Tony whilst honoured you should put your mate "Frank the Famous Hot Dog Vendor" there...you have to remember your source (or in this case sauce?)

I remember a couple of seasons back the name aiden seizer was mentioned and remember he once was a Bulldog. Tony, we released him for a reason. You can't re-build a car with worn out used parts and a football team is exactly the same.

In our patches of good form we can match it with most sides.... problem is the other 65 mins...

Canberra got some confidence out of our game, we played them at the right time when they were beatable.

However I think think there is a chance we could get our act together and beat most teams,unless the top 3-4 teams have an off day we are very little chance against them. Dragons are not one of those top sides.

If we are looking at a playmaker for 2021, it means Foran is a gone and we dont think Cogger or Wakeham can partner Lewis or the new coach has other ideas.

That's ok by me. 

But I still want the focus to be on a 9 that plays what's in front of him. Someone smart.

I really think we need to sign a veteran for 1 or 2 seasons just to get the team playing right and then allow the longer term hooker at 14 to take over and continue that style of play.

Signing untried young kids at hooker is flawed these days. Even Cook had first grade experience and certainly showed me enough to be livid when Des showed him the door. 

The problem with every wooden spoon team is that at seasons end, they are 1 or 2 wins away from avoiding it.

They look back and think of some "winnable" games they should have won - but didnt. 

We really stuffed up badly. So did the coach.

We now have to not only beat a low ranked team like the Dragons, but need to knock off a top team just to break even.

That loss will cost us dearly I'm afraid

Seizer would of being a better much  siging than
joe simpson @ lest seizer can drive the ship around 
l lewis dosnt seem happy playing behind cogger 
zef i dont look back 5 years i look now we need 
something as this ship is sinking fast
& if & when st george beat us monday we have to
listen to dean pays press conference excuse are excuse 

We may or may not need to purchase a halfback at some stage, but we have Coggs, Lewis and Wakeham....

All 3 deserve a chance for another season or two...

There are good players we can buy who can play fullback and in the halves.... buying them makes more sense as Meaney is our only fullback option....

But we have a kid called Leumelu in reserve grade who I think may have potential....

Let's give our young kids a chance, that is why a guy like Seizer left in the first place, he thought he deserved at shot an NRL. He left because he thought he wasn't getting an opportunity. But we want to give the young guys a chance, just in case they are good, we don't want to let them go then have them turn into rep players at another club...

If we were looking to sign a half I would sign Cooper Johns from the Falcons who has an excellent combination with Stimson.. But we have 3 young guys who deserve a chance.

Stimpson isn't a half, but is good at what he does....

I was disappointed with Siezer left and from time to time he makes me regret it, that regret is usually 3-4 games a season, for the balance of the season, I'm glad we let him go.

Not saying Siezer can't improve become more consistent and fully realise the potential he has always had, but gee it is taking a long time.

If there's one thing Seizar is famous for, it's when your ship is in troubled waters you'd rather the captain of the Costa Concordia at the helm before Seizar.

The bloke is infamous for not being able to ice games. 2 points behind, 2 points in front - that's when you hook Seizar. It's a halfbacks job to ice games, Seizar can not do it. Hasn't been able to.... ever.

He's mediocrity defined. Sorta great sometimes, mostly average all the time, f***in' liability when he's needed.

Hounddog , lewis , cogger arnt up to it period
need still a reasonable. No 7 a no 9 a no 3
then we possibly we can improve cogger is raw & is
nsw cup player @ best ive seem enough of him & 
isnt a nrl player in my view st george will missing
hunt if he is rested , norman , lafai, graham,frizel if his rested & i still think it will be a hard game for the dogs
wr got okanbar out & napa but napa is a soft prop
& should nt of come to us 

Honestly this is just "one of those years" so far, and looks like remaining "one of those years" unless the team can turn it around play with more intent and consistency.

While the coach has made mistakes, I'm more critical of the players, and even more critical of the senior players.
In patches of 10-15 mins most games we look better than the opposition, we also show commendable grit and fitness at times. 

Even though the coach might not get getting selections 100% right, the 17 selected are  good enough to win the game, most games.

Most games they start slowly, made dumb mistakes in the first 20 min, then consistently waste a lot of good attacking opportunities for most of the game.  I know the players are trying, but they are their own worst enemies. I would ask why senior leaders of the team can't get the team fired up or relaxed at the right time and why we can't take better options...

