Youth development in Australia, where did it all go wrong?


Youth development in Australia, where did it all go wrong?

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Waz
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AJF - 13 Sep 2019 9:54 PM
Waz - 13 Sep 2019 6:43 PM
Doesnt read that way


You need to read back a bit in the thread. 
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Waz - 13 Sep 2019 9:55 PM
AJF - 13 Sep 2019 9:54 PM

You need to read back a bit in the thread. 

I was responding to the content of a specific post bagging the lack of football intelligence of youngster (which you happened to agree with).

I did read the other posts and if I wanted to comment on them specifically I would have done so. 








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AJF - 13 Sep 2019 10:22 PM
Waz - 13 Sep 2019 9:55 PM

I was responding to the content of a specific post bagging the lack of football intelligence of youngster (which you happened to agree with).

I did read the other posts and if I wanted to comment on them specifically I would have done so. 

I get reading back over long threads is challenging. 

But just to clarify - we were both agreeing that the inadequacy in certain youth players is down to coaching. 
miron mercedes
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Waz - 13 Sep 2019 10:38 PM
AJF - 13 Sep 2019 10:22 PM

I get reading back over long threads is challenging. 

But just to clarify - we were both agreeing that the inadequacy in certain youth players is down to coaching. 

I can remember years ago when Craig Moore came to the Roar , he made a comment that the one very big difference between European leagues and the A-League was the spatial awareness of Aussie players .
It was mostly non existent.

He said that in Europe before a player receives a ball he has already had a quick look around and knows where he is in relation to others...so he knows where his opponents are and what his options are for passing.
He said Aussie players tend to get the ball, then look up and think of what they will do with it .

Our players are improving at this but it needs to be drilled into players from when they first start kicking a ball as a kid .
It is how the really good players always seem to have so much time when they get a ball ...
Think Broich, Ninkovic etc ...they know before they have received it exactly where their opponents are and where their teammates are .
These sort of players can receive a ball and pass it before an opponent can even get near them .
It's like playing against a ghost.
They are incredibly hard to play against as you feel you can't touch them
...and it all comes down to something so simple...they know where they are in relation to others at all times .

Having said this... it does need great technical skills as well ...the quicker you can control a ball the more time you have .
So ,yes, our players are becoming technically better (and that is fantastic) but it needs to be married to spatial awareness.
We are getting there but we need to keep honing our training techniques .


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Last Month by miron mercedes
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well said miron.

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miron mercedes - 14 Sep 2019 10:48 AM
Waz - 13 Sep 2019 10:38 PM

I can remember years ago when Craig Moore came to the Roar , he made a comment that the one very big difference between European leagues and the A-League was the spatial awareness of Aussie players .
It was mostly non existent.

He said that in Europe before a player receives a ball he has already had a quick look around and knows where he is in relation to others...so he knows where his opponents are and what his options are for passing.
He said Aussie players tend to get the ball the look up and think of what they will do with it .

Our players are improving at this but it needs to be drilled into players from when they first start kicking a ball as a kid .
It is how the really good players always seem to have so much time when they get a ball ...
Think Broich, Ninkovic etc ...they know before they have received it exactly where their opponents are and where their teammates are .
These sort of players can receive a ball and pass it before an opponent can even get near them .
It's like playing against a ghost.
They are incredibly hard to play against as you feel you can't touch them
...and it all comes down to something so simple...they know where they are in relation to others at all times .

Having said this... it does need great technical skills as well ...the quicker you can control a ball the more time you have .
So ,yes, our players are becoming technically better (and that is fantastic) but it needs to be married to spatial awareness.
We are getting there but we need to keep honing our training techniques .

+1
Great post!!









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Last Month by Sebr1968
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I'm really enjoying this topic so keep posting people. Having been involved in coaching since 2010, it is depressing to see how many problems there are in the game.
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miron mercedes - 14 Sep 2019 10:48 AM
Waz - 13 Sep 2019 10:38 PM

I can remember years ago when Craig Moore came to the Roar , he made a comment that the one very big difference between European leagues and the A-League was the spatial awareness of Aussie players .
It was mostly non existent.

He said that in Europe before a player receives a ball he has already had a quick look around and knows where he is in relation to others...so he knows where his opponents are and what his options are for passing.
He said Aussie players tend to get the ball the look up and think of what they will do with it .

Our players are improving at this but it needs to be drilled into players from when they first start kicking a ball as a kid .
It is how the really good players always seem to have so much time when they get a ball ...
Think Broich, Ninkovic etc ...they know before they have received it exactly where their opponents are and where their teammates are .
These sort of players can receive a ball and pass it before an opponent can even get near them .
It's like playing against a ghost.
They are incredibly hard to play against as you feel you can't touch them
...and it all comes down to something so simple...they know where they are in relation to others at all times .

Having said this... it does need great technical skills as well ...the quicker you can control a ball the more time you have .
So ,yes, our players are becoming technically better (and that is fantastic) but it needs to be married to spatial awareness.
We are getting there but we need to keep honing our training techniques .


Absolutely spot on. It's the one thing that we should be teaching young players....space, how to use it and how to recognise it. 
I saw a great quote once, to paraphrase..' football is all about space, you are either moving into it or moving out of it to let your teammates use it'
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Waz - 13 Sep 2019 7:44 AM
Barca4Life - 13 Sep 2019 2:05 AM

Thanks for posting that. 

The comment “Thinks that the younger players coming through are better technically especially under pressure but often lack in intelligence and and what’s around them off the ball” certainly rings true. 

