Yeah nah. Dreading to think what kind of pitch Suncorp would throw up

If we qualify for WC and don't get banned by FIFA I'm still predicting Gersbach and Ibini on the left.

Formation of 3-2-4-1 is idiotic.

Postecoglou is a stubborn b*****d who needs to fit the formation around his players not fit players into idiotic system.

We are going to be slaughtered at the Conferations Cup with this formation.

So this is totally random but I thought I'd do some searching for players who might have gone under the radar that might be worth looking at for the national team (or the youth teams or A-League clubs). Many of them are definitely unproven and are playing at levels very difficult to discern the quality of, but should be noted somewhere:

- Gabriel Cleur: 19 year-old right back AND right midfielder who can play as a right wingback (basically our weakest positions). Plays for Virtus Entella in Serie B, and has made 17 appearances in Primavera, playing every match since February with the team undefeated in every game he's played.

- Chris Duggan: 23 year-old striker playing for East Fife in Scottish League One (not a great league, but still worth noting). He's scored 7 goals in his last 9 games and is off contract at the end of the season. Maybe worth bringing to the A-League to see what he's capable of?

- Jordan Lyden: 21 year-old midfielder (who can also play at right back) for Aston Villa. He's been playing sporadically for the Villa first team and U23 team, but seems to be rated decently by the Villa fans. Maybe worth getting on loan in the A-League or being tried out for the U23 team?

- Aiden O'Neill: 18 year-old midfielder who's probably one of the more recognizable names on this list since he made a handful of appearances for Burnley in the EPL this season, and is now on loan at Oldham Athletic in League One (having made 10 appearances so far, with only two losses in games he's played). He's currently in the U23 setup but given his position he seems like a natural successor to the likes of Jedinak and Milligan. Maybe worth a senior call up in a friendly in the coming months?

-  Reno Piscopo: 18 year-old striker who was Inter's Primavera team top scorer two seasons ago, and has since moved to Torino who currently have Andrea Belotti (the best young Italian striker in Europe) on their books. It's very difficult to find any stats about Reno but surely he's worth exploring further, especially if he can get a loan or be continually involved in the youth setups for Australia. Since he's eligible for Italy, it may be worth capping him at senior level as a preemptive move, particularly if he ever breaks out Belotti-style in the future.

- Joel Rollinson: 18 year-old midfielder/winger playing for Reading, having appeared 23 times this season (~2000 minutes) for the U18 team, with 10 goals. He hasn't appeared for Australia at youth level and hasn't been mentioned at all in any of the development squads/training camps, but seems like an interesting prospect for the future.

- Kwame Yeboah: 22 year-old striker playing for Borussia Monchengladbach II in the fourth division of Germany. He's most likely well known to most people here, especially for being a classic example of leaving Australia too young. He has started finding his feet this season with 7 goals in 21 appearances, and is apparently off contract at the end of this season. Maybe worth a look-in for an A-League team or elsewhere in Europe? Either way, he's still young and should be in the back of the mind especially considering how desperate we are for Australian strikers that can finish.

  - Kenny Dougall: 23 year-old midfielder/centreback playing for Sparta Rotterdam in the Eredivisie. He's appeared 17 times for Sparta this season, and has been in the matchday squad a further 10 times. He's made more appearances for club than Smith, Sainsbury, and Degenek have this season, but he hasn't had a look-in at any level nor really been in the discussion. Maybe worth a call-up in a friendly to see what he can do?

- Cameron Burgess: 21 year-old midfielder/centreback playing for Bury in League One, on loan from Fulham who are in the fight for promotion to the EPL. He's played nearly every game for Bury this year, and has been in the Australian U23 development squad this week. Worth keeping an eye on to see how he progresses, especially since we'll need some more defensive-minded players in the coming year.

And for some better known players that probably deserve a shout out at some level (either at youth level or a call-up to the senior team for a friendly/qualifying) over the next 6 months if they keep up their form this season: Adam Taggart, Jamie Maclaren, Awer Mabil, Brandon Borrello, Brandon O'Neill, Liam Rose, Joe Caletti, Alex Gersbach, Callum Elder, Alex Wilkinson, Jonathon Aspro, Ruon Tongyik, Danny Vukovic, Lawrence Thomas.
 

that is the entire point of his formation change.  to fit the players he has.

I noticed Saudi Arabia played 2 friendlies in January. One against Slovenia and one against Cambodia. Ange doesn't really believe in friendlies and the calendar is already very full. 

Some UEFA nations seem to get a lot of practice in with domestic players. Scandinavia has it easier with their season but many Balkan nations practice together without their bigger names. 