What is the fix?, Mostly we need new players .... we need leaders and winners.

We need a good 9 especially with in experienced halves.

Lewis I think is more of a 5/8, centre, or possibly even a hooker.

Cogger and Wakeham are natural halfbacks .. that is their right position and the one they have the most potential in, Cogger is improving and I like the fact that the is a competitor, he still has a lot of work to do on his game, but while he keeps improving is worth another year or 2.

IMO Wakeham is more naturally talented than Cogger but like Cogger seems to play with plenty of courage, both are great passers but may need to work on other aspects...

Both guys are 1-3 years off getting close to their peak, let's find out what that peak is...

Seizer should have peaked by now but is still inconsistent, let's ensure we have all other positions adequately covered before rushing to sign another half. When Foran's contract expires, we will have more money to available, maybe better players will be available, 

Napa was the best we could do in terms of a replacement for Klem.

So far I don't see him as a long term quality starting prop for us, he is one of the guys that should be providing more leadership.

But let's see how he goes for the rest of the season. If he can get some match fitness and some hunger he is good enough to make a difference.

Whomever we need, management were not lying when they said we can't have a serious dip at the player market until '21. This restriction is not only because of SC space, it's roster space too and anyone who followed the link I posted days ago can see that.

Nu Brown, Fatalo, Lichaa, Martin, Olive, Tualau. These are the only players we can punt at the end of the season at no cost to us. Sure, we may be able to punt a few others.... and pay them to play at another club AGAIN....

.... so, NOT.

Those players free up 7 spots in the roster (6 now with Stimpson signing) and only a handful of SC space - they're not our big money players.

So for 2020 just replace like for like value for money - because there's just not much money. Don't waste what little money we got on mediocrity for key positions that we can have a very f***in' serious stab at filling in '21 with high quality.

So yeah, we give Meaney, Lewis, Cogger and to a lesser extent JMK or whatever lower grade #9 talent we got every chance in '20 to prove they're worthy of keeping that spot in '21 mainly because that's all we can do. And if they're not, we go for the best available talent on offer for those positions and more for '21 because it's what we can do.

Again - management were NOT lying. These are the cards we got to play with. You can fool yourself we're sitting on pocket aces all you like but they're really a pair of two's.

I agree, perhaps we can sign one quality player for a key position, for 2020, but everyone else needs to be "value for money"... 

 "value for money".. is ;......
1. Experienced NRL payers out of form, or out of favour with their current coach who we think can turn it around. 
2. Good player stuck in reserve grade at strong clubs because a better player is holding down the NRL position (these can be experienced or inexperienced) 
3. Good solid NRL player who club would like to keep, but needs to let go for SC reasons.
4. Young talented kids impatient for an opportunity in the NRL.

I think what some are objecting to is that "value for money" isn't "proven" if it was it would not be "value for money"....

That slippery slope that should be avoided IMO is paying good money for average NRL players who have peaked but are seen by some misguided fans as "proven". If they are not featuring regularly in an NRL 17 over several  seasons and doing a good job for 60-80 mins most weeks, they are not "proven". What it comes down to is, "proven" players are rarely available, and never available at a good price.

Why I think we may have sightly more money than Zef thinks we do, is because we are going to be paying less for our ex-players to play at other clubs. That is hard won, some of the  "value for money"  may be other clubs playing their players to play for us.
We can't move player on and pay them to play for others, but we can do player swaps as long as that doesn't costs us valuable SC money.

Like sensible gamblers we need to know our limit, and we need to know which players are worth extra and how much that extra is... because mostly we don't have it to gamble... but if we do .. roll the dice.... within our limit.

Your philosophy of hitting the market hard for 2021 is flawed on the basis that there are just way too many players off contract at the same time.

The most effective way to operate is by having 3 year contracts for your first graders that are offset from each other, not all due at once. Look at Parra right now. Look at the big 4 at Tigers 2 years ago. 

I know we are under a cap restriction at the moment, but we cant fall into the trap. We need to sign our next top player next year knowing Foran finishes off that year. So only 1 year overlap. Then once Foran is gone and payments to Mbye, Graham, Woods are finished, we can get another big name.

But that's not all. Our current first graders need to be told they are not their worth and any offers to renew them will be slashed next time around. 

They can start looking from now and break contract if they want. 

