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Decentric 2
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+x+x+x+x+x+xCan't fault the effort of the players, all tournament. Left it all out there in every game. Arnold got his tactics right too- Cede possession (because the players can't keep it even if they tried), and play on the counter. Craig Foster praised everyone and said we would learn from this. Judging by the comments here we've reset our football development expectations, away from possession football and playing out from the back to absorbing pressure and counter-attacking. Not sure what else we learned that we didn't already know. Excellent results though. I'm not so sure about this. I think many on here want Australia to aspire to dominate games with the ball.
For the first time in a while, I have seen us play to our strengths. We played with a sense of realism. Hopefully our strengths in the future will be a squad full of technical players coupled with the mentality we've showed this WC. Well if that's true, they're not saying so. Yes Arnold did play to our strength, our mentality. He did what he had to with the cattle he had. Always said he is a better fit as a NT coach than Postecoglou who forces players into a game style rather than the fitting the game to the players. I'm less hopeful of having a squad full of technical players- 15 years of being promised it and ending up with possession in the 20's and long balls in the box in 2022. Wanting us to when we have developed the talent underneath is not the same as expecting these particular guys to do it vs Argentina I’m a knock out game.
So much needs to happen in the country to be ready for that and none of that can happen in the once every 4 year showpiece.
You must know this We set out do develop the talent 15 years ago. We've ended up with 42% possession against Tunisia, 31% against Denmark. These are teams we should be matching control of the ball. ( ignore France and Argentina) Don't get me wrong- I agree with how Arnold did it, given the players he had to play with. Foster said:" We should learn from this". What will we learn that we didn't know? I'm not talking about posters on here, but I reckon the average socceroos fan would not understand the true failing of the socceroos as you are attempting to describe. Our good WC performance, in fact, the best one in the history of the socceroos, does tend to paper over these obvious issues to do with touch, ball control in tight areas, working your way out of trouble with quick, deft one touch passing, etc. The top teams have it and the socceroos don't. In part, it's because we don't have players playing week in week out in the world's top leagues. You can't get this high level of playing unless the players are subject to it day to day. It needs to be developed at an early age. If you don't have it as a young adult, one can only improve at a slow rate compared to those skills acquired at an earlier age. It doesn't matter which league one plays in. The less skilful players in those top leagues , who compensate in other areas for their lack of skill (speed, stamina, strength , game sense), only improve slowly as an on the ball technician. Whereas tactically, players can improve very, very quickly as an adult. Ditto in football conditioning and communication. Even when we had lots of players playing in good leagues, the players who played in them were usually less skilful on the ball than the average players in those leagues. The more skilful Socceroos were the exception not the norm.
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angusozi
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xCan't fault the effort of the players, all tournament. Left it all out there in every game. Arnold got his tactics right too- Cede possession (because the players can't keep it even if they tried), and play on the counter. Craig Foster praised everyone and said we would learn from this. Judging by the comments here we've reset our football development expectations, away from possession football and playing out from the back to absorbing pressure and counter-attacking. Not sure what else we learned that we didn't already know. Excellent results though. I'm not so sure about this. I think many on here want Australia to aspire to dominate games with the ball.
For the first time in a while, I have seen us play to our strengths. We played with a sense of realism. Hopefully our strengths in the future will be a squad full of technical players coupled with the mentality we've showed this WC. Well if that's true, they're not saying so. Yes Arnold did play to our strength, our mentality. He did what he had to with the cattle he had. Always said he is a better fit as a NT coach than Postecoglou who forces players into a game style rather than the fitting the game to the players. I'm less hopeful of having a squad full of technical players- 15 years of being promised it and ending up with possession in the 20's and long balls in the box in 2022. Wanting us to when we have developed the talent underneath is not the same as expecting these particular guys to do it vs Argentina I’m a knock out game.
So much needs to happen in the country to be ready for that and none of that can happen in the once every 4 year showpiece.
You must know this We set out do develop the talent 15 years ago. We've ended up with 42% possession against Tunisia, 31% against Denmark. These are teams we should be matching control of the ball. ( ignore France and Argentina) We are doing something wrong. Every Argentinian player is better on the ball than every Socceroo. Why is this? It is not because of the way we structure youth teams or competitions. It’s because of what we value in young individual players and how we coach their individual skills. To provide some context. Every Argentinian, or Brazilian, is possibly better on the all than every player in any of the UEFA powerhouses too. Maybe France and Spain are closer to them, but they are far better with close ball control than their domestic playing counterparts in the English, Italian and German leagues. Besides football being a religion in Argentina and Brazil , they also have a massive street football culture in these countries. Another facet of play compared to what I've recently identified as a problem in most UEFA teams, is that they select far too many tall players in any given team, apart from Portugal and Spain, and maybe the Netherlands. Argentina's shorter players with a lower centre of gravity, are more nimble on their feet, able to change direction more quickly, and can turn more quickly. Ditto Brazil. Two facets of first touch are to stop it dead, and , to turn away from the opponent as one simultaneously receives the ball. At least we select shorter players like Behich, Kuol and Maclaren. In a country like Australia where football is at best the 5th most popular sport behind AFL, league, union and cricket, we lose a much larger percentage of talented sportspersons to theses codes than nearly every other country in the World Cup. Plus there is virtually no money for youth devotement, because AFL takes most of the financial resources, trying to improve the standard for a sport nobody else plays the world. Governments also put a lot money into Olympic sports too. Apologies to residents of NSW and the ACT. You probably have no idea how AFL enjoys its hegemony in the southern states that it does. Queensland is becoming an AFL state. That's the problem with Australia is their obsession with the provincial sport in AFL. If I would question the governments across Australia and the big business that invest in those sports and ask this would the AFL touch the hearts and minds of all Australians the Socceroos could achieve within the space of 3 weeks? I have seen anything like it but this national team plus the Matildas represent the nation better than anyone but do the authorities know this? When will they wake up realise the potential football can do for the nation? People like you in NSW and the ACT, aren't completely overwhelmed with AFL, like we are in most other states, Barca. Since 2006 when football steadily built up a bigger profile and support, it went backwards after about 6 -8 years. Also, T20 cricket, basketball, women's AFL, have grasped the summer market. After the A L has been mocked from pillar to post, even by supposed Aussie football fans, at the 2022 World Cup, A L players, Goodwin, Leckie, Maclaren, Cummings, Kuol, Redmayne (bench), Vukovic (bench), have been members of the greatest Socceroo team of all time - including 2006. They were more successful than all the supposed club superstars playing for Belgium, Germany and Denmark, who breezed through UEFA WC qualification. If memory serves me correctly D2 you're also from Tassie, we can both attest to the stranglehold AFL has down the there. I've lived in Victoria, ACT, NT and now NSW in the last 6 years since leaving Tas and I'm still yet to experience a sport to be so dominant as AFL is in Tassie and Vic. NRL does come close though
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Booney
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The wild ride is over but what joy it brought to most of us over the last 12 days.This team certainly exceeded all expectations though personally I did feel that getting to the Round of 16 is what we needed to be aiming for after five successive qualifications.
