of the day school is about learning social skills and getting a rounded education. If students arent pursuing maths and or science on top on English towards the end of their schooling years they are not getting a rounded education. I strongly disagree with you on science being compulsory in the senior years. Not everyone is made to do senior school level science. I did Physics and Chemistry in year 11 and 12. Out of the 120 students in my year there was only 35 that chose to do one or both of those subjects. After a month 10 people quit because it was too hard for them. I'm not sure about the numbers for biology but they seemed to have similar numbers to us. If someone is brilliant artistically but struggles with scientific concepts why should they have a subject that is not in their interest forced upon them. And if there are only 4-6 compulsory units they still have another 6 or 4 (or more if they do more than 10 units which to me is just playing it smart) to pick the subjects they enjoy and good at. People who are good at maths/science still have to do english and i dont think it should be different for people who are more humanity inclined. Science wise there is also Earth and Environmental science and Im pretty sure there an easier science course called Senior Science or something like that. I just think letting people pick pure humanities or just non maths/science subjects who do not get a proper rounded education for reasons ive already said. I have a friend who is great at computers but was awful at science. In year 12 he did engineering studies, IT, some other computer subject, maths and english. Why should he have had to take another mandatory science course when he struggled through it in the previous 4 years? Edited by chillbilly: 27/9/2012 09:33:44 AM
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Fredsta
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RedKat, fair call and I agree.
I'm at uni and still have no idea what I want to do with myself, I mean I'm doing a history major because I enjoy the study but I've given no thought to where it will lead me.
I sort of meant more students knowing what they want to study, I've always known what I've wanted to study and have been very strongly aware of what I don't want on my timetable. I studied English, Literature, History, Politics, and Media from 11 onwards as my five subjects, when the careers office tried to talk me into doing a sixth subject I found I just had no interest or motivation to try anything else, and I know this is the case with many others. That's why I reject the idea of subjects like maths and science being enforced upon students as so many gifted students are just completely brain dead at subjects outside their comfort zones, and forcing it upon them would result in a negative impact imo.
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Roar_Brisbane
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Anyway in Qld if you are doing an OP, English and Math are already mandatory.
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chillbilly
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RedKat wrote:Fredsta wrote:Riv of Canberra wrote:PE should be compulsory too, because there are just too many fat kids and people in their early 20s nowadays. I didn't do PE after year 10 but going from the work my friends did when we were in year 12 there was very little actual physical components to the subject and it was almost entirely theory. People saying English shouldn't be compulsory because they don't need to know about Shakespeare clearly under estimate the necessity of English in developing skills that will be highly influential in later life. English teaches you to think critically and express yourself fluently, plus it teaches us how to structure our writing which can be useful in future employment. I think at the end of the day students should have freedom in selecting their subjects and should be able to tailor their timetables to match their study/employment plans, but I think an element of English should be compulsory even if it is the most basic skills class imaginable. I personally dropped Maths and Science after year 9/10 because I always knew I wanted to play to my strengths and study English and Humanities subjects.
I found when I eliminated Maths and Science I really enjoyed school, and it allowed me to concentrate on what I enjoyed, which was hugely beneficial in helping me attain a good score to study my course. If I was forced to study Maths and Science my score would have dropped significantly and school would have been far less enjoyable, which is why I'm against enforcing subjects upon students, proper guidance and education on tertiary/employment prospects should be enforced so that students can make informed choices about their own future. Agree with all the non bold stuff. The last part I disagree with. No one really knows what they want to do with their lives in year 10 or 11 or even year 12. I only decided what I wanted to do at the end of year 12. Ive had friends who've wanted to do something their whole high school years and then decide its not for them. Theres a lot of people who get into what they've dreamt of doing for so long and realise it isnt for them and they're stuck because they taylor made their subjects to get into the degree. Of course there are no prerequisites so they can transfer but they lost out on 2 years of developing the skills needed for that degree. I agree totally with your comments on English. Scientific teaches so to be analytical in a different way to English and brings in a lot of logic. Maths is also exceptionally important in teaching more ways of logical thinking and problem solving. Its why i think english, science and maths should all be mandatory. Im not sure how its like in other states but if we take NSW for example. Theres 6 units that could be taken up in maths, science and english. That still allows for 4 units at least of the persons own choosing, and even 6 if they want to do 12 units and then one of the mandatory subjects dont count. On further thought if you made english and maths or science compulsory thats 4 units mandatory and the rest is up to the student to decide which really isnt that big a jump from the current 2 mandatory units of English. At the end of the day school is about learning social skills and getting a rounded education. If students arent pursuing maths and or science on top on English towards the end of their schooling years they are not getting a rounded education. I strongly disagree with you on science being compulsory in the senior years. Not everyone is made to do senior school level science. I did Physics and Chemistry in year 11 and 12. Out of the 120 students in my year there was only 35 that chose to do one or both of those subjects. After a month 10 people quit because it was too hard for them. I'm not sure about the numbers for biology but they seemed to have similar numbers to us. If someone is brilliant artistically but struggles with scientific concepts why should they have a subject that is not in their interest forced upon them.
