Good link.

I'm being a bit theatrical but the essence of what I'm saying is that Germany have done a good job at producing a side which is technically superb and has a number of players who are genuinely good athletes.

By athleticism, I don't just refer to height or strength, but also speed, balance and (foot-eye) co-ordination, among other things.

I don't think it's good to have a bunch of good athletes who don't know how to play football.

I also don't believe that team needs every player to be a good athlete. Paul Scholes, I think, was one of the best players ever. He was not a particularly good athlete. But his football IQ was off the charts.

However would a team of Paul Scholes' be that useful? Probably not. Paul Scholes playing alongside guys like David Beckham (also not a very good athlete), Cristiano Ronaldo, Roy Keane, Ryan Giggs, Ole Gunnar Solkskjaer, now that's an amazing combination (obviously they didn't all play at the same time). Some of those blokes were outstanding athletes. There was a balance and it was lethal.

Germany (at all levels) is similar. Some big players, some small players, lots of football IQ, some super fast players and some players with the ability to skip past opposition.

I think there are some areas of the game where, to be successful, you need to be a good athlete. I think for 1 vs 1 ability, you need speed, (foot-eye) co-ordination and balanc. Strength is useful, too. I mean look at the best 1 vs 1 exponents in recent years. Cristiano Ronaldo, Leo Messi, Thierry Henry, etc. Most are very fast, have beautiful close control (and thus great co-ordination) and good athletes.

The thing is that not every player needs to have 1 vs 1 ability. As I say Paul Scholes was brilliant and never really demonstrated much 1 vs 1 ability at all, as far as I remember.

But you need some players to have 1 vs 1 ability. That means you need some players with superior athletic ability.

Australia had very few players on the park who demonstrated much 1 vs 1 ability (although I would like to see more of Joice and Arzani). I don't know. Maybe the others just had a bad day. But maybe it's symptomatic of more. This suggests that Australia's players either lack the skill or the athletic ability or both.

The commentators noted Australia's toothlessness in terms of 1 vs 1 ability. They noted that Germany had players capable of running at opponents with speed and passing them. Look at Felix Passlack. I'm not sure Panos Armenakas can't do 1 vs 1 stuff. But he was doing walking step-overs. This is not good enough (well it's not bad, but it's not that difficult for defenders). When a striker runs at the defender at speed with the ball close to his feet and does step-overs (or whatever 1 vs 1 manoeuvre) that's far more difficult to defend against. The NC and SSG were supposed to address this. Australia, so far, still aren't demonstrating any improvement.

All we've seen is that, in addition to being far, far more poorly organised than previous Australian youth teams, they're just as rubbish in 1 vs 1.

The other thing is look at Germany. Get the ball in a good area, wind up, shoot, BANG, the ball's in the top or bottom corner and is a goal. Our players just aren't that clinical.

It's all a bit depressing.

lukerobinho

That's true. We don't have the infrastructure. But I still don't think we make the most of what we've got. I mean South Korea just beat Brazil. Mali just drew with Belgium.

And it wasn't long ago that Australia got tonked by Vietnam.

We're not getting enough things right, specifically the things which require clinical movements (in defence and attack) and 1 vs 1 and it's costing us. The issue is that it's still doesn't seem to be improving (early days in this tournament, admittedly).

I've been in Paris (some years ago, now) and seen kids playing football at their local clubs whose skill levels seem much higher than a lot of our elite junior players.

Edited by quickflick: 19/10/2015 10:20:26 PM

One thing about the CofE. The Germans mightn't have an equivalent. But the French, who also have a fantastic structure for producing talented footballers, have Clairefontaine. Surely some other powerhouse nations have something similar?

I arranged a trip for a top Aussie 13 yold some years ago in Germany and I can honestly say he dominated the play. Big clubs trying to sign him etc etc. player visa issues arise and player returned to oz. same player went back as a 15 yold. Different result, still did well but not like previously, the parents quxikly came to the conclusion they must get to Europe ASAP and have done so.

The reason I share this story is I believe we loss something after the age of 13-14yold here in oz and it needs addressing.

Edited by robbo: 19/10/2015 11:13:18 PM

That's concerning. So you think that Australia isn't a long way off European countries in terms of producing technical quality up until about 13-14 but then the gap really appears?

The player in question has been picked up by a top European club just like about 7 others I know off aged between 15-18. This evidence shows we are clearly not far off but when I compare the coaching and ENVIRONMENT of our players aged 14-18 compared to Europe aged 14-18 we fail dismally.

The 64 million dollar question why weren't the 7 players I only know about even looked at for the joeys , let alone the others i don't know!.


