should a league clubs provide prayer rooms for muslims??


should a league clubs provide prayer rooms for muslims??

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Mark457
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Mister Football wrote:
The AFL is a very welcoming and inclusive competition. We want all Australians of all backgrounds enjoying our game.


Congratulations you managed to fit 'Welcoming' and 'inclusive' with the term AFL. Must be a first.
Axelv
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notorganic wrote:
Axelv wrote:
If people enjoy a long read, one thing I found fascinating was this article.

It is about Islam integrating into Western culture and asks questions from an Australian perspective, wondering if the only difference between Australia and Europe is that we are 20 years behind. Europe has always been far more liberal and progressive than Australia has, so why are European nations cutting down on Islamic immigration?

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/how-i-lost-faith-in-multiculturalism/story-fn59niix-1226031793805


Wow.

A right winged commentator for The Australian has negative things to say about Islam & Multiculturalism.

I'm shocked. This is groundbreaking.


You should open your mind rather than just being dismissive.

The headline is provocative, surely you can read past that ;)

Edited by Axelv: 20/4/2012 03:10:06 PM
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Axelv wrote:
notorganic wrote:
Axelv wrote:
If people enjoy a long read, one thing I found fascinating was this article.

It is about Islam integrating into Western culture and asks questions from an Australian perspective, wondering if the only difference between Australia and Europe is that we are 20 years behind. Europe has always been far more liberal and progressive than Australia has, so why are European nations cutting down on Islamic immigration?

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/how-i-lost-faith-in-multiculturalism/story-fn59niix-1226031793805


Wow.

A right winged commentator for The Australian has negative things to say about Islam & Multiculturalism.

I'm shocked. This is groundbreaking.


You should open your mind rather than just being dismissive.

Edited by Axelv: 20/4/2012 03:08:25 PM


I have the right to be dismissive of a man that has suggested that George W Bush will be remembered as one of the great leaders in world history.
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zimbos_05 wrote:
Hahaha, some of the people saying things like, "Its idiotic" and "Oh my, so politically correct" and "What the hell, this is stupid". You all make me laugh.

Ive been for many game, cricket, football, rugby etc etc and often find that i have to read one of my 5 time prayers during the event, so as such, id get up and go with my mates, if i was with them, and ask one of the staff for a place to read.

Theyd tell us to find a quiet area in the stadium, which we would try and do to the best of our ability, and try and find a corner and put a jersey or jumper down and pray on that. Now its not ideal, as people walk past and they can see you and its quite noisy and such.


Having a prayer room would be fantastic, whilst we not fussy on the issue, its a solution worth considering. Many of the people who attend games are of other religions and i know quite a few people who have not come for games or have left a game at a certain time so they can go pray or have time to find a suitable place to pray. Its not the ideal situation, but we often have to try and make do.

We not asking for specific prayer room for our religion, but just a small room where anyone, who has prayers can go pray. They have it in all the airports nowadays and its not something that is difficult to do.

You may not like religion or be for it, but at the end of the day, their are people out there who are religious, but they also love their sport.

You may not like it, but a lot of the money nowadays comes from Etihad, Emirates, Qtel and etc etc and they are Muslim run organisations and as such, may look to cater to a religious audience.



Well said.

Don't forget that you will always be welcome at AFL games.

It was the Richmond footballer, Bachar Houli, who suggested the idea to the AFL.
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notorganic wrote:
Axelv wrote:
notorganic wrote:
Axelv wrote:
If people enjoy a long read, one thing I found fascinating was this article.

It is about Islam integrating into Western culture and asks questions from an Australian perspective, wondering if the only difference between Australia and Europe is that we are 20 years behind. Europe has always been far more liberal and progressive than Australia has, so why are European nations cutting down on Islamic immigration?

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/how-i-lost-faith-in-multiculturalism/story-fn59niix-1226031793805


Wow.

A right winged commentator for The Australian has negative things to say about Islam & Multiculturalism.

I'm shocked. This is groundbreaking.


You should open your mind rather than just being dismissive.

Edited by Axelv: 20/4/2012 03:08:25 PM


I have the right to be dismissive of a man that has suggested that George W Bush will be remembered as one of the great leaders in world history.


"Rarely has the question been asked; Is our children learning?" G.W. Bush

"I believe human beings and fish can co exist peacefully." G.W. Bush

Man was an exceptional leader...provided people with such great material. Every. Single. Day.
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Fool me once, shame on, err, shame on me?
Point is, you can't get fooled again!

