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Marki
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+xHow long would people offer the Panthers 6 to get him across the line as a half???… Does anyone see him a 7 type player that could play with Burto at 6???… Is playing two 6 type players a reasonable plan???… Or do we sign him to replace Burto at 6????… Cos the moves gotta me made now…
I could be wrong but believe they played together at the Panthers in the halves and they were at 6s and 7s! It was clear that once Burton played well at left centre, he fell 2 or 3 rungs in the pecking order and was behind May and someone else let alone Luai. I don't think they can play well together. Luai is a better 6 than a 7. If we get Luai, he should be 6 and someone like Sexton should be 7. Luai would actually do really well next to Sezer at the Tigers. Sezer would be slow now in his final years but can control kicking and guide the team. Sexton not quite polished and can't command the team like Sezer can. Luai plays best when he's second fiddle and when he's free to play instinctively.
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Marki
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+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Fence sitter! C'mon mate. We were rubbish both years. Rubbish. We need improvement and we need it alot quicker than the guts have served up. Player improvement is minimal and in fact offset badly by the significant amount of players who went backwards. Our ladder position is no mirage. We are a bottom ladder team and lucky to not have more spoons given Broncos took it with a poor F/A a couple of years ago and Tigers/Dragons were in disarray last few years also. No doubt CC and Gus have their work cut out. I expect a decent amount of improvement in 2024 otherwise my support of those 2 will be gone
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Marki
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+x+x+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Backing up good with bad is common for young players… Hoping we don’t have the injury issues of last year… anyone who doesn’t think it contributed to our performances is an idiot… The thing with Romy is unless he’s planning on pulling a Moses and never intending to leave and drag it out to milk the Panthers of every cent, we likely have to act now… Or do we??… There is no better person than Gus to play that game… I can’t for the life of me figure out how any player wouldn’t favour the dogs over the tigers or dragons, who appear to be the only other options.. unless it’s only about money… And if we don’t get him, I think Sexy has plenty of po… Gus knows who we have and what we need. No knock on Romy , I think that he is chasing the next challenge.. But how would Romy have gone playing in the Dogs 2023 side? As for Sexy, I agree that he has all of the skills, instincts and knowledge needed to be a good half. What young halves need more than anything is the ability to filter out external noise, the confidence to keep playing their game and the trust in their taam-mates to play the long game and not force the play. The thing about team sport is all parts of the team need to be in good shape and the team needs to work together Working together and trusting Team-mates is also an area where we can improve. At the bottom of the table the list of things that can be improved is long. All of the list needs to be fixed and that extends far beyond one player. Not a half in the game would’ve made a significant difference for us last year… only a half wit would attempt argue otherwise… Define significant... There's a good 3 or 4 halves that would have improved us to one of the teams fighting for the top 8. Is that significant enough? I think it is. IMO our philosophy of getting the forwards to get on the front foot first before the "halves can shine" is flawed. I'm a believe that a good spine is needed first and foremost to assess if you have the forwards and outside backs to challenge for a title. Not many Bulldogs fans agree with me and that's up to them. All I can say is the runs are on the board. Weve been neglecting spine in favour of finding a forward pack and it has led us to our worst period of results since probably our inception or the period between 50s and 60s. The game has changed and it's time our philosophy changed with it.
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Marki
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+x+x+x+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Backing up good with bad is common for young players… Hoping we don’t have the injury issues of last year… anyone who doesn’t think it contributed to our performances is an idiot… The thing with Romy is unless he’s planning on pulling a Moses and never intending to leave and drag it out to milk the Panthers of every cent, we likely have to act now… Or do we??… There is no better person than Gus to play that game… I can’t for the life of me figure out how any player wouldn’t favour the dogs over the tigers or dragons, who appear to be the only other options.. unless it’s only about money… And if we don’t get him, I think Sexy has plenty of po… Gus knows who we have and what we need. No knock on Romy , I think that he is chasing the next challenge.. But how would Romy have gone playing in the Dogs 2023 side? As for Sexy, I agree that he has all of the skills, instincts and knowledge needed to be a good half. What young halves need more than anything is the ability to filter out external noise, the confidence to keep playing their game and the trust in their taam-mates to play the long game and not force the play. The thing about team sport is all parts of the team need to be in good shape and the team needs to work together Working together and trusting Team-mates is also an area where we can improve. At the bottom of the table the list of things that can be improved is long. All of the list needs to be fixed and that extends far beyond one player. Not a half in the game would’ve made a significant difference for us last year… only a half wit would attempt argue otherwise… That Parra half comes to mind… you know the $6M man that couldn’t lead one of the best squads in the game to better than hoping for other results to make the 8… when they miss the 8 again next year I shall formally anoint him Mutch Misses… Nice play on the name, but i doubt it happens. If Parra keeps their spine together for 75% of the season, they are top 4 bound again. They have 1,6,7 locked in and great young 9 to plug the gap left by Reed and Hodgson. Moses is first drop to Cleary for NSW origin. He actually played well given he was injured. Probably outplayed Luai. I know you keep harping on about his salary but the sooner you realise the going rate for origin halves is upwards of 1.2M a season, the better. If you think Burton on 800k is more value than Moses at 1.2M then I'll never be able to convince you but our team will continually be pegged at the bottom of the ladder. But we'll save 400k so I'm sure you'll somehow seek solace in that....
