European Super league.


European Super league.

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Monoethnic Social Club
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huddo - 21 Apr 2021 9:21 AM
19-SU-58 - 21 Apr 2021 9:17 AM

It's not picking and choosing, it's Horses for Coarse, we can't afford to have an open comp at this time in Australia (although I'd like to see it in the future), they can't afford to have a closed comp in Europe (As it would destroy 150 years of history, and probably multiple smaller clubs).

ESL concept lasted 2 days (although it far from over and will rise its ugly head in the future I reckon) yet Aleague concept has lasted 17 years.
WE CAN afford an open comp here, the only objectors are 12 x franchise holders.... and their ever diminishing band of sycophants.
What about the 150 year history of clubs here? ... Thats not worth preserving?
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Super League DOA.The people have spoken.At least those in UK.
MLS and A League stand alone.
I wonder if FIFA will now act to make Promotion /Relegation mandatory?
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Monoethnic Social Club - 21 Apr 2021 9:32 AM
huddo - 21 Apr 2021 8:14 AM

Why would professional clubs fold when relegated? Dont they have fans that would still suppoort them in the lower tiers and sponsors that would stick with them? How did the ex NSL clubs survive their relegation (actually being excluded from top flight for 17 years is a fate much worse than relegation)?

Y did SM need to avoid relegation in '79? Didn't they have fans who'd support them in the lower tiers?
As for them surviving, NPL teams are semi-professional, key word there is "semi"
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Buggalugs the Third - 21 Apr 2021 9:32 AM
maxxie - 21 Apr 2021 9:18 AM

You're either ProPyramid or not

The A-League is a closed shop

If you're Pro A-league, you're Pro Closed-Shop

To say if your not one your the other, is a rediculous way to look at the world.
It's all about positives and negatives, and we get alot more positives out of the closed shop at the moment, but that may change in the future
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im pro having a professional football league in australia, full stop.

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huddo - 21 Apr 2021 9:51 AM
Buggalugs the Third - 21 Apr 2021 9:32 AM

To say if your not one your the other, is a rediculous way to look at the world.
It's all about positives and negatives, and we get alot more positives out of the closed shop at the moment, but that may change in the future

Being a closed shop is the whole founding basis of the A-League.  Every decision made is reliant on it being a closed shop

Licenses were sold guaranteeing
  • no relegation,
  • no competition in your franchise zone
Go to Pyramid and all you're left with is the Trademark


      

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Buggalugs the Third - 21 Apr 2021 9:32 AM
maxxie - 21 Apr 2021 9:18 AM

You're either ProPyramid or not

The A-League is a closed shop

If you're Pro A-league, you're Pro Closed-Shop

doesnt get much more simple than this.

the fear amongst A-league Fans is once a A-League club gets relegated, they will cease to exist and fold. Let's face it that is a big possibility for some of the clubs. 

Not a Phase, Not a Trend, SYDNEY UNITED till the END! 

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Buggalugs the Third - 21 Apr 2021 10:02 AM
huddo - 21 Apr 2021 9:51 AM

Being a closed shop is the whole founding basis of the A-League.  Every decision made is reliant on it being a closed shop
  • no relegation,
  • no competition in your franchise zone
Go to Pyramid and all you're left with is the Trademark

But who's to say the end result won't be to get them to open up, I know that's what FIFA want from us. Also licences aren't sold, their leased (the last renewal being until 2034), so re-evaluation can be done in the years leading up to that date as to whether P/R is a useful tool for the competition .
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19-SU-58 - 21 Apr 2021 10:08 AM
Buggalugs the Third - 21 Apr 2021 9:32 AM

doesnt get much more simple than this.

the fear amongst A-league Fans is once a A-League club gets relegated, they will cease to exist and fold. Let's face it that is a big possibility for some of the clubs. 

Who replaces those clubs? the SEMI PROFFESIONAL NPL Clubs? Where the new supporters come from? Where the money to turn them professional come from? How do you garrentee a raise in crowd numbers of these NPL Crowds?


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The problem is you see it as a simple problem, it ain't, it's very complex.
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huddo - 21 Apr 2021 10:20 AM
19-SU-58 - 21 Apr 2021 10:08 AM

Who replaces those clubs? the SEMI PROFFESIONAL NPL Clubs? Where the new supporters come from? Where the money to turn them professional come from? How do you garrentee a raise in crowd numbers of these NPL Crowds?


Part of the agreement with clubs who get promoted is that they have to meet x, y and z or else they can't go up that season. There are examples of this all over the world. The FA needs to set the standards for each division and go from there. At the moment, they are refusing to put out a blueprint.
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theFOOTBALLlover - 21 Apr 2021 10:31 AM
huddo - 21 Apr 2021 10:20 AM

Part of the agreement with clubs who get promoted is that they have to meet x, y and z or else they can't go up that season. There are examples of this all over the world. The FA needs to set the standards for each division and go from there. At the moment, they are refusing to put out a blueprint.