Argentina certainly dominated possession but only their first goal came from combination play,the second being a huge mistake by Ryan and even Rowles playing back to him.Yes Behich's mazy run and Kuol's last minute effort gave us hope following Goodwin's shot which took a massive deflection but we never threatened their goal seriously though Duke did nearly get a foot to a back pass which Martinez was just able to clear-if we had scored he would have looked as bad as Ryan does in many people's eyes.
Ryan possibly should have hoofed it but if people were watching how we were pressing especially in the first half Argentina usually elected to play out and having players with the technical ability were able to do so.It is the way elite level teams should be able to play but unfortunately on that occasion it came unstuck for us.
Anyway congratulations to Arnie and all associated with the team.
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riquelmes_laces
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xCan't fault the effort of the players, all tournament. Left it all out there in every game. Arnold got his tactics right too- Cede possession (because the players can't keep it even if they tried), and play on the counter. Craig Foster praised everyone and said we would learn from this. Judging by the comments here we've reset our football development expectations, away from possession football and playing out from the back to absorbing pressure and counter-attacking. Not sure what else we learned that we didn't already know. Excellent results though. I'm not so sure about this. I think many on here want Australia to aspire to dominate games with the ball.
For the first time in a while, I have seen us play to our strengths. We played with a sense of realism. Hopefully our strengths in the future will be a squad full of technical players coupled with the mentality we've showed this WC. Well if that's true, they're not saying so. Yes Arnold did play to our strength, our mentality. He did what he had to with the cattle he had. Always said he is a better fit as a NT coach than Postecoglou who forces players into a game style rather than the fitting the game to the players. I'm less hopeful of having a squad full of technical players- 15 years of being promised it and ending up with possession in the 20's and long balls in the box in 2022. Wanting us to when we have developed the talent underneath is not the same as expecting these particular guys to do it vs Argentina I’m a knock out game.
So much needs to happen in the country to be ready for that and none of that can happen in the once every 4 year showpiece.
You must know this We set out do develop the talent 15 years ago. We've ended up with 42% possession against Tunisia, 31% against Denmark. These are teams we should be matching control of the ball. ( ignore France and Argentina) Don't get me wrong- I agree with how Arnold did it, given the players he had to play with. Foster said:" We should learn from this". What will we learn that we didn't know? I'm not talking about posters on here, but I reckon the average socceroos fan would not understand the true failing of the socceroos as you are attempting to describe. Our good WC performance, in fact, the best one in the history of the socceroos, does tend to paper over these obvious issues to do with touch, ball control in tight areas, working your way out of trouble with quick, deft one touch passing, etc. The top teams have it and the socceroos don't. In part, it's because we don't have players playing week in week out in the world's top leagues. You can't get this high level of playing unless the players are subject to it day to day. It needs to be developed at an early age. If you don't have it as a young adult, one can only improve at a slow rate compared to those skills acquired at an earlier age. It doesn't matter which league one plays in. The less skilful players in those top leagues , who compensate in other areas for their lack of skill (speed, stamina, strength , game sense), only improve slowly as a on the ball technician. Whereas tactically, players can improve very, very quickly as an adult. Ditto in football conditioning and communication. Even when we had lots of players playing in good leagues, the players who played in them were usually less skilful on the ball than the average players in those leagues. The more skilful Socceroos were the exception not the norm. Kewell himself is angry about the affair and told The Sun-Herald:
"I learnt the most by playing in the backyard or at the local park with my brother Rod and my mates."Hitting a ball up against a wall for hours on end with different parts of my foot, juggling a soft drink can up against the backyard fence, that is what it's all about.
https://www.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/kewell-in-row-over-coaching-20030928-gdhh5t.html
I remember reading this article back in the day.
Coerver is a complete scam although I think Emerton may have spent some time there?
In any event, Kewell is arguably our most technically gifted player that we have produced and it's clear by his own admission that time with the ball at his feet > anything else.
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Decentric 2
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xCan't fault the effort of the players, all tournament. Left it all out there in every game. Arnold got his tactics right too- Cede possession (because the players can't keep it even if they tried), and play on the counter. Craig Foster praised everyone and said we would learn from this. Judging by the comments here we've reset our football development expectations, away from possession football and playing out from the back to absorbing pressure and counter-attacking. Not sure what else we learned that we didn't already know. Excellent results though. I'm not so sure about this. I think many on here want Australia to aspire to dominate games with the ball.
For the first time in a while, I have seen us play to our strengths. We played with a sense of realism. Hopefully our strengths in the future will be a squad full of technical players coupled with the mentality we've showed this WC. Well if that's true, they're not saying so. Yes Arnold did play to our strength, our mentality. He did what he had to with the cattle he had. Always said he is a better fit as a NT coach than Postecoglou who forces players into a game style rather than the fitting the game to the players. I'm less hopeful of having a squad full of technical players- 15 years of being promised it and ending up with possession in the 20's and long balls in the box in 2022. Wanting us to when we have developed the talent underneath is not the same as expecting these particular guys to do it vs Argentina I’m a knock out game.
So much needs to happen in the country to be ready for that and none of that can happen in the once every 4 year showpiece.
