Agree defensively a few mistakes costs us some easy goals. Not doubt will be worked on. Scoring early against these sides is a must. Opens the game up to our advantage. Also agree that being better prepared for these conditions could be looked at. The boys will only gain valuable experience out of this which is a positive. Do or die in the afc qualifiers next month. Good luck to the boys and we'll done.

Thanks a bunch, Sponge Bob.

Thanks a bunch everybody else, who has found streams.

This Thai game has a decent picture too.=d>

Off forum, when I've spolken to some significant stakeholedrs in football, nobody has seen any of these Joey games and think I'm some sort of IT genius because I have.:roll:

Most middle-aged folk and geriatrics like me, struggle to find these streams.#-o

Agree that scoring first or not conceding late the when the game is in the balance is must for the confidence of these lads, once they score first they settle in the game and they start to play but when the game is tight and concede they must have buckled under pressure.

But a great learning experience for these lads, some very exciting talent im sure they can only get better from this.

PS. Your son scored a beauty against Thailand, beat past two defenders and a nice finish. =d>

Many of the skeptics involved in Australian Football around social media think our players are technically deficient compared to Thailand which is why we lost, but the thing is they comment without watching the games or stuggle to mention the large technical strides this group has made from previous generations. ](*,)

But what can you do they will always find a way to complain.

It's interesting watching these junior games.It's like everyone is hyped up on RedBull.Non stop movement and high risk ball movement.At times like a pin ball game.
The close ball control seems to have markedly improved.But considering all the mitigating factors,it's difficult to say with any confidence whether any particular player will be a future star.
Controlling tempo,accurate Passing,shot selection and risk management don't appear to have been high priorities from what I have seen.
Where all those fit into the process,I don't know.

I am at the 17 minute mark of the Thai game, and even though I'll be accused of being a FFA stooge, there is a lot I (I think current FFA coaches too will ) like about the Joey performance.

Whilst in the early phase of the game, Australia is dominating possession and territory.

Unequivocally, from comprehensive research by UEFA Technical Department, teams who enjoy the majority of possession in the attacking third, have an incredibly high probability of winning. Coaches have been shown comprehensive data on this at FFA Regional Conferences.

There will be upsets. Football is also a game of chance. Arthur has posted articles in Perfrmance section where 40% of any given game can be attributable to chance. The best team does not always win.

Unlike Test cricket, where England have thrashed us by being a far better team in the conditions.:cry:




The stats I have at this stage of the game are.

Shots at goal, Australia 2, Thailand 3.

Balls into the pen box, Australia 7, Thailand 3.

I can tell the Joeys have dominated possession. The main concern of this is being caught on accelerated attacks (KNVB terminology) for counter attacks.

The only world powerhouse who have enjoyed sustained success relying on a counter attacking game, according to FFA boffins, are Italy.
They also deem that their defensive football does not suit the Aussie psyche of taking the attack to the opponent. The underlying premise of the other 7 powerhouses is to dominate a game of football, not nick results against the run of play.



In terms of possession Joeys are building up through the midfield in triangles and diamonds. These are the optimum shapes.
Why?
Because players receive the ball with the correct body shape to play or move forwards by receiving the ball on a diagonal angle, simultaneously scanning the field. This can be done even under moderate marking pressure.

Conversely, a straight ball played straight down the pitch is only prudent if there is no opposition marker within cooee.

Otherwise, a player has to turn blind. This results in an increased probability of losing the ball. Or, a player can only bounce pass backwards. Few of these have been played by the Joeys.

With square balls played, it is good for a player to scant the field of play, but if they are intercepted, it can split an entire defence open. That is why the diagonal passes are so important.

Conversely, Thailand has played many more straight, higher, long balls over the top. This relies on one's team having faster forwards over the turf than opposition defenders. It has been seen far too often in junior and youth football in Australia in the past.

Teams relying on these tactics are losing control. Thailand is not building up in triangles and diamonds through the midfield. They may he individually good enough, but they have not had the requisite coaching and team structure to execute this. The Thai players don't know to support players on the ball, proactively. Nor did we before 2008ish.


Why is this important?

Because it has been deemed by highly qualified, experienced world renowned professional coach educators that the 7 world powerhouses at senior level have all used this method to attain success.

According to them, apart from Italy, the counterattackers extraordinaire, no other team has had sustained success at senior level by using any other method. There may have been exceptions, like Greece in Euro 2004.







Edited by Decentric: 9/8/2015 11:17:41 PM

What was the final score?

