The Victorian response team has been the same since the start of the pandemic. Nothing has changed and nothing will ever change. For whatever reason they have decided to lock everybody down until the pandemic is over and it has been consistent since every state came out of lockdown and Victoria stayed locked down for 3 weeks

Yesterday didnt surprise me to be honest. The decision to stay in lockdown until there is a 70% double jab, and then to live under tight restrictions with no freedom day from there on after is where I expected Victoria to be at. The only thing that puzzles me is the gap in attitude towards regional Victoria and Melbourne. Its like running two different shows. Its OK for regional Victoria to open up with low vaccination rates next week buts its not OK for Melbourne with 70%

The only hope for Victoria is that in the middle of December when they try to argue a state of emergency and fight for another 6 or 12 months that common sense finally prevails and the push is defeated. I hope nobody outside of the response team honestly believed they saved 6000 people from getting the disease. Is there another industry where you can just make up your success?

What Australia fails to understand is people contracting COVID twice is rare, if at all. But vaccinations may only last 6-12 months before the effect starts to wear off. Going through the cost, pain and logistical nightmare of a 12 month national vaccination program only to then keep everybody in lockdown during the period of effectiveness is just the final icing on the cake for a country that has never understood this pandemic

Victoria are simply going to be a state that succumbed to the virus where as every other jurisdiction in the world plotted a pathway out. We are going to be the new Sentinel Island

The QLD premier is a fucking clown. NRL wives and girlfriends are allowed across the border but not a 3 year old stranded with his grandparents because of the border lockdown, or terminally ill people or people trying to get home or people trying to see a loved one.  Idiot.

And now, last night, she declares, without evidence that COVID19 is dangerous to under 12's  and that they won't be opening up the state and exposing under 12's to coronavirus until there's a vaccine.

First they scare the fucking beejesus out of everyone regards the AZ shot and now they're carrying on about under 12's dying. It's so retarded. Would love the federal government to stop funding them GST revenues or something.

Typical insular, chip on their shoulder Qld'ers. So glad I don't live in that shithole anymore.

Would so love  massive outbreak there and in WA.

Oh, and who's dragging the chain the most when it comes to vaccine take ups? Qld of course.

Except 99% of them will recover just fine which is worse because they can spruik about how it was all just 'much ado about nothing'.

The wife has a teacher mate who's anti-vaxx and now in NSW it's mandatory to be vaccinated if they want to continue work. Interesting times ahead though I'm sure those fuckers will find some loophole and a compliant doctor somewhere to write them a letter.

I'm empathetic to your situation so I'll let the stuff directed at me slide.

The fallacies are:
1. The state v state attacks are way overblown. They're tiny soundbites that the media lap up. There's a lot more cooperation going on than division. If you truly think the federation is in serious risk of collapse then you've been suckered in by it too much
2. People in the "Covid Zero" states are well aware that it's inevitable that its coming. Some of us are lamenting that it's probably coming too quickly due to mismanagement (we should have much higher vaccination rates before it became endemic), but almost all of us know that the time will come. Extra resources for vaccinations are being poured into the areas where there are outbreaks but there's plenty of demand for vaccination everywhere in Australia still. NSW (and Vic to follow) having faster vaccination rates is to be applauded by everyone but it's not a dick measuring contest. Every state wants high vax rates and it isn't in their interest to keep rates low for political gain because keeping it out forever is an impossibility.

I mean FFS WA had truck drivers last week, last night we had 5 drivers from interstate test positive. Qld today announced a swag of exposure sites. The various state premiers and CHO's aren't stupid.

Here are the actual quotes

It's actually pretty much what I said a couple of pages back. What's the strategy to protect children, she doesn't say its exceedingly dangerous to children but there needs to be plans in place to mitigate spread amongst unvaccinated children.

Anyway this highlights exactly what I was saying in my last post. The media feed outrage and people get sucked in to it. It was actually quite hard to find an article with her actual quotes!

