so why are we in a position of stagment paulc, don't bring up the nsl past for one, that so long ago its not funny.
Lowy and his team/s of ignoramous's have had 15yrs, delivered marketing and sponsership for the shop front, what plans were in place looking ahead, fish where the fish are I guess and more rich buggers putting Clubs not needed as long as they paid the buck, what a business.
Lowy was so passionate about the game (packed up set up his own) and knew very well how the game works re P/R near on everywhere else around the world but focussed on the business franchise model and neglected below that part due to his own actions having cut off the State PL Clubs, they wouldn't have wanted to comply any peace pipe over the preceeding years how they were treated for Lowys head was too big and full of dollars, who needs them eh, a real nice man for the game overall.....not.
Here we are after having finally booted your messia out.
Your right, He added to the basket case blindly for their own gains, ironically their actions have steered the game into a "richmans" sport, only those willing to pay for Johnny in SAP/YL etc need apply.
He created all this knock off effect in the big picture.....

Yet as a sport we’re still getting air time and on the news. Crowds are resilient despite Covid and quality has been very good throughout the past 15 years. Record participation and still plenty of money in the game, all under his watch.

The WC made FFA’ take their finger of the pulse, a gamble that would have catapulted the sport to the next level if it would of come off, it failed but that was the big picture. The governance issues were brought about greed from others, namely the A League clubs. Lowy lost out. You and others got their wish.

4 years is more than ample time to get an NSD going, with or without the FFA. Not even JJ your saviour can work it out. You don’t like it, you’re ashamed and embarrassed it’s not working out, so you retort to the populous response of hating on Lowy and her s involvement. Suggest you eat some humble pie and peel some of that egg of your face. You’ll  see how difficult it has been for all concerned.

seriously - nothing to peel off my face.
Quality was not good the last 5yrs or so, it was declining.
Ofcourse there was money under his watch, he had it and drew in connections nothing hard about that.
Yep the big picture failed - dishonesty has its way of rising to the top, thank god mentioning egg on face.
The governance is about greed period, not just the AL Clubs, might I add if I was a ALClub and paid those out landish License fees to Lowys, etcetc and then seeing attendance's deplete, Governace cut off active support, let the media talk negative about the game etcetc do you blame the bleeding owners trying to be greedy but screw em anyway.
JJ isn't my saviour, I've never quoted as such, be it he or whoever what they inheritated was a melting pot and incl the State Clubs a re build/or whatever else you can call it regards to P/R/NSD blahblah would take a loonnng time to get up and running 4yrs and more with all the complications and more so Costs involved.
In the big picture everyone is losing despite you being so smug about it all.

Again 4 years is more than enough to get a plan and structure in place on paper at least, irrespective of the past. It is the current structure you and sundry wished for is what is complicating it.

You can’t explain away using Lowy as an excuse for not progressing beyond “discussions” and “concepts” after 4 years.

Before his departure Lowy warned that the game will be seriously compromised by the new governance. Sure, there are questions about his performance, but he wasn’t wrong.

well no matter what you'll have your say and others have theirs, just like whats going on re this subject the bodies involved, no where so nothing achieved.
15yrs come and gone - how good was that, and the next probably pretty much the same, thats australian football.

Hard to disagree with those sentiments 

pleasant change lol....

Thats how I understood his interview too. How very farkin sad this all is.....
Good news for the Aleague brigade they will get a chance to support their NPL ( or  in the case of the Bulls and WU, other clubs rebranded as theirs) teams in the new champions league of Australia... Hope they come up with a nice jingle and some cool marketing ideas to promote it to you all.  I guess Heineken may not be interested but all the NPL supporters love a VB or XXXX dont they?

was listening to JJ on Simon Hill's podcast at the gym last night and i nearly threw my barbell through the wall when i heard this talk of a champions league format. 

Football fans are frustrated. We do not want any more delays. we do not want stop gap measures or half-arsed ideas implemented. do it soon. And do it farkin properly.

Yeah, it was a very frustrating interview. JJ and the whole FA need to understand that unless they give the fans what they want (and it should be clear by now that we want a second division, pro-rel and an integrated pyramid), then the professional game is going to shrivel up and die. 

If they do end up proposing a Champions League model for a supposed second tier, then the AAFC should just politely tell them to f--- off. It would simply be an elongated version of the current national NPL play-offs, which with nothing at stake apart from a paltry FFA Cup spot fails to attract any significant interest whatsoever. They should just plough forward with their own plans, bearing the costs from their own pockets for the first few years (with travel and admin, these come to a couple of hundred thousand a year per club). Realistically, what could the FA do to stop them? Would they really be willing to risk a Super League-style war over the ambitions of second-tier clubs to create a competition that actually implements their own stated goals?

A-League fans should also let their club owners know their feelings about pro-rel. I don't know anybody who's not in favour of the principle, even if it means the risk of their own club being relegated (that's life for a football fan). The owners have to understand this.

The least the APL could do is announce plans for A-League expansion to 16 teams over the next 2-4 years, and then say that once they hit 16 they will open up the league to pro-rel with the (hopefully by then existent) NSD. All it would entail would be a change to the licenses to make them dependent on not finishing last in a given season. The four expansion clubs will know what they are getting in for, while the existing clubs will just have to aim to do better than the expansion clubs, which honestly shouldn't be too much of an ask.