You must know this We set out do develop the talent 15 years ago. We've ended up with 42% possession against Tunisia, 31% against Denmark. These are teams we should be matching control of the ball. ( ignore France and Argentina) We are doing something wrong. Every Argentinian player is better on the ball than every Socceroo. Why is this? It is not because of the way we structure youth teams or competitions. It’s because of what we value in young individual players and how we coach their individual skills. To provide some context. Every Argentinian, or Brazilian, is possibly better on the all than every player in any of the UEFA powerhouses too. Maybe France and Spain are closer to them, but they are far better with close ball control than their domestic playing counterparts in the English, Italian and German leagues. Besides football being a religion in Argentina and Brazil , they also have a massive street football culture in these countries. Another facet of play compared to what I've recently identified as a problem in most UEFA teams, is that they select far too many tall players in any given team, apart from Portugal and Spain, and maybe the Netherlands. Argentina's shorter players with a lower centre of gravity, are more nimble on their feet, able to change direction more quickly, and can turn more quickly. Ditto Brazil. Two facets of first touch are to stop it dead, and , to turn away from the opponent as one simultaneously receives the ball. At least we select shorter players like Behich, Kuol and Maclaren. In a country like Australia where football is at best the 5th most popular sport behind AFL, league, union and cricket, we lose a much larger percentage of talented sportspersons to theses codes than nearly every other country in the World Cup. Plus there is virtually no money for youth devotement, because AFL takes most of the financial resources, trying to improve the standard for a sport nobody else plays the world. Governments also put a lot money into Olympic sports too. Apologies to residents of NSW and the ACT. You probably have no idea how AFL enjoys its hegemony in the southern states that it does. Queensland is becoming an AFL state. That's the problem with Australia is their obsession with the provincial sport in AFL. If I would question the governments across Australia and the big business that invest in those sports and ask this would the AFL touch the hearts and minds of all Australians the Socceroos could achieve within the space of 3 weeks? I have seen anything like it but this national team plus the Matildas represent the nation better than anyone but do the authorities know this? When will they wake up realise the potential football can do for the nation? People like you in NSW and the ACT, aren't completely overwhelmed with AFL, like we are in most other states, Barca. Since 2006 when football steadily built up a bigger profile and support, it went backwards after about 6 -8 years. Also, T20 cricket, basketball, women's AFL, have grasped the summer market. After the A L has been mocked from pillar to post, even by supposed Aussie football fans, at the 2022 World Cup, A L players, Goodwin, Leckie, Maclaren, Cummings, Kuol, Redmayne (bench), Vukovic (bench), have been members of the greatest Socceroo team of all time - including 2006. They were more successful than all the supposed club superstars playing for Belgium, Germany and Denmark, who breezed through UEFA WC qualification. If memory serves me correctly D2 you're also from Tassie, we can both attest to the stranglehold AFL has down the there. I've lived in Victoria, ACT, NT and now NSW in the last 6 years since leaving Tas and I'm still yet to experience a sport to be so dominant as AFL is in Tassie and Vic. NRL does come close though Thanks for providing the context, Anguosi. It is media saturation that keeps the AFL hegemony in Tas. As a relief teacher AFL is only the most popular sport in rural schools. Football, cricket and basketball are far more popular in city and suburban schools. Hardly anybody is playing Aussie rules in metropolitan school playgrounds. And they fudge their participation rates too. Unfortunately, the current massive media surrounding the campaign by Aus in the world's most popular sport, will disappear pretty quickly in the southern states. Hopefully, the womens' Wolrd cup in Aus and New Zealand has a big media presence. Also, given Nathaniel Atkinson has played for the Socceroos, and is the first Tasmanian to play at a World Cup, he has had virtually no media profile in Tasmania. Even worse, he has also been a media scapegoat for the loss against France! If he was an average AFL player, who plays for any club, his photo would have been in the digital and print media almost every day! There would have been a plethora of print articles about - what he likes to eat, his favourite movies, which car he drives, etc. The media would have been interviewing his parents a few times a week too. It just makes one aware of living in a backwater. It would not be much different in Victoria, South Aus and West Aus either.
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Decentric 2
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xCan't fault the effort of the players, all tournament. Left it all out there in every game. Arnold got his tactics right too- Cede possession (because the players can't keep it even if they tried), and play on the counter. Craig Foster praised everyone and said we would learn from this. Judging by the comments here we've reset our football development expectations, away from possession football and playing out from the back to absorbing pressure and counter-attacking. Not sure what else we learned that we didn't already know. Excellent results though. I'm not so sure about this. I think many on here want Australia to aspire to dominate games with the ball.
For the first time in a while, I have seen us play to our strengths. We played with a sense of realism. Hopefully our strengths in the future will be a squad full of technical players coupled with the mentality we've showed this WC. Well if that's true, they're not saying so. Yes Arnold did play to our strength, our mentality. He did what he had to with the cattle he had. Always said he is a better fit as a NT coach than Postecoglou who forces players into a game style rather than the fitting the game to the players. I'm less hopeful of having a squad full of technical players- 15 years of being promised it and ending up with possession in the 20's and long balls in the box in 2022. Wanting us to when we have developed the talent underneath is not the same as expecting these particular guys to do it vs Argentina I’m a knock out game.
So much needs to happen in the country to be ready for that and none of that can happen in the once every 4 year showpiece.
You must know this We set out do develop the talent 15 years ago. We've ended up with 42% possession against Tunisia, 31% against Denmark. These are teams we should be matching control of the ball. ( ignore France and Argentina) Don't get me wrong- I agree with how Arnold did it, given the players he had to play with. Foster said:" We should learn from this". What will we learn that we didn't know? I'm not talking about posters on here, but I reckon the average socceroos fan would not understand the true failing of the socceroos as you are attempting to describe. Our good WC performance, in fact, the best one in the history of the socceroos, does tend to paper over these obvious issues to do with touch, ball control in tight areas, working your way out of trouble with quick, deft one touch passing, etc. The top teams have it and the socceroos don't. In part, it's because we don't have players playing week in week out in the world's top leagues. You can't get this high level of playing unless the players are subject to it day to day. It needs to be developed at an early age. If you don't have it as a young adult, one can only improve at a slow rate compared to those skills acquired at an earlier age. It doesn't matter which league one plays in. The less skilful players in those top leagues , who compensate in other areas for their lack of skill (speed, stamina, strength , game sense), only improve slowly as a on the ball technician. Whereas tactically, players can improve very, very quickly as an adult. Ditto in football conditioning and communication. Even when we had lots of players playing in good leagues, the players who played in them were usually less skilful on the ball than the average players in those leagues. The more skilful Socceroos were the exception not the norm. Kewell himself is angry about the affair and told The Sun-Herald:
"I learnt the most by playing in the backyard or at the local park with my brother Rod and my mates."Hitting a ball up against a wall for hours on end with different parts of my foot, juggling a soft drink can up against the backyard fence, that is what it's all about.
https://www.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/kewell-in-row-over-coaching-20030928-gdhh5t.html
I remember reading this article back in the day.