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dman2018
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+x+x+x+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Backing up good with bad is common for young players… Hoping we don’t have the injury issues of last year… anyone who doesn’t think it contributed to our performances is an idiot… The thing with Romy is unless he’s planning on pulling a Moses and never intending to leave and drag it out to milk the Panthers of every cent, we likely have to act now… Or do we??… There is no better person than Gus to play that game… I can’t for the life of me figure out how any player wouldn’t favour the dogs over the tigers or dragons, who appear to be the only other options.. unless it’s only about money… And if we don’t get him, I think Sexy has plenty of po… Gus knows who we have and what we need. No knock on Romy , I think that he is chasing the next challenge.. But how would Romy have gone playing in the Dogs 2023 side? As for Sexy, I agree that he has all of the skills, instincts and knowledge needed to be a good half. What young halves need more than anything is the ability to filter out external noise, the confidence to keep playing their game and the trust in their taam-mates to play the long game and not force the play. The thing about team sport is all parts of the team need to be in good shape and the team needs to work together Working together and trusting Team-mates is also an area where we can improve. At the bottom of the table the list of things that can be improved is long. All of the list needs to be fixed and that extends far beyond one player. Not a half in the game would’ve made a significant difference for us last year… only a half wit would attempt argue otherwise… Define significant... There's a good 3 or 4 halves that would have improved us to one of the teams fighting for the top 8. Is that significant enough? I think it is. IMO our philosophy of getting the forwards to get on the front foot first before the "halves can shine" is flawed. I'm a believe that a good spine is needed first and foremost to assess if you have the forwards and outside backs to challenge for a title. Not many Bulldogs fans agree with me and that's up to them. All I can say is the runs are on the board. Weve been neglecting spine in favour of finding a forward pack and it has led us to our worst period of results since probably our inception or the period between 50s and 60s. The game has changed and it's time our philosophy changed with it. Significant defined as would not have seen us compete fur the 8… allowing fur inexperience and injuries… The club could already see the back and forwards need to be better without a top class half over the past couple of years… and have made moves… where possible… Again, no half in the comp significantly improves our horrific injury toll, go forward, handling errors, dumb penalties or awful edge and middle defence last year… Maybe a little less fatigue through good kicking placement and metres, maybe a few more try’s, maybe less pressure on Burto and Lou Reed… but doesn’t have us threaten for finals… Forwards set the platform for the halve to perform, been that way forever… Penrith don’t win their first twin comps without that pack, and one of the greatest performances ever saw them win a third behind a beaten pack… . Noone is in denial a quality spine is require to threaten for a title, but it all comes down to what you’ve got, who is actually available, who fits the culture and cap, and who you breed… based on Newcastle spine would have have suggested they make it as far as they did???… Look at Souths and Parras spines… no finals… sure they had some injuries in their spine through the year.. but the main reason they both ended up relying on others results or a last round win was their forward injuries through the year… they lost games they’d have likely won by winning the ruck…
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dman2018
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+x+x+x+x+x+x[quote]2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Backing up good with bad is common for young players… Hoping we don’t have the injury issues of last year… anyone who doesn’t think it contributed to our performances is an idiot… The thing with Romy is unless he’s planning on pulling a Moses and never intending to leave and drag it out to milk the Panthers of every cent, we likely have to act now… Or do we??