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notorganic wrote:
Axelv wrote:
notorganic wrote:
Axelv wrote:
If people enjoy a long read, one thing I found fascinating was this article.

It is about Islam integrating into Western culture and asks questions from an Australian perspective, wondering if the only difference between Australia and Europe is that we are 20 years behind. Europe has always been far more liberal and progressive than Australia has, so why are European nations cutting down on Islamic immigration?

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/how-i-lost-faith-in-multiculturalism/story-fn59niix-1226031793805


Wow.

A right winged commentator for The Australian has negative things to say about Islam & Multiculturalism.

I'm shocked. This is groundbreaking.


You should open your mind rather than just being dismissive.

Edited by Axelv: 20/4/2012 03:08:25 PM


I have the right to be dismissive of a man that has suggested that George W Bush will be remembered as one of the great leaders in world history.


So you're not going to think about the future and ask any questions? Just going to keep your head buried in the sand?

Are you aware of the social problems currently being faced in Britain, Netherlands, France, Germany, Switzerland etc. Do you think these nations are bigoted? They are 50 years advanced ahead of Australia when it comes to human rights and liberalism. Why they facing these issues and Australia isn't? Is it because Australia is unique and special, or is it because Australia is 30 years behind and Islam still too small of a minority to worry about?
Axelv
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notorganic wrote:
Axelv wrote:
notorganic wrote:
Axelv wrote:
If people enjoy a long read, one thing I found fascinating was this article.

It is about Islam integrating into Western culture and asks questions from an Australian perspective, wondering if the only difference between Australia and Europe is that we are 20 years behind. Europe has always been far more liberal and progressive than Australia has, so why are European nations cutting down on Islamic immigration?

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/how-i-lost-faith-in-multiculturalism/story-fn59niix-1226031793805


Wow.

A right winged commentator for The Australian has negative things to say about Islam & Multiculturalism.

I'm shocked. This is groundbreaking.


You should open your mind rather than just being dismissive.

Edited by Axelv: 20/4/2012 03:08:25 PM


I have the right to be dismissive of a man that has suggested that George W Bush will be remembered as one of the great leaders in world history.


Lol fair enough to have no respect for someone who could say something that stupid, I wasn't aware ;)

I had no idea who this writer was, still in this piece he makes excellent points, I suggest you keep an open mind.
Mister Football
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Mark457 wrote:
Mister Football wrote:
The AFL is a very welcoming and inclusive competition. We want all Australians of all backgrounds enjoying our game.


Congratulations you managed to fit 'Welcoming' and 'inclusive' with the term AFL. Must be a first.


Well, it's an AFL initiative, and it's soccer fans on this forum who are sounding like they are ringing in to Alan Jones.

It was Richmond footballer, Bachar Houli, who suggested the idea to the AFL.
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Mark457 wrote:
Mister Football wrote:
The AFL is a very welcoming and inclusive competition. We want all Australians of all backgrounds enjoying our game.


Congratulations you managed to fit 'Welcoming' and 'inclusive' with the term AFL. Must be a first.


Also, I wonder if people are aware that a far greater percentage of women attend AFL games than attend any other football code.
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Mister Football wrote:
... It was the Richmond footballer, Bachar Houli, who suggested the idea to the AFL.


What does Bachar Houli do when prayer time occurs during an AFL match in which he is playing? Does he ask to be taken off the ground to do fulfill his duties?

I know nothing about Muslim prayer times - does Muslim prayer time ever occur between 2:20 p.m. & 5:20 p.m. on the last Saturday in September?

I'm really keen to understand how our brothers in Islam, who play professional sport, handle prayer times when they coincide with official matches.
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Mister Football wrote:
Mark457 wrote:
Mister Football wrote:
The AFL is a very welcoming and inclusive competition. We want all Australians of all backgrounds enjoying our game.


Congratulations you managed to fit 'Welcoming' and 'inclusive' with the term AFL. Must be a first.


Also, I wonder if people are aware that a far greater percentage of women attend AFL games than attend any other football code.
Yep, I was aware of this. All trying to be the next Rebecca Judd, nee Twigley.

More AFL footy players earning decent money in Australia than there are footballers, so have more of a chance.

Or it could be there are 9 games a week in the AFL and they have larger attendances etc etc
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Mister Football wrote:
..Also, I wonder if people are aware that a far greater percentage of women attend AFL games than attend any other football code.


