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thupercoach
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Link2588 wrote:If Davidson, Bozanic and Leckie aren't in the squad Vs Canada and France we riot! Davidson and Leckie. Bozanic is crap.
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moops
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rusty wrote:This might seem a bit unorthodox but how about judging a player based on how they play for their country rather than on some trifling statistics. The game is greater than 'pass completion', 'blocked shots' etc, just seems a bit dimwitted to summarise a players ability based on some vague percentages. A pretty silly thought, in reallity the best performers in the best leagues for each position should be selected, players permitted- those that best suit the style of play and individual brilliance sorting the chaff from the starting XI.
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rusty
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Neanderthal wrote:rusty wrote:This might seem a bit unorthodox but how about judging a player based on how they play for their country rather than on some trifling statistics. The game is greater than 'pass completion', 'blocked shots' etc, just seems a bit dimwitted to summarise a players ability based on some vague percentages. In your view if a player plays in Europe then they had a good game. Your mind is already made up before a game begins. I'd rather base my opinion on statistics which depict a players abilities rather than on your deluded nonsense rusty. You praise European football but you reject their method of player evaluation. All of the best European managers like Arsene Wenger and Alex Ferguson put huge emphasis on statistics when evaluating their players or choosing players to bring in to the club. No top managers rely's on their gut instinct of a players performance after a superficial viewing. There have been instances of top European managers bringing in a player into clubs because of a statistical error showing the player to be better than they are! If you're interested in expanding your football knowledge and understanding the importance of stats, read Soccernomics. Lots of great stuff including input from Arsene Wenger. I never said if a player plays in Europe they have a good game, only in all likelihood a better game than someone who plays in Asia or the Middle East. You're right and wrong I do praise European football and I totally embrace their method of player evaluation, which relies on picking players out of the best leagues and avoiding altogether the sewerage factories of Asia and the Middle East. No manager looks at a bunch of statistics and goes "oh looksy, he's got a 98% pass completion rate lets buy that guy", they want someone who can do that not in some talent bankrupt retirement village like the UAE but at a proven high level in some developed football country. That's the reason why Xavi plays in La Liga and Paartalu plays in some bumfart team in China, despite having similar "pass completion" ratios. You just can't dumb football down to "soccernomics" , rather than reading books try watching the game.
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Eastern Glory
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rusty wrote:This might seem a bit unorthodox but how about judging a player based on how they play for their country rather than on some trifling statistics. The game is greater than 'pass completion', 'blocked shots' etc, just seems a bit dimwitted to summarise a players ability based on some vague percentages. Why don't people apply this logic to Jade North as well?
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Neanderthal
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rusty wrote:I never said if a player plays in Europe they have a good game You didn't SAY that, but that's the only criteria that is consistent with who you believe has a good game after each NT match. rusty wrote:avoiding altogether the sewerage factories of Asia and the Middle East. :lol: Typical Rusty. Because the K and J league don't produce top players.... :oops: rusty wrote:No manager looks at a bunch of statistics and goes "oh looksy, he's got a 98% pass completion rate lets buy that guy", they want someone who can do that not in some talent bankrupt retirement village like the UAE but at a proven high level in some developed football country. That's the reason why Xavi plays in La Liga and Paartalu plays in some bumfart team in China, despite having similar "pass completion" ratios. You just can't dumb football down to "soccernomics" , rather than reading books try watching the game. That's why you take into account the league they are in and compare them with league averages. No one is saying to base your opinion purely on an isolated number without taking anything else into account.
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jas88
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Neanderthal wrote:SocaWho wrote:Neanderthal wrote:Just checked out Shane Lowry's stats for the season so far.
- 61% pass success rate. Absolutely abhorrent for a defender.
- Average of 1 tackle and 0.3 intercepts per game. Not good ball winning stats at all for a fullback. I thought this was supposed to be his strength according to some on this site?
- Also one red card and one own goal.
I get it that he's in an under-performing team... but even then whoscored's statistical algorithms rate him as Millwalls 22nd best player! (That's their 2nd worst player to have played more than one game).