Coerver is a complete scam although I think Emerton may have spent some time there?
In any event, Kewell is arguably our most technically gifted player that we have produced and it's clear by his own admission that time with the ball at his feet > anything else. Kewell is one of our very few players who was technically gifted - even by EPL standards.
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Decentric 2
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Another terrific facet for this WC is that our experienced players, who may have been going backwards a bit in the last few years, or stagnating, really lifted for the Qatar World Cup.
They played their best ever football and provided onfield leadership.
Behich ( apart from lack of discipline after his Messi spat), Irvine, Mooy and Leckie, played their greatest football for Australia in Qatar.
Moreover, although only being selected for the Socceroos in recent times, and playing international football late in their careers, Goodwin and Duke were also outstanding. Both exhibited game sense in spades, particularly Goodwin.
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Decentric 2
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A lot has been made of Souttar who was undoubtedly good. I wonder if it is because he is the most prominent and well known Socceroo in England?
I thought Rowles was even better!
Sometimes Souttar took great risks committing to sliding tackles and blocks in various games. A few times he was last player standing and he had to commit. But a few times, he committed, without adequate cover, and if he had mistimed the tackle, the defence would have been split wide open.
Also, sometimes when he went to ground he kept his legs too wide apart, so opponents shot between his legs - like Messi did today for the first goal.
Rowles, stayed on his feet more, and won even a greater number of timely tackles, made more blocks and made more intercepts from good reading of play. Both are comfortable on the ball distributors too.
If Souttar and Rowles inexplicably fade from now on, even in their embryonic international careers ( like Sains after the 2015 Asian Cup) I think what they've excelled as a CB pairing in this World Cup.
Playing together for the first time, the Rowles/Souttar pairing is the greatest CB pairing the Socceroos have ever had!
I think they exceed Moore/Neill in 2006 and Sains/Spira in the Asian Cup 2015.
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tsf
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+xIf Souttar and Rowles inexplicably fade from now on, even in their embryonic international careers ( like Sains after the 2015 Asian Cup) I think what they've done as a CB pairing in this World Cup, playing together for the first time, is the greatest CB pairing the Socceroos have ever had! I think you might be jumping the gun here a tad, but that back four today was immense and awesome to think we will have souttar and rowles for years
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riquelmes_laces
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+x+x- the "1" was pure luck, and kind of embarrassing
- Argentina should have had, at least, two more
- one of the "2" was a keeper howler
- we parked the bus for the first hour
- only Licki's fluke got us into the knock-out game -- definitely no 2006 ver.2.0
- we were hopeless against France Republic of Africa
- Arnold's "lob it in and hope" strategies leave a lot to be desired
- we have no strikers
- Mooy will retire
- Ryan should be banned
"France Republic of Africa" fuck off with this racist rubbish mate. Their team is full of proud Frenchmen, as our team is full of proud Australians from many backgrounds. Mods can you ban this sad old man The whole irony of that guys brain dead post is that France were the colonisers. Yet that idiot thinks French football was colonised by Africans.
The whole thing is backwards, which I’m sure most of his posts are.
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angusozi
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+xA lot has been made of Souttar who was undoubtedly good. I wonder if it is because he is the most prominent and well known Socceroo in England? I thought Rowles was even better! Sometimes Souttar took great risks committing to sliding tackles and blocks in various games. A few times he was last player standing and he had to commit. But a few times, he committed, without adequate cover, and if he had mistimed the tackle, the defence would have been split wide open. Also, sometimes when he went to ground he kept his legs too wide apart, so opponents shot between his legs - like Messi did today for the first goal. Rowles, stayed on his feet more, and won even a greater number of timely tackles, made more blocks and made more intercepts from good reading of play. Both are comfortable on the ball distributors too. If Souttar and Rowles inexplicably fade from now on, even in their embryonic international careers ( like Sains after the 2015 Asian Cup) I think what they've done as a CB pairing in this World Cup, playing together for the first time, is the greatest CB pairing the Socceroos have ever had! I think they exceed Moore/Neill in 2006 and Sains/Spira in the Asian Cup 2015. Very impressive from them, I'd hope they make the jump to a top league and have a few years of Premier League, Bundesliga etc under their belt by 2026
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Decentric 2
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xCan't fault the effort of the players, all tournament. Left it all out there in every game. Arnold got his tactics right too- Cede possession (because the players can't keep it even if they tried), and play on the counter. Craig Foster praised everyone and said we would learn from this. Judging by the comments here we've reset our football development expectations, away from possession football and playing out from the back to absorbing pressure and counter-attacking. Not sure what else we learned that we didn't already know. Excellent results though. I'm not so sure about this. I think many on here want Australia to aspire to dominate games with the ball.
For the first time in a while, I have seen us play to our strengths. We played with a sense of realism. Hopefully our strengths in the future will be a squad full of technical players coupled with the mentality we've showed this WC. Well if that's true, they're not saying so. Yes Arnold did play to our strength, our mentality. He did what he had to with the cattle he had. Always said he is a better fit as a NT coach than Postecoglou who forces players into a game style rather than the fitting the game to the players. I'm less hopeful of having a squad full of technical players- 15 years of being promised it and ending up with possession in the 20's and long balls in the box in 2022. Wanting us to when we have developed the talent underneath is not the same as expecting these particular guys to do it vs Argentina I’m a knock out game.
So much needs to happen in the country to be ready for that and none of that can happen in the once every 4 year showpiece.