A far greater percentage of women attend ballet than football matches ... so what's your point?

Women play football in greater numbers than any other code and women prefer their kids to play football above any other code.

I think football is pretty comfortable with the level of respect & love we get from women.
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Joe Davola wrote:
Mister Football wrote:
... It was the Richmond footballer, Bachar Houli, who suggested the idea to the AFL.


What does Bachar Houli do when prayer time occurs during an AFL match in which he is playing? Does he ask to be taken off the ground to do fulfill his duties?

I know nothing about Muslim prayer times - does Muslim prayer time ever occur between 2:20 p.m. & 5:20 p.m. on the last Saturday in September?

I'm really keen to understand how our brothers in Islam, who play professional sport, handle prayer times when they coincide with official matches.
You clearly have access to the internet, look it up.

Or are you just trolling?
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For those who don't really know anything about Islam, this is a documentary I saw a while back and I found it really interesting.

Dave Zwolenski goes to Sydney and lives with Sheik Halily in Lakemba for a few days, giving an inside perspective and trying to understand Islam in Australia.


http://www.smh.com.au/tv/show/embedded/embedded-with-sheik-hilaly-20110715-1hhgn.html
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hutchonholiday wrote:
You clearly have access to the internet, look it up.

Or are you just trolling?


I'm not that interested to waste my time researching religions that have ZERO interest for me.

If a Muslim wants to answer the question fine - if they don't, that's fine too.
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Joe Davola wrote:
Mister Football wrote:
... It was the Richmond footballer, Bachar Houli, who suggested the idea to the AFL.


What does Bachar Houli do when prayer time occurs during an AFL match in which he is playing? Does he ask to be taken off the ground to do fulfill his duties?

I know nothing about Muslim prayer times - does Muslim prayer time ever occur between 2:20 p.m. & 5:20 p.m. on the last Saturday in September?

I'm really keen to understand how our brothers in Islam, who play professional sport, handle prayer times when they coincide with official matches.


He is a devout muslim, and I know he prays in the change rooms before games, it wouldn't surprise me if he asked the coaching staff to take him off at certain times to pray - they could do it given the interchange rule.
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notorganic wrote:
Axelv wrote:
notorganic wrote:
Axelv wrote:
If people enjoy a long read, one thing I found fascinating was this article.

It is about Islam integrating into Western culture and asks questions from an Australian perspective, wondering if the only difference between Australia and Europe is that we are 20 years behind. Europe has always been far more liberal and progressive than Australia has, so why are European nations cutting down on Islamic immigration?

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/how-i-lost-faith-in-multiculturalism/story-fn59niix-1226031793805


Wow.

A right winged commentator for The Australian has negative things to say about Islam & Multiculturalism.

I'm shocked. This is groundbreaking.


You should open your mind rather than just being dismissive.

Edited by Axelv: 20/4/2012 03:08:25 PM


I have the right to be dismissive of a man that has suggested that George W Bush will be remembered as one of the great leaders in world history.


he also quotes two British PM, Germany's Chancellor, and France's President. All no good?
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Is it really necessary?

How many Muslims attend football matches?
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Joe Davola wrote:
Mister Football wrote:
..Also, I wonder if people are aware that a far greater percentage of women attend AFL games than attend any other football code.


A far greater percentage of women attend ballet than football matches ... so what's your point?


it's a question of inclusiveness, that's what this discussion is all about
and I'm dismayed that those who would ordinarily consider themselves as cosmopolitan and worldly are precisely the ones making the most noise about being against the prayer rooms, which at the end of the day are nothing more than quiet, empty rooms.
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Wow this thread really took off now, didn't it?
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notorganic wrote:
stefcep wrote:
If the goal is to remove barriers to attendance to increase crowds, what happens if other fans (say mums and dads with young kids) stay away because of they find it too confronting seeing possibly several hundred men making their way in and out of these prayer rooms?


I would say that these mums and dads with young kids need to have a look at their own attitudes and awareness and not rely on Andrew Bolt to make up their minds for them.


Haha oh dude, agreed x eleventy billion.

Davide82, skeptic and a few others are spot on. Having prayer rooms in Australian stadiums is not an issue. What [size=7]IS[/size] an issue is that some of you hold such uneducated and misinformed beliefs. Just.... wow.