So why did this not work for the NPL?
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NSL*
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huddo - 21 Apr 2021 10:39 AM
NSL*

I don't know mate. I'm not old enough to know the ins and outs of the NSL but football has changed since then.
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huddo - 21 Apr 2021 10:16 AM
Buggalugs the Third - 21 Apr 2021 10:02 AM

But who's to say the end result won't be to get them to open up, I know that's what FIFA want from us. Also licences aren't sold, their leased (the last renewal being until 2034), so re-evaluation can be done in the years leading up to that date as to whether P/R is a useful tool for the competition .

You seem to be another who has fallen for the 2034 lie.   Just cos Lederer or Nikou or Johnson waffles around it, get the facts





https://www.tas-cas.org/fileadmin/user_upload/Award_CAS_5264-5265-5266_internet.pdf


      

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Monoethnic Social Club - 21 Apr 2021 9:38 AM
huddo - 21 Apr 2021 9:21 AM

ESL concept lasted 2 days (although it far from over and will rise its ugly head in the future I reckon) yet Aleague concept has lasted 17 years.
WE CAN afford an open comp here, the only objectors are 12 x franchise holders.... and their ever diminishing band of sycophants.
What about the 150 year history of clubs here? ... Thats not worth preserving?

Only Melbourne AFL clubs have 150 years of history.
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theFOOTBALLlover - 21 Apr 2021 10:46 AM
huddo - 21 Apr 2021 10:39 AM

I don't know mate. I'm not old enough to know the ins and outs of the NSL but football has changed since then.

Before my time in Australia as well

But most I've found see the organisation as anything from naive to chaotic

Main problem is those who now desperately cling to the idea that it was the Pyramid concept that was to blame 20 years ago.

      

Edited
3 Years Ago by Buggalugs the Third
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No disrespect here but there is no way we can allow semi pro clubs to be apart of the aleague, otherwise it will set the game back 30 years as a semi pro league again like the NSL was.

It needs to be full time professional league with full time professional teams, with a second division involved and then you can add pro-rel down to the NPL from there.

Otherwise we will be left behind by the likes of Japan, South Korea, the middle eastern leagues whom have far greater resources whom are not running their clubs in hundreds or thousands but in the millions whilst watch the level of the national team fall away even further.

We need to raise the bar not lower it and if clubs want to apart of the professional game in Australia then a line must be drawn.

By the way why haven't we heard from the AAFC or Football Australia about the NSD? Very quiet.
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Sanity prevails here, people power wins but I have a feeling this is not over by any stretch of the imagination.

This will hurt the owners egos but they dont how much damage its done to their reputations as many won't forget this.

It seems like the bad PR was going to be a factor, with almost everyone against it from the start.

I can see them making another attempt at it maybe post 2022 Qatar, but one thing is for sure is football won't be the same even after this even with a expanded champions league format which doesnt help the smaller leagues and clubs that much.
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paulc - 21 Apr 2021 6:48 AM
Burztur - 21 Apr 2021 5:37 AM

Yes, but the intent was there and always will be. They played their hand and it will be just a matter of time when the planets align a bit better for the clubs.

I think the severity of the reaction will make anyone think twice about doing anything similar in the future.

Heads have already rolled, and we haven't seen the fallout even begin properly. Fans of the clubs involved are baying for blood.

(VAR) IS NAVY BLUE

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huddo - 21 Apr 2021 10:20 AM
19-SU-58 - 21 Apr 2021 10:08 AM

Who replaces those clubs? the SEMI PROFFESIONAL NPL Clubs? Where the new supporters come from? Where the money to turn them professional come from? How do you garrentee a raise in crowd numbers of these NPL Crowds?


Strange phenomenon seen around the rest of the World, 
  • As a club climbs the Pyramid it signs better, more highly paid players
  • More supporters/fans/customers appear for the more successful teams, less for those going the other way
  • There are 2 million Football 'fans' in Australia (if you beleive the FFA official figures)


      

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19-SU-58 - 21 Apr 2021 10:08 AM
Buggalugs the Third - 21 Apr 2021 9:32 AM

doesnt get much more simple than this.

the fear amongst A-league Fans is once a A-League club gets relegated, they will cease to exist and fold. Let's face it that is a big possibility for some of the clubs. 

That's not true. It's a fear amongst owners. 
Most fans couldn't give two shits, look at MV - if you took a vote they'd probably vote to be relegated as they believe they deserve it.

The owners are no different from those managing clubs in the NSL days who I said before argued against relegation. 

The vast majority of fans in Aus ultimately want a strong professional competition with pro/rel.


