If you don't consider Stop The Boats to be a major part of the Liberal campaign, then nothing else really needs to be said.

Deflect alert.

-PB

Its ok...you've established your repertoire as a criminal apologist, I think theres no need for you to justify your position anymore than you have to. And please do not disguise your sympathies for criminal behaviour as freedom for civil liberties....its incredibly nauseating.

Edited by SocaWho: 19/12/2014 11:33:09 AM

=d> =d> =d> =d> =d> spot on.......

being the son of police inspector and detective, and having been exposed to the criminal system i would have to say i have very little faith in what the system delivers in the way of justice.......so many grubs walk away due to technical and strategical errors........

I hope that if either of you are called for jury duty you request to be excused on the basis that you have zero capacity for impartiality or to understand basic definitions fundamental to our judicial system.

I think you would find most people who are law abiding citizens have a lesser understanding of the law because they don't feel the need to study it since they have nothing to hide. Unless you are practising in law, those who constantly study the finite details of laws like they are practising fall under two categories...

a) Civil Libertarians who feel the need to keep the authorities on their toes on how they are overstepping the mark in terms of privacy legislation.

b) Criminal Apologists...those with more questionable motives and have something to hide and something to excuse criminals for their anti social behaviour.

I think you fall in the latter NO. No offence.

I agree. I read about the Greens member who came up with the #illridewithyou campaign and how she concocted the idea. So as it seems, she was sitting on the train and she saw a women with hijab and pitied her for the potential backlash she might face after the events. So she felt compelled to do something about it and came up with this idea since she felt incredibly sorry for the moderate muslims that would be unfairly targeted in public. If it was her family member or friend that was killed, I'd be very interested to see if she feels the same way.

I haven't really been following this thread, but something has quite of bugged me. I didn't know where else to put it, so figured why not here.

The Sydney Siege proved how powerful most Australians are. It proved that most are able to rise above stereotypes, above media propaganda, and political agenda to show compassion, humanity, kindness and solidarity. This was evident in the #illridewithyou campaign. It was also evident when people stood side by side together as one, without wishing to point the finger.

As was going to be the case, people were going to point fingers. Many of these fingers have been pointed towards ISIS, Islamists, Multiculturalism, and Islam as a whole. Quite frankly I am not here to defend any of that. The calls for Muslims to denounce the attacks and denounce these dumb organisations has gotten a bit too much. Almost as if, the action of one man were instructed by the other 1.6 billion people. Its gotten a rather stale. No one can defend ISIS, or any radicalised nut job.

Since the incident, all attention has turned to things such as #illridewithyou. People have been sending flowers and cards to mosques in a show of support. The whole incident has turned in to some sort of movement to comfort Muslims.

Whilst I am always grateful for that support, I know that the majority of people are not bigoted. I know majority of the population are level headed. I know majority of the population are kind, compassionate, and caring. The minority who are not, are much like the minority of those who support ISIS and co. We as a nation are bigger than our government. We are bigger than our media. We know not to pander to their agendas and propaganda.

No one has been talking about remembering Tori Johnson and Katrina Dawson. Their families are the ones who the compassion cards and flowers should be sent to. Their families are the one who needs the most support right now. Australians have always been kind and caring people. We should be stronger than the minority. We should be able to not let political agenda and media propaganda dictate our lives.

We must remember those who lost their lives. Tori did so trying to fight the gunman. He knew very well the risks of his actions. But he put his life on the line for the sake of the others in the cafe. Katrina was an innocent person with much to live for. Their deaths should not be remembered by us bickering and pandering to agenda and propaganda. They should be remembered by us uniting for a greater good.

Their deaths should not be forgotten. The Muslims are not the ones who need to be comforted, their families are.

That woman on the train isn't the one who started #illridewithyou.

That woman on the train isn't the one who started #illridewithyou.

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/how-illridewithyou-began-with-rachael-jacobs-experience-on-a-brisbane-train-20141216-128205.html

Rachael Jacobs' simple offer to walk with a Muslim woman as they got off a Brisbane train on Monday sparked a social media campaign under the hashtag #illridewithyou.

Overwhelmed by interest in her gesture, Ms Jacobs has agreed to share her story with Fairfax Media rather than be interviewed, in the hope the focus can then remain on the victims of the Sydney siege and their families.

The movement has inspired thousands to publicly and loudly stand up for a decent and humane world

As news of the siege unfolded, I scrolled through updates on my phone, searching for the latest information. My brother works in the city of Sydney. My husband's office is a government building near Martin Place. I knew all were safe and sound, but I wanted to know more.

Brisbane woman Rachael Jacobs' gesture sparked the #illridewithyou social media movement.
Brisbane woman Rachael Jacobs' gesture sparked the #illridewithyou social media movement.
At this point I saw a woman on the train start to fiddle with her headscarf.

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Confession time. In my Facebook status, I editorialised. She wasn't sitting next to me. She was a bit away, towards the other end of the carriage. Like most people she had been looking at her phone, then slowly started to unpin her scarf.

Tears sprang to my eyes and I was struck by feelings of anger, sadness and bitterness. It was in this mindset that I punched the first status update into my phone, hoping my friends would take a moment to think about the victims of the siege who were not in the cafe.

I spent the rest of the journey staring – rudely – at the back of her uncovered head. I wanted to talk to her, but had no idea what to say. Anything that came to mind seemed tokenistic and patronising. She might not even be Muslim or she could have just been warm! Besides, I was in the "quiet carriage" where even conversation is banned.

By sheer fluke, we got off at the same station, and some part of me decided saying something would be a good thing. Rather than quiz her about her choice of clothing, I thought if I simply offered to walk her to her destination, it might help.