I do think that love of the game is definitely the driving force, but make no mistake, the level they have now entered is about results. Most coaches KPI's are going to be results inclusive surely!?

Still style of play is paramount.

I know the former Thai assistant senior coach who now coaches in the Indian Super League. In both countries he says results are paramount at all age levels.

I'd like to think we have moved beyond that.

A massive aspect with Australia's past style of play is an ability to produce special players.

That is a Kewell at his peak, or a Tom Rogic. They can change a game when the game plan isn't working.

A lot of these Joeys have deft touches in one twos, where the guy who provides the touch in the wall pass or lay off, is producing better weighted balls for the player playing the pass, then rushing forwards to receive the return pass.

There are instances of players receiving the ball with the outside of the foot and flicking the ball on more often.

Most of the attacking players have a range of 1v1 attacking moves, where if they aren't beating players, or wrong footing them, they are intimidating them.

The first touches are defter, and are more under control even than with some Socceroo seniors, like Matt Leckie.

The handling speed is quicker for this cohort of Joeys.

Even last year, a head FFA coach said at one coaching course I attended that Australia is the best tactical nation in Asia by some margin. That is the good bit.

He then said technically we are so far behind that if the other Asian nations get their act together soon, the will wipe the floor with us. Hopefully, this cohort of Joeys and successive ones will be senior players before the rest of Asia catch us up tactically.


I'm also sure that from what I've seen to date, if theJoeys were playing these games in Australia, now, where conditions suited then a bit more, they should have beaten Thailand decisively based on the patterns of play manifest so far at the 22 minute mark of this game.





Edited by Decentric: 10/8/2015 12:24:10 AM

Thanks, Jono.

The picture in these Youtubes is much better than most of the live streams.

10-2

So the Thais won the final 3-0.

Interesting comparison between 2nd and 3rd.

2nd Myanmar Played 6 Won 4 Lost 2 GF 10 GA 8 GD +2
3rd Australia Played 6 Won 5 Lost 1 GF 36 GA 9 GD +27

The magic of knock out football.

A lot to be excited about overall though

Damn why cant we win these Asean tournaments

I don't know but it makes me sad. Would have been great to test ourselves against the AFF at U19 level but I guess we are far to good for that and we would win way too easily.

My frustration over this result can't really be written down.
Unfortunately I missed the Thailand game, but when I have the time to sit down with a notepad ect I'll have a look at it.

I'm ecstatic at the quality of midfielders and strikers in this group, but I must admit the defenders worry me a bit. The GK with the dark hair who was quick off his line was also a highlight. If some of these lads keep their heads down, they'll be worth a LOT of money before they're 20.

We can only pray that Paul Okon never so much as shakes hands with these lads.

Its pretty hard for 14 to 15 year olds to stay on for 5 games in 9 days. That brought an element of luck into it and it was always a possibility that we could have an unlucky day

these are sides we would normally win 1 or 2 nil with the occasional drubbing so it is still a step up

also keep in mind that these boys have not even played 11 v 11 until 13 iirc. The only thing they have learnt in technique
the gap in quality will accelerate over the next 12 months as these boys learn defensive structure and tactics while growing physicially

Good play from this team, only small problems can and will get better, well done Australia.

Some of our defenders have work to do on their 1v1 defensive skills, but these can be improved as time progresses.

Australia conceded goals, from making mistakes. These can be improved as a player ages, individudaally and in a team context.

The good thing is that most of Australia's chances created, were from Proactive play. =d>

The majority of Thai chances created were based on Reactive play.[-x

At senior level, those Joey mistakes will rarely be made. Coaches can improve structure, communication and team play off the ball at any age.

Technique can only be satisfactorily acquired at an earlier age.

I only analysed up to the 71 minute mark when the Thai player was sent off. I thought he should've stayed on. Analysis is meaningless with numerical superiority.

Shots on goal. Joeys had 11. Thailand had 18 within the 71 minutes.

Balls i to the pen box. Joeys 23, Thailand 11.

This equates to territorial possession advantage for Joeys and possession superiority.

Thais were good in counter attacking and were more clinical capitalising on Oz mistakes.=d>

Joeys' weakness was some 1v1 defensive actions with a few defenders and defensive and midfield line team structure when the other team has the ball, and in the Defensive Transitions.