We have a few A-League players in the squad but the logistics would just be too hard. Plus the clubs would refuse a release on a non FIFA date.

I guess the best we can do is that U23 camp in Spain. 

I really don't think Wright or Degenek offer anything that DeVere doesn't, especially in a back 3. UAE noticed it and put their best player on Wright. He's a great blood and guts CB, but our weakness in a possession-based back 3.

If we're going to keep this system we need 2 more fast, ball playing defenders. Spiranovic would work and probably Milligan. Degenek and Wright are too rigid and slow. 

Spiranovic, Sainsbury and Jedinak would be my 3.

And I think DeVere is better at carrying the ball forward, although he his prone to the occasional lapse in focus. 

Jade North actually would've been awesome in a back 3, back in the day.

I'm also worried Spira is slowing down.

No reason why we can't have a 2-3 week camp prior to Saudi game in June, would be good time to play NZ as they prep for confeds like us... maybe if we played more times with the formation we might get better at it? Practice makes perfect hey Ange? Seems pretty fucking basic to me...don't know why he hates playing friendlies.

Championship regular season ends start of may, the championship final play off is 26th may..

A serious coach would have the boys in camp by mid may..that gives 3 weeks to have a friendly and prepare for Saudi's(Which I think will be our most important game possibly in the last 10 years - if we draw/lose its play-off time)

Would put us in a very good position come Confeds Cup.

it has its good days.....

Just looking at the remaining fixtures...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_FIFA_World_Cup_qualification_%E2%80%93_AFC_Third_Round#Group_B

It's a shame Iraq couldn't do us a favour and atleast draw with the Saudis this morning. To have a chance of Direct Qualification we have to win both our home games atleast and preferably defeat Japan away too. Nine points, plus no more than six points guaranteed for the Saudis and Japanese that way, given we play both of them.

Asking us to gain more than a draw against Japan away from home, after our draw at home to them is a big ask though, especially as they also still have their place to play for at that point in-time, even if they defeat Iraq away the week before. They know we can still leapfrog them and don't want to rely on us defeating the Saudis in that process, given we could only barely draw against them away in a high scoring game. Japan will be set to guarantee qualification and unfortunately for us, if they do they may have foot off the gas come their final game away to the Saudis. It's a shame Japan weren't scheduled to visit Saudi Arabia earlier in qualifying.

We need to be in the best form of this qualification campaign to put the Saudis to the sword and re-assert our claims to direct qualifying - more draws and we're destined for the play-offs. There is the bonus too, IF we can defeat Japan, then that delays their guarantees, so Saudi Arabia v Japan will be a ding-dong game, instead of a cheap dead rubber victory to the Saudis.

Let's hope the UAE are highly motivated, with the upheaval of a change in coaching regimes yet they're still in with a chance for the play-off place we occupy. They could get on a run defeating Thailand away next fixture then that aligns Omar Abdulrahman and co to host and hopefuly upset the Saudis in August, during the same window we have to take on Japan away. The UAE at home upset Japan earlier in qualifying, so hopefully Iraq can do likewise, given the troubles they caused us in Tehran this month and Japan's own struggles to overcome Iraq when they hosted them last October.

For us to sneak home, we have to hope that we draw Japan away, win the other two games, AND hope Saudi Arabia don't win against both of UAE and Japan.

UAE could do us a massive favour by drawing them for us. If they manage to knick some points from the Saudi's and we beat them I think we'll be ok. Going to come down to the wire though.

Yeah, this is where we rely on other results. To not be beholden to those results (Other results), we MUST WIN against Japan and then Saudi Arabia and Japan have to take each other seriously, in the final game - because we're threatening both of them. Any more draws or less and it's the play-offs for us.

^This - Jamie Carragher type of defender CB who can also play as a defensive FB perfect as one of the wide defenders in a back 3

My thoughts going forward. Some of the basic ideas about the formation are an improvement (i.e. Ange is trying to get more out of the footballers at his disposal) but had the wrong application in Tehran.

We're don't have a proper striker and shan't get such unless a youth footballer who is a gifted winger can be converted to a striker. If this has not be countenanced by Ange, he's missing a trick. It's thinking outside the box but it has been done in the past. Thierry Henry, for example, was winger turned striker.

Without that, then we must hope a top-notch attacking footballer such as Daniel Arzani or Lucas Derrick can become prominent shortly with great off the ball movement, 1 vs 1 skill, speed, agility and shooting. Then we can deploy one of them as a sort of fantasista. Nathan Burns also has some of those kind of skills and can be used there. Basically, Tom Rogic is so good for Celtic because he can work with footballers of Moussa Dembélé and Patrick Roberts quality. Without that kind of quality on the park, Rogic is half the footballer. Similar story with Aaron Mooy. We need that in the Socceroos before Russia.