… There is no better person than Gus to play that game… I can’t for the life of me figure out how any player wouldn’t favour the dogs over the tigers or dragons, who appear to be the only other options.. unless it’s only about money… And if we don’t get him, I think Sexy has plenty of po… Gus knows who we have and what we need. No knock on Romy , I think that he is chasing the next challenge.. But how would Romy have gone playing in the Dogs 2023 side? As for Sexy, I agree that he has all of the skills, instincts and knowledge needed to be a good half. What young halves need more than anything is the ability to filter out external noise, the confidence to keep playing their game and the trust in their taam-mates to play the long game and not force the play. The thing about team sport is all parts of the team need to be in good shape and the team needs to work together Working together and trusting Team-mates is also an area where we can improve. At the bottom of the table the list of things that can be improved is long. All of the list needs to be fixed and that extends far beyond one player. Not a half in the game would’ve made a significant difference for us last year… only a half wit would attempt argue otherwise… That Parra half comes to mind… you know the $6M man that couldn’t lead one of the best squads in the game to better than hoping for other results to make the 8… when they miss the 8 again next year I shall formally anoint him Mutch Misses… Nice play on the name, but i doubt it happens. If Parra keeps their spine together for 75% of the season, they are top 4 bound again. They have 1,6,7 locked in and great young 9 to plug the gap left by Reed and Hodgson. Moses is first drop to Cleary for NSW origin. He actually played well given he was injured. Probably outplayed Luai. I know you keep harping on about his salary but the sooner you realise the going rate for origin halves is upwards of 1.2M a season, the better. If you think Burton on 800k is more value than Moses at 1.2M then I'll never be able to convince you but our team will continually be pegged at the bottom of the ladder. But we'll save 400k so I'm sure you'll somehow seek solace in that.... Moses is first drop for Freddy… and despite him playing reasonably in certain moments last series he he’s a flat tracker… He ain’t an Origin half any more more than a Team sheet, he’s a Freddy fill in.. and plenty would argue there were better options… He ain’t a bloke that can change a game when his team is behind or even in the grind.. so I reckon $6M is very poor value compared to Cleary, DCE, or Maddog who can turn a game and have done it plenty at both club and rep level… Re Parras young 9 I’m surprised you didn’t mention him last time you tried to defend Parras poor season, only offering Hodgson did nothing and Mutch Misses missed two games to injury… Its not saved money if Moses was never gonna leave… plus they weren’t available at the same time… bit of a nothing argument…I’d rather have bought Burto knowing he has talent and work to do, than not but Burto wait for Mutch Misses to become available and hope we capfuls snare him… Burto and Misses are different players… just as Misses and his 6 are different players… they offer different things… and for anyone that’s really watched Parra over the last two years, I reckon plenty would suggest Brown has offers as much if not more than Misses when things get tough… Has Burto proven his alleged value at this stage???… nope… but he’s 2 years into a career as a first grade half… Has Misses proven his alleged value?… nope… he has a whole career of no significant achievements behind him… and has Mutch Misses to show for it… and despite his talent has been called a flat tracker for much longer than his time at Parra… I reckon Burto plays more games in the halves for NSW than Mutch Mosses by end of their careers…
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dman2018
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Mockstra, as a dirty QLD supporter in Oeigin, did Mutch Misses selection fill you with fear???… even a slight amount of concern???…
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dman2018
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Just saw article… $6M to Wests Tigers… ouch but not ouch…
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dman2018
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+xJust saw article… $6M to Wests Tigers… ouch but not ouch… Allegedly 5 years… Leaves money for a couple props if they become available… or a 7 if required and available…
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dman2018
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Romy at $6M for 5… 3 Premierships, 5 or so origins including a win, World Cup final..
Mutch Misses at $6M for 5… 0 Premierships, perhaps 3 origins, no tests for his country…
Who got the beat value for a half???…
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hounddog
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+xJust saw article… $6M to Wests Tigers… ouch but not ouch… If we were interested we would have bid. Also we can't believe what we read in the press.
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dman2018
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+x+xJust saw article… $6M to Wests Tigers… ouch but not ouch… If we were interested we would have bid. Also we can't believe what we read in the press. Agree on both counts…
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hounddog
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I still say a lot of our tries in 2022 were from Burto Kicks for Fox.
Try scoring in 2023 was mixed, but Averillo and Reed featured more highly...
Fox and Burto didn't have a great start to 2023 and that lingered on.