Although I think this whole championship transitional format is rubbish, the problem is that you just know that it will be here to stay for way longer than a season or two. That's still the major issue with the FA, zero long term planning. If they came out and said 'we are gonna run this silly championship format for 2 seasons and then transition into a proper div 2 format in 2023/24', I'd have no problem with it. They could even spin it and say they would use the results of those seasons as part of the decision process for the initial div 2 clubs. But they never say anything like that. They just say 'this is the budget solution we are running with, we'll look at alternative options in the future when the time is right'. Without actual planning and goal setting, nothing will ever eventuate. The time will never be right.

You’re assuming “fans” know everything about structuring a competition, it’s finances and management. We can’t even agree whether it’s a foul or not yet we’re experts at this as well, lol.

No, it's the task of the football authorities to figure out the finances for a competition structure that actually provides fans with what they want, and by now it's abundantly clear that fans at all levels of the game want an integrated pyramid. If the FA doesn't do that then fans will vote with their feet (as they are already doing), and the present malaise in the game risks becoming an inexorable death spiral.

That’s a massive long bow!

Great little interview on Soccerscene, these guys are pretty decent and seem to really care about local soccer .
https://www.soccerscene.com.au/aafc-chairman-nick-galatas-we-want-the-best-possible-national-second-division/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Key points for me are below, to paraphrase  the FFA model will NOT do anything towards creating the professionalism in a second tier, but lets see what FA come up with?

“We are not rejecting the outline of what James put out the other day, it may turn out to be better. We will explore that further and try and look at that and imagine it to its best level and work on that in good faith. If it looks good, and the risk associated with that is so much lower to make it more viable, then great.

“But, our work to date shows that it is not the case.

“The cost to the revenue side of a more limited model and the difficulty our member clubs will have in selling that to their own people, in terms of generating the relevant interest, isn’t worth it, as the savings it involves doesn’t compensate for the forgone revenue and interest. We look forward to seeing the FA model James mentioned in more detail when it’s ready, but we have anticipated such a model in our progress report before settling on our preferred model.”

whether or not a 2nd div exists the NPL Finals need to be expanded 32 and the state finals disbanded altogether 

Agreed. The State Finals serve a much lesser purpose

So he's saying the restricted model put forward by JJ might reduce the cost of running iy, but equally, it will limit options to earn revenue.
In other words, both models have risks, and the restricted model doesn't guarantee a break even position.
It's not really a cost/benefit question anymore.
It's really a matter of who is lobbying for what.  Loudest wins.

So a NSD and a NPL Champions League?

Except that the state finals have been known to get crowds of up to 10,000 to them in NSW and Vic, whereas the national play-offs are barely a blip on the post-season radar. I'm all for giving them more meaning (pro-rel to an NSD would certainly achieve that), but not at the expense of state finals.

Thus is true and the obvious answer as to why they exist (just like in the Aleague) They serve no other purpose than the fact the federation gets the gate takings and in a year with a couple of well supported teams the crowds can be quite good. When you have Bentleigh vs Avondale in front of 750 at AAMI park though it is a bit of a fizzer.

That to me would be the ultimate however JJ wants NPL champions league INSTEAD of NSD ... or rather I should say APL wants this.

It always was mate... When you have volunteers stepping in to do the work that the actual federation doesnt want to even consider, you know which side the toast is buttered on. FA have now declared they are doing their own report into NSD economic modelling, I bet you cents to the dollar that this will take as long as WU building a stadium and final conclusion will be "cant be done, sorry we tried, we will expand the youth league though which is what they  do in Botswana" hahahah

It was actually a good way of responding to JJ's comments. He says they'll take a Champions League-style format into consideration, but that their modelling has already suggested that this "pragmatic" format (as JJ said) would see very little benefit over the status quo, making the added costs not really worth it. In contrast a proper NSD would have much higher costs, but the potential benefits are also much higher, since the league could really generate interest in member clubs which is currently only latent while they are stuck in the NPL. You would think it would also provide a benefit to the NPL itself (in spite of the loss of the big clubs), because there is then a tangible gain to be had from having a winning season: promotion to the NSD.

I think that loss of the big clubs is what worries the State Federations. If for no other reason than a purely economic one. Yes yes I know everyone thinks I harp on about South faaar too much but the reality is that when South, Knights or Heidelberg are not in the State finals here the crowds and thus the gate takings are abysmal.. look at last years attendance of under 1k yet, South vs Oakleigh in the final a few years back drew 7k at Lakeside. Its no coincidence that FFVic has been at its most influential ever since the Aleague started and the ex NSL clubs dropped down to state leagues, they would certainly feel it if all 3 "went national"

How much money are state federations making from player registrations  ? It sounds like the most lucrative part of australian football 

But that wouldnt change much with the loss of a couple of clubs though? And the Nsd clubs would still keep their juniors and reserves in the NPL of their respective states so really only peanuts the state feds would be missing out on in regoes.. 

yes

And it's also clear that fans at all levels do NOT want an integrated pyramid.

I'm a fan of the professional game and a member of an amateur club. I want a fully professional level, and I don't care if it's integrated with the levels below.
I'm happy to see a system like Colombia where there are two fully professional divisions (36 teams in total) completely separate from the local amateur leagues.

I don't understand why you express these sorts of concerns.
Even in Dutch football, the 2nd tier (eerstedivisie) is tied to the fully amateur comps below it.
There are clubs who strive to move up the pyramid - that's the essence of football.