For now what we have to pay them is the contract amount, when they are off contract we can offer them what we think they are worth.

Zef is right 2021 is an opportunity, not a problem... I can rattle of plenty of names of good reserve graders in most positions that may be "value for money" signings for 2020 that might become regular members of our NRL side in 2020-2025. We have around 6 positions to fill. The payers who are going are no big loss, we don't need a superstar to replace them like-for-like.

We can start signing payers for 2021 early in 2020, like we just did with Stimson, over the course of a year, that is plenty of time to recruit the players we need. Lots of players off contract means lots of money to spend, so lots of opportunity to allocate money according to priority.

I'm not going to guess who the club will let go or sign up. All I want is for the club to obtain and then maintain a stable and efficient roster with a coach that can get the best out of who we have. The way the salary cap is currently structured and implemented there will never be a level playing field as far as teams rosters are concerned so the club needs to be savvy how they handle purchases.

Firstly, who says we have to sign everyone to contracts finishing the same time? Secondly with what money are we gonna pay this top line player next year? You seen the players off contract and we can't replace 6 with 1, you MUST have 30 and the money Nu Brown, Fatalo, Lichaa, Martin, Olive, Tualau free up is not gonna be much.

There's no philosophy about hitting the market in '21, circumstance makes it so it's just the way it is.

Did u actually read what was written, or are you just trying to prove how great a league mind you think u are???....
U just argued your own point saying the the new signings should be all on three year deals...
why not some two, why not some three, and a couple four???... add in a couple of deseverved extensions and we shouldn't have the problem to which I alluded...
#leaguesgrratestmindpffttt...

Well if that's case case get leagues greatest mind in to sign everyone in 2021 to 3 year contracts that end in different years...

He's going to use the Villi model learned at the Uni of Notre Dib, 1 superstar for 6 duds not realising you need 6 replacements to fill a squad...

Villi can do that.... and they will all be immortals ... next question

Now that it's round 13, I think (but not 100% sure) that T-rex has served his 12 match suspension & can take the field for the Manly feeder club he signed for..
If ever a player was on his final chance...he's already used his 9 lives, so if he stuffs it up on or off the field, that's it. 
I doubt he can afford an injury at this stage of his career either.
Des has about 2 weeks to orchestrate a scandle to get rid of one of his top 30 & promote him....seriously though, he'll have to play well to get promoted next year.

Matthew Johns blows smoke up every knights player. You obviously havent been watching Gagai play week in, week out. He is not a good investment as his price tag is based on his origin performances which are at long odds to his club games. I'm not saying he's a bad player, just overpriced. I think he has scored about 4 tries the last 2 seasons at souths. That's pretty pathetic considering how well souths have played in that period. 

While we are kicking ideas around here, that is mostly just fans having a chat.

I've seen no evidence that the club doesn't know what they are doing, on the contrary, so far they are managing a difficult situation very well.

We will be able to judge when we see the team line up for 2021 and probably not much before that..

i'm also not suggesting it will be smooth sailing, every game is important and every signing is important...

I think we need to generate some momentum in 2020 that suggests the club is moving in the right direction, that will help with recruiting players for 2021. That momentum has to be improved on field performances and/or a new coach.

So while we are only replacing 7 players we want to replace them with 7 better players, while that isn't hard we want 7 players that can make a difference in the hope that 3-4 of them make a difference. 

I've still got confidence, we will make the right moves, the only bad decision we made in the last 2 years was extending Lichaa, at the time it didn't look like a bad decision. Out of 7 we can probably afford 1 bad decision, the other 6 need to be good.

At the time it was a terrible decision, and one in which  I bet Dean Pay had zero control...

I meant not bad in that Lichaa was in good form at the time... that disappeared as quickly as it came...

I looked up the latest team list for Blacktown Workers Sea Eagles in Ron Massey Cup, they're playing C'bury at Belmore tomorrow, that's who T-Rex supposedly signed for & there's no sign of him. Not a murmur showing up on google search either. 

That's why it is important we tap a high paid player (or players) now and get them looking for another club. We need to free the cash from top earners not the fringe guys on 200k who will be replaced by another fringe guy on 200k. 

I cant remember the end of contracts for Graham, Woods, Klemmer and Mbye but I would think 1 would be end of this season leaving us with 150-200k to play with. 

I'm hoping we have not spent more than 350-400k on Stimpson. Otherwise we have rocks in our head.