Edited by Decentric: 10/8/2015 04:04:12 PM

Decentric, when transitioning from attack to defence (ie. when we turn it over, I forget the proper phase name) what are the key roles of the holding mid according to the Curriculum? One thing I noted was that when we turned it over in the games I saw, our midfield anchors were far too advanced or that we were far too flat in the middle, which left space in between the lines (a criminal mistake against counter attacking Asian sides).

I'd be interested to know whether this was poor positioning or some kind of tactical gap in what these kids are learning. When I coach and play, I always teach that when we turn it over, the DM/DMs should be between the opposition's midfielder and our defense.

One thing that has been a pleasure to watch is our finishing catches defenders by surprise more
our seniors telegraph when they are about to shoot where they are going to shoot and still find a way to miss :D

Does anyone have an idea of the ages of the teams we're playing? I know alot of our guys are 14 (some just turned 14), are the other teams the same? Some have looked older but then others have looked like they had 11 year olds in their team.

And why exactly are we using guys a year younger than we need to?

Defensive Transition.

When a team attacks with numbers it is inevitable that there will be space conceded through lighter numbers at the back, somewhere.

There is no prescribed role for the holding midfielder in the FFA NC. A single screener, or holder, is part of the attacking variation of the midfield triangle - one screener and two number 10s or attacking mids.

That in itself, is a deviation from the prescribed FFA 1-4-3-3 formation which has the defensive midfield triangle for players 16 years and under.

This means that two DMs should be there. The twin DM midfield triangle is the standard way to negate counter attacks.

Any team who team plays with one DM, or screener, is liable to a counterattack, particularly as the full backs push high simultaneously.

Pim used to push one full back up at a time, with the other FB tucking in on the other side to make a back three.





Joeys' midfield triangle.

-----------------------DM
----------AM---------------------AM






FFA prescribed midfield formation for teams 16 years and under.

-----------DM---------------------DM
----------------------AM

Edited by Decentric: 10/8/2015 03:11:21 PM

Another weakness in the Thai game was the attacking interplay of the forwards. Given we had 23 balls put into the penalty box to the Thais' 11, it was an issue.

Our build ups were usually slower and more patient, hence Thailand had more players in the defensive line for most of the time.

I know one of the six state SAP head coaches.

A few years ago he took his state SAP participants on a tournament in South Korea. He didn't quite realise what and humidity they would confront in Korean mid summer.

Game 1

They played Thai team. FFA SAP coach quickly summed up his team was technically superior. They lost the game in the end struggling with the conditions, after dominating the first part of the game.

Game 2

Played a more significant Asian team, Japanese or Korean, I think. Again evaluated his SAP team as technically equal to the opposition, having clossed the gap. Again he was satisfied

Game 3

Played a Sporting Lisbon team of same sage. There was a significant difference in technical class between his state SAP team and Sporting Lisbon underage team, which caused him some worry.

The FFA SAP coach wasn't concerned one bit about results in the tournament.

Since that tournament we've both met a middle aged bloke who played for Sporting Lisbon youth. On of the best technicians ever seen in this state! Makes a football talk. I met him through co-ordinating migrant programs as he was the head honcho and introduced him to the state head SAP coach.

Modest bloke. His only wish is not to be told the English can play decent football. We didn't need him in the season , but he was a back up player for a social team in a country club I had a coaching role with. At the time we had no idea he had been with Sporting Lisbon youth.:lol:


Current FFA mantra is if one hasn't the requisite technique, or skills, defined when technique can be applied in game context, one can achieve nothing in football.

Same with the Dutch KNVB.

Interesting observations decentric, i'm curious to know the former sporting lisbon youth player thought's of our players, and why they are technically better than our youth?

Edited by Barca4life: 10/8/2015 07:29:26 PM

Caught the last 10 min of normal time and all of extra time. We were doing well down the left and getting a lit of balls into the box, I think to Roberts, but there was no support at all, compared to 4 red shirts closing down all the time. Boys were simply buggered.

And before anyone says that the Thais had to play in the same conditions, they have lived their whole lives in those weather conditions.

Edited by Aljay: 10/8/2015 07:51:51 PM

One thing I noticed in this tournament was the way that these boys will cut in front of a defender alongside them or chasing them when dribbling at speed., meaning the defender have to tackle them from behind to get the ball. Great move that many players use, but I've never seen it so obviously and frequently done, particularly in the box, so it makes me wonder if they have been coached in this.

Haven't met him through football performance, but more in participation for migrants in football.

Not having pay TV he doesn't see much local football. Mainly watches UEFA CL.