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dman2018
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While we are having fun… 4 wickets 60 runs.. so we enforce the follow on if we can right… 😂😂😂
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hounddog
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+x+x+x+x+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Backing up good with bad is common for young players… Hoping we don’t have the injury issues of last year… anyone who doesn’t think it contributed to our performances is an idiot… The thing with Romy is unless he’s planning on pulling a Moses and never intending to leave and drag it out to milk the Panthers of every cent, we likely have to act now… Or do we??… There is no better person than Gus to play that game… I can’t for the life of me figure out how any player wouldn’t favour the dogs over the tigers or dragons, who appear to be the only other options.. unless it’s only about money… And if we don’t get him, I think Sexy has plenty of po… Gus knows who we have and what we need. No knock on Romy , I think that he is chasing the next challenge.. But how would Romy have gone playing in the Dogs 2023 side? As for Sexy, I agree that he has all of the skills, instincts and knowledge needed to be a good half. What young halves need more than anything is the ability to filter out external noise, the confidence to keep playing their game and the trust in their taam-mates to play the long game and not force the play. The thing about team sport is all parts of the team need to be in good shape and the team needs to work together Working together and trusting Team-mates is also an area where we can improve. At the bottom of the table the list of things that can be improved is long. All of the list needs to be fixed and that extends far beyond one player. Not a half in the game would’ve made a significant difference for us last year… only a half wit would attempt argue otherwise… That Parra half comes to mind… you know the $6M man that couldn’t lead one of the best squads in the game to better than hoping for other results to make the 8… when they miss the 8 again next year I shall formally anoint him Mutch Misses… Nice play on the name, but i doubt it happens. If Parra keeps their spine together for 75% of the season, they are top 4 bound again. They have 1,6,7 locked in and great young 9 to plug the gap left by Reed and Hodgson. Moses is first drop to Cleary for NSW origin. He actually played well given he was injured. Probably outplayed Luai. I know you keep harping on about his salary but the sooner you realise the going rate for origin halves is upwards of 1.2M a season, the better. If you think Burton on 800k is more value than Moses at 1.2M then I'll never be able to convince you but our team will continually be pegged at the bottom of the ladder. But we'll save 400k so I'm sure you'll somehow seek solace in that.... First quality Mock of the 2024 season.
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dman2018
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Backing up good with bad is common for young players… Hoping we don’t have the injury issues of last year… anyone who doesn’t think it contributed to our performances is an idiot… The thing with Romy is unless he’s planning on pulling a Moses and never intending to leave and drag it out to milk the Panthers of every cent, we likely have to act now… Or do we??… There is no better person than Gus to play that game… I can’t for the life of me figure out how any player wouldn’t favour the dogs over the tigers or dragons, who appear to be the only other options.. unless it’s only about money… And if we don’t get him, I think Sexy has plenty of po… Gus knows who we have and what we need. No knock on Romy , I think that he is chasing the next challenge.. But how would Romy have gone playing in the Dogs 2023 side? As for Sexy, I agree that he has all of the skills, instincts and knowledge needed to be a good half. What young halves need more than anything is the ability to filter out external noise, the confidence to keep playing their game and the trust in their taam-mates to play the long game and not force the play. The thing about team sport is all parts of the team need to be in good shape and the team needs to work together Working together and trusting Team-mates is also an area where we can improve. At the bottom of the table the list of things that can be improved is long. All of the list needs to be fixed and that extends far beyond one player. Not a half in the game would’ve made a significant difference for us last year… only a half wit would attempt argue otherwise… That Parra half comes to mind… you know the $6M man that couldn’t lead one of the best squads in the game to better than hoping for other results to make the 8… when they miss the 8 again next year I shall formally anoint him Mutch Misses… Nice play on the name, but i doubt it happens. If Parra keeps their spine together for 75% of the season, they are top 4 bound again. They have 1,6,7 locked in and great young 9 to plug the gap left by Reed and Hodgson. Moses is first drop to Cleary for NSW origin. He actually played well given he was injured. Probably outplayed Luai. I know you keep harping on about his salary but the sooner you realise the going rate for origin halves is upwards of 1.2M a season, the better. If you think Burton on 800k is more value than Moses at 1.2M then I'll never be able to convince you but our team will continually be pegged at the bottom of the ladder. But we'll save 400k so I'm sure you'll somehow seek solace in that.... First quality Mock of the 2024 season. He training the house down…
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dman2018
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+xI still say a lot of our tries in 2022 were from Burto Kicks for Fox. Try scoring in 2023 was mixed, but Averillo and Reed featured more highly... Fox and Burto didn't have a great start to 2023 and that lingered on. Burto most try assists for the Team… just not as many with Fox who was injured for a bit… 3rd highest TA for 5/8 in the comp from memory… And from memory had more assists than both $6M men… admittedly played a few more games… but relatively speaking there or there abouts… 2nd year as a 1st grade half syndrome…
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Marki
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+xRomy at $6M for 5… 3 Premierships, 5 or so origins including a win, World Cup final.. Mutch Misses at $6M for 5… 0 Premierships, perhaps 3 origins, no tests for his country… Who got the beat value for a half???… As you said... Different players. Moses is the halfback who is tasked with orchestrating the teams performance. Luai is just the risk taker. It's easier for a 5/8th to pick and choose his moments and go for it than it is for a halfback. Moses is more of a captain than Luai.
