Ashes Third Test (22-27 August)


Ashes Third Test (22-27 August)

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Decentric
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baggygreenmania - 29 Aug 2019 9:36 AM
Batting averages and bowling averages are dropping. I just did a study for 97 - 2006 vs 2013 to now. I can cut and paste it for you if you want. Baggers has no doubt seen it.

No I have not seen it Paddles.

I think Mike might have put this up too.
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baggygreenmania - 29 Aug 2019 9:33 AM
Australia XI to face Derbyshire: Usman Khawaja (c), Cameron Bancroft, Alex Carey (wk), Marcus Harris, Marnus Labuschagne, Mitch Marsh, Michael Neser, Peter Siddle, Steve Smith, Mitch Starc, Matthew Wade.

Khawaja skipper..interesting. Doubt if they are planning to drop him at Manchester. So he scores big against a rookie (likely) Derbshire side.. what does that prove? The decks will be made for batting to give us a false sense of security.

True, Baggers.
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Paddles - 28 Aug 2019 12:43 PM
Decentric - 28 Aug 2019 8:37 AM

They can - but they don't average out like that. Ever. Even if you drop Tendulkar, say he averaged 1 life per innings before out, and he averaged 54 - that's 27 per drop. A bowling dominant team, will have the keeper take about 2 dismissals an innings. If you start talking the 1 percenters - if the run difference is huge - it makes sense to have Gilchrist over Healey... and you all saw that vs Pakistan in 1999. Gilly won the unwinnable with the bat. Its doesnt matter if he was never going to be as good as Healey with the gloves. He still took more dismissals per innings than Healey, as the seam stocks he kept too were much stronger than Reiffel, Whitney, Mcdermmot, Hughes, Lawson and whatever else Healey kept to...

I wouldn't give up Watling's ability to turn a disaster around (2  record partnerships batting at 7) for Blundell's glove work. Watling may only average 40 as a keeper, but he only makes big runs when needed. He never downhill ski's like Blundell did.  India use Pant, who is the worst keeper in intl cricket - but a batting average of near 45. Pant is so bad, that it starts to become an issue. Watling at least is not bad. He missed one stumping opportunity in the past series, was still mots... for his runs.... Pant is terrible - I think he will get dropped at some point in India keeping to spinners. But he is the extreme example of choosing the best batsman over the best keeper...

For Australia, Carey looks like a good keeper... He certainly looks a gun bat... He is making huge runs for Sussex right now continuing his WC form...

There is no viable current captain besides Paine, and, Carey is inexperienced.

To go straight in to an Ashes series, is a big step for Carey.

I didn't see them, but according to Grazor Carey dropped many  key chances in the WC too.



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Decentric - 28 Aug 2019 8:37 AM
Some thoughts on Paine's captaincy and position in the team.

I've always subscribed to the view that the  best keeper  takes the position, regardless of batting. Dropped catches can cost 100 runs. Wicketkeeper is the key catching position. Even though others have shown Bairstow's better contribution  with the bat, Sangakarra analysed how Paine is the better keeper with freeze frames.

in News Corp, who don't let posters access it free of charge , because of a pay wall, Ben Horne elucidates   Paine's captaincy.

* Horne argued those calling for his sacking have short memories. He argues that Australia were in a position to have challenged for the Ashes in England for the first time  since 2001, is due significantly to his leadership in steadying the ship.

* Horne contends Paine is a superb statesman. Moeroever, he has united a broken dressing room.

*Horne advances that Paine could benefit in having access to Ian Chappell or Michael Clarke's tactical nous, but Chappell himself posts no Aussie captain in history would have handled the predicament  as well as Paine has just done in the wake of a crushing  defeat in the 3rd Test.

* Horne  suggests those calling for Smith's ascension to the captaincy, forget he  struggled as leader on the field, and, was never a great tactician as a captain. When Pakistan amassed 450  at he Gabba in 2016, he argus Smith was worse as a captain than Paine was against Stokes.

* As we stand, Horne posits Paine is on the verge  of one the greatest performances by an Aussie captain.

* Yes he got  DRS challenges wrong, but he has got a lot else right that has been overlooked.








Gday  Dc,
jaszyjim - I will answer this type of dialogue in full at the end of the series
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Paddles - 29 Aug 2019 6:40 PM
baggygreenmania - 29 Aug 2019 9:33 AM

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27486154/usman-khawaja-australia-captain-why-not

Oh no - the Aussie media campaign to drop Paine has begun...

The issue I always raised is then who is captain? The answer according to cricinfo is - Qld and former Aus A captain, Ussie Khawaja...

Paine's problem is not just that he is the worst of test captains and wicket keepers at reviews, its his total and utter lack of runs of late...

Carey raises a problem being the ICC World Cup team wicket keeper - and fair enough. He outshone my favourite in Jos Buttler. Carey is in career form...

Now I expect DC to go ballistic about this and staunchly defend Paine. But there is a problem. He is not scoring runs. He is not reviewing well. As good as a champion he is of a bloke, he isn't ticking all the boxes.