You are kidding aren't you? This is straight out of the anti-vax playbook and a dog whistle so loud they can hear it in WA.

I watched the dumb clown talking last night and I was paraphrasing.

It's a joke. And her health officer should have told her not to say it. Not that Jeanette Young can talk saying she didn't want 18 year olds dying from AZ when they are multiples of times more likely to die from Covid. The medical association should have torn up her membership. (And she's 50% responsible for the slow take up of AZ shots.)

There is next to no chance of children under 12 getting sick and a simple phone call to any one of the 20 OECD countries that are miles ahead of us with vaccinations and easing of restrictions could have set her straight. That's assuming they didn't know that already. (Which of course they did.)

She's playing politics now, pure and simple.  Otherwise why the hell are the NRL WAGS allowed in?

 

its all an easy being cycnical Pala....
Who's to know the real reasons about the case on Wilcannia let alone many outcomes over the years by the Feds no matter the side (regards regional areas).
Generally speaking the big smoke/or smokes in every single country in the world is first base and priority thats life mate and you know this.
Were all very good at finger pointing and conviction being armchair experts but in the big picture we don't know jack shit but assume.
I also find it hard to think majority of the rank and file just swallow what Murdoch media throw out and other mediums the opposite.
A huge % of us armchair experts are not typical sheep in the big picture as many think.

I know were all frustrated being chained up - what its showing mind you is peoples true identities and bias coming out.
I've mentioned before watching from the cheap seats as we are its like a game, we have the Managers/assistants/medical staff each State in the game.
People stand behind their State as you would.
A change of tactics is expected in a game but this games target is not easy to counter, yet people expect so because our earlier game had worked you could say but the opponent stepped up another 2/3/4 levels now its hard to counter. Funny rest of the world couldn't hold it out yet people expect here.
Do you now sack your coach in your State who has played a park the bus game forever and day, had you locked up, no I'm not making any subs no change to my game plan.
Yet here we are as Podicide quotes.

Then we got that POS in Qld as Muz posted after what came out of her gob yesterday.
What damage is this person causing in the past present and future for QLD.

Most of this shit isn't because of what the media directives are, its driven by all our State Prems wanting to play the game of beating each other and the media feed it.
IF there was a key time in our recent history for these people to work together much closure and show unity, encouragement to each State its now and before.
It would be really interesting if that occured and see how the media presented the news then.

If it wasn't Scomo/Glady it would be Albo/Dan - surely people can see it wouldn't mater if it was peter paul and mary.
No one has or will have a great game plan AND there will be mistakes/blunders errors.

My friends in other countries are not blaming their main cities for covid getting through their process's/defences yet we sure are re NSW.
I mean where else does anyone think it would come through ? Darwin for eg, like I said earlier, its really showing whats underneath peoples skins today.

We've forgotten were Australia especially our pollies re unity, not the country of NSW/Vic/Qld etcetc.....

I respect your point and to some end agree with it but I believe actions, not words

OK so we cant find quotes on what specific premiers have said but you cant deny how much of the country is in lockdown, how long they are projected to be in lockdown, the resistance and excuses for not opening up, the constant changes of direction

The thing you have to remember is that the reason for no plan of vaccinations for children is because of the low risk associated with them being adversely impacted by the virus. Most countries have stopped at 18 year olds and even then thats precautionary. If everybody under 12 was a significant health risk do you think anybody would look at opening up?

This is just another excuse to stay under wraps and once people start the "think of the children" line thats when the discussion gets low. There was a legal debate in Florida about face masks and the rhetoric was "how many dead children is an acceptable amount?"

listening to Palaszczuk this comes to mind

Those outback joints full of our unvaccinated indigenous brethren are victims of misinformation flung about on facebook and the like. They weren't believing anything the government was telling them which is where the local elders needed to step up big time. So easy to blame the government.  Do you blame the government for fuckwits in Mullumbimby, Nimbin and Byron for not getting vaccinated Pala or only when the narrative suits?

all over sydney radio stations this morning mcjules, heard loud and clear.