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Marki
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+xMockstra, as a dirty QLD supporter in Oeigin, did Mutch Misses selection fill you with fear???… even a slight amount of concern???… The concern with him is if he puts his team on the front foot, wins the fatigue battle through management and kicks the field goal when it needs to be kicked. To be fair to your arguments, I'm more fearful of him playing a part in turning a 10point NSW lead into 30 than I am in him converting a 6 point deficit to a 6 point win. But in origin, where the final outcome of the game is the most important thing, both are equally important.
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Marki
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+x+xI still say a lot of our tries in 2022 were from Burto Kicks for Fox. Try scoring in 2023 was mixed, but Averillo and Reed featured more highly... Fox and Burto didn't have a great start to 2023 and that lingered on. Burto most try assists for the Team… just not as many with Fox who was injured for a bit… 3rd highest TA for 5/8 in the comp from memory… And from memory had more assists than both $6M men… admittedly played a few more games… but relatively speaking there or there abouts… 2nd year as a 1st grade half syndrome… You're sugar coating those stats. But I will give you that he is /was our best available halves player in the list. Obviously when you have neglected the spine for so many years and coach too stubborn to play the right man at FB, you rely heavily on your one best half and naturally his stats are stacked given no one else gets to share those stats. The issue is, he is not improving any near what everyone anticipated. In fact IMO he is going backwards. I saw it before Gus extended his deal. Now we have an overpriced player in a key position. He could easily become one of the most overrated players of all time. But it's up to him.
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hounddog
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+x+xRomy at $6M for 5… 3 Premierships, 5 or so origins including a win, World Cup final.. Mutch Misses at $6M for 5… 0 Premierships, perhaps 3 origins, no tests for his country… Who got the beat value for a half???… As you said... Different players. Moses is the halfback who is tasked with orchestrating the teams performance. Luai is just the risk taker. It's easier for a 5/8th to pick and choose his moments and go for it than it is for a halfback. Moses is more of a captain than Luai. A captain has to provide leadership . Luai is a leader and is mentally tough. Moses isn't a leader and is mentally soft. Moses is improving, but still no where near captain material.
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hounddog
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I am expecting the Burton / Fox combo to bounce back in 2024.
Burto is the best attacking kicker in the game, Fox still has the speed to turn half chances into tries.
I hope Critter plays left centre he can also pass and kick for Fox, Critter will fix the defence on that side.
Throw in Kicks and it is a potent left edge.
Right edge needs the fullback joining the line to be potent...
Yes, I would like to see Burto answer his critic (singular) in the best possible way.
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dman2018
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+x+x+xI still say a lot of our tries in 2022 were from Burto Kicks for Fox. Try scoring in 2023 was mixed, but Averillo and Reed featured more highly... Fox and Burto didn't have a great start to 2023 and that lingered on. Burto most try assists for the Team… just not as many with Fox who was injured for a bit… 3rd highest TA for 5/8 in the comp from memory… And from memory had more assists than both $6M men… admittedly played a few more games… but relatively speaking there or there abouts… 2nd year as a 1st grade half syndrome… You're sugar coating those stats. But I will give you that he is /was our best available halves player in the list. Obviously when you have neglected the spine for so many years and coach too stubborn to play the right man at FB, you rely heavily on your one best half and naturally his stats are stacked given no one else gets to share those stats. The issue is, he is not improving any near what everyone anticipated. In fact IMO he is going backwards. I saw it before Gus extended his deal. Now we have an overpriced player in a key position. He could easily become one of the most overrated players of all time. But it's up to him. In no way sugar coated… If he had no one around him for the D to focus on it probably makes it tougher to get TAs… As for becoming one of the most overrated players, he has many years of failure and a few significant salary increases before he leap frogs Mutch Misses and a few other current halves currently playing, let alone ever…
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Mick O
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+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Fence sitter! C'mon mate. We were rubbish both years. Rubbish. We need improvement and we need it alot quicker than the guts have served up. Player improvement is minimal and in fact offset badly by the significant amount of players who went backwards. Our ladder position is no mirage. We are a bottom ladder team and lucky to not have more spoons given Broncos took it with a poor F/A a couple of years ago and Tigers/Dragons were in disarray last few years also. No doubt CC and Gus have their work cut out. I expect a decent amount of improvement in 2024 otherwise my support of those 2 will be gone Is it really fair that you expect the team to play better but you believe our roster isn’t any better or even worse?