Gday Paddles,
jaszyjim - agree with you 100%
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Paddles - 26 Aug 2019 6:20 PM
Lastbroadcast - 26 Aug 2019 1:48 PM

These comments really really annoy me. I saw cricinfo write the same thing. Ben Stokes innings WAS NOT EVEN THE BEST TEST INNINGS TO WIN A TEST THIS YEAR...

This one is imo...

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/18645/scorecard/1144164/south-africa-vs-sri-lanka-1st-test-sl-in-sa-2018-19

That's AWAY in SA, facing Steyn, Philander, Rabada, Olivier and Maharaj! 78 required for the last wicket...

Sorry Stokes is great, but how noone even discusses this one which occurred this very year should be mindblowing... but its actually just reveals how little attention is paid to intl cricket outside matches involving the Rich 3.

That Lara 1999 series was drawn 2-2 - Lara does the 153* in the 3rd test, to put WI up 2-1...

No way! I saw Perera's knock and it was indeed absolutely incredible, but I think Stokes was better given the series circumstances.

Keep in mind, if Stokes got out, that was the entire ashes gone. The pressure on him was way higher than Perera - an entire Ashes series on one man's shoulders. Plus the bowling may not have been quite as hot but the pitch was tougher. To do that with all of those pressures on, plus 15,000 Northern English fans screaming, that's off the charts. 
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Lastbroadcast - 1 Sep 2019 2:43 PM
Paddles - 26 Aug 2019 6:20 PM

No way! I saw Perera's knock and it was indeed absolutely incredible, but I think Stokes was better given the series circumstances.

Keep in mind, if Stokes got out, that was the entire ashes gone. The pressure on him was way higher than Perera - an entire Ashes series on one man's shoulders. Plus the bowling may not have been quite as hot but the pitch was tougher. To do that with all of those pressures on, plus 15,000 Northern English fans screaming, that's off the charts. 

Circumstances? Really don't buy this. 

 Look I get you think that the Ashes series win is a thing as against drawn series. But its still just another test series. There's been drawn series before, be drawn series again.

Its not like they'll skip the fourth and 5th test if Aus won the third. 

Now you can tell me I don't get it. But I got up to watch the English chase cos I thought they had a chance of winning. I got to see Stoke's innings, cos I thought England had a good chance of doing it.

Now Perera, in South Africa, after SL had lost 3-0 at home to England, had lost away comfortably, I mean thrashed, to NZ and Aus - then turn up with a mickey mouse team, facing Philander, Rabada, Steyn, Maharaj and Olivier. And pull off a bigger 10th wicket partnership chase to win. AWAY. On a spicy pitch. Against the best bowling attack on the planet!. Sorry - its not close. Noone had heard of Perera before that innings, we already knew Stokes. Perera scored more runs, he scored more his team's total, and he blunted the best bowling group on the planet. Away. On a mine field. In a team that had just lost 3 series in a row...

Perera for mine, much more brilliant and unexpected innings. Root, Bairstow, Stokes, England always had a chance. SL sent a rubbish team that should have been destroyed by Rabada, Ngidi, Philander, Olivier, Maharaj et al like Australia, India and everyone else has been. But they won? In those circumstances? With Perera playing like a man possessed with CHANCELESS innings. Not dropped like Stokes was. Chanceless.

Sometimes I don't get why any country plays test cricket, if the Ashes - between the 4th and 5th ranked test nations, means so much more apparently cos its the Ashes. You really think Olivier, Steyn and Rabada, let alone Perera, dont care about winning their tests even if they're not Ashes matches? But here's the thing, if Perera doesn;'t win that test, SL coudn't win their first series in SA. An entire SA tour on one man's shoulders ;)

You may not understand this, but it was  huge deal to Indiam cricket fans to win in Aus, even if not the Ashes,  India still have never won in SA. NZ has never won in SA. Its a big deal to many of us. And SL has, while fielding their worst test team since the 1980's. Perera made it possible. And it did then happen. SL beat India to a series win in SA... they got one up on big brother. Again. And while Aus and Eng fans may get excited about the Ashes, sub continental fans are always excited by every single test match. They are under intense and constant pressure. They drop players and coaches like tomorrow. And burn effigies in the streets. The players and the coaches fight in public. The CURRENT players even fight with each other's player's wives on twitter lately! Seriously, read T Perera, Malinga, wive, captaincy issue. https://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket/sri-lanka-a-laughing-stock-captain-s-wife-in-spat-with-player-20190131-p50urh.html Its not evena  wait till retire and sell some gossip. These are current players. And they're fighting on twitter and facebook!

If winning in SA despite the Ashes was important to Aussies, Smith and Warner wouldn't have cheated. These guys are playing to win whether they are from Eng or Aus, Ind or SL, regardless of who they're playing and where.

 They're cricket nuts in the sub continent. There is always pressure to perform on them. Always. 

What Fernando's point was, it shows the Big 3 have become so myopic, that it doesn't matter what SL, NZ, SA, WI, etc players achieve. The global cricket media has gone Big 3 mad. Which is odd, cos England and Aus are 4th and 5th right now... afterall. The levels of ignorance to non-Ashes or non-Indian series is just overwhelming. 
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5 Years Ago by Paddles
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