I definitely agree we have to make it work, but pretty hard to get consensus on how to make it work

Thats why I liked the article from the SBS journalist, he simply said lets set up some kind of preferred model ... agree and work towards making it work...

The lack of a common purpose and everyone blaming everyone else... and if you make a mistake blame FFA .. its not helping...

I like the 3 tier model suggested and can live with his time line... 

Anything would be better than the HAL.

If the FFA were genuine about this sport, they would open up the league and introduce some of the old soccer. perhaps a second division with promotion and relegation.

I want to eat at a fine restaurant and not at McDonalds.

Anything would be better than the A-League... Really 

If the FFA were genuine about this sport, they would open up the league and introduce some of the old soccer. perhaps a second division with promotion and relegation.... Read the SBS article that is linked its a very decent model, but gets there without destroying the A-League.

I want to eat at a fine restaurant and not at McDonalds..... thats cost money and if the A-League falls over you honestly believe a new start up league can earn the revenue needed ..

Whether you wanta believe it or not, the A-League has to work if we want Football to work in Australia...  no one is saying, pretending, even suggesting we don't need a second division and P & R in time... its how we get there, what journey do we take... and for it to work we need to maintain a national domestic professional competition with sufficient revenue streams to attack teams, coaches, players that can take Football forward... 

Read the linked SBS article and think about what the journalist has said and his 3 tier system by 2029... then tell me whats wrong with it other than you want it in 2020... 

 

Not sure what your point is?
My Football Live is #37 on Google Play.  A long list of apps for various sports are in front of it.

It was ok, but really it's just the sort of musings we've all been reading, writing, sharing for the best part of 10 years across many sites.

As we sit here, there are not enough important stakeholders on the same page to bring it together.

Which tells anyone that not many people are watching it on Kayo.

I'm ok with not destroying the A League. I believe most of the teams already there have a lot to offer but they should have more autonomy as well and transition to owning their own IP rather than be franchise. I would like them to transition to big grassroots clubs.

I would like to see old soccer added to the mix - clubs such as SMFC. They will add their own dimension. We need to move away from the metric system. It's ok for MVFC and WSW to attract 20K averages, whilst SMFC only musters 8 to 9K. People have a choice and can you imagine the derbies?

But that isn't enough either. I would like to see the pathway opened up with promotion and relegation. We need to stand up for the game more. We shouldn't be playing on pitches such as we saw in Sydney, and we should move to smaller stadia and not play in expensive arenas like Suncorp.

So no, I don't want to see the HAL destroyed, but because its so closed up with debilitating franchise and ground fees and dwindling crowds, it is destroying itself. As a result, rather than the same old same old where nothing is progressing, I would be ok with the HAL imploding and collapsing, so the new Pheonix can rise from the ashes.

I do not believe the HAL needs to work for the sport. I actually believe the HAL is destructive to the sport in its current form and things need to change.

i can't see a spot in the HAL for old soccer at this point. SM might be competitive with their deeper pockets, but teams like Wollongong will be fighting CCM for the spoon every year. they need to show their value in the second tier first and prove their worth. there has been much debate as to the crowd numbers of SM in their final NSL years, but that was 15-20 years ago. I wanna see them prove they can muster 8-9k to games in the lower tier first before joining the big boys. they also need to prove the are a watchtable team on TV as well. 

Can't agree... while he may have said or repeated what many have said before ... he has said let's simply agree where we want to go and give it time to work...

What he suggests is so simple, lets say this is what we want and then apply a time to get there ... there is no who gets in, who does not get in, no must be Football Specif Stadium, No stadium size, no base capital, not where the teams have to be. etc...don't play over summer.... Its these issues were things get stuck and arguments occur ... 

It's simple Div 1, 16 mens and womens teams, Div 2 16 mens & Womens teams, Div 3 current state teams, play Feb to Nov or say 40 weeks, P & R between all Div's.... association Football Mar to Sep.... don't play in summer... allow between 11 & 15 years to complete... 

If we can get all stakeholders to agree to this or similar, then we can work away at it, and achieve a bit each year... so long as we understand the grand plan and where we are going... 

Why? Some teams are already unwatchable in the A-League and don't muster 8-9k in attendance. 

Who said anything about Wollongong and CCM? If these teams are not competitive, they can drop. Same with SMFC. If they do not perform, they will drop.

But if you say SMFC will be competitive, then they should be allowed to play? I think it is criminal excluding them, or any other club that will also be competitive and be able to survive at the top flight. I believe there are a few old soccer that would be competitive, not just SMFC.

SMFC have a long time ago proven their worth. To say they still need to prove themselves is pretty arrogant in my opinion. But if that is the only avenue, I am 100% that if there was a Second Division with an avenue for promotion, then SMFC will be in the HAL in no time. You can't keep a club like that down. They will always succeed.

Mustering 8 to 9K is easy. And I don't believe this metric is important either. I believe clubs that can only get 4 to 5k should be allowed in provided they can be competitive and play on small suburban grounds. There is no reason why the Marconi's and Bentleighs cant be in the HAL. This is how you grow the game in fact, and get new fishing grounds. These suburban teams will polarize their local communities whenever they come up against the MVFC's of the world. They will provide the new David Vs Goliath battles, and they will also give us the new Cindarella Stories. isn't this what Soccer is about? In Spain, the Real Madrid's and Barcelonas play lower ranked teams.