I’m annoyed as much as any other fan but there is little else that Gus can do to improve our team next year. There simply isn’t anything special on the market.
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Mick O
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Backing up good with bad is common for young players… Hoping we don’t have the injury issues of last year… anyone who doesn’t think it contributed to our performances is an idiot… The thing with Romy is unless he’s planning on pulling a Moses and never intending to leave and drag it out to milk the Panthers of every cent, we likely have to act now… Or do we??… There is no better person than Gus to play that game… I can’t for the life of me figure out how any player wouldn’t favour the dogs over the tigers or dragons, who appear to be the only other options.. unless it’s only about money… And if we don’t get him, I think Sexy has plenty of po… Gus knows who we have and what we need. No knock on Romy , I think that he is chasing the next challenge.. But how would Romy have gone playing in the Dogs 2023 side? As for Sexy, I agree that he has all of the skills, instincts and knowledge needed to be a good half. What young halves need more than anything is the ability to filter out external noise, the confidence to keep playing their game and the trust in their taam-mates to play the long game and not force the play. The thing about team sport is all parts of the team need to be in good shape and the team needs to work together Working together and trusting Team-mates is also an area where we can improve. At the bottom of the table the list of things that can be improved is long. All of the list needs to be fixed and that extends far beyond one player. Not a half in the game would’ve made a significant difference for us last year… only a half wit would attempt argue otherwise… Define significant... There's a good 3 or 4 halves that would have improved us to one of the teams fighting for the top 8. Is that significant enough? I think it is. IMO our philosophy of getting the forwards to get on the front foot first before the "halves can shine" is flawed. I'm a believe that a good spine is needed first and foremost to assess if you have the forwards and outside backs to challenge for a title. Not many Bulldogs fans agree with me and that's up to them. All I can say is the runs are on the board. Weve been neglecting spine in favour of finding a forward pack and it has led us to our worst period of results since probably our inception or the period between 50s and 60s. The game has changed and it's time our philosophy changed with it. The last time we made finals our forward pack was the strongest it’s been since. Our spine however hasn’t been much better.
Canterbury-Bankstown Bulldogs: 1. Brett Morris, 2. Curtis Rona, 3. Josh Morris, 4. Tim Lafai, 5. Sam Perrett, 6. Josh Reynolds, 7. Moses Mbye, 8. James Graham (c), 9. Michael Lichaa, 10. Aiden Tolman, 11. Josh Jackson, 12. Tony Williams, 13. Greg Eastwood. Interchange: 14. Sam Kasiano, 15. David Klemmer, 16. Shaun Lane, 17. Tim Browne.
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hounddog
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 9.9K,
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+x+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Fence sitter! C'mon mate. We were rubbish both years. Rubbish. We need improvement and we need it alot quicker than the guts have served up. Player improvement is minimal and in fact offset badly by the significant amount of players who went backwards. Our ladder position is no mirage. We are a bottom ladder team and lucky to not have more spoons given Broncos took it with a poor F/A a couple of years ago and Tigers/Dragons were in disarray last few years also. No doubt CC and Gus have their work cut out. I expect a decent amount of improvement in 2024 otherwise my support of those 2 will be gone Is it really fair that you expect the team to play better but you believe our roster isn’t any better or even worse?