You must know this We set out do develop the talent 15 years ago. We've ended up with 42% possession against Tunisia, 31% against Denmark. These are teams we should be matching control of the ball. ( ignore France and Argentina) We are doing something wrong. Every Argentinian player is better on the ball than every Socceroo. Why is this? It is not because of the way we structure youth teams or competitions. It’s because of what we value in young individual players and how we coach their individual skills. To provide some context. Every Argentinian, or Brazilian, is possibly better on the all than every player in any of the UEFA powerhouses too. Maybe France and Spain are closer to them, but they are far better with close ball control than their domestic playing counterparts in the English, Italian and German leagues. Besides football being a religion in Argentina and Brazil , they also have a massive street football culture in these countries. Another facet of play compared to what I've recently identified as a problem in most UEFA teams, is that they select far too many tall players in any given team, apart from Portugal and Spain, and maybe the Netherlands. Argentina's shorter players with a lower centre of gravity, are more nimble on their feet, able to change direction more quickly, and can turn more quickly. Ditto Brazil. Two facets of first touch are to stop it dead, and , to turn away from the opponent as one simultaneously receives the ball. At least we select shorter players like Behich, Kuol and Maclaren. In a country like Australia where football is at best the 5th most popular sport behind AFL, league, union and cricket, we lose a much larger percentage of talented sportspersons to theses codes than nearly every other country in the World Cup. Plus there is virtually no money for youth devotement, because AFL takes most of the financial resources, trying to improve the standard for a sport nobody else plays the world. Governments also put a lot money into Olympic sports too. Apologies to residents of NSW and the ACT. You probably have no idea how AFL enjoys its hegemony in the southern states that it does. Queensland is becoming an AFL state. No need to compare us to Sotuh America and EUFA. The Africans have a better first touch. The Saudi's have a better first touch. The Iranians have a better first touch. The Koreans and Japanese do as well. Why is it so hard for Australian players to develop a good first touch? In all the football conferences I've attended there are four specific football performance criteria that affect outcomes on the pitch . 1. Technique. 2. Insight ( game sense). 3. Communication. 4. Specific football conditioning. 5. I'm going to add mental strength. Technique takes a long time to develop and is most important, because it can't be rectified in an adult's mid stage and late stage football career. However, 2, 3, 4 and 5, can also be improved quickly as an adult player and if all are superior to 1, they can counterbalance it in terms of football outcomes in matches. Agree though that the Africans have a quality technique, as do Japan and South Korea, but in terms of specific performance criteria of football that affect football results , Australia is very competitive in global terms in football specific game criteria 2, 3 4 and 5.
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Decentric 2
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+x+xA lot has been made of Souttar who was undoubtedly good. I wonder if it is because he is the most prominent and well known Socceroo in England? I thought Rowles was even better! Sometimes Souttar took great risks committing to sliding tackles and blocks in various games. A few times he was last player standing and he had to commit. But a few times, he committed, without adequate cover, and if he had mistimed the tackle, the defence would have been split wide open. Also, sometimes when he went to ground he kept his legs too wide apart, so opponents shot between his legs - like Messi did today for the first goal. Rowles, stayed on his feet more, and won even a greater number of timely tackles, made more blocks and made more intercepts from good reading of play. Both are comfortable on the ball distributors too. If Souttar and Rowles inexplicably fade from now on, even in their embryonic international careers ( like Sains after the 2015 Asian Cup) I think what they've done as a CB pairing in this World Cup, playing together for the first time, is the greatest CB pairing the Socceroos have ever had! I think they exceed Moore/Neill in 2006 and Sains/Spira in the Asian Cup 2015. Very impressive from them, I'd hope they make the jump to a top league and have a few years of Premier League, Bundesliga etc under their belt by 2026 For me I'm not so concerned about which league players play in. It is more the style of play. These current Socceroos, like Souttar and Rowles, have excelled at the highest level, on the biggest stage - the World Cup. It would be very difficult to get a coach as good as Arnie in any league. Very few coaches in any league have taken modest teams to the last 16 in World Cups. Fantastic club players for Belgium, Germany and Denmark, some of the best club players in the world in Europe, have choked on the biggest stage in Qatar. Germany are usually good travellers, coming 1st in Brazil 2014 and 3rd South Africa 2010. But Belgium, on paper close to the best in the world given the club careers of the players, are chokers outside Europe. They also failed in Brazil. They've never made a final of a big tournament, with arguably the best team. They lack mental strength.
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Decentric 2
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robbos
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xCan't fault the effort of the players, all tournament. Left it all out there in every game. Arnold got his tactics right too- Cede possession (because the players can't keep it even if they tried), and play on the counter. Craig Foster praised everyone and said we would learn from this. Judging by the comments here we've reset our football development expectations, away from possession football and playing out from the back to absorbing pressure and counter-attacking. Not sure what else we learned that we didn't already know. Excellent results though. I'm not so sure about this. I think many on here want Australia to aspire to dominate games with the ball.
For the first time in a while, I have seen us play to our strengths. We played with a sense of realism. Hopefully our strengths in the future will be a squad full of technical players coupled with the mentality we've showed this WC. Well if that's true, they're not saying so. Yes Arnold did play to our strength, our mentality. He did what he had to with the cattle he had. Always said he is a better fit as a NT coach than Postecoglou who forces players into a game style rather than the fitting the game to the players. I'm less hopeful of having a squad full of technical players- 15 years of being promised it and ending up with possession in the 20's and long balls in the box in 2022. Wanting us to when we have developed the talent underneath is not the same as expecting these particular guys to do it vs Argentina I’m a knock out game.
So much needs to happen in the country to be ready for that and none of that can happen in the once every 4 year showpiece.
