# NoEffnics

also what was the support of brisbane strikers like back in the day? could they ever replicate port adelaide and have brisbane roar be adelaide crows.

wouldnt say they were unsuccesful just because their geographics overlapped. it was that western sydney's 4 clubs were a serbian, italian, croatian club and then a generic parramatta team whose identity was to copy the eels. with these 4 teams, the rest of the footballing community had zero interest in the nsl.

if there was to suddenly be 4 western sydney teams in the a-league today (penrith, wsw, blacktown, liverpool) each would be significantly greater than what we had in the nsl

The biggest mistake was Lowy being persuaded by O'Neill on the '1 team per city' model when every city is a different market. The A-League should have adhered to the Crawford Report recommendations from the start: 3 Syd, 2 Melb, 1 Bris, 1 Per, 1 Adel , 1 Newcastle + 1 other.

Probably would have worked in Melbourne but if a West Sydney team had come in at the beginning SFC would be dwarfed by the Western Sydney team. Western Sydney is football heartland. Sydney wouldn't have been able to compete. The only way to have two teams in one Sydney team based near the CBD and to add a western one later.

Edited by patjennings: 2/8/2014 11:45:40 PM

When it comes to metro-markets, the only and clear option for a second Brisbane team is the Ipswich area, which can function as a similar blueprint to the Wanderers/SFC dynamic/experience to a degree. Atleast with the geographic divide, intra-regionality and the local football history in Ipswich. They have a well located venue there too, which govt. could be prepared to support in developing. Discussion here: FFT - Now the A-League has Ipswich as its goal

And for similar reasons, this is why I feel the 'gong have a greater chance, with their bordering on the wider Sydney Metro. WIN Stadium a great potential venue too and would HAVE to be the home ground - None of this 'sharing' with Kogarah rubbish that the hybrid Steel-Dragons team undertakes! This is another area where a 'gong/South Coast A-League team can thrive in a void - where the NRL team have kind of left WIN Stadium and the 'gong behind to a degree, the A-League team can take up with full gusto and the 'gong can embrace the team as their own and attendances at WIN should reflect so.

It may make the league even more NSW-centric, but atleast it's a 'gong team, another historic football region, coming back, another region represented, but same time a new potential hot rival for SFC, Wanderers, Mariners and even fellow Steel City Jets?

If Canberra, Fury and any others are to have their chance, then the FFA will have to agree to expand to the final/optimum number of 14 - but what makes the stakes even greater in all this is that either 12 or 14 could see the final expansion of this league! But hopefully the blow to those who miss out will be less, via the FFA Cup and potentially a new national second tier of sorts which can accommodate 8-10 of these medium sized cities? That too would provide the platform for a more formal, but limited, Prom/Rel process of sorts, down the track?



Indeed.

Fury mk II are going about it the right way too, but the odds stacking against them now it seems, given the preference to bigger markets, formula for success they provide. Same may unfortunately go for Canberra too at this rate, despite their decent bottom up efforts, with the former 'A-League4Canberra' bid from Ivan Slavich and co and the still on-going W-League team created as part of that.

Edited by GloryPerth: 3/8/2014 01:05:37 AM

On the condition it's not a team created from scratch

Wollongong.

SFC don't do that bad at pulling a crowd when they are doing well, so they still seem to be doing fairly well at getting support.

The West was the massive gap from day one, not really the North or the South, which were still within reach of either CCM or SFC.

The NSL was seen as heavily focused on Sydney/NSW for a long time, where clubs overlapped to only give each a smaller target market to possibly work with.

With these limitations, each club really could only attract a majority following from the core base, which ultimately seemed to revolve around a certain ethnicity, not particularly a geographic location.

The main example of this was the Western Sydney market, which had up to 4 clubs in the later years of the NSL (Marconi, United, Olympic and Parramatta Power). None of these could draw great crowds due to numerous factors, but the market overlap did not help build the competition.

In this regard, starting with a couple of clubs in different geographic areas made more sense from the start, but starting small was key. Targeting Central/East and West made far more sense to look at first.

I don't see how it's a recipe of NSL MK2. The problem with the NSL is that the teams were ethnically based, playing at shitty grounds. Three broad based teams in three distinct regions in a city of 4.5 million(like the Australasian Premier League suggested) would've been fine. Instead Sydney FC sit in between North and South, not properly tapping into either.

3 Sydney teams in an 8 team comp at the start? Wow, that was a recipe for the NSL Mk 2. In a 10 team comp, it also seems a heavy weighting.

Having 2 teams (West and Central/East) was all that was needed in Sydney at the start, and in Melbourne having 2 teams would have also been beneficial at that stage.

Melb 1
Melb 2
Syd West
Syd Central / East
Newcastle
Adelaide
Brisbane
Perth

That would have been a better starting platform really, giving the 2 largest markets significant coverage from the start.

CCM and NZ/WP would have been the losers from this plan, but given the challenges both those licenses have had since the start of the league, it may have been a better move.