The next time someone suggests putting him in the NT ahead of Davidson or Zullo they get a hard slap in the face. Surely that still makes him better than Mckay though. I've only seen Lowry play a couple of times but I wouldn't even go that far. Neither of them belong at leftback. Lowry seems much more suited to centerback while McKay, a good midfielder is completely ill suited to leftback. moops wrote:Lol, from what games I have seen him play, he likes the looong pass. I don't think he is a viable lb either, though cb he could do alright. Completely agree. But to play as a centerback for the national team he would have to majorly improve those passing stats. Edited by neanderthal: 23/9/2013 10:32:29 AM What you don't understand is the difference in leagues, I wouldn't be suprised if Lowry is told by his coaches to bomb the ball forward and hope for the best. Where as Davidson and Zullo would probably always be told to play it out from the back. I'd like to see some other CB's in the championship and put there stats next to Lowry and see how are they are. I can pull up some stats from Holman where his passing percent is below 30%.. in some games and he's a midfielder.
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Neanderthal
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jas88 wrote:Neanderthal wrote:SocaWho wrote:Neanderthal wrote:Just checked out Shane Lowry's stats for the season so far.
- 61% pass success rate. Absolutely abhorrent for a defender.
- Average of 1 tackle and 0.3 intercepts per game. Not good ball winning stats at all for a fullback. I thought this was supposed to be his strength according to some on this site?
- Also one red card and one own goal.
I get it that he's in an under-performing team... but even then whoscored's statistical algorithms rate him as Millwalls 22nd best player! (That's their 2nd worst player to have played more than one game).
The next time someone suggests putting him in the NT ahead of Davidson or Zullo they get a hard slap in the face. Surely that still makes him better than Mckay though. I've only seen Lowry play a couple of times but I wouldn't even go that far. Neither of them belong at leftback. Lowry seems much more suited to centerback while McKay, a good midfielder is completely ill suited to leftback. moops wrote:Lol, from what games I have seen him play, he likes the looong pass. I don't think he is a viable lb either, though cb he could do alright. Completely agree. But to play as a centerback for the national team he would have to majorly improve those passing stats. Edited by neanderthal: 23/9/2013 10:32:29 AM What you don't understand is the difference in leagues, I wouldn't be suprised if Lowry is told by his coaches to bomb the ball forward and hope for the best. Where as Davidson and Zullo would probably always be told to play it out from the back. I'd like to see some other CB's in the championship and put there stats next to Lowry and see how are they are. I can pull up some stats from Holman where his passing percent is below 30%.. in some games and he's a midfielder. On the contrary I'm very aware of the vastly different game plans Championship clubs and Eredivisie clubs deploy. I'm certain that if Lowry spent a period of time in the Eredivisie his passing stats would be much improved. But that doesn't mean if we call him up from Millwall into the NT his passing will suddenly be acceptable just because he has different orders. Since you asked for a same league CB comparison, here's Lowry vs Williams (Who has had an average season so far): Passing success: Lowry 61% - Rhys 85% Passes per game: Lowry 26 - Rhys 45 Accurate long balls per game: Lowry 2 - Rhys 5.4(Williams makes nearly triple the amount of successful long balls) Tackles: Lowry 1 - Rhys 1.6 Interceptions: Lowry 0.3 - Rhys 0.8 Aerial duels won: Lowry 1.2 - Rhys 2.4 (This despite it generally being easier to rack up ball winning stats at fullback. Jason Davidsons ball winning is much better than either of these two). In general Rhys's other stats look better too. i.e. Rhys makes triple as many clearances, lots of blocks per games where as Lowry hasn't made a single one yet. Lowry is dribbled around nearly once per game which is more than double Rhys. The best I can say for Lowry is that he gives away less fouls. You can blame the team to an extent, but Lowry still has the worst stats of any defender in his team this season. Edited by neanderthal: 23/9/2013 02:28:23 PM
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moops
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jas88 wrote:Neanderthal wrote:SocaWho wrote:Neanderthal wrote:Just checked out Shane Lowry's stats for the season so far.