You must know this We set out do develop the talent 15 years ago. We've ended up with 42% possession against Tunisia, 31% against Denmark. These are teams we should be matching control of the ball. ( ignore France and Argentina) We are doing something wrong. Every Argentinian player is better on the ball than every Socceroo. Why is this? It is not because of the way we structure youth teams or competitions. It’s because of what we value in young individual players and how we coach their individual skills. To provide some context. Every Argentinian, or Brazilian, is possibly better on the all than every player in any of the UEFA powerhouses too. Maybe France and Spain are closer to them, but they are far better with close ball control than their domestic playing counterparts in the English, Italian and German leagues. Besides football being a religion in Argentina and Brazil , they also have a massive street football culture in these countries. Another facet of play compared to what I've recently identified as a problem in most UEFA teams, is that they select far too many tall players in any given team, apart from Portugal and Spain, and maybe the Netherlands. Argentina's shorter players with a lower centre of gravity, are more nimble on their feet, able to change direction more quickly, and can turn more quickly. Ditto Brazil. Two facets of first touch are to stop it dead, and , to turn away from the opponent as one simultaneously receives the ball. At least we select shorter players like Behich, Kuol and Maclaren. In a country like Australia where football is at best the 5th most popular sport behind AFL, league, union and cricket, we lose a much larger percentage of talented sportspersons to theses codes than nearly every other country in the World Cup. Plus there is virtually no money for youth devotement, because AFL takes most of the financial resources, trying to improve the standard for a sport nobody else plays the world. Governments also put a lot money into Olympic sports too. Apologies to residents of NSW and the ACT. You probably have no idea how AFL enjoys its hegemony in the southern states that it does. Queensland is becoming an AFL state. That's the problem with Australia is their obsession with the provincial sport in AFL. If I would question the governments across Australia and the big business that invest in those sports and ask this, would the AFL touch the hearts and minds of all Australians the Socceroos could achieve within the space of 3 weeks?
I haven't seen anything like it but this national team plus the Matildas represent the nation better than anyone but do the authorities know this? When will they wake up realise the potential football can do for the nation? I can assure you that there were no live sites for the Swans GF appearance in Sydney, nor did we have anything like what we have experienced in the last few weeks during the WC. Your statement is just SO TRUE, when will they realise this both the governments & the sponsors. FA needs to make Leckie, Goodwin as heroes & pump their media cred & encourage people to come to A-League to see these heroes.
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clockwork orange
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xCan't fault the effort of the players, all tournament. Left it all out there in every game. Arnold got his tactics right too- Cede possession (because the players can't keep it even if they tried), and play on the counter. Craig Foster praised everyone and said we would learn from this. Judging by the comments here we've reset our football development expectations, away from possession football and playing out from the back to absorbing pressure and counter-attacking. Not sure what else we learned that we didn't already know. Excellent results though. I'm not so sure about this. I think many on here want Australia to aspire to dominate games with the ball.
For the first time in a while, I have seen us play to our strengths. We played with a sense of realism. Hopefully our strengths in the future will be a squad full of technical players coupled with the mentality we've showed this WC. Well if that's true, they're not saying so. Yes Arnold did play to our strength, our mentality. He did what he had to with the cattle he had. Always said he is a better fit as a NT coach than Postecoglou who forces players into a game style rather than the fitting the game to the players. I'm less hopeful of having a squad full of technical players- 15 years of being promised it and ending up with possession in the 20's and long balls in the box in 2022. Wanting us to when we have developed the talent underneath is not the same as expecting these particular guys to do it vs Argentina I’m a knock out game.
So much needs to happen in the country to be ready for that and none of that can happen in the once every 4 year showpiece.
You must know this We set out do develop the talent 15 years ago. We've ended up with 42% possession against Tunisia, 31% against Denmark. These are teams we should be matching control of the ball. ( ignore France and Argentina) We are doing something wrong. Every Argentinian player is better on the ball than every Socceroo. Why is this? It is not because of the way we structure youth teams or competitions. It’s because of what we value in young individual players and how we coach their individual skills. To provide some context. Every Argentinian, or Brazilian, is possibly better on the ball than every player in any of the UEFA powerhouse international teams too. Maybe France and Spain are closer to them, but they are far better with close ball control than their domestic playing counterparts in the English, Italian and German leagues. Besides football being a religion in Argentina and Brazil , they also have a massive street football culture in these countries. I agree with everything you say. But seriously, how do you explain every other country (pretty much) having better skills than us. It’s no coincidence that possibly our most skilful player of the past 15 years had a background in Futsal. It’s just frustrating that if we could just improve the individual skills side by 20%, our strength and grit could be the descriminator in games like this.
Meanwhile, we are focused on whether our youth team should play 4-3-3 or 3-5-1-1 or whatever formation is this year’s fashion.
Make the individual players better and the rest will follow.
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johnszasz
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Hrustic twice. Pure frustration Behich didn't cut it back and the same with Kuol. Not sure how to read into it. Great passion and certainly in a decent position but I hope this doesn't lead to him creating a disdain for his team mates.
Pausing at the Behich moment. He's left footed and if he'd rolled it back to Hrustic, Hrustic's eyes can see the perfect gap to shoot it through for a goal. I think it's something they'd done a lot in training hence the frustration. Maclaren was also nearby and had his arms out.
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Volkira
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xCan't fault the effort of the players, all tournament. Left it all out there in every game. Arnold got his tactics right too- Cede possession (because the players can't keep it even if they tried), and play on the counter. Craig Foster praised everyone and said we would learn from this. Judging by the comments here we've reset our football development expectations, away from possession football and playing out from the back to absorbing pressure and counter-attacking. Not sure what else we learned that we didn't already know. Excellent results though. I'm not so sure about this. I think many on here want Australia to aspire to dominate games with the ball.
For the first time in a while, I have seen us play to our strengths. We played with a sense of realism. Hopefully our strengths in the future will be a squad full of technical players coupled with the mentality we've showed this WC. Well if that's true, they're not saying so. Yes Arnold did play to our strength, our mentality. He did what he had to with the cattle he had. Always said he is a better fit as a NT coach than Postecoglou who forces players into a game style rather than the fitting the game to the players. I'm less hopeful of having a squad full of technical players- 15 years of being promised it and ending up with possession in the 20's and long balls in the box in 2022. Wanting us to when we have developed the talent underneath is not the same as expecting these particular guys to do it vs Argentina I’m a knock out game.
So much needs to happen in the country to be ready for that and none of that can happen in the once every 4 year showpiece.