I’m annoyed as much as any other fan but there is little else that Gus can do to improve our team next year. There simply isn’t anything special on the market. I agree with Gus, Covid shut-down a lot of lower grade footy for a couple of years, also some clubs including us at the time dropped the ball on player development. So there is a lack of young NRL ready talent, clubs have responded by stockpiling talent. Clubs that are strong on development like Penrith are doing better. We are forced to develop talent, but we're are a club where young players can get opportunities. Over 2-3 seasons a club can bring through 6-7 good young players. Last season we had Preston, Morrin, Edwards and co. As I mentioned previously the Flegg halfback is good, we apparently have some good young middles. So the answer for us is, youth, development, opportunity backed up by pragmatic opportunistic signings. No point in paying overs for average talent, sign quality or give young kids a shot.
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hounddog
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The lack of good young halves is also over coaching, set moves erc, forcing halves into the straight-jacket of formula based play.
Older halves we developed in a different era, young halves never had that problem.
Most of the recognised NRL halves are simply solid and mostly dependable rather than exceptional.
In most earlier eras we had better halves.
IMO finding a young half who can play 10-12 seasons of NRL who is better than most of the current halves (at this stage of their career) is far from impossible, true class always stands out.
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dman2018
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 8.7K,
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+x+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Fence sitter! C'mon mate. We were rubbish both years. Rubbish. We need improvement and we need it alot quicker than the guts have served up. Player improvement is minimal and in fact offset badly by the significant amount of players who went backwards. Our ladder position is no mirage. We are a bottom ladder team and lucky to not have more spoons given Broncos took it with a poor F/A a couple of years ago and Tigers/Dragons were in disarray last few years also. No doubt CC and Gus have their work cut out. I expect a decent amount of improvement in 2024 otherwise my support of those 2 will be gone Is it really fair that you expect the team to play better but you believe our roster isn’t any better or even worse?
I’m annoyed as much as any other fan but there is little else that Gus can do to improve our team next year. There simply isn’t anything special on the market. Apparently we can just sign Hint or DCE at a whim according to some…
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hounddog
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 9.9K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Fence sitter! C'mon mate. We were rubbish both years. Rubbish. We need improvement and we need it alot quicker than the guts have served up. Player improvement is minimal and in fact offset badly by the significant amount of players who went backwards. Our ladder position is no mirage. We are a bottom ladder team and lucky to not have more spoons given Broncos took it with a poor F/A a couple of years ago and Tigers/Dragons were in disarray last few years also. No doubt CC and Gus have their work cut out. I expect a decent amount of improvement in 2024 otherwise my support of those 2 will be gone Is it really fair that you expect the team to play better but you believe our roster isn’t any better or even worse?
I’m annoyed as much as any other fan but there is little else that Gus can do to improve our team next year. There simply isn’t anything special on the market. Apparently we can just sign Hint or DCE at a whim according to some… Hint has been dropping....
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dman2018
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 8.7K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x2024 will be a true indicator of where we are at. In 2023 I noticed some good individual performances by our forwards, Preston, King, Patolo, Hughes, Morrin (especially) and Edwards. These ultimately came to nothing because our spine or other players fumbled the play we ended up losing the field position and possession battle. Another issue was King got injured, Hughes and Patolo were battling long term injuries, even Preston got injured eventually. Next issue the young guys were inconsistent and often backed up a good performance with a below average performance or after a few good weeks dropped off the pace. Averillo and Kiraz in the backs were similar. Burton and Fox were good in 2022, but didn't hit that standard in 2023. A lot is going to come down to completions, end of set options and execution in 2024. If there is no improvement in those areas, our spine needs a major overhaul and we need to look at expensive options like Luai. 10 weeks might be long enough to judge, I think that the forwards can give the spine a bit more help. If is a chicken and egg situation. Team-mates can help each other out, or make life harder for each other. Fence sitter! C'mon mate. We were rubbish both years. Rubbish. We need improvement and we need it alot quicker than the guts have served up. Player improvement is minimal and in fact offset badly by the significant amount of players who went backwards. Our ladder position is no mirage. We are a bottom ladder team and lucky to not have more spoons given Broncos took it with a poor F/A a couple of years ago and Tigers/Dragons were in disarray last few years also. No doubt CC and Gus have their work cut out. I expect a decent amount of improvement in 2024 otherwise my support of those 2 will be gone Is it really fair that you expect the team to play better but you believe our roster isn’t any better or even worse?
I’m annoyed as much as any other fan but there is little else that Gus can do to improve our team next year. There simply isn’t anything special on the market. Apparently we can just sign Hint or DCE at a whim according to some… Hint has been dropping.... And the Broncs fans will never forget…
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