Edited
3 Years Ago by tsf
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tsf - 21 Apr 2021 11:38 AM
19-SU-58 - 21 Apr 2021 10:08 AM


The vast majority of fans in Aus ultimately want a strong professional competition with pro/rel.


But, but, but that 2nd division.....

only if it's 'professional enough'
only if its been going x years and shown itself to be 'stable enough', 'sustainable' 
only if it can prove we can survive if we get dropped in there

This same crap comes from the chickenshit A-League fans as much as the owners

      

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Buggalugs the Third - 21 Apr 2021 9:30 AM
Enzo Bearzot - 20 Apr 2021 9:53 PM



And?  He wanted to get in when it suited him. I guess you didn't see the negativity, the mocking , the laughs  and jokes about the quality he and Les had on SBS e when SBS was sidelined.  Of course both changed their tune later.  For a while.
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theFOOTBALLlover - 21 Apr 2021 10:46 AM
huddo - 21 Apr 2021 10:39 AM

I don't know mate. I'm not old enough to know the ins and outs of the NSL but football has changed since then.

ba boom, football has changed as have clubs etcetc, no Club can operate as it was back in the past, they wouldn't last 6mths BUT one thing hasn't changed as quoted by one of the most respected coachs in the game to date, way to go Pep :

And Guardiola did not hold back at all."If you ask me about these teams that have been selected for this hypothetical competition in the future, I don't know the reason why," he said, per Manchester Evening News.Pep Guardiola, Man City manager"Sport? It is not sport when the relation between effort and success and reward doesn't exist. It is not a sport. It is not a sport if success is already guaranteed. It is not a sport if it doesn't matter if you lose."That's why I said many times that I want the best competitions as strong as possible - especially the Premier League - and it is not fair when one team fights to arrive at the top and cannot qualify because the success is already guaranteed just for a few clubs.Read more: European Super League: Everything you need to know about breakaway league."This statement is what I feel. I don't know what is going to change and people say maybe four or five teams can go up and join these teams but what happens in the 14 or 15 don't have a good season and every time they are there? This is not a sport."
https://www.givemesport.com/1678675-man-city-boss-pep-guardiola-doesnt-hold-back-about-european-super-league

Thankyou Pep, you wouldn't need to tell us your thoughts on MLS and our AL :)


Love Football

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I couldn't give a crap if the national comp was blokes playing for cevapi 
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tsf - 21 Apr 2021 11:38 AM
19-SU-58 - 21 Apr 2021 10:08 AM

The vast majority of fans in Aus ultimately want a strong professional competition with pro/rel.


Very true ...

The argument should be around how to get it done... constant infighting and people in NSL camps, A-League camps, European Camps, .... all with in their minds valid reasons...

One day I hope someone will produce some kind of mud map to follow that has enough detail that we can see P & R coming... but accepts the fact it is never going to happen overnight.... and only when we have a common purpose will Football grow... 

Perfect example IMO is the Lowy era.... IMO the first 3 to 5 years were needed to get us off the floor.... the issue was we kept the recovery model rather than further develop the recovery model.... best example of this was JON, the CEO who coined the phase One City One Team... after twelve months he understood his mistake and went to Frank Lowy and said we need a team in Western Sydney and another team in Melbourne... Its history now Frank said no we are staying with the One City One Team.... Six months latter JON resigned siting differences that he saw we needed to expand and the board did not...

Naive maybe, but my hope is someone or some group will develop that plan we can all get behind... I guess everyone has to give a little... no one is going to get everything they want... 
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crimsoncrusoe - 21 Apr 2021 9:42 AM
Super League DOA.The people have spoken.At least those in UK.


So a Brexit then...



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sydneyfc1987 - 21 Apr 2021 11:19 AM
paulc - 21 Apr 2021 6:48 AM

I think the severity of the reaction will make anyone think twice about doing anything similar in the future.

Heads have already rolled, and we haven't seen the fallout even begin properly. Fans of the clubs involved are baying for blood.

agreed, the multi rich owners will try other ways in the future no doubt about it.
For now the movement has been cut off, at the same time its time UEFA was pulled in as well for they are part of the prob milking the cow for so long - greed again.
Hopefully this will get a re set Global football needs.

I see Boris is looking to introduce new legislation for the future :
The prime minister gave a strong hint that one long-term solution could be to oblige English clubs to give fans a majority stake, based on the so-called 50+1 system used in Germany.

Things like this make for good back up.


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Edited
3 Years Ago by LFC.
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Buggalugs the Third - 21 Apr 2021 10:02 AM
huddo - 21 Apr 2021 9:51 AM

Being a closed shop is the whole founding basis of the A-League.  Every decision made is reliant on it being a closed shop
  • no relegation,
  • no competition in your franchise zone
Go to Pyramid and all you're left with is the Trademark

Keep pushing that false narrative bud

(VAR) IS NAVY BLUE

GO


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