You must know this We set out do develop the talent 15 years ago. We've ended up with 42% possession against Tunisia, 31% against Denmark. These are teams we should be matching control of the ball. ( ignore France and Argentina) Don't get me wrong- I agree with how Arnold did it, given the players he had to play with. Foster said:" We should learn from this". What will we learn that we didn't know? I'm not talking about posters on here, but I reckon the average socceroos fan would not understand the true failing of the socceroos as you are attempting to describe. Our good WC performance, in fact, the best one in the history of the socceroos, does tend to paper over these obvious issues to do with touch, ball control in tight areas, working your way out of trouble with quick, deft one touch passing, etc. The top teams have it and the socceroos don't. In part, it's because we don't have players playing week in week out in the world's top leagues. You can't get this high level of playing unless the players are subject to it day to day. It needs to be developed at an early age. If you don't have it as a young adult, one can only improve at a slow rate compared to those skills acquired at an earlier age. It doesn't matter which league one plays in. The less skilful players in those top leagues , who compensate in other areas for their lack of skill (speed, stamina, strength , game sense), only improve slowly as an on the ball technician. Whereas tactically, players can improve very, very quickly as an adult. Ditto in football conditioning and communication. Even when we had lots of players playing in good leagues, the players who played in them were usually less skilful on the ball than the average players in those leagues. The more skilful Socceroos were the exception not the norm. The problem once again in Australia is the kids season isn’t year long. Living in Germany I see the huge difference in skills in Junior football tiers. The academy boys train 4 x week for 2hrs plus sessions The academy goalkeepers 4x week for 3hr sessions with 2 weeks off for Winter break and two weeks off for summer break.The rest of the 48weeks is football. With licensed A or B trainers. The same aged grouped boys in the lowest tier of football by U12 are training 3x week for 90min a session. But have all school holidays off.Trained with basic trainer license. You can see the difference in technique,understanding of tactics and skill.It’s a huge difference considering they’re the same age groups. The Aussie kids need to be learning year long not switching to cricket for Summer.
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riquelmes_laces
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+xHrustic twice. Pure frustration Behich didn't cut it back and the same with Kuol. Not sure how to read into it. Great passion and certainly in a decent position but I hope this doesn't lead to him creating a disdain for his team mates. Pausing at the Behich moment. He's left footed and if he'd rolled it back to Hrustic, Hrustic's eyes can see the perfect gap to shoot it through for a goal. I think it's something they'd done a lot in training hence the frustration. Maclaren was also nearby and had his arms out. As much as Hrustic may have been open for both situations we could also be writing about goal of the tournament from Behich or an equalizer from the youngest player in knockout WC football since Pele. It's just one of the many moments we look back on, but I certainly don't think Hrustic should look down on his teammates. These are all lessons learnt.
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Derider
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+xHrustic twice. Pure frustration Behich didn't cut it back and the same with Kuol. Not sure how to read into it. Great passion and certainly in a decent position but I hope this doesn't lead to him creating a disdain for his team mates. Pausing at the Behich moment. He's left footed and if he'd rolled it back to Hrustic, Hrustic's eyes can see the perfect gap to shoot it through for a goal. I think it's something they'd done a lot in training hence the frustration. Maclaren was also nearby and had his arms out. He also unloaded on Karacic after the latter dared suggest he should’ve passed it to him instead of trying to curl it in at one point. Karacic was wrong - Hrustic was well within his rights to shoot there - but his reaction was oddly aggressive. He seemed furious out there today. It was weird.
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riquelmes_laces
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+x+xHrustic twice. Pure frustration Behich didn't cut it back and the same with Kuol. Not sure how to read into it. Great passion and certainly in a decent position but I hope this doesn't lead to him creating a disdain for his team mates. Pausing at the Behich moment. He's left footed and if he'd rolled it back to Hrustic, Hrustic's eyes can see the perfect gap to shoot it through for a goal. I think it's something they'd done a lot in training hence the frustration. Maclaren was also nearby and had his arms out. He also unloaded on Karacic after the latter dared suggest he should’ve passed it to him instead of trying to curl it in at one point. Karacic was wrong - Hrustic was well within his rights to shoot there - but his reaction was oddly aggressive. He seemed furious out there today. It was weird. He probably wishes he was starting. Could be pent-up frustration because his injury led to limited game time.
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sydneyfc1987
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+x+x+xHrustic twice. Pure frustration Behich didn't cut it back and the same with Kuol. Not sure how to read into it. Great passion and certainly in a decent position but I hope this doesn't lead to him creating a disdain for his team mates. Pausing at the Behich moment. He's left footed and if he'd rolled it back to Hrustic, Hrustic's eyes can see the perfect gap to shoot it through for a goal. I think it's something they'd done a lot in training hence the frustration. Maclaren was also nearby and had his arms out. He also unloaded on Karacic after the latter dared suggest he should’ve passed it to him instead of trying to curl it in at one point. Karacic was wrong - Hrustic was well within his rights to shoot there - but his reaction was oddly aggressive. He seemed furious out there today. It was weird. He probably wishes he was starting. Could be pent-up frustration because his injury led to limited game time. I'd say so. He's clearly not 100% fit though and did little today to show he should have started.
(VAR) IS NAVY BLUE
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johnszasz
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Hrustic is going to be an interesting one. Very temperamental. Talented. Definitely not a defensive midfielder. I guess I'd rather have him barking at the others if it leads to zero tolerance for shit play but you've got to have the expectations set.
The team were so highly motivated. Behich was screaming for the ball when Goodwin put the cross in but thankfully it got through to Kuol.
We've got to be better when we concede. The majority of players go off in their little world for a minute. Immediate heads down. They clearly didn't learn from the France game to stop stuffing around with it at the back.