The problem with Southern Sydney is, Sydney FC sit right between North and South. You could eat into Sydney FC's support base.

Ideally from the start you would've had a Southern, Northern and Western team in Sydney, but there's a lack of any decent central stadium in the North.

Missing the point really.The Roar have supporters all around Qld.But somewhere down the track we need more Qld teams.Another one in Brisbane would be a good idea.The longer the wait the more difficult it will be.As The Roar will have everyone.
Ipswich just isn't ready.
More than likely you would not have a geographical location in the name,like Melb Heart /City.But if ever you were to be bold and have a geographical location based on part of Brisbane The South seems most logical to me.

Unless any new expansion bid has a viable stadium in place in their target area, there is no point in even thinking about a 2nd Brisbane or 3rd Melbourne club.

South-East Melbourne = No venue
Logan/Ipswich = No venue

Of the others:

South Coast NSW = Does not meet FFA's current focus
Auckland = Meets the FFA's stated focus and has viable venues to utilise in this area, although the AFC would likely block such a proposal
Canberra = Does not meet FFA's current focus
South Sydney = Meets the FFA's stated focus and has viable venues to utilise in this area
Townsville / NQ = Does not meet FFA's current focus
Gold Coast = Does not meet the FFA's current focus

When I say not meeting FFA's stated focus, I am referring to Gallop's comments about playing in larger markets with populations in the millions, not hundreds of thousands. The other markets would need to work very hard to change that mindset, particularly when it comes to adding crowd, corporate and broadcasting value.


Edited by heart_fan: 2/8/2014 07:39:53 PM

Didn't word that the greatest, was meaning that the idea of people in south Brisbane not considering the Roar as their team is laughable. This isn't Sydney, we don't have that 'east v west' hate like they have, Brisbane is a one team town.

Edited by Roar_Brisbane: 2/8/2014 05:43:56 PM

Exactly, and it seems to be people from out of Brisbane who are calling for a second Brisbane team, it just wouldn't work. We are a very unified city unlike Sydney that seems to have very distinct individual areas.

The a league definitely needs to try North Queensland again before even half considering another SE Qld team.

Suncorp is pretty much smack bang in the middle of greater Brisbane. So they currently draw fans from all directions. There isn't really a north/ south divide like there seems to be in Sydney

Maybe Queensland Lions were, but aren't Brisbane Roar's admin, training and matchdays all north of the river?

That said, they'd all need new grounds first.

Putting another team up here in South East Queensland is naff unless it's well away from Brisbanes CBD. Brisbane itself is a one team city, anyone who is not a Brisbane Roar supporter here is not going to be picked up by a new team. Even if the strikers went out to Logan it would still be a disaster. No one from Gold Coast would support a Brisbane team either.

Ipswich, Gold Coast and Sunshine Coast are different cases though. They are far away enough from the Roar to not be suffocated out of the market, have high growth expectations and they each have their own independent identity. As long as people weren't expecting them to get mega crowds and we're happy for more small teams then they would be fine

The notion that the Roar aren't considered a south side team is laughable.

The more I have thought about it,the more I think a South side Brisbane team should be considered.It seems to have good local clubs like Olympic,Strikers,Redlands,Rochedale ,East Brisbane and The Wolves,which are performing well in the NPL and BRL.
It covers a large population area extending down to the Gold Coast and is defined by being South Of the River.
It could also have the potential to draw in Gold Coast and Ipswich supporters if marketed properly.
Could it be a case of build it and they will come ,like WSW ?
Maybe an 'amalgamation' or joint share holding of the aforementioned teams to form a new team /club.
Of course it will always require someone to stump up the cash,but with the potential for real derbies against The Roar,it is not that unrealistic.

South Coast Wolves and a Canberra side from the ACTPL should be priority. No expansion into NZ, pacific islands, Bali, Egypt, South America etc etc.

Absolutely. ](*,)

The goal should be to establish more Aust based teams, most likely from the NPL national champion from say 2018 onwards as Gallop mentioned about a year ago in an IV. Auckland is a big population centre, but not sure of another outside the AFC.

im supportive of an auckland team, but suggesting a pacific islands or south-east asian team is ridiculous.

11. wollongong wolves
12. brisbane strikers or ipswich rovers
13. 3rd sydney (south sydney)
14. 3rd victorian
15. 4th sydney (south-west sydney)
16. 4th victorian
17. auckland city
18. canberra athletic

All the above mentioned teams don't need to join the A-League they have the FFA Cup to show or prove if they have the goods or not.
Auckland side should be handed a license asap, Followed by a Pacific Island - A-League team then move on to the dregs in Australia.

They all look shit and childish.

JoFFA, fuck off with all the pushing for a NZ side. If NZ want to grow as a footballing nation, it won't be of any help if it were through our league and will just bring us down.

change sporting brisbane to brisbane strikers and its a winner.

^^^ all of those kits look amazing.

Why is it that fans seem to make very classy kits for their teams yet the pros turn out some absolute trash