- 61% pass success rate. Absolutely abhorrent for a defender.
- Average of 1 tackle and 0.3 intercepts per game. Not good ball winning stats at all for a fullback. I thought this was supposed to be his strength according to some on this site?
- Also one red card and one own goal.
I get it that he's in an under-performing team... but even then whoscored's statistical algorithms rate him as Millwalls 22nd best player! (That's their 2nd worst player to have played more than one game).
The next time someone suggests putting him in the NT ahead of Davidson or Zullo they get a hard slap in the face. Surely that still makes him better than Mckay though. I've only seen Lowry play a couple of times but I wouldn't even go that far. Neither of them belong at leftback. Lowry seems much more suited to centerback while McKay, a good midfielder is completely ill suited to leftback. moops wrote:Lol, from what games I have seen him play, he likes the looong pass. I don't think he is a viable lb either, though cb he could do alright. Completely agree. But to play as a centerback for the national team he would have to majorly improve those passing stats. Edited by neanderthal: 23/9/2013 10:32:29 AM What you don't understand is the difference in leagues, I wouldn't be suprised if Lowry is told by his coaches to bomb the ball forward and hope for the best. Where as Davidson and Zullo would probably always be told to play it out from the back. I'd like to see some other CB's in the championship and put there stats next to Lowry and see how are they are. I can pull up some stats from Holman where his passing percent is below 30%.. in some games and he's a midfielder. Lol, but i cannot say I have seen much of lowery, what I have seen is he can't take a defender on, makes 2 (at the most) short passes when at lb, but he has good positioning and quick enough, nothing spectacular. But thats my opinion of what I have seen.
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Neanderthal
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moops wrote:Lol, but i cannot say I have seen much of lowery, what I have seen is he can't take a defender on, makes 2 (at the most) short passes when at lb, but he has good positioning and quick enough, nothing spectacular. But thats my opinion of what I have seen. The stats seem to support that view. The one thing I find most fascinating is how on earth he has managed to rack up 6 red cards in his career at at his age despite rarely going in for tackles. :-s
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Link2588
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moops wrote:rusty wrote:This might seem a bit unorthodox but how about judging a player based on how they play for their country rather than on some trifling statistics. The game is greater than 'pass completion', 'blocked shots' etc, just seems a bit dimwitted to summarise a players ability based on some vague percentages. A pretty silly thought, in reallity the best performers in the best leagues for each position should be selected, players permitted- those that best suit the style of play and individual brilliance sorting the chaff from the starting XI. This it has always seemed so simple to me but yet it never happens with the roos.
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Voice ofReason
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A great Sunday for the OS Aussies http://osaussies.com/sunday-wrap-51/Edited by Voice ofReason: 23/9/2013 05:48:50 PM
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Proud2BeCanberran
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Neanderthal wrote:jas88 wrote:Neanderthal wrote:SocaWho wrote:Neanderthal wrote:Just checked out Shane Lowry's stats for the season so far.
- 61% pass success rate. Absolutely abhorrent for a defender.
- Average of 1 tackle and 0.3 intercepts per game. Not good ball winning stats at all for a fullback. I thought this was supposed to be his strength according to some on this site?
- Also one red card and one own goal.
I get it that he's in an under-performing team... but even then whoscored's statistical algorithms rate him as Millwalls 22nd best player! (That's their 2nd worst player to have played more than one game).