SMFC were getting descent crowds in the NSL at a time when the league was dieing and had only 10% of the exposure the HAL has. 8K for SMFC should be a doddle. I actually believe they will be around 10K, but even if they are not and are closer to 8K, then it doesn't matter. They got a good ground, and facilities and a great social club. They add and contribute to the sport. People will actually enjoy hanging around this club even if they don't support them because they have a great model that needs to be emulated.

I would say its arrogant to suggest they should be admited unconditionally based on what they did last century. and i completely disagree about teams playing on small suburban grounds. playing HAL in Bentleigh will make the league look like an amateur sunday league. its fine for the second division, but the top tier needs to think a little bit bigger than that. I'll be in the minority here, but I'm not even convinced lakeside stadium should be considered HAL compliant with its lowly 7,000 seats. 

If we had grounds with just 7k seats this past weekend the games perhaps wouldnt have looked so dire on tv...empty seats are becoming a real issue. The reality is the venues are too big. The leagues quest for becoming afl/nrl lite has spectularly backfired and been rejected. Now just wait for the 30,000+ empty seats at kardinia park next yr for the icing on the cake.

In any case Souths midweek cup rating against sydney fc looks more and more attractive as we go on.

Missed STV top 20 cut off last night so less than 46k...

You would suspect last nights match wouldnt have even reached a top 50. 

46k is a high cut off for us these days, we wouldn't have made it too many times this season

Thats funny, because the if CCM played there it would still be half empty with everyone seated

Mariners average home attendance over the last 3 seasons is 6,600.  Souths average home attendance over the last 3 seasons of the NSL was 5,900.  The capacity would suit both small clubs. ;)

i agree. but if SM have ambitions on playing in the champions league one day (where sections with no seats such as hills or concrete are banned from use), then 7,000 seats doesn't cut it. and a 12,000 capacity doesn't cut it if you wanna allow for future growtth (like all clubs should).

My personal view is that an FFA complaint stadium should begin with a 15,000 capacity with at least 10,000 seats. On the other side of the coin, no side should be playing out of a stadium bigger than 35,000.

I think it's silly to mandate those restrictions for the domestic league from day 1 on the 'off chance' that they make the ACL. Most of these clubs live in or near areas where they can temporarily move to an AFC approved stadium for continental fixtures if required, until such a time that their own grounds are upgraded and approved.

Using your South Melbourne example, there is no reason why they can't play in front of 7k for the domestic fixtures at Lakeside, and then move ACL games to AAMI Park. It just sounds like trying to fit a square peg into a round hole - we've got to learn to crawl before we can walk! If that means we're playing in front of capacity crowds of 7k then so be it. The grounds won't stay that small forever if they continually sell it out, which should be the number 1 priority. A packed ground makes for a good TV product.

The minimum requirements for domestic stadiums should be pretty minimum:

>Minimum required lighting for broadcasting night games
>Adequate changing facilities for the teams and officials
>Compliant with Australian OHS standards (your stadium must be in good condition etc)

As time goes on, and hopefully the A-League goes from strength to strength, then maybe we can think about adding more ambitious requirements. Until then, we just need to get the bare minimum done - that includes just getting a smooth, even surface to play on!

This goes back to what i said about playing games in stadiums such as Bentleigh. its too amateur for what is supposed to pre-eminent football league in the country. yes we need to strip back our choice of stadiums so they are smaller and boutique, but the minimum standard requirement should be a little more detailed than this. 

Totally agree.  Nothing wrng with boutique stadiums, but they still need to resemble a stadium and not a park with seating for a couple of thousand.

They shouldn't have been omitted last century.

The arrogance is when these clubs were told there is no place for you in the HAL.

I disagree it will make the league look amateur. I actually like their ground way better than seeing an empty Suncorp and it doesn't take much to upgrade to a 5 to 6k ground. This is how the game is developed at the grassroots and this is how the bar is raised.

To think bigger, you need to understand that there will be teams going in and out of the HAL, even with their little suburban ground. I actually think his adds to the plethora. It will polarize support on its own right as Aussies swarm to an underdog.

This is the only country that mandates such silly criteria. In the end, you can only shoot ourselves in the foot.

A suburban ground of 5 to 10k is fine. Right now, the entire HAL only averages 10500 per game.

“They also point to changing consumption of sport - including Kayo Sports and the soccer-specific MyFootballLive app - which would add tens of thousands of viewers to each match”

Fark, don’t go adding “tens of thousands” to the viewing figures .... we might actually have to have a proper debate about viewing figures and how the f’ck football will fund itself in a diverse digital world.

https://au.sports.yahoo.com/le...

BRIvWEL 12K

I'm sure millions maybe even billions were watching on Kayo. Trillions? Who knows.

@The Select Few

It’s pretty clear “tens of thousand” have switched to alternative platforms. It doesn’t suit your argument and you’re incapable or unwilling to have any debate to the contrary.

You have zero proof. Are you telling me that everyone was tuning in via Kayo to watch that crap.

Your dillusional. No one showed up in the stadium.