Some of you need to give yourselves an uppercut.

Mister Football wrote:
..Also, I wonder if people are aware that a far greater percentage of women attend AFL games than attend any other football code.


The AFL has an enviable 'cradle to the grave' mentality which the whole family unit get off on, including the wimmenz. The big studs in little uniforms jumping around alot may also have something to do with it. Don't deny it!

Edited by eskimo: 20/4/2012 03:43:51 PM
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eskimo wrote:
notorganic wrote:
stefcep wrote:
If the goal is to remove barriers to attendance to increase crowds, what happens if other fans (say mums and dads with young kids) stay away because of they find it too confronting seeing possibly several hundred men making their way in and out of these prayer rooms?


I would say that these mums and dads with young kids need to have a look at their own attitudes and awareness and not rely on Andrew Bolt to make up their minds for them.


Haha oh dude, agreed x eleventy billion.

Davide82, skeptic and a few others are spot on. Having prayer rooms in Australian stadiums is not an issue. What [size=7]IS[/size] an issue is that some of you hold such uneducated and misinformed beliefs. Just.... wow.

Some of you need to give yourselves an uppercut.


Some views are perfectly warranted
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Mister Football wrote:
He is a devout muslim, and I know he prays in the change rooms before games, it wouldn't surprise me if he asked the coaching staff to take him off at certain times to pray - they could do it given the interchange rule.


I think you'll find a significant number of sportspeople pray before games.

In football, you'll find a signficant number of people making the "sign of the cross" when they enter & leave the pitch.

Drogba & Messi make the sign of the cross as a symbol of thanks for scoring a goal. Solorzano (MVFC) & Hernandez (MUFC) take it to the next level and get down on their knees to pray at the start of the game or start of 2nd half.

Tim Tebow is very vocal in his Christian faith after NFL matches.
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Mister Football wrote:
..
and I'm dismayed that those who would ordinarily consider themselves as cosmopolitan and worldly are precisely the ones making the most noise about being against the prayer rooms, which at the end of the day are nothing more than quiet, empty rooms.


I'm not against "prayer rooms" or "breast-feeding rooms" or "smoking rooms" ...

I just don't see the need for a Prayer Room at a sports stadium.
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City ----------- Fajr - Sunrise - Dhuhr - Asr - Maghrib - Isha
Adelaide --- 5:20 -- 6:43 ----- 12:15 - 3:21 - 5:46 --- 7:05
Brisbane --- 4:50 -- 6:07 ----- 11:47 - 3:01 - 5:26 --- 6:40
Canberra --- 5:07 -- 6:31 ----- 12:03 - 3:08 - 5:33 --- 6:53
Geelong ---- 5:27 -- 6:54 ----- 12:22 - 3:23 - 5:49 --- 7:12
Hobart -------- 5:15 -- 6:48 ----- 12:10 - 3:03 - 5:30 --- 6:59
Melbourne -- 5:25 -- 6:51 ----- 12:20 - 3:21 - 5:47 --- 7:09
Newcastle -- 4:57 -- 6:18 ----- 11:52 - 3:01 - 5:26 --- 6:43
Perth ---------- 5:20 -- 6:40 ----- 12:16 - 3:25 - 5:50 --- 7:07
Sydney ------- 4:59 -- 6:21 ----- 11:55 - 3:02 - 5:27 --- 6:45
Wollongong - 5:00 -- 6:23 ----- 11:56 - 3:02 - 5:27 --- 6:47

edit as the formating on this site bites.

Edited by general ashnak: 20/4/2012 03:48:47 PM

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General Ashnak wrote:
City ------- Fajr Sunrise Dhuhr Asr Maghrib Isha
Adelaide --- 5:20 6:43 -- 12:15 3:21 5:46 - 7:05
Brisbane --- 4:50 6:07 -- 11:47 3:01 5:26 - 6:40
Canberra --- 5:07 6:31 -- 12:03 3:08 5:33 - 6:53
Geelong ---- 5:27 6:54 -- 12:22 3:23 5:49 - 7:12
Hobart ----- 5:15 6:48 -- 12:10 3:03 5:30 - 6:59
Melbourne -- 5:25 6:51 -- 12:20 3:21 5:47 - 7:09
Newcastle -- 4:57 6:18 -- 11:52 3:01 5:26 - 6:43
Perth ------ 5:20 6:40 -- 12:16 3:25 5:50 - 7:07
Sydney ----- 4:59 6:21 -- 11:55 3:02 5:27 - 6:45
Wollongong - 5:00 6:23 -- 11:56 3:02 5:27 - 6:47


Dont need to post those here mate
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eskimo wrote:
notorganic wrote:
stefcep wrote:
If the goal is to remove barriers to attendance to increase crowds, what happens if other fans (say mums and dads with young kids) stay away because of they find it too confronting seeing possibly several hundred men making their way in and out of these prayer rooms?