Technical coaches are very common but coaches who have played the game extensively and can coach game awareness are far fewer. Perhaps 1 in 5 even. 

I just wished to bring this back into discussion for us all if thats ok.
Maybe I'm talking crap :)
More so you coachs that I notice here such as AJF, TFL, Waz and others.
AJF made the point the Coachs have allowed some of these players not being "aware" and making "error" repeatedly.
Now I'm just a ol football playing tragic who played Prem/Div 1 levesl (still playing) and been around some good coaching and 2 boys having gone through YL and now in PL3.
So I live and breath it but by no means do I claim being a coach.
My sideline observations are my opinions/observations but from what I see - getting a good Coach is like the lottery.
You win some you lose some, I've seen my boys improve/shine and next season under next Coach go to zero, and I've seen fellow players go through similar......
Now this should not be happening for starters (excl my sons here) to any player who can actually play, in all my years I sure didn't go from say a 8-9 out of 10 season in performance to sub 5 for eg.the following and I never saw that with fellow competitors.
One the Club itself is responsible imo - they should step in more questioning why X player is going backwards to assigned coach but that depends on the type of Club management I guess.
2 does the Coach see/understand what his "philosophy" is doing to X good players ? I don't see them change much regards to a players ability/strengths but formations contesting the opponent.
Next you see well drilled players keep their start up position instead of the natural ability type player, not always but you can see with your own eyes at games..
Like every sportsperson, some people are more coach-able than others.
Waz this is where you mention the more Techinal type coachs.
Our system/curriculum is part to question here and imo should always be "tinkered" and filtered through down to grass roots as well.
I see many well drilled coach-able kids and their 1st step in Snr grade, U18's/even 20's who by now should have a clue how to play right but you know what, Waz mentioned re U18's and I agree incl 20's - how does any Coach teach "reading the play" ? game awareness ? do they prior getting to that age. How did those kids get through ?
The players with natural ability who can read the play, close touch control, take one 2 on create but many Coachs prefer playing the well drilled same game type of player instead who at times has no game sense but is good at small sided games during training and his enthusiasm, during the games he isn't as polished and being shown.
He's good doing his same ol same ol Mr reliable but his alertness as well is whoah, hang on there.
Doesn't know to step in the hole when play is over the other side is another.
Oh shit my opposing winger is hanging right out on the sideline I need to hang close - but the play is over the bloody other side and its more likely to cut out a switch ball being more central for lets face it, half of them can't play switch ball well much anymore lets face it - oooops did I say that.
Aaaargh there is more but I've probably said enough to inspire some more posting more likely abuse to me lol.....





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Last Month by LFC.
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@LFC there are a lot of points in your post to discuss, but I can only talk from my perspective and first thing is that development is not linear. The kids develop at different rates physically, technically and even in game understanding so it is impossible to tell who will kick on to what level when.

The thing that bothers me the most is many coaches teach kids to win, not to develop. There are 2 reasons normally, 1 is their own ego, other is job security as many coaching gigs are paid. Case in point, I knew a coach of U9's who was extremely strict with them about positioning and that was the focus of training and games. When they played other U9's they would easily win because at that age kids tend to want to chase the ball so with a structure they were able to easily play around and score heaps of goals. Fast forward a few years and many of these kids simply didnt develop the technical skills other kids did and similarly decision making was lost because they were only taught to follow a winning system.

Again I get annoyed with the many coaches who have got their C or B license but have no understanding of what was taught in the NC course. First myth I will bust is that NC requires everyone to play 433. At the time of the NC, 433 was the preferred structure for the NT and all junior NT's, but individual coaches were free to play as they liked. Yes the material in the NC is based on 433 but that was done to provide a template for coaches to use if they wanted to develop their own style. Like I mentioned elsewhere, there are people with no football experience or "feel" with these qualifications teaching kids and so all they know is what they see on TV (often HAL because they wont get up in the middle of the night) and what is in the NC then we end up with rigid ideas of what football is.

To the point of game smarts, this isnt really that difficult to teach and it was a major focus of the NC where they call it PDE (perception, decision & execution) but it requires preperation and commitment from the coach in terms of setting up appropriate game scenarios and assisting the kids with learning. Many coaches work day jobs and dont have time to adequately prepare and so at training run drills which look Ok but dont actually afford learning opportunities. Similarly playing practice games against other teams are always fun but in my opinion a waste of a learning session. I have been guilty of taking these shortcuts as well so I am not pretending I am a super coach but for many coaches this is the norm. On game day when the coach is yelling advice to every player how are kids expected to learn.

The sad truth about why many kids get through is that many coaches still pick youth players on physical attributes (ie size, speed, etc) because it helps them win and not for technical reasons as there is no immediate benefit for development. Just check out the size of the U15 joeys and compare that to a local U15 team and you will note majority of the Joey's were big boys while local U15's will have a mix of sizes which is normal for that age. This is why many of the junior reps dont kick on and others come out of nowhere (just look at N'Golo Kante's story).

Final issue is the development pathway and biggest difference between the NSL and now is that back then young players were exposed to senior team football early and what many dont understand is this is not just about playing against "men" but actually playing with experienced players who would give you guidance of how to play senior football. This is why the HAL youth teams in NPL comps dont do very well (both Melb teams will be relegated to NPL 3 next year) as one 19O has no real experience to teach the other 19YO's.

I am actually reasonably positive as I am seeing lots of improvements across the park and most importantly, many of the NPL and Grassroots clubs are starting to see the light and are improving, being pushed along by P/R and the pressure to improve this creates.