I hear you re U12 children concerns - I haven't seen a thing from other parts of the world thats its been a priority issue  but that pharma is working on a vaccine suitable for the age group for there isn't one right, so how can we expect something/answers right now on the subject but rely on current medical advise.
I think its concerning for all not just them what possible side effects could occur in the future.
The common vaccines don't seem to have issues in the past but I'm no rocket scientist.

edit - OK cool BB2 did a far better summary than me, agreed.

As trite as that is that is exactly how she sounded.

Never has there been a more appropriate gif.

So easy to victim blame.

I choose not to engage with you on your implication that those in remote indigenous communities have had the same opportunities in life than hippies in Byron, I don't have the energy for that.

Time until second dose of AZ in Victoria just changed from 12 weeks to 6.

I agree. Those poor Byron residents.

Sorry there are plans to vaccinate everyone when a vaccine has been approved for them. Definitely adults were targeted first because of their risk profile but the other reason is that children's immune systems respond much better than adults (it's part of the reason we have a vaccine schedule for children) so the dosing has to be much more specifically calibrated. This takes more time. 

While there's a rush to be vaccinated, Qld, WA, SA, NT and Tas do not need to rush to lift border restrictions. They're not in the same emergency situation and currently have the luxury to actually get appropriately prepared. This window may shut at any time though and without notice, if that happens you'll see their tune will change. 

interesting this for, here in Syd I had my 1st jab 3/6 and yes at the time it was 12wk interval to 2nd.
It was released sometime ago after it was safe to bring forward by 2wks or abouts, so 11/8 done my 2nd.

Amazes me this kind of news on AZ wasn't annouced earlier down there but just now ?

I don't see how it's out of the anti-vax playbook.

The NRL WAGS thing is something I've been frustrated about too but think about this for a second. If someone has to move to Qld for work, do they get to take their family with them? The answer for the vast majority is yes. If anything, the negativity of that particular decision is actually bad politically.

Right but the important thing to note is that the plan to open up and the plan to vaccinate children are two different discussions. They shouldnt be mentioned in the same paragraph

And the other states can keep their borders shut to the majority of the general public but they'll always needs truck drivers and other essential workers. They'll effectively be drip feeding themselves the virus and then going into lockdown for every case. Kind of what Victoria do every time there is an outbreak in NSW

It's because the infections are climbing in Victoria and you'll likely need a booster in any case down the track.  My understanding (and what my Doctor said) is it's more effective if given 12 weeks apart. It's still effective after 6 weeks but not to the same degree.

The trade-off is everyone is vaccinated to a pretty decent degree or there's a delay, thousands of infections, and everyone is properly vaccinated.

Sigh she doesn't say anything about having to wait until children are vaccinated until they open up. She wants the modelling to include plans for children. The modelling isn't just about vaccinations!

The other bit I said about 10 posts ago, it's probably still on the same page (it is for me but I have the ordering different to the standard)

Interesting quote on the ABC feed today:

Royal Children's Hospital's director of mental health, Dr Ric Haslam, says they are witnessing considerable and sustained increases in presentations of children and young people with mental health difficulties.

He says the sorts of conditions they are seeing are anxiety, depression, self-harm, suicidal behaviours, and eating disorders.

The problem is society is simply sticking a swab into children, detecting their is no COVID present, and declaring that everything is fine. They dont have swabs for detecting the long term impacts of 30 weeks of being forcibly home schooled, months of being shut out from friends and social circles, months of being locked in doors, loss of emotional communication / meaningful engagement due to masks (study from the US), etc...

And adults are just as much prone to these issues as kids. They arent immune either

I remember ScoMo saying early on (to badly paraphrase) that "no low virus numbers with no school or where people cant go to work is not success". This has always been a one sided response and with every person vaccinated the amount gained from a one sided heavy handed response decreases to a point of detriment

Because she's dog whistling she doesn't have to say anything. You only have to go on twitter and see how many qld-ers are commenting on her post with a big thumbs up and glowing endorsements.