I would say that these mums and dads with young kids need to have a look at their own attitudes and awareness and not rely on Andrew Bolt to make up their minds for them.


Haha oh dude, agreed x eleventy billion.

Davide82, skeptic and a few others are spot on. Having prayer rooms in Australian stadiums is not an issue. What [size=7]IS[/size] an issue is that some of you hold such uneducated and misinformed beliefs. Just.... wow.

Some of you need to give yourselves an uppercut.


This is what frustrates me, people aren't allowed to have differing views and this cannot be debated maturely, anyone who questions Islam gets labeled as bigoted, racist, xenophobic, uneducated etc whatever you want, it's all stigmatized name calling, name calling just like children resort to when they can't win an argument.
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General Ashnak wrote:
City ----------- Fajr - Sunrise - Dhuhr - Asr - Maghrib - Isha
Adelaide --- 5:20 -- 6:43 ----- 12:15 - 3:21 - 5:46 --- 7:05
Brisbane --- 4:50 -- 6:07 ----- 11:47 - 3:01 - 5:26 --- 6:40
Canberra --- 5:07 -- 6:31 ----- 12:03 - 3:08 - 5:33 --- 6:53
Geelong ---- 5:27 -- 6:54 ----- 12:22 - 3:23 - 5:49 --- 7:12
Hobart -------- 5:15 -- 6:48 ----- 12:10 - 3:03 - 5:30 --- 6:59
Melbourne -- 5:25 -- 6:51 ----- 12:20 - 3:21 - 5:47 --- 7:09
Newcastle -- 4:57 -- 6:18 ----- 11:52 - 3:01 - 5:26 --- 6:43
Perth ---------- 5:20 -- 6:40 ----- 12:16 - 3:25 - 5:50 --- 7:07
Sydney ------- 4:59 -- 6:21 ----- 11:55 - 3:02 - 5:27 --- 6:45
Wollongong - 5:00 -- 6:23 ----- 11:56 - 3:02 - 5:27 --- 6:47

edit as the formating on this site bites.

Edited by general ashnak: 20/4/2012 03:48:47 PM


Does the [code] function work here?
General Ashnak
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notorganic wrote:
General Ashnak wrote:
City ----------- Fajr - Sunrise - Dhuhr - Asr - Maghrib - Isha
Adelaide --- 5:20 -- 6:43 ----- 12:15 - 3:21 - 5:46 --- 7:05
Brisbane --- 4:50 -- 6:07 ----- 11:47 - 3:01 - 5:26 --- 6:40
Canberra --- 5:07 -- 6:31 ----- 12:03 - 3:08 - 5:33 --- 6:53
Geelong ---- 5:27 -- 6:54 ----- 12:22 - 3:23 - 5:49 --- 7:12
Hobart -------- 5:15 -- 6:48 ----- 12:10 - 3:03 - 5:30 --- 6:59
Melbourne -- 5:25 -- 6:51 ----- 12:20 - 3:21 - 5:47 --- 7:09
Newcastle -- 4:57 -- 6:18 ----- 11:52 - 3:01 - 5:26 --- 6:43
Perth ---------- 5:20 -- 6:40 ----- 12:16 - 3:25 - 5:50 --- 7:07
Sydney ------- 4:59 -- 6:21 ----- 11:55 - 3:02 - 5:27 --- 6:45
Wollongong - 5:00 -- 6:23 ----- 11:56 - 3:02 - 5:27 --- 6:47

edit as the formating on this site bites.

Edited by general ashnak: 20/4/2012 03:48:47 PM


Does the [code] function work here?

Not that I am aware, I am used to being able to use [list][/list] on other sites etc.

The thing about football - the important thing about football - is its not just about football.
- Sir Terry Pratchett in Unseen Academicals
For pro/rel in Australia across the entire pyramid, the removal of artificial impediments to the development of the game and its players.
On sabbatical Youth Coach and formerly part of The Cove FC

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