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Melbcityguy
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+xHrustic is going to be an interesting one. Very temperamental. Talented. Definitely not a defensive midfielder. I guess I'd rather have him barking at the others if it leads to zero tolerance for shit play but you've got to have the expectations set. The team were so highly motivated. Behich was screaming for the ball when Goodwin put the cross in but thankfully it got through to Kuol. We've got to be better when we concede. The majority of players go off in their little world for a minute. Immediate heads down. They clearly didn't learn from the France game to stop stuffing around with it at the back. I was upset with hrustic this tournament there was one point in the match today he chose to drive instead of playing a forward and if lead to an Argentina shot on goal
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verrelli
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+x+xHrustic twice. Pure frustration Behich didn't cut it back and the same with Kuol. Not sure how to read into it. Great passion and certainly in a decent position but I hope this doesn't lead to him creating a disdain for his team mates. Pausing at the Behich moment. He's left footed and if he'd rolled it back to Hrustic, Hrustic's eyes can see the perfect gap to shoot it through for a goal. I think it's something they'd done a lot in training hence the frustration. Maclaren was also nearby and had his arms out. He also unloaded on Karacic after the latter dared suggest he should’ve passed it to him instead of trying to curl it in at one point. Karacic was wrong - Hrustic was well within his rights to shoot there - but his reaction was oddly aggressive. He seemed furious out there today. It was weird. So many thoughts on our campaign that I don't really know where to begin but I do want to comment on this specific point. Was so disappointing to see Hrustic chastisingel each of Behich, Kuol and Karacic in that way. Really stood out to me because you just don't see it from any of our other players. I've seen him do it in previous games too. To be honest, whilst I acknowledge that he is recovering from injury, I thought he was absolute trash this world cup off the bench. Offered absolutely nothing. I think he needs to get back in his box and shut the fuck up. Or I'll happily not see him again. I did think he was the best Socceroos option as a #10, at least with no Rogic, but I'm not so sure now. I'm actually not sure if he's anywhere near as good as many of us think. Bench warmer at Eintracht and was heading the same way at Verona, with their fans not rating him at all. I should preface thus by saying that early in his career and until recent times I was a massive fan and would regularly sing his praises. I just hate seeing that shit re: openly criticising teammates like that and in such a way, and it's also hugely detrimental to the team culture bring built.
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Derider
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+x+xHrustic is going to be an interesting one. Very temperamental. Talented. Definitely not a defensive midfielder. I guess I'd rather have him barking at the others if it leads to zero tolerance for shit play but you've got to have the expectations set. The team were so highly motivated. Behich was screaming for the ball when Goodwin put the cross in but thankfully it got through to Kuol. We've got to be better when we concede. The majority of players go off in their little world for a minute. Immediate heads down. They clearly didn't learn from the France game to stop stuffing around with it at the back. I was upset with hrustic this tournament there was one point in the match today he chose to drive instead of playing a forward and if lead to an Argentina shot on goal Yeah, you could see he was desperate to be the hero today. I didn’t mind the intention to drive - he had the right idea - but the execution was terrible. He ran straight into the defender and was dispossessed much too easily. It was frustrating. You can see the flashes of talent, but he hasn’t put it together for the Socceroos yet.
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riquelmes_laces
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+xHrustic is going to be an interesting one. Very temperamental. Talented. Definitely not a defensive midfielder. I guess I'd rather have him barking at the others if it leads to zero tolerance for shit play but you've got to have the expectations set. The team were so highly motivated. Behich was screaming for the ball when Goodwin put the cross in but thankfully it got through to Kuol. We've got to be better when we concede. The majority of players go off in their little world for a minute. Immediate heads down. They clearly didn't learn from the France game to stop stuffing around with it at the back. Hrustic hasn't earned the right to bark at his teammates. It's one thing to make sure the players are following the coaches orders, it's another to belittle your teammates because you think you should be running the plays. The fact is Hrustic hasn't done anything in his career thus far to demand that the team is built around him or at least the final 3rd. I do hope that he kicks on in the Serie A, but I think it's likely (given he's 26) that he becomes an important utility player for us and a possible replacement for Mooy.
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johnszasz
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Months back now but was it Mabil and maybe Hrustic who had that half time argument on the pitch? Against China or Oman I think.
Anyway there's some evidence that when Hrustic was being used as the lead and star of the team that things were also on shaky ground. Teams inevitably have cliques. I just hope they're all on the same page.
It's a nice thing that Metcalfe is coming through and Genreau needs to get his club minutes sorted.
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johnszasz
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+x+xHrustic is going to be an interesting one. Very temperamental. Talented. Definitely not a defensive midfielder. I guess I'd rather have him barking at the others if it leads to zero tolerance for shit play but you've got to have the expectations set. The team were so highly motivated. Behich was screaming for the ball when Goodwin put the cross in but thankfully it got through to Kuol. We've got to be better when we concede. The majority of players go off in their little world for a minute. Immediate heads down. They clearly didn't learn from the France game to stop stuffing around with it at the back. Hrustic hasn't earned the right to bark at his teammates. It's one thing to make sure the players are following the coaches orders, it's another to belittle your teammates because you think you should be running the plays. The fact is Hrustic hasn't done anything in his career thus far to demand that the team is built around him or at least the final 3rd. I do hope that he kicks on in the Serie A, but I think it's likely (given he's 26) that he becomes an important utility player for us and a possible replacement for Mooy. Frankfurt have a brilliant structure and grouping that I think he wouldn't dare try that there. He seemed to be in a shell most of the time there. He knew his place. Who knows how he, Rogic and others vying for the same position got on? While I want the passion he's got to be careful. He was fiery in the press conference and often states how good he is. With Mooy and Irvine winding up there may have been arguments that he should already be ahead amongst the group. I find the sideline and celebration footage very telling. Of course we were all in teams where a moment on camera looked like we were ignoring someone or didn't seem overjoyed but you can also see which players truly support each other.
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Derider
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+x+x+xHrustic is going to be an interesting one. Very temperamental. Talented. Definitely not a defensive midfielder. I guess I'd rather have him barking at the others if it leads to zero tolerance for shit play but you've got to have the expectations set. The team were so highly motivated. Behich was screaming for the ball when Goodwin put the cross in but thankfully it got through to Kuol. We've got to be better when we concede. The majority of players go off in their little world for a minute. Immediate heads down. They clearly didn't learn from the France game to stop stuffing around with it at the back. Hrustic hasn't earned the right to bark at his teammates. It's one thing to make sure the players are following the coaches orders, it's another to belittle your teammates because you think you should be running the plays. The fact is Hrustic hasn't done anything in his career thus far to demand that the team is built around him or at least the final 3rd. I do hope that he kicks on in the Serie A, but I think it's likely (given he's 26) that he becomes an important utility player for us and a possible replacement for Mooy. I find the sideline and celebration footage very telling. Of course we were all in teams where a moment on camera looked like we were ignoring someone or didn't seem overjoyed but you can also see which players truly support each other.
Which footage are you referring to? Was Hrustic ignored or did he do the ignoring? I still have high hopes for him coming good, but I wasn’t a fan of his attitude today. Then again, surely Arnie wouldn’t have taken him if he didn’t get along with the group or was a destabilising influence.
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