Agree with this.

BVM was genuinely perplexed.

I think Derider must have been watching a different team from the rest of us.

Or he was smoking whoopee weed!

Some people see what they want that suits their narrative ...

Yes Australia could have played better, and I think a few selections were "off" ... but overall we played the right style of game against all three opponents. We just couldn't make it count on the scoreboard, not due to a lack of chances but finishing (pretty much most of our qualification issue too). BVM introduced a variation to our game style and tweaked Ange's base to better suit international football. Yes against France we sat deep and relied on a counter attack (they did go on to win the World Cup), but against Denmark and Peru we didn't take a backward step (both sides in the top 20 of the world). BVM managed to keep that "attack" and "give it a go" mentality we wanted our team to play, but in a far more balanced approach that Ange was able to apply.

Whoopee weed? What are you, 90 years old?

It's because our players are not adjusted to playing at such a high intensity/level for successive moments (opportunities).

They aren't used to fashioning chances at such a high level ? Yeah that.

A-League doesn't cut it and not a lot of our strikers are doing this. 

You aren't too far off

I think the majority who know anything about  football perforrnance would agree with your appraisal, Sokorny.

Ange = Ultraattacking coach with more movements in the system in attacking and possession play and high energy pressing but less discipline in defending either be 1v1 or collective defending.

Bert = Defensive coach at best, focused more sitting off teams whilst working a restricted attacking framework with less movements with basic patterns of play and with more relience of individuals to pull something from nothing

Arnie = Shown to be more balanced out of the former two, likes certain movements in attack with freedom for the attacking players but also respects defensive structure and shape.

We have gone full circle now! Ha!

France was spot on but i would argue we were too conservative against the last 2. Luongo should have played in place of jedi. Cahill more minutes also

Would love us to play the 3-3-3-1 again that gus used. He was balanced I would say also. Verbeek super defensive 

Kyrgyzstan 2 Syria 1 in a friendly.

Generally I was amazed at our organisation. There were some moments where I wish Mooy or Rogic had attempted to go forward on the ball only to pass back. We created some close chances against Peru and their goals were from nothing. It was a frustrating day. Denmark was a good game but we still didn't bite enough up front. Arzani almost won it. 

They have all been/will be, good coaches in different ways.

Our worst coaches since Guus have been Arnie, in his original tenure ( Arnie claims he was awful too), and Holger stagnated us.

It was simply finishing, and, sometimes poor co-ordination  and cohesion in interplay in the attacking third.

Players sometimes made the same runs and collided, or didn't read each other's runs, even being out-thought and out-positioned by opposition defenders, etc.

Bert wasn't that defensive.

He worked on parts of Ange's style - taking it to another level.

He  worked on players positioning off the ball - to open passing lanes more quickly and more proactively.

He also worked on footwork to create more effective body shape in confined spaces.

We had more shots at goal and more possession than either Peru or Denmark. This implies we weren't that defensive against them. 

^ I also think the Bert being defensive thing is way over exaggerated.

Yes he organised our defence, but not really at the expense of attack.
We still kept possession and played nice attacking football when we had the ball against some top teams. I think we had more possession against Denmark and Peru if I remember correctly?

Actually I think if you compare 2014 to 2018, the possession stats are pretty similar or maybe even better in 2018 (correct me if I’m wrong).
So much of this is just narrative spun by Craig Foster.

I think people saying BVM was defensive may be because Ange was so unorganized defensively they hadnt seen it for a while..

A Japan reserve side beat Costa Rica 3:0. Costa Rica with many of their WC players while Japan had none. Great now Doan and Minamino will give us hell the next decade. 

This.

Agreed. 

BVM being defensive was peddled by Foster and I completely disagree with that assessment. BVM got us organised and I hope Arnie maintains it.

Arnie, if anything, tends to have well organised teams. I think if he maintains a high possession style will be interesting ... believe Sydney FC, although containing some of the best players in the A-League over the last couple of seasons, rarely dominated the possession stat in games (relied heavily on the quick counters provided by a quick and agile front three and overlapping full backs). Of course depends on his team that he selects for the Socceroos (never played with a creative mid for Sydney, so how he'll deploy the midfield I think will be the most interesting ... and his change in formation from BP to BPO).

It's very strange that BvM is still the subject of so much fanboyish gushing. It's actually fucking insane and I honestly can't believe it. It's become quite annoying. 

He objectively did nothing. We had hoped to get out of the group at the WC but failed dismally. Didn't win, didn't score from open play, conceded nearly 2 goals per game, and finished comfortably last in the group. But yes, praise god Van Marwijk regardless. He really changed football in this country with his ultra-conservative counter attacking play. Plus he got Holland to the final 10 years ago! BvM for PM! 

Bvm achieved better results than Ange.
2018 - 1 point, -3 goal difference
2014 - 0 points, -6 goal difference

BvM had a far, far better squad. We were legitimately hopeless in 2014, but the pluckiness and exciting game style gave me lots of hope for the future. Those were losses I would call honourable. I didn't get the same sense this time. This time it just felt like a missed opportunity. 

BVM inherited ange's work

ange inherited holger's work

I love Ange and all, but what makes you think Ange would've made them more exciting? He would've had the same lack of strikers options that he had all through qualifying where he could barely get the team to score.
We just would've conceded more.

It was different in 2014 when Timmy was scoring for fun.
Aside from Cahill's goals, the only other goal we scored in 2014 was..... a Jedinak penalty.

Why do you think we would have conceded more under Ange? We never actually conceded that many under him after the world cup.  We tended to leak one or two goals per game, which continued exactly the same under BvM. So I absolutely dispute the claim that BvM made us defensively sound. I don't think we would have done any worse under Ange, but maybe we would have scored a couple with a more adventurous system and formation (as well as Ange's superior knowledge of the squad). But whatever, fuck Ange, he left. That wasn't BvM's fault at least. 

Yeah conceding multiple goals against low ranked AFC teams is totally comparable to France. BVM avoided us getting the belting many dreaded, time to move on.

Can't you say the same about Ange fanboys?

Our last coach for a competitive match was BvM. He is still relevant. I mean, people still talk about Hiddink...

That's an accurate reflection in the difference between Ange and BVM, As much as I liked some of the things Ange did with our team, our defense was an absolute shambles at times under Ange.  And it is time to move on.