It's clear this 'do your own / We need more research' is politicking.  And low politicking at that.  (Dog whistle to conspiracy nuts too.)

I know you're a rusted on Labour man but come on this is ridiculous.

Why would the modelling specifically include children if they are not a risk factor? The opening up strategy is about what % of the population has risk of hospitalisation. If children are deemed a no risk (or rather, risk of hospitalisation from COVID is lower than risk of drowning or car accidents) then why would any modelling include them?

This is about looking specifically at the vulnerable population, trying to estimate what hospitals would look like if (say) 10%-20% of the population were infected over the next 2-3 years, and determining if opening up is a safe and smart thing to do. A child in this instance has the same weight as a double vaccinated adult. They can catch the virus but they have a significantly less chance of being hospitalised from it

If you're looking specifically for discussions about whether schools will be closed if a child is infected, whether there will be long term social distancing in place, or masks at schools, like I said, this isnt opening up because it assumes those under 12 are at high risk if infected. And if you can assume risk then why open up?

"I honestly believe we need more research on what happens to the zero- to 12-year-old cohort, as they remain unvaccinated," the Premier said.
"We need some medical advice because if you're going to let virus in and rip through, what is going to happen to the children?" she said.
"I want to know what is going to happen to the children of this state.
"It is a fundamental question. It is omitted from any modelling, omitted from any plan and every single Queenslander must be included in that plan."

Apparently the whole of the civilised world doesn't know anything about children under 12. (Pick up the farking phone luv.)

Qld'ers need specific advice and modelling because, as we're told ad nauseum, "We are Queenslanders. We're the people that they breed tough, north of the border." (Anna Bligh 2011.)

It's an absolute garbage statement designed to make her look tough on borders and shift the goalposts yet again.

I can't believe anyone can read that statement by her and not see it for the absolute bollocks it is.  What next?

'I honestly believe we need more research on what happens to the cats and dogs cohort because they're much loved members of our families and communities.'

Nice addendum and cop out.

One has nothing to do with the other regards uptake of vaccinations.

Horse / water comes to mind.

More garbage from the goose up north.

https://www.news.com.au/national/queensland/news/queensland-premier-says-thousands-will-die-each-month-if-borders-open/news-story/b0f42f461b947eba077ea94e7fec6146

Annastacia Palaszczuk has warned more than 2000 people will die each month if she follows instructions to open borders when vaccine coverage reaches 70 per cent.The Queensland Premier cited preferred modelling from the Doherty Institute when making the claim, but many have rebuked the assumption of the data including the Federal Health Minister who said the misuse of the numbers “breaches good faith and damages public confidence”

McJules that is pure and simple a deliberate misuse of statistics by her.  

The modelling in Australia has been laughable at best. You can just tell its people pumping figures into Excel and then applying an exponential growth formula. The initial modelling said that 20% to 60% of people would get infected (there has only been a 3% global infection rate after nearly 2 years), and I also remember figures of 20,000 by April 2020 (when there was less than 2000 local)

I still havent worked out how Victoria saved 6000 people from getting the virus over a 4 week period with a single patient zero

https://www.childrens.health.qld.gov.au/blog-covid-19-and-kids-what-you-need-to-know/

From QLD health's own website.

Is the delta strain more dangerous for children and young people?

There is no evidence that Delta variant causes more serious illness in children specifically Reassuringly data from the UK suggests admission rates for children have not increased despite emerging reports across the world that admission to hospital may be increased in young adults compared to previous variants. The good news is the vast majority of children with the Delta variant continue to experience a mild infection. Severe infections in children requiring intensive care unit admission or leading to death remain surprisingly uncommon throughout the pandemic.

Dan Andrews has been using various supercomputers for modelling in Victoria

"But there is an enormous amount of work going on, modelling scenarios being run through various supercomputers".

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/victoria-records-73-new-coronavirus-cases-41-more-deaths-20200831-p55qsz.html