Edited by robbo: 19/10/2015 11:26:41 PM

Talent ID needs huge improvement no doubt, but we also need to continue to improvement our coaching standards too

at junior elite level differences in player quality aren't all that pronounced. If it is, that's usually due to growth differences and athletic differences. I think it is in the late teens and early 20s that a gap can grow. Players in those age groups need to be playing in a top quality environment to become top quality themselves. Young players at that age who are given an opportunity at the highest level, seniors will develop exponentially better than their peer who stays stuck in the academy playing at a lower level.

This is essentially why, bearing in mind that Belgium has a brilliant youth system, it's fantastic if young Aussies go there around 15 or so. But if they go around twenty or older, it's not that great (it's not bad, but not great). As all the development should be done by then and all the best Belgian players their age have left Belgium and are in the Premier League or wherever.

I agree but can you explain to me why a boy based in Belgium, eligible for joeys wasn't even invited to a camp, not to mention the others based in Germany , England, Sweden etc etc?

I'm no expert in these matters but I'm guessing resources, time, money from the FFA's side.

For example if they want to trial that young bloke from Belgium with the Joey's wouldn't they need to fly him backwards and forwards from Europe just in case he's good enough? Maybe it's all too hard?

Thanks not to say that's OK just offering a up possible explanation? Again, I'm no expert.

I'm no expert either and I don't know what the FFA can/can't do in terms of resources and finances.

If they're flying a CofE lad from Australia to Chile then surely they can afford to fly a lad from Belgium to Chile.

And they've had ample chance to have a look at them. The Joeys have just had a series of matches in France. I've not had the immense privilege of visiting the wonderful country of Belgium but I noticed, when I was staying Paris, that on the freeway there was a sign saying it goes to Belgium.

As such there really is no excuse. Or rather there is an excuse. Ignorance. If it's unintentional ignorance, then that's bad. Having somebody representing the FFA as a liaison officer based in Europe would do the trick and at least we'd know about this.

Heck, they don't even need to be Australian. They can just hire a scout or two from a European club, already based in Europe. I'm sure some of the money wasted on sending an endless entourage to accompany the Joeys to Chile would be better redirected in that way and might actually yield profitable returns. You get what you pay for.

On the other hand, it may be down to deliberate ignorance on the part of the FFA. Maybe they don't want to know who is where because it's in their best interests to say the the CofE is producing la crème de la crème of Australian football. It doesn't suit the narrative.

I should point out that four of the twenty-one players in the Joeys this time around are based in Europe. So it's not as if they're paying them no attention whatsoever.

But if we're not seeing the very best of Australian youth playing (and we get beaten 4-1 and look gormless for the majority of the match) then that's cause for concern.

Edited by quickflick: 20/10/2015 01:18:01 AM

Interesting fact - joeys are the second most expensive national team the FFA run behind the soccerroos. The spending on olyroos comes next then the young socceroos. Therefore looking at budgets surely there is a better way to spend resources for the joeys..... Move away from full time training/coaching/marketing/physio/management /technical directions of the joeys and invest in talent identification, scouting, camps and player profiling. By adopting this with the same resources we could have 14yold, 15 yold and 16yold national team fully identified and prepared for world cups..... Just like GERMANY

Let's hope Luke casselly or ang read the forum..... Haha

Edited by robbo: 20/10/2015 04:31:11 AM

Interesting fact - joeys are the second most expensive national team the FFA run behind the soccerroos. The spending on olyroos comes next then the young socceroos. Therefore looking at budgets surely there is a better way to spend resources for the joeys..... Move away from full time training/coaching/marketing/physio/management /technical directions of the joeys and invest in talent identification, scouting, camps and player profiling. By adopting this with the same resources we could have 14yold, 15 yold and 16yold national team fully identified and prepared for world cups..... Just like GERMANY

Let's hope Luke casselly or ang read the forum..... Haha

Edited by robbo: 20/10/2015 04:31:11 AM

If they're flying a CofE lad from Australia to Chile then surely they can afford to fly a lad from Belgium to Chile.

Maybe a cheaper option would be to have a 15-18 year old group of Euro based Aussies meet in Europe a few times a year with people from the COE going there to see them.

Now you're talking.

Still logistically, dragging players in to a camp from 20 or thirty countries, securing releases, putting them up etc would be fairly difficult.

Given you can only play the cards your dealt the FFA has a difficult task.

Just checking OS Aussies abroad site and it would appear that the vast majority of OS teenagers are in England not surprisingly with about 4-5 in Germany and a couple in Italy. So meeting up in England would reduce a lot of travel costs I reckon.

Time for you to hand your resume into the FFA. (That is if you could handle the pay cut.)