It's hard to describe the moment when humans, and complete strangers, have a conversation with no words. I wanted to tell her I was sorry for so many things – for overstepping the mark, for making assumptions about a complete stranger and for belonging to a culture where racism was part of her everyday experience.

But none of those words came out, and our near silent encounter was over in a moment.

My second status was written as a heartbreaking postscript to my first. While the woman appeared to appreciate my gesture, we had both left defeated and deflated. What good is one small action against an avalanche of ignorance?

Hours later, social media showed me good people can create their own avalanche of kindness.

My posts were written on my private Facebook page to a private audience, never intended for public eyes. A friend of mine made his own decision to share it publicly, and I'm deeply humbled by his action. Perhaps the story was then shared widely because it represented what so many people felt in their heart. But while I'm warmed by the sheer volume of media interest, I am not the story here, and my actions were not extraordinary or heroic.

We are all in shock at the tragedy that has unfolded, and out of respect for the victims' families, I'm reluctant to take any media focus.

I've made the decision to decline interviews for a few reasons. I have spent some time in the public eye due to my recent experiences as a candidate in federal and local elections. I would be mortified if anyone thought I was using this tragedy for political gain.

I'm also a teacher and lecturer and have a responsibility to represent my profession and institution. At a time of heightened emotions, a misplaced word or phrase could cause offence, requiring numerous explanations and reassurances.

But most importantly, my role in this movement was minuscule and unworthy of the attention received. The #illridewithyou hashtag, started by Twitter user @sirtessa and embraced by thousands, is the real story of inspiration. The movement has inspired thousands to publicly and loudly stand up for a decent and humane world. It's a pre-emptive strike against racism and bigotry. We know what fear can do to a society, and rather than fall victim, thousands have pledged to be part of the force that fights for tolerance and compassion.

As we grapple with the tragic end to the siege, there's no better time to ride with each other, walk with each other, listen to each other or just silently be there for someone else.

Our grief as a nation will be overwhelming and we will be confounded as we try to make sense of this event. It will be tempting to search for answers in politics or beliefs, sheltering in the irrational fear that more madness is to come.

But #illridewithyou reminds us that we can overcome fear and ignorance with a pledge to treat each other with respect. It's a reminder that decent Australians don't hold an entire group of people responsible for the actions of one man.

Some claim the movement is patronising, forcing misplaced support upon those who need space, rather than spotlight. They may have a point. But there's no doubting its good intentions. And perhaps we need it more for ourselves as a reminder that there are reasoned and tolerant people that walk among us, publicly disempowering the trolls.

One of the most common questions I've been asked is "Do you have a message for the Muslim community?"

In truth, I don't. They are a strong community with their own articulate leaders, able to speak for themselves if they choose to do so.

I am, however, the daughter of Indian migrants, and having lived all of my 37 years in Australia, I feel I've seen the best and the worst this country has to offer. I'd rather deliver a message to racists, bigots and anyone who dares to derive a message of hate from this tragedy – it is you who are unwelcome here. Your values have no place in civilised society, and if you spread intolerance, there's an avalanche of kindness ready to take you down.

Rachael Jacobs is a lecturer in Education at the Australia Catholic University in Brisbane. She was the Greens candidate for the seat of Brisbane in 2013.

Basically people like NO think that sending threatening letters to families is a "nothing" offence and until they commit the most horrific atrocities then only then should they be arrested. But even then I doubt NO probably still thinks they should be roaming the streets until they see their day in court. And Benjamin who thinks being sent a threatening letter isn't a heinous crime...well its ok if your not the recipient.

really??? i think it does, because this is what you stated "our Liberal friends won the last election almost entirely due to the majority's fixation with the notion that Australia would be a better and safer place if we could just close the doors and not let any of those nasty Muslims in - thus pre-empting all terrorist actions."

so now your saying something different, which one is it.......entirely due to, or was a majority or was it PART of an election campaign ?????? i think it was part of the campaign for sure ....i would guess the axing of the carbon tax was a major campaign objective.......and a surplus...

I'll go with almost entirely. The Libs won the election after repeating STOP THE BOATS at every single opportunity. It was by far the most visible element of their campaign, and was the focus of virtually all media coverage up until shortly before the budget. This was the swing issue that almost certainly decided the election. Argue all you want, can't escape it. If Abbott and co didn't think it was a key issue, they wouldn't have kept repeating it.

He shouldn't have been prosecuted for the letters at all. Can see nothing in them justifying legal sanction.

Then you have your SocaLols who can't tell the difference between abusive and threatening and expects people to be locked up for their words and ideas.

Finklestein, have you ever heard of Blackstone's Formulation?

I hope that if either of you are called for jury duty you request to be excused on the basis that you have zero capacity for impartiality or to understand basic definitions fundamental to our judicial system.

I'll go with almost entirely. The Libs won the election after repeating STOP THE BOATS at every single opportunity. It was by far the most visible element of their campaign, and was the focus of virtually all media coverage up until shortly before the budget. This was the swing issue that almost certainly decided the election. Argue all you want, can't escape it. If Abbott and co didn't think it was a key issue, they wouldn't have kept repeating it.

Dont argue with the fink , ben he knows all and we are all wrong . ;)

I disagree, I think that the letters to the families to dead soldiers was clearly harassment and deserved charge. I don't think it was reason to put him in prison, though.

what charge would you suggest???

I thought that the charge he received was appropriate.

Using the postal service to send offensive and harassing letters is a criminal offence. As upheld by the High Court of Australia (despite the views of the great legal minds on this forum).

Yes, and I agree with the charge and conviction.

The argument of said great legal minds is whether or not he should have been on bail for the accessory to murder and sexual assault charges he was facing.

The problem is that the media is falsely asserting that he had a history of violent crime - this is technically incorrect. The only thing he had been found guilty of doing was harassing the families of dead soldiers.