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Fredsta
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Riv of Canberra wrote:PE should be compulsory too, because there are just too many fat kids and people in their early 20s nowadays. I didn't do PE after year 10 but going from the work my friends did when we were in year 12 there was very little actual physical components to the subject and it was almost entirely theory. People saying English shouldn't be compulsory because they don't need to know about Shakespeare clearly under estimate the necessity of English in developing skills that will be highly influential in later life. English teaches you to think critically and express yourself fluently, plus it teaches us how to structure our writing which can be useful in future employment. I think at the end of the day students should have freedom in selecting their subjects and should be able to tailor their timetables to match their study/employment plans, but I think an element of English should be compulsory even if it is the most basic skills class imaginable. I personally dropped Maths and Science after year 9/10 because I always knew I wanted to play to my strengths and study English and Humanities subjects. I found when I eliminated Maths and Science I really enjoyed school, and it allowed me to concentrate on what I enjoyed, which was hugely beneficial in helping me attain a good score to study my course. If I was forced to study Maths and Science my score would have dropped significantly and school would have been far less enjoyable, which is why I'm against enforcing subjects upon students, proper guidance and education on tertiary/employment prospects should be enforced so that students can make informed choices about their own future.
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afromanGT
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Looking at the adult literacy rates out there, ABSOLUTELY it should be. These kids need all the help they can get.
When majority of the grown adults I know don't know their your-s from their you're-s, and the difference between were/where or they're/there/their...
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Riv of Canberra
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Yes, English should be mandatory in years 11 and 12, as should maths. And students should also complete one foreign language through years 7 to 12, although not necessarily an Asian language. And PE should be compulsory too, because there are just too many fat kids and people in their early 20s nowadays.
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General Ashnak
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RedKat wrote:This is awkward. I agree with ozboys point on science. Science teaches so much skills. Theres a reason some business will rather hire people with a BSc rather than a BCom because of the analytical skills science teaches. Maths can also bring a lot of logic.
English however is important. Whilst yes Shakespeare might not be needed in later life, I still think people need to be 'culturally' enrich and exposed to one of the greatest writers in history. He is one of the greatest writers of pulp fiction ever, a very entertaining read :)
The thing about football - the important thing about football - is its not just about football.
- Sir Terry Pratchett in Unseen Academicals
For pro/rel in Australia across the entire pyramid, the removal of artificial impediments to the development of the game and its players.
On sabbatical Youth Coach and formerly part of The Cove FC
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aufc_ole
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AndyToddsElbow wrote:English is very important. The amount of people out there that are cannibals compared to the amount of people that just like to eat dinner with their grandmas is astonishing. :D =d> =d> 
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AndyToddsElbow
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English is very important. The amount of people out there that are cannibals compared to the amount of people that just like to eat dinner with their grandmas is astonishing. :D
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SpawningSalmon
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99 Problems wrote:RJL25 wrote:SpawningSalmon wrote:11.mvfc.11 wrote:I personally think our school system is rather slack. I believe one English, one math and one science should all be compulsory. RedKat wrote:I personally feel English, Maths and one science should be compulsory. But thats just me. At first I thought this was a good idea, but then I remembered that [size=7] you only need to take four subjects in Year 12[/size] for the new SACE, so students wouldn't be given much choice, unless they decided to take an extra subject or two. Alternatively, they could scrap the PLP or whatever it's called and make it five subjects in Year 12 again. Wait, what? That's a joke right?? Yeah when the shit did that happen?? I finished 4 years ago and it was 6 subjects, 5 minimum, and any 1 unit subjects on top of this I finished in the last year of the old SACE (2010) where it was only five subjects, but I'm sure the new SACE is only four subjects and something called a Research Project. I don't know too much about it, it's best to ask somebody doing the new SACE/somebody who did it last year.
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TimmyJ
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moofa wrote:I did VCE last year and English was my lowest score. I think English should be mandatory but I do not think it should be included in your top 4. This basically means it should not have such a large effect on your final score if it is not one of your better subjects but I still think you should take it. This is similar to how I feel. My english score really pulled down my TER score. I have terrible sentence structure, spelling skills and grammar skills but a decent vocabulary and good overall essay structure. I think the subject should focus more on report writing, referencing and oral presentations and have more interesting texts to analyse as I found all my school texts quite boring and I doubt I was the only one. This may be getting better as both my sisters seem to have had better or at least more interesting texts. I study electrical engineering and tutor high school students in math and physics. I would say that neither math nor science should be compulsory. Some students really struggle with these subjects and it would really disadvantage them. Just as I feel I was by taking english. As a side note the main problem especially with maths is that people who are struggling have no clue about the concepts and from around year 8 upwards and when you start to get into superimposing and substituting formulas into one anther they become really confused. The solution I find is just to tell them why these concepts are there and prove it with a number of varied expansions. Always see a drastic improvement once some of the basic concepts are understood. Deos English work the same way?
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chillbilly
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RJL25 wrote:Of all the subjects that should be "elective", English is not one of them!
Lol at keepersball saying its not like maths because you use maths everyday but not English, are you actually serious or just taking the piss?
You may not use poetry every day, but you don't use trigonometry every day either! But you still need to know it to have a proper comprehension of maths, just as poetry teaches you the groundwork of English.
English is the one subject I especially wish I had paid more attention to at school
Edited by RJL25: 24/9/2012 07:59:41 PM On the topic of trigonometry I found it astounding catching a train to uni with Tafe students I went to school with that struggled to complete a question on a sheet of trig problems and just sat there fiddling with their calculators in an hour long trip. I would have been able to complete the sheet in my head, at the start of year 7, in under 10 minutes. What the hell did they do in the 6 years they did maths at school?
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