The next time someone suggests putting him in the NT ahead of Davidson or Zullo they get a hard slap in the face. Surely that still makes him better than Mckay though. I've only seen Lowry play a couple of times but I wouldn't even go that far. Neither of them belong at leftback. Lowry seems much more suited to centerback while McKay, a good midfielder is completely ill suited to leftback. moops wrote:Lol, from what games I have seen him play, he likes the looong pass. I don't think he is a viable lb either, though cb he could do alright. Completely agree. But to play as a centerback for the national team he would have to majorly improve those passing stats. Edited by neanderthal: 23/9/2013 10:32:29 AM What you don't understand is the difference in leagues, I wouldn't be suprised if Lowry is told by his coaches to bomb the ball forward and hope for the best. Where as Davidson and Zullo would probably always be told to play it out from the back. I'd like to see some other CB's in the championship and put there stats next to Lowry and see how are they are. I can pull up some stats from Holman where his passing percent is below 30%.. in some games and he's a midfielder. On the contrary I'm very aware of the vastly different game plans Championship clubs and Eredivisie clubs deploy. I'm certain that if Lowry spent a period of time in the Eredivisie his passing stats would be much improved. But that doesn't mean if we call him up from Millwall into the NT his passing will suddenly be acceptable just because he has different orders. Since you asked for a same league CB comparison, here's Lowry vs Williams (Who has had an average season so far): Passing success: Lowry 61% - Rhys 85% Passes per game: Lowry 26 - Rhys 45 Accurate long balls per game: Lowry 2 - Rhys 5.4(Williams makes nearly triple the amount of successful long balls) Tackles: Lowry 1 - Rhys 1.6 Interceptions: Lowry 0.3 - Rhys 0.8 Aerial duels won: Lowry 1.2 - Rhys 2.4 (This despite it generally being easier to rack up ball winning stats at fullback. Jason Davidsons ball winning is much better than either of these two). In general Rhys's other stats look better too. i.e. Rhys makes triple as many clearances, lots of blocks per games where as Lowry hasn't made a single one yet. Lowry is dribbled around nearly once per game which is more than double Rhys. The best I can say for Lowry is that he gives away less fouls. You can blame the team to an extent, but Lowry still has the worst stats of any defender in his team this season. Edited by neanderthal: 23/9/2013 02:28:23 PM I'd love to see Williams given a shot with the Socceroos. Not gonna happen for as long as we have Ognenovski, Neill and Cornthwaite FFS. #-o
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playmaker11
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Carney & Cahill [youtube]PHgNvOb_3Ks[/youtube]
By now, American Samoa must have realised that Australias 22-0 win over Tonga two days earlier was no fluke.
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Bowden
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FSV highlights??
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Jong Gabe
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Bowden wrote:FSV highlights?? No
E
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Voice ofReason
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More of the young players in action on Monday http://osaussies.com/monday-wrap-49/Edited by Voice ofReason: 24/9/2013 12:04:10 PM
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ryan2008
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Good to see Bouzanis debuting, although his club is struggling.
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paladisious
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Neanderthal wrote:jas88 wrote:Neanderthal wrote:SocaWho wrote:Neanderthal wrote:Just checked out Shane Lowry's stats for the season so far.
- 61% pass success rate. Absolutely abhorrent for a defender.
- Average of 1 tackle and 0.3 intercepts per game. Not good ball winning stats at all for a fullback. I thought this was supposed to be his strength according to some on this site?
- Also one red card and one own goal.
I get it that he's in an under-performing team... but even then whoscored's statistical algorithms rate him as Millwalls 22nd best player! (That's their 2nd worst player to have played more than one game).
The next time someone suggests putting him in the NT ahead of Davidson or Zullo they get a hard slap in the face. Surely that still makes him better than Mckay though. I've only seen Lowry play a couple of times but I wouldn't even go that far. Neither of them belong at leftback. Lowry seems much more suited to centerback while McKay, a good midfielder is completely ill suited to leftback. moops wrote:Lol, from what games I have seen him play, he likes the looong pass. I don't think he is a viable lb either, though cb he could do alright. Completely agree. But to play as a centerback for the national team he would have to majorly improve those passing stats. Edited by neanderthal: 23/9/2013 10:32:29 AM What you don't understand is the difference in leagues, I wouldn't be suprised if Lowry is told by his coaches to bomb the ball forward and hope for the best. Where as Davidson and Zullo would probably always be told to play it out from the back. I'd like to see some other CB's in the championship and put there stats next to Lowry and see how are they are. I can pull up some stats from Holman where his passing percent is below 30%.. in some games and he's a midfielder. On the contrary I'm very aware of the vastly different game plans Championship clubs and Eredivisie clubs deploy. I'm certain that if Lowry spent a period of time in the Eredivisie his passing stats would be much improved. But that doesn't mean if we call him up from Millwall into the NT his passing will suddenly be acceptable just because he has different orders. Since you asked for a same league CB comparison, here's Lowry vs Williams (Who has had an average season so far): Passing success: Lowry 61% - Rhys 85% Passes per game: Lowry 26 - Rhys 45 Accurate long balls per game: Lowry 2 - Rhys 5.4(Williams makes nearly triple the amount of successful long balls) Tackles: Lowry 1 - Rhys 1.6 Interceptions: Lowry 0.3 - Rhys 0.8 Aerial duels won: Lowry 1.2 - Rhys 2.4 (This despite it generally being easier to rack up ball winning stats at fullback. Jason Davidsons ball winning is much better than either of these two). In general Rhys's other stats look better too. i.e. Rhys makes triple as many clearances, lots of blocks per games where as Lowry hasn't made a single one yet. Lowry is dribbled around nearly once per game which is more than double Rhys. The best I can say for Lowry is that he gives away less fouls. You can blame the team to an extent, but Lowry still has the worst stats of any defender in his team this season.  Excellent post.
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playmaker11
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Langerak should start in the cup game against 1860 tomorrow morning... at least I hope so, considering he'll be playing Champions League in a week. It'll be interesting to see whether Kruse or Son starts in their game against Bielefeld, might give an idea as to who starts on the weekend.
By now, American Samoa must have realised that Australias 22-0 win over Tonga two days earlier was no fluke.
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YerNathanael
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RedKat wrote:BUT BUT LOWRYS A YOUNG PLAYER SO HE MUST BE IN THE SQUAD REGARDLESS OF HOW GOOD HE IS! SACK HOLGER HE DOESNT KNOW ANYFIN. And you just summed up the majority of the idiotic posts I saw on FB today.
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Eastern Glory
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RedKat wrote:BUT BUT LOWRYS A YOUNG PLAYER SO HE MUST BE IN THE SQUAD REGARDLESS OF HOW GOOD HE IS! SACK HOLGER HE DOESNT KNOW ANYFIN. Marry me?
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Bowden
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GabMVFC wrote:Bowden wrote:FSV highlights?? No 2.Bundesliga highlights don't exist?
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YerNathanael
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Bowden wrote:GabMVFC wrote:Bowden wrote:FSV highlights?? No 2.Bundesliga highlights don't exist? I haven't had any luck finding them so far.
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grazorblade
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ryan2008 wrote:Good to see Bouzanis debuting, although his club is struggling. two players in the greek superleague breaking through. The greek superleague is quite a good league. If these two players become consistent starters that would make 8 players breaking into the starting squad this year in a good league as opposed to six last year. Also Rogic apparently has had a groin injury so perhaps he is still a chance. Chris herd is always injured so perhaps he is a chance too
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grazorblade
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here is some random apostolos highlights i found from about a year ago for those interested http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOlEM2Ry77Uhe seems to play out and out striker so he is in a problem position for the roos and should be monitered
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johnszasz
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Langerak starting in the cup vs 1860 Munich. Leckie and Ruka should feature tomorrow night. Kruse may play tonight in Bielefeld.
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grazorblade
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think langerak has touched the ball twice this game. I swear it is better to develop in a midtable team poor fella must be bored!
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grazorblade
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langerak makes a save
awkward and caught cleanly but very regulation
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playmaker11
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Hopefully Klopp starts him against Freiberg this weekend. Kruse and Son both starting... intriguing.
By now, American Samoa must have realised that Australias 22-0 win over Tonga two days earlier was no fluke.
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grazorblade
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schwarzer starting for chelsea but just quitely i'll chear for luongo
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