Tim Cahill and Tomi Juric are good options up front. But we need a bit more firepower and routes to goal. A fantasista would provide that in lieu of an out-and-out, complete, clinical striker (which neither of them nor Adam Taggart nor Jamie Maclaren appear to be).

In central midfield, we're struggling for rhythm. But Jackson Irvine is outstandingly versatile and consistent. If he can gel with Mooy, Rogic and some kind of fantasista (Arzani, Derrick, Burns) we'll have that rhythm.

Central defence is a bit of a worry. I've come to realise that a system with three central defenders requires those central defenders to be ball-playing central defenders. It's concerning that Trent Sainsbury is not playing for Inter Milan. But training with Inter Milan is of more use than playing in China, the A-League or a host of other places. Ange should be mindful of that. Sainsbury was substantially better than the rest of the defence. If only Thomas Deng can make the first-team at PSV. Then we, all of a sudden, have two central defenders who are far more competent on the ball. If Curtis Good can do well, that would be helpful. Matthew Spiranovic has ability but is not in great form. I'm not sold on Bailey Wright or Milos Degenek but they may find some form.

Brad Smith and Mathew Leckie are best-suited to wing-back positions. Smith is one-dimensional, but does improve the more he plays. It's incumbent upon him to move to a good football side where he will start. Alex Gersbach and Craig Goodwin are also well-suited to wing-back roles. So we do at least have some depth.

Robbie Kruse needs to leave China and find a high quality competition. He has struggled since going there.

Mitch Langerak is potentially a world-class shot-stopper. We need more evidence that Mat(t)y Ryan can do that, too. Otherwise, Langerak should be in goals. But things now look better in goals.

But the upshot is that if everything went perfectly with those footballers, we had some huge strokes of luck and they got used to playing together, we could have a team that is actually decent. Despite the fact we are struggling against crappy Asian sides now.

In Russia (assuming we qualify), if all those things went well, we could actually do some damage with this kind of a line-up...

NB- I do not suggest that all of the following are selected for the NT just now. I merely suggest that they should be in the plans of Ange for the long-run (if they can do some good stuff in club football, as they have the basic ingredients)


-----------------------------------------------------------------------Juric------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-------------------------------------------------------Rogic-------------------------------Arzani--------------------------------------------------------------------


Smith--------------------------------------------------Irvine-------------------------Mooy----------------------------------------------------------Leckie


------------------------------Sainsbury-----------------------------------Spiranovic-----------------------------Deng----------------------------------------


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------Langerak------------------------------------------------------------------------

Juric
Rogic
Ibini Mooy Irvine Leckie
Gersbach Sainsbury Tongyik Degernak
Mitch

Phil‏ @PhilSpeak

 Follow

More

Chance of direct qualification if we beat Saudis jumps to 76% (& a decrease in my blood pressure!)

By beating the Saudis it puts us in a much better position. Their last 3 games are the hardest. They've got two very hard away games and host a team that has excellent ability. When you see how KSA play it's sometimes baffling how they've gotten so many points. 

I agree on the point of 3 at the back would need ball playing types. This is something Wright and Degenek need to work on. Thankfully De Vere, Milligan, Spiranovic can do that. I'd say they'd need to be quick as well so Jedinak might not be best there. I'd like to think if Jedinak were on the right,  he'd guide Leckie to become an excellent RWB.

Was on FIFA tonight as Australia manager and the next highest rated CB was Mrcela. How has he been going?

I still think Rhys Williams can offer something. 6 months of matches can make a massive difference. 

If Williams can remain uninjured and hasn't lost his mobility, he certainly would work in a back 3.

We currently have three reasonable options up front for this formation that each offer something different. Cahill obviously does cahill things attracting defenders opening space for his team mates while also having defences at sixes and sevens when the ball is lofted into the box. Juric, although shocking in the last match is able to hold the ball up, has trickery and is deceptively quick for a big man. Burns has speed and scoring ability. A lot of this selection will be horses for courses. We are reasonably well served with the option of mixing it up if someone else can announce themselves. Maclaren and Taggart are both well and truly in the mix moving forward and im sure will receive their chance to show what they can offer in this formation.

For you to intentionally or unintentionally imply that tim cahill is anything less than clinical up front is extremely odd.

Irvine has done enough in these last two games to push himself above luongo in the pecking order and his versatility through the middle allows us to be a lot more flexible depending on the availability of mooy, rogic, luongo and even jedinak. We are well serviced through the middle in this formation with each of the five players mentioned offering something different to the rest.

Sainsbury will be the first name on the team sheet moving forward regardless of if he plays at inter or not. We are not blessed with world class talent anywhere but particularly at the back to suit this formation. Spiranovic i have the feeling will not be part of Anges plans unless he can get a move away from his current club.

Surely given Dengs decision to join PSV where he struggles to get into the reserves has him well behind Tongyik in the pecking order who offers both strength and ability on the ball. Should Williams remain fit and be playing he is also a perfect fit because he really does have quality on the ball and is a more than able defender.

Wright will play when available because of his leadership abilities and the fact he plays week in week out at his club. I acknowledge his use of the ball isnt the best but as long as he can play a short 10-15 metre pass to one of his more able team mates he will be fine.

I like DeVere but im not sure how reliable his form will be given the fact he is quite injury prone, i acknowledge the same of Williams. No one will know if curtis Good is up to it until he starts playing again but obviously he is another option with age on his side. Wilkinson is reliable but aging and im hoping Degenek may improve with game time but im starting to question my initial belief in him.

Wingback for me is less of an issue. Leckie will play on the right hand side. He isn't overly injury prone so should be good to go most games. Other than him hopefully risdon can rediscover his previous form and at least offer a back up option.

We are well served on the left hand side. Gersbach, once in season will be able to play that role with little difficulty, behich is fit and playing and will be capable. Smith needs football but certainly has the engine Ange is looking for to play that role for 90 mins and just to throw a smokey in there zullo is in reasonable form with sydney though behind the rest in the pecking order.

There is no papering over the cracks. The last two games we played shit, that's the reality. If we want to make the world cup and actually be competitive we need to improve. I think Ange has seen that and that is why he is now changing his formation to try and fit his best players in. I'm sure if you asked him privately off the record he would be wishing he had made this change earlier than he has but hindsight is 20/20.

The draw against Thailand is what has really hurt us. Moving forward results like that should be deemed unacceptable. We as a nation dont want to find ourselves depending on the results of other teams to qualify. 

So strongest 11 now if all fit and playing regularly.. 

Ryan
Wright Jedinak Sainsbury
Milligan Mooy
Leckie Irvine Rogic Smith
Juric

Langerak, Troisi, Luongo all unlucky to miss out.

I just saw there was another post in the Gombau out thread and for some reason it reminded me that when Gombau coached Kitchee in Hong Kong before he came to Adelaide they played with three at the back at least some of the time.
I am wondering whether the new formation might be a result of Gombau's influence now he is part of the nation team set up.

Hopefully - though I fear it won't be soo easy. You guys over-state how hard the Saudis may have it. IF we don't get the desired result against Japan, then Japan auto-qualifies before they even face the Saudis. They put up a weakened team having less to play for, meanwhile Saudis still have alot to play for and facing a weakened, less motivated Japan. The Saudis with the kind of attacking, high scoring football they play they could easily get the result against Japan in a fixture that plays out easier than it should on paper. UAE for Saudi Arabia may not be soo tough as it seems on paper either, given the UAE could be all-but out of the running if they don't do the job away to Thailand, which is entirely possible given how competitive Thailand have been at home. And even though they are regional rivals, Saudi Arabia playing in UAE is hardly a strenuous, unfamiliar away trip for the Saudis and the UAE again are weakened with their coach just departed and confidence down - even Omar Abdulrahman was below his high-standards against us, too easily contained. I think their performance against us showed why they sit where they do in qualifying. Meanwhile, Iraq, who caused us all sorts of trouble away, did us no favours by subsequently losing to Saudi Arabia. There was the chance of a draw but Iraq weren't effective enough on the counter and the Saudis could've have blown them away by more - they were a pale shadow of the team that caused Australia all those headaches on the cow paddock in Tehran.

And unlike Saudi Arabia hosting Japan in the last window of games, Japan host us when Japan still have guaranteed qualification to play for. Japan at that stage of qualifying AND playing at home, are more likely to be up for it, full strength, than they would be the following period away to Saudi Arabia if again, we don't get the win we require to guarantee our own qualification. We should also some partial retribution for that home draw slip-up with Haraguchi's swift early goal and failing to put the Japanese away in that second-half - infact all those four 4 draws in qualifying, failing to finish games off, just too many and why we're in the position we're in. We need to be playing much better than that when we face them in August, or the play-offs it is.

if we cant